A hypothetical about Heaven :)

[Sir Pwn4lot]

Hey guys.

Just wondering, if you have a daughter or son who you really, really love (A lot of you have kids so imagine that) and they rebelled against the Christian faith; just couldn't believe it, then you went to Heaven and because of their blasphemy they go to Hell....

Could you enjoy Heaven?

What about if later on if they repented and came to know God and love Him, she was the nicest person imaginable, but because she rebelled on Earth (A rebellion she no longer feels) she is disallowed entry into Heaven, even after reform.

Could you enjoy Heaven?

Thanks.

 

[ChevyRodeo]

Jesus will wipe the tears from our face himself; out of our sadness for missing those who are not there. I have accepted the fact that my Grandmother and Father will not be joining me in eternity. Its is sad, but it is the nature of God to consume sin. There is nothing that can be done.

I don't feel that I will be given a synthetic representation of my father or grandmother in heaven.

 

[Sir Pwn4lot]

Jesus will wipe the tears from our face himself; out of our sadness for missing those who are not there. I have accepted the fact that my Grandmother and Father will not be joining me in eternity. Its is sad, but it is the nature of God to consume sin. There is nothing that can be done.

I don't feel that I will be given a synthetic representation of my father or grandmother in heaven.

Ok then lol. A strange viewpoint.

Imagine if a pedophile got a hold of your daughter and raped her, would you be mad/sad? Hell is INFINITELY worse than that, and even though she now loves God and is the nicest person imaginable (more so than most people in Heaven) she isn't allowed forgiveness.

Why are your grandparents going to eternal infinite torture? Are they non-believers? Are they evil or something :gah

Heaven would start to look just as bad as Hell for me.

 

[elijah23]

According to John 3:16, all you have to do to have eternal life is to believe in Jesus. I doubt if anyone will choose hell over eternal life, given those two options.

 

[Tissue]

To answer the OP, 'No.'

 

[Sir Pwn4lot]

According to John 3:16, all you have to do to have eternal life is to believe in Jesus. I doubt if anyone will choose hell over eternal life, given those two options.

Technically life in Hell is still eternal Sure, if after I'm dead the Christian God came up to me and said "Now do you believe!" I'd of course say yes lol, but if he wants be to unjustly believe down here then I suppose he's predestined me to Hell (Why make me anyway if he knew I was just going to Hell?)


You guys are all monsters if you wouldn't be unhappy knowing your God has destined your loved ones to eternal torture.

 

[ChevyRodeo]

Hell is full of some cool people. smart people, nice, loving passionate people.

Hell is full of ultimately ONE kind of person. Those who did not receive the salvation of God.


It has nothing to do with personality, how nice you are, how grumpy you are. My grand mother has never seeked out to accept God.

Imagine God standing at the door, we are outside in the cold rain. God wants us to come in but he will not force us to safety and shelter, He simply shows us the way and lets us choose.

 

[Sir Pwn4lot]

Hell is full of some cool people. smart people, nice, loving passionate people.

Hell is full of ultimately ONE kind of person. Those who did not receive the salvation of God.


It has nothing to do with personality, how nice you are, how grumpy you are. My grand mother has never seeked out to accept God.

Imagine God standing at the door, we are outside in the cold rain. God wants us to come in but he will not force us to safety and shelter, He simply shows us the way and lets us choose.

Okay, so he creates me knowing that I'll be tortured for all eternity in infinite pain lol.

Just because I used the logic he gave me I deserve to be tortured for all eternity? Is that was an infinitely loving being would do?

It doesn't make sense to me why he's so crazy about people believing in him on insufficient evidence, it's just as justified to believe in any other superstition instead lol.

 

[ChevyRodeo]

Okay, so he creates me knowing that I'll be tortured for all eternity in infinite pain lol.

no

Just because I used the logic he gave me I deserve to be tortured for all eternity? Is that was an infinitely loving being would do?

Your logic is the result of your learned culture, not God given. Logic is different to everyone, its not objective.


If you reach your hand into a burning fire, do you then get mad at the fire and say HOW DARE IT DO THAT, no. We understand the nature of the fire is to burn. The nature of God is to consume sin.

He has made a path for you to be with Him IF YOU CHOOSE IT.

It doesn't make sense to me why he's so crazy about people believing in him on insufficient evidence, it's just as justified to believe in any other superstition instead lol.

God did come to earth and at one point, you could smell him, hug him, speak with him, that time has passed but now people will just say , OH that was not God , that was some crazy guy with good morals and teachings.


Go Figure. If Jesus in the flesh is not proof enough then what is ??

 

[Sir Pwn4lot]

no

Yes.

He knows everything, therefore he knows how my life will turn out.

Your logic is the result of your learned culture, not God given. Logic is different to everyone, its not objective.

Provide me a better way to determine truth than using evidence.

If you reach your hand into a burning fire, do you then get mad at the fire and say HOW DARE IT DO THAT, no. We understand the nature of the fire is to burn. The nature of God is to consume sin.

The fire isn't a sentient being. If you walked to the shops to get your food and someone jumped out and shot you 7 times in the chest is that person immoral?

My objection is that not believing in him isn't bad, it doesn't affect anyone.

He has made a path for you to be with Him IF YOU CHOOSE IT.

It's impossible for me to chose it because it's something that I cannot believe. If someone who could hypothetically read your mind came up to you and said "Believe in fairies right now or I'll kill you, and I know if you're just saying it to avoid punishment!" would you be able to get out of that alive?

God did come to earth and at one point, you could smell him, hug him, speak with him, that time has passed but now people will just say , OH that was not God , that was some crazy guy with good morals and teachings.

