abortion is murder, and how shall we respond to it

[kenmaynard]

I think abortion can only be allowed in the case of the pregnant woman's life being at risk.

That's how Planned Parenthood sold the procedure in the beginning. Then it grew little by little.

No the legal right to an abortion is seated in the right to privacy. That the government can't interject itself into the relationship between Dr. and Patient until the baby becomes viable.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roe_v._Wade

 

[Rick W]

That's how Planned Parenthood sold the procedure in the beginning. Then it grew little by little.

Roe vs Wade came after Planned Parenthood's advocacy for abortion to save a mother's life. Roe vs Wade later enforced Planned Parenthood's campaign for abortion as we know it today.

 

[kenmaynard]

[quote="Rick W":202k8zwo]
That's how Planned Parenthood sold the procedure in the beginning. Then it grew little by little.

Roe vs Wade came after Planned Parenthood's advocacy for abortion to save a mother's life. Roe vs Wade later enforced Planned Parenthood's campaign for abortion as we know it today.[/quote:202k8zwo]

You say sold. Are you suggesting that abortion should be illegal even when the mother will die? I am pro life, but I don't fall for the conspiracy theories either. Planned parenthood serves a purpose. They actually do a lot of good. Getting women prenatal care to have a healthy baby. Their website is a good place to check them out. I don't hate planned parenthood. Even on their own website they say If you are considering an abortion you should think about parenting classes or about adoption.

From their website
There are two kinds of abortion in the U.S.  in-clinic abortion and the abortion pill.

Abortions are very common. In fact, more than 1 out of 3 women in the U.S. have an abortion by the time they are 45 years old.

If you are trying to decide if abortion is the right choice for you, you probably have many things to think about. Learning the facts about abortion may help you in making your decision. You may also want to learn more about parenting and adoption.

 

[Rick W]

At first the proposition seemed moral enough until one begins to think of how many instances is the mother's life really in danger these days to deliver a child. In any case people seemed to agree to it. But what they really agreed to unwittingly enough was the normalization of abortion as a common procedure.
The story of the tent and camel comes to mind.

 

[kenmaynard]

At first the proposition seemed moral enough until one begins to think of how many instances is the mother's life really in danger these days to deliver a child. In any case people seemed to agree to it. But what they really agreed to unwittingly enough was the normalization of abortion as a common procedure.
The story of the tent and camel comes to mind.

Yes selfish women get abortions. That doesn't mean abortion should be illegal. It simply means we have to do a better job of convincing them not to get abortions. How many women see supposedly "Christian people say to hell with those welfare queens". If you have no education, can't make any money, but get pregnant the world is very likely a hard and scary place. Kindness and generosity is the only solution that I can think of.

 

[Rick W]

Yeah, being responsible for one's actions can be a bit inconvenient I suppose. And it wouldn't be right to bring up children in a hard world so it would be best to be merciful.

 

[kenmaynard]

Yeah, being responsible for one's actions can be a bit inconvenient I suppose. And it wouldn't be right to bring up children in a hard world so it would be best to be merciful.

What are you talking about? Responsible how? Leave the baby with who while you go to that minimum wage job? Read the statistics about who actually gets abortions in this country. They aren't living the high life. Most abortions are performed on the uneducated and poor. I think they feel bad enough already. So sad the hatefulness here.

 

[ThisisThaLord]

ANYONE who kills passes judgemen t upon themselves even in the defense of ones own self governance. you think there is a reason to kill well yOU ARE WRONG! god gave us a will to use freely and on the judgement you gonna say

"well if i didn't kill this innocent unborn child then there was going be complications"

This is why the Lord made man. man should be in charge of all the decision amking i don't understand why a woman, who couldn't never afford to have or bear a child without a man, should have the right to say what it is she just wants instead of what Jesus told her to do.

that's right he said to love his neighbor.

and i tell you that Jesus has spoken here to me TODAY and told me to find the way and i am glad i came here to tell all yall that this here is the work of the devil. The devil he is working in an against us.

abortion is murder. you wanna explain that to God one day den go ahead. i don't care. I know i'm holy I know his own son talk to me. You think i'm playin just watch it when you go see the Lord.

tell him bout your abortions.

 

[Lewis]

:naughty

I think abortion can only be allowed in the case of the pregnant woman's life being at risk.

:verysick

That's a trade off, is your life worth more than the babies life ? Ok you all, I promise, that I won't get all worked up, because you guy's know how I feel about abortion.

