I have heard through the years that there is no such thing as a Carnal Christian... Now according to this verse 1 it would seem to imply that there is. According to verse 3 it would seem to say that there is not..... What say you?
Hi Javier, I am going back to the OP with my response. I apologize for the length, but most is Scripture, and I wanted to put it in context for everyone.
I would like to show that there are possibly three different things going on when we speak of carnality.
1.Carnal minded without the Spirit
2.Carnal minded in a particular area because of lack of maturity. 3.Carnality of the flesh, which we all suffer from, but delighting in God's law in our spirit.
1 Corinthians 2
6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:
7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:
8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.
then Paul goes on to...
1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
4 For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?
If you look at all of these verses, Paul begins by giving those at Corinth a picture of the mature believer, the spiritual believer, and he desires to speak with them, and correct them, as mature believers, but first he must deal with the area that is keeping them from growth, and possibly from hearing the rest of his instructions.
The area in which they are acting carnally is sectarianism. This has led to envy, strife, and divisions among them...they were walking as men (carnal minded unbelievers), and not as ones in the Spirit, in the mind of Christ. I think Paul was revealing the character of what they were doing, to show them that it was at odds with God...even a trait of unbelief.
This does not imply to me that the modern definition of carnal christian is being spoken of here. I would define that as being one who believes they can love the world, look like the world, serve the world and love God, and serve God too. We know that no one can serve two masters.
It seems to me that they were struggling in particular area, and it was out of hand. Paul's response to their carnal mindedness in this area, was to correct them, not to leave them there and give them assurance of their place in the body...they were not having the mind of Christ in this matter, and he meant for them to repent for it, and to stop being carnal about such things. He tells them that it has led to envy, and strife, and these things are not honoring God.
I would like to address some other verses that speak of carnality.
Romans 8
1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.
19 I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.
20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.
21 What fruit had ye then in those things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death.
22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.
23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Here Paul exhorts believers to holiness, and to no longer be slaves to sin, I will go on...
Chapter 7
No law has power over a man after his death
1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.
5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.
6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.
14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
Here Paul says that the law is good, because it reveals sin, but that it is spiritual, and we, being in the flesh, are carnal. Here Paul speaks of carnality of the flesh, and that it struggles against the inward man who delights in God's law. This does not seem to be the same as 1 Corinthians, because the heart is willing to obey here.
The Corinthians were not having the mind of Christ...they were carnal minded in a certain area, and not delighting in God's law in that area. They were not having a heart of obedience in this. This is self focused, and selfish, and willful. It could be evidence of complete lawlessness if correction is not received, and repentance is not made. I think our reaction when we are being corrected for being carnal is very telling of our fruit, and may even help to grow us more, in some cases, if we are willing to be restored...that is God's work, however.
I would like to add, though, how can people react to correction, if they are not corrected? We probably have an epidemic of "carnal christians" because they are not being confronted about their sin, and not given an opportunity to repent, and grow. And,we also need more of the Word. That is just opinion.
last verses...
Romans 8
1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
I stopped here to highlight this portion, but I encourage all to read on. The carnal mind, which I think is different from carnality of the flesh, is at enmity with God...because it is not subject to the law of God...it's willful and self focused. This is just my take, and so I would say that believers suffer with a carnal flesh, and fail because of it, but they should always be walking with the mind of Christ, and delighting in God's laws in their spirit, inwardly.
However, he who is completely carnal minded, yet professing faith, is in a more dangerous position, and may not even be saved. This man is at enmity with God, and will be spewed out of His mouth.
As for the Corinthians, they were being carnal minded in a particular area, and Paul was calling them on it, and showing them that this is at odds with God. I would imagine that Paul's expectation by telling them this, was to cause them to repent, and hopefully to keep from this type of behavior again, and to be able to receive instruction in maturity, with the mind of Christ.
So, for me, there are at least three areas of carnality. Two do not lead to death if repented of and restored (which evidence of genuine belief), but one was already there because there was not faith to begin with.
As far as Paul Washer, I think he was combating the church's error in condoning carnal mindedness...the serving of two masters. He mentioned loving the world, and God, and we know that we are not to do that. 1 John speaks to this well, along with many other verse. The Lord bless all of you.