That's not evidence, it's the proposition itself. The teachings he gave us weren't even all that great, the golden rule was thought of 2000 years before....

Go Figure. If Jesus in the flesh is not proof enough then what is ??

But what you offer isn't Jesus in the flesh, it's a bunch of 5th and 6th hand accounts of poorly translated "25 year after the event" chinese whisper superstition.

If Jesus actually appeared before me (And him knowing that it's the only way to save me from eternal torture) then we'd be getting somewhere.

 

[follower of Christ]

Hey guys.

Just wondering, if you have a daughter or son who you really, really love (A lot of you have kids so imagine that) and they rebelled against the Christian faith; just couldn't believe it, then you went to Heaven and because of their blasphemy they go to Hell....

Could you enjoy Heaven?

Yes.
Very much so.
I have nothing to do with someone elses rejection of truth.

Did you really think this ignorance was going to cause someone to throw away their faith in God, poster ?
Your ignorant belligerence is being laid on pretty thick.

What about if later on if they repented and came to know God and love Him, she was the nicest person imaginable, but because she rebelled on Earth (A rebellion she no longer feels) she is disallowed entry into Heaven, even after reform.

Could you enjoy Heaven?

Thanks.

Not the way it works.
'reform' is made here in this lifetime.

Any more of these absurd hypotheticals that are what, centuries old by now ?
You certainly arent naive enough to think that youre the first person to come up with this nonsense, at least Id hope that is the case.

 

[Tissue]

Yes.
Very much so.
I have nothing to do with someone elses rejection of truth.

Did you really think this ignorance was going to cause someone to throw away their faith in God, poster ?
Your ignorant belligerence is being laid on pretty thick.

--------------

Not the way it works.
'reform' is made here in this lifetime.

Any more of these absurd hypotheticals that are what, centuries old by now ?
You certainly arent naive enough to think that youre the first person to come up with this nonsense, at least Id hope that is the case.

Hey now. Let's be civil.

If you don't think the questions Pwn4lot are asking are important, then I'm not sure you've thought about the matter sufficiently. Christianity is not an easy religion. We've got difficulties we need to sort through, and the doctrine of eternal hell and its consistency with a loving God are one of those big ones (along with the problem of evil). Perhaps you've figured it out in a way that allows you to continue believing the two. If that's the case, grand. Share it. But don't be immature about it, treating people who have genuine questions as though they are inferior. That's not Christian at all, brother.

These questions aren't nonsense. I daresay more than half of the thoughtful Christians I've met struggle with this very issue, myself included.

 

[follower of Christ]

Hey now. Let's be civil.

Yes, lets.
how about this. The next time I see a post of his that is attacking our faith or God I'll start reporting him every 10 minutes until something is done
Coming here genuinely seeking answers from christians is one thing. THIS chap however ISNT. He's been insulting and attacking from post 1 from what I can tell. We ARENT obligated to put up with it.

Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

 

[jasoncran]

no we arent

people do come here just to troll and not seek answers.

i have no problem with an atheist who disagree and are pollite, and come here to post civily.

edited things out with apologies.

 

[Tissue]

Oh. I hadn't read any of his other posts. Ok then.

 

[elijah23]

Technically life in Hell is still eternal Sure, if after I'm dead the Christian God came up to me and said "Now do you believe!" I'd of course say yes lol, but if he wants be to unjustly believe down here then I suppose he's predestined me to Hell (Why make me anyway if he knew I was just going to Hell?)

You guys are all monsters if you wouldn't be unhappy knowing your God has destined your loved ones to eternal torture.

Hell is eternal—does that mean anyone gets sent there forever? I would think the Lord only sends people there long enough to learn a lesson. If I refuse ever to repent of my sin, I imagine I’ll spend eternity there.

I know a lot of people disagree with me.

 

[Sir Pwn4lot]

Technically life in Hell is still eternal Sure, if after I'm dead the Christian God came up to me and said "Now do you believe!" I'd of course say yes lol, but if he wants be to unjustly believe down here then I suppose he's predestined me to Hell (Why make me anyway if he knew I was just going to Hell?)

You guys are all monsters if you wouldn't be unhappy knowing your God has destined your loved ones to eternal torture.

Hell is eternal—does that mean anyone gets sent there forever? I would think the Lord only sends people there long enough to learn a lesson. If I refuse ever to repent of my sin, I imagine I’ll spend eternity there.

I know a lot of people disagree with me.

In that case I'm in the clear! ZING! Why give up your intellectual honesty when you don't have to?

 

[elijah23]

In that case I'm in the clear! ZING! Why give up your intellectual honesty when you don't have to?

I appreciate the compliment. However, I’m only speculating.

 

[Sir Pwn4lot]

In that case I'm in the clear! ZING! Why give up your intellectual honesty when you don't have to?

I appreciate the compliment. However, I’m only speculating.

There's a reason why they put the punishment for non-belief at an infinite level, because it takes a lot to make a man abandon his logic & intellectual honesty.

 

[Orion]

I'm unsure as to why a system of "belief without proof" ever became "holy" in the first place. Especially when most of it goes against logic and evidence. Is there something special about a person who believes what OTHER people "said is true", when there is nothing else to go on? It is a mystery to me, to be honest.

Oh, to answer your OP, . . . . IF I made it to heaven and knew one of my family members was spending an eternity of pain, . . . .IF I retained who I am today, then absolutely NO, I would not be happy with that. And I would hope that anyone would think the same way. This whole "they deserve it for not being perfect" is immoral and unethical.