Your Baby in the Womb
Some of my patients are startled when they see an ultrasound of their baby and it appears that the baby has its mouth open. In addition to turning over and moving their hands and feet, babies do open and close their mouths in the womb. The fetus may also suck its thumb or finger.
Digestive System Develops
By 21 weeks, the fetal digestive system has developed enough to allow the fetus to swallow amniotic fluid. The fetus absorbs much of the water in the swallowed fluid. Hydrochloric acid and adult digestive enzymes are present in small amounts in the fetal digestive system at 21 weeks.
Researchers believe swallowing amniotic fluid may help growth and development of the fetal digestive system. It may also condition the digestive system to function after birth. By the time a baby is born, he or she may swallow large amounts of amniotic fluid, as much as 17 ounces (500ml) of amniotic fluid in a 24-hour period.
Eyes Open
Your baby can open its eyes inside the uterus. Eyelids cover the eyes and are fused or connected around 11 to 12 weeks. They remain fused until about 27 to 28 weeks, when they open.
Hearing Begins
A baby can hear inside the womb, before it is born. Life inside the womb may be like living near a busy freeway. The developing baby hears a constant background of digestive noises and the maternal heartbeat. The mother-to-be's voice is also heard, although the fetus may not hear higher-pitched tones. There is evidence that by the third trimester the fetus responds to sounds it hears. Researchers have noted fetal heart-rate increases in response to tones it hears through the mother's abdomen. Newborns have been found to prefer their mother's voice to a stranger's, which suggests they recognize the mother's voice. They have also been found to prefer their mother's native language, and they respond strongly to a recording of an intrauterine heartbeat.
And then foolish selfish people go and kill them.

 

[jasoncran]

kenmaynard look up the founder of planned parenthood margaret sanger, and then tell me if what she planned to do with the abortion isnt happenting perfeclty and also if one cant afford or have the will to take care of the child then put it up for adoption, instead of killing the baby, i have an elder in my church who does adopt and or foster unwanted children and hes a few of his own.

jason

 

[Ed the Ned]

Id this a subject we should even be discussing, people are debating whether fibbing is a sin and the majority of the people have said yes fibbing is a sin. YET WE HAVE CHRISTIANS WHO STILL DEFEND ABORTION
ABORTION IS MURDER AND SHOULD BE SEEN AS MURDER

 

[jasoncran]

Id this a subject we should even be discussing, people are debating whether fibbing is a sin and the majority of the people have said yes fibbing is a sin. YET WE HAVE CHRISTIANS WHO STILL DEFEND ABORTION
ABORTION IS MURDER AND SHOULD BE SEEN AS MURDER

never will say it aint murder, it is murder that why started this thread as response to lewis w.

but there must be away to get those mothers to avoid that visit to the abortion clinic and there is it's called adoption or what have in Florida care net. I have stated that, and yes it wrongs,but look at it this way adoption is a good alternative for a mother who's scared, too young to care for the new born child, maybe when she's ready she can be a part of the child's life, but what sickens me is the fact that planned parenthood(abortion) pushed the abortion not the alternative, they take advantage of those hurting women, some do it out of selfishness, but that's another topic i'm not going to get into i'm not a woman, let a pro-lifer woman comment on that.

jason

 

[Tina]

^

Well then , all you guys that talk big , let's say a gynae tells you that your pregnant wife's life is in grave danger unless the foetus is aborted .... what will you do ?


:bigfrown :o

 

[whirlwind]

Recently, at one of the "town hall meetings" on Obama's health care plan, the featured speaker was Claire McCaskill, senator from Missouri. When questioned about abortion she replied...."there is NO provision for abortion in this health care plan." :o

Wake up America! The democrats fought long and hard to keep any mention of abortion out of the bill. Why? If it isn't mentioned as a covered procedure then IT IS COVERED AUTOMATICALLY.

 

[Lewis]

Pictures are at bottom of post as well as a video link

Baby grabbing Dr's hand from the womb is now 9 years old and is thankful to God that he was in that picture..

"It's just a miracle picture, a miracle moment," Clancy told FOXNews.com. "It shows the earliest human interaction ever recorded."

The baby in the picture to the left is now 9 years old. Fox News recently reported and don't miss YouTube of House MD episode below:

""When I see that picture, the first thing I think of is how special and lucky I am to have God use me that way," Samuel told FOXNews.com. "I feel very thankful that I was in that picture."

"It's very important to me," