marriage outside of your faith?

[handy]

This is a discussion I've had with several of my Mormon friends...who claim wholeheartedly that they believe in Jesus Christ....it's just that the "Jesus" they believe in...and the real, historical Jesus, the Son, who came to die for the remissions of our sins, aren't the same person by any stretch of the imagination.

For instance, I could say that I believe that George Washington was the first President of the United States...and then go on to say that he was a short man who was a real sloppy dresser, didn't know how to read or write and was a real coward when it came to fighting in a war. Yeah..I believe in George Washington...just obviously not THE George Washington.

Muslims, Jews, and Christians all believe in the Genesis account of Scriptures when it comes to Creation. However, both Jews and Muslims will deny that Jesus is the God that created the world. If they deny that...then by default, they are not believing in the same God as the Christians believe in.

Now, I do happen to believe that God is merciful and just when it comes to the ignorant...but you are in a great position to show your wife...through your actions as a godly husband and father, as well as your example and your words, who the true God of Genesis is...nothing came into this world that Jesus did not create.

As to your question regarding the Trinity...again, read the Scriptures and seek out a Bible believing church...We do believe in One God...but He has revealed Himself to us as the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. This is the cornerstone of the Christian faith. It is indeed what Jesus meant when He said "I and the Father are One"...as well as when He stated several times over "I AM...." (the resurrection and the life, the bread of life, the way, truth the life...the Jews knew exactly what He was saying...which was why they wanted to stone Him.)


I want to say that your wife sounds like a very nice person...of good morals and values and I have every hope that she will eventually "see the light"...but if you're going to help her in this process, it behooves you to study and seek better knowledge of your faith.

One thing that might also help with your folks in this is if they see your marriage as strengthening your faith...as opposed to weakening it into universalism. It might not be that they are being judgmental...as much as they are discerning that you are falling away from what they raised you in....perhaps...I obviously don't know or understand the full situation.

 

[justme1808]

but if they follow him and his teachings the same way if we do and believe in GOD similar just with a different beginning...


Like we believe that GOD created the world which was later revealed to be Jesus. While they don't believe that... She believes He was a prophet... It's like believing that George Washington didn't later become president. He became a senator. While I know he did. We both believe in GOD. Just that HE did different things. Jesus isn't separate neither is the holy spirit... I guess that's why I think anyone who believes in GOD as in the way as genesis does then that's the same thing. It's accepting essentially the same thing unkowingly. Because it's all the same... That's how I see it....

It would be nice we could agree but I'm not really worried for her just others I guess it's something they'll have to accept....

Well I know I'd never leave my faith. I don't think she would either... I'd divorce before she tried to convert but that's not her interest. It's not in her religious belief to convert she believes everyone who believes in one GOD and a heaven and hell and do right are as likely and as righteous so there's no desire to convert...

 

[Danus]

but if they follow him and his teachings the same way if we do and believe in GOD similar just with a different beginning...


Like we believe that GOD created the world which was later revealed to be Jesus. While they don't believe that... She believes He was a prophet... It's like believing that George Washington didn't later become president. He became a senator. While I know he did.

It would be nice we could agree but I'm not really worried for her just others I guess it's something they'll have to accept....

Well I know I'd never leave my faith. I don't think she would either... I'd divorce before she tried to convert but that's not her interest. It's not in her religious belief to convert she believes everyone who believes in one GOD and a heaven and hell and do right are as likely and as righteous so there's no desire to convert...

justme, in my response to you I placed emphasis on the term you used "religious". I did that for a reason; 1 to see if you'd agree and 2 since reading your situation, it was to me, too far gone to offer you any real advice abut how to handle the marriage, or your parents at this point.

What handy and others are trying to say here is that you need to take a stronger assessment of what you believe in regard to calling yourself a Christian.

If being a Christian is simply believing in God and doing good, then you might accept similar beliefs as being just as valid.

That's religion in it's weakest sense, of adhering to a set of rules and rituals. the problem with that in, and of itself, is that it really depends on the individual to measure up, or live up to those things; rather than allowing God to lead them into conforming to his will; religious people lead themselves in this way, vs those who have a "relationship" with Christ (God), who depend on God, look to God to lead them in his way.

I still don't quite know what your "wife" is in terms of her beliefs, but Mormons and or Muslims, although they have an understanding of Christ insofar as they acknowledge Christ, they do not understand or know Christ in the biblical truth that is Christianity. Then again, some proclaiming Christians don't either (Mormons case in point).

You might want to ask yourself, do you want to be religious or do you want to have a relationship with God? there is a big difference. If you want to be religious, then you can choose from any number of religions you want to choose from. But, if you want a real relationship with God; a real one on one relationship; a friendship to last eternity, where he guides and leads and heals and fulfills you with the hope, love, peace and joy you seek, then there is only one way...and that is through Christ Jesus, our Lord and savior.

For me, the best part about being a Christian is knowing that I could not measure up. I can not measure up to any religion. But the best part is I don't have to, because Jesus can, he did, and he has, but Christ did not just measure up to a religion. He measured up to God himself, because God and Christ are one in the same, and his righteousness is imputed to me on my behalf. By accepting that and allowing him to lead me and my effort to simply be good, he is conforming me daily to his image. An image that I could never conform to on my own.

If you get tired of being religious. If you find yourself frustrated because you can not measure up to your religious standard, whatever it may be, then please remember that Christ can, that he loves you, that he has a plan for you and that all you have to do to get started is to come to him. You don't have to be ashamed or afraid,. Even if you think you made a mess of things. In fact he'd love most to take your hand at that time.

So good luck to you. Good luck with your parents and if you find yourself in a spot that you feel you can not over come, just remember what Christ has overcome all. John 16: 33 “I have told you these things, so that in me you may have peace. In this world you will have trouble. But take heart! I have overcome the world.”

 

[justme1808]

I actually believe in GOD in the christian sense. I feel it's the truth... I'm religious and have complete faith. It's just to me I believe in GOD as one with three entities. So if they believe in GOD they are accepting him as GOD unknowingly. But my parents found out not good. Really want the baby baptized. I didn't know that was a dealbreaker really... Not like I wanna argue with her though. Wait til it gets there..

 

[Mike]

Justme, to your credit, you've been barraged by advice and critiques, but you've taken it all very pleasantly. You do seem like the kind of guy you and her aspire to be. I'll bet you'd be terrific neighbors, and I really mean that!

Nothing will be achieved in this thread. You won't likely throw yourself down on the floor, prostrate before the Lord by the end of this thread. I'm planning on this being my last post in it. Right now, you're pretty fixed on "We're all just God's children". But my friend, there is an amazing difference, a gulf, an ocean of difference between what you've described and that our faith teaches

I pray, pray, pray that you stop believing in doctrine that comes from your gut, and immerse yourself in the most important thing that can possibly be... Having a true knowledge of your Savior. I pray one day you will be in a faithwalk where you can look back and chuckle at the things you're saying now. The more I hear you validating your set of beliefs, the more I think - Boy, he could be an outstanding witness one day if he comes to embrace the True Calling of a believer!

It's just that there is a very serious flaws in your theology that need some time spent in the way I said in my last post (pray, Bible, Godly counsel). If you read the bible, read about Jesus for sure, but read about the men who followed Him. You will see them transformed. Men who couldn't relate to anything Jesus was telling them, and listen... really listen to what He was telling them, that in fact He is telling YOU. Imagine you being one of these men who never knew what to say or what to do. Witness what happened in the hearts of these men on Pentecost, when the Helper Jesus had Promised them before He had died and Rose came and dwelt in their hearts. They were transformed into bold men who preached nothing but repent, confess and be baptized. They heard all this from the mouth of Jesus. These lost souls became hero's of the faith. They were afraid of nothing that threatened to make them stop preaching the Jesus is the only Way. They never said Jesus was a good man or that He was a prophet. They wouldn't have been persecuted if that's all they said. They went a lot further, by proclaiming that he was God in the flesh who had defeated death.

In Revelation, Jesus said how He felt about lukewarm believers. He said He would spit them out of His mouth. We need to earnestly seek Him and pray that He reveals himself to you. Your family has infinitely better chances of finding that same path down the road. Find a Bible-based church with a solid pastor. Believe me, you will be thrilled when your transformation takes place.

 

[handy]

But my parents found out not good. Really want the baby baptized. I didn't know that was a dealbreaker really... Not like I wanna argue with her though. Wait til it gets there..

Not too sure what you mean here...That your parents want the baby baptized and your wife is adamant that they not be?

Could you clarify?

 

[justme1808]

yea she doesn't want that to be done because she doesn't like baptism but she's fine with teaching the religion. The thing is like there is no ceremony in her religion or ritual done when the baby is born... So she sees it as unfair I guess.

 

[handy]

One's first taste as to how having different religions creates problems.

Frankly, while I go to a church that teaches infant baptism, I don't believe one needs to be baptized until one is a believer....but, once a person confesses belief in Christ, baptism should be pretty much the first thing one does.

My children confessed Christ pretty early in life...both around 5-6 years old...if your child confesses Christ that early, will your wife be OK with the child being baptized then? This is a good time to talk about that.

Now...what about you? Do YOU believe sincerely and wholeheartedly that you should baptize your baby? If you do, then isn't her demand that the baby be unbaptized just as "unfair". While I believe that there is no sin in waiting until a child can confess Christ before baptism...my parents believed otherwise. If you believe something is right to do...and refuse to do it...that is sin.

This issue is an important one, and an opportunity for you and your wife to work out how your different religions will be played out in your home with your children. If you believe that the child should be baptized...and she says that is a "deal-breaker" essentially threatening your marriage if you follow through on your heartfelt belief that you must baptize your baby...then you have a much bigger problem in your life. Another area might be going to church...are you going to church and if so, will you take your child to church with you? Is she OK with that?

All questions that need to be discussed and worked out. Preferably before the baby comes.

The problem with waiting until after the baby arrives is this: Both of you will most likely feel much more strongly about these issues after the baby gets here. It's amazing what happens when you actually become a parent and these questions are no longer theoretical. If you already have certain things decided upon...it might make it easier. At any rate, if you've already developed a pattern of openness and communication regarding these issues, you'll be able to address them better as your child grows up.

 

[justme1808]

well if that's what they chose I think she'd be fine. Just like vice versa

 

[justme1808]

One's first taste as to how having different religions creates problems.

Frankly, while I go to a church that teaches infant baptism, I don't believe one needs to be baptized until one is a believer....but, once a person confesses belief in Christ, baptism should be pretty much the first thing one does.

My children confessed Christ pretty early in life...both around 5-6 years old...if your child confesses Christ that early, will your wife be OK with the child being baptized then? This is a good time to talk about that.

Now...what about you? Do YOU believe sincerely and wholeheartedly that you should baptize your baby? If you do, then isn't her demand that the baby be unbaptized just as "unfair". While I believe that there is no sin in waiting until a child can confess Christ before baptism...my parents believed otherwise. If you believe something is right to do...and refuse to do it...that is sin.

This issue is an important one, and an opportunity for you and your wife to work out how your different religions will be played out in your home with your children. If you believe that the child should be baptized...and she says that is a "deal-breaker" essentially threatening your marriage if you follow through on your heartfelt belief that you must baptize your baby...then you have a much bigger problem in your life. Another area might be going to church...are you going to church and if so, will you take your child to church with you? Is she OK with that?

All questions that need to be discussed and worked out. Preferably before the baby comes.

The problem with waiting until after the baby arrives is this: Both of you will most likely feel much more strongly about these issues after the baby gets here. It's amazing what happens when you actually become a parent and these questions are no longer theoretical. If you already have certain things decided upon...it might make it easier. At any rate, if you've already developed a pattern of openness and communication regarding these issues, you'll be able to address them better as your child grows up.

yea well our plan pretty much is we're going to leave it to our kid. I will take them to church though every sunday. No pork. he/she can learn to pray both ways... Our holidays barely at all conflict. She celebrates Christmas because she is a follower of Jesus. I don't mind Eid ul ftr it is just breaking the fast. I actually fast myself as does some of my family. To me I think we've discussed enough that we could make this work... I do admit I do pray more because of her. Since she prays 5 times a day it's kind of I guess guilt. But what's wrong with that my son/daughter I want to develop a close subservient position to GOD.

 

[Tina]

I see ... So your wife is a Muslim !

This problem is worse than I thought ...

 

[justme1808]

yeah I never said she wasn't.

And by stereotype it would be a problem.

I have orthodox Jewish friends and I actually thought she was one. The three faiths actually have more than you think in common...

 

[Mike]

yeah I never said she wasn't.

And by stereotype it would be a problem.

I have orthodox Jewish friends and I actually thought she was one. The three faiths actually have more than you think in common...

Friend, they might have some things in common, but they are WORLDS apart from a spiritual perspective. And if she's a Muslim, she is not a follower of Jesus. She's not a follower of God. She's a follower of Allah, who is not God.

You seem to have a good heart, but you are in way over your head. I'm certain that you don't comprehend Christianity now. I asked earlier on if she was a Mormon or a JW. That would seem to have been a perfect time to say she's Muslim. I only say this because you were playing this close to the vest for a reason.

I pray your salvation and the salvation of your family becomes more important and urgent than it is today.

 

[Tina]

There's a whole world of difference between Islam and Christianity and you're only making excuses for your sins.

 

[justme1808]

Friend, they might have some things in common, but they are WORLDS apart from a spiritual perspective. And if she's a Muslim, she is not a follower of Jesus. She's not a follower of God. She's a follower of Allah, who is not God.

You seem to have a good heart, but you are in way over your head. I'm certain that you don't comprehend Christianity now. I asked earlier on if she was a Mormon or a JW. That would seem to have been a perfect time to say she's Muslim. I only say this because you were playing this close to the vest for a reason.

I pray your salvation and the salvation of your family becomes more important and urgent than it is today.

no actually she praises GOD and in her language it's ZOT. Not Allah. Allah is actually a word arabic christians use... She's not arabic nor does she speak it... Allah is only an arabic word for GOD.

Which you've just said pretty God is not God. Just by another language.

Truth is I'm more religious than most religious Christians. I feel my relationship with GOD is very close thank you.

You seem to be speaking without knowledge....

 

[reba]

2Jn 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.
2Jn 1:8 Look to yourselves, that we lose not those things which we have wrought, but that we receive a full reward.
2Jn 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
2Jn 1:10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
2Jn 1:11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.

 

[reba]

There's a whole world of difference between Islam and Christianity and you're only making excuses for your sins.

AMEN

 

[Mike]

no actually she praises GOD and in her language it's ZOT. Not Allah. Allah is actually a word arabic christians use... She's not arabic... Allah is only an arabic word for GOD.

Whatever language or word she is using, she's praying to Allah, not the Christian God, and certainly not Jesus. I don't mean to be harsh on you just because you've shared this. It just makes things more difficult than I first believed.

So, now you have to read up on come to an understanding of both religions; yours and hers.

 

[justme1808]

Whatever language or word she is using, she's praying to Allah, not the Christian God, and certainly not Jesus. I don't mean to be harsh on you just because you've shared this. It just makes things more difficult than I first believed.

So, now you have to read up on come to an understanding of both religions; yours and hers.

No the word 'Allah' is an arabic word. She believes in the same GOD as in Judaism. ALLAH is not the name of the Islamic god anymore than GOD is. ALLAH is the Arabic word for GOD. She believes in simply GOD which is DIOS DIEU ZOT in several different languages. Allah is not an islamic word it's an arabic word. It has nothing to do with islam alone it's just a word those muslims use... Arabic christians say it too get it? It seems you need to understand the fundamental beliefs of islam to understand. You apparently don't that's why I thought you'd ignorantly stereotype you don't even get who they believe is GOD. Reason I wanted to leave it out because you don't even know about that...

She prays to GOD. Also JW and mormons are christians... I said she wasn't christian... And that she was of a family faith but not Jewish.... What else is left of popular religions...

I don't see myself as making a sin because I do believe in the old testament and I do believe in the Jewish GOD but only as in the father the son and the holy spirit in one. I guess I truly consider myself a monotheist and that's one none of the 3 can be taken apart. I am not a bitheist or polytheist never will be wasn't raised that way. You can only claim it's different without even saying how.... She to me accepts Jesus as GOD if she accepts what the old testament says to be true in genesis. Which she does therefore I don't really care what label she is... She believe in GOD which Zot which is Dieu. And all the other languages out there. I believe in GOD which is Zot which is Dieu. Maybe someday you'll understand languages differ in wording because well it's a different language...


Btw she is a follower of Jesus in her opinion.... She follows his teachings like she follows the rest. She doesn't praise him she follows him still. That still is true to her.

The word Allah is used by christians in the region. Allah is a regional word. She believes in GOD which Zot usually in prayer because she prays in Albanian...


If you actually knew what they believed you'd see it's not too hard. She also isn't a reader of the hadith so beliefs are different.

 

[Tina]

Oh please! Come on .... Did you come to this forum seeking right Christian advice, or hoping to try and convince us that your marriage isn't such a bad idea ?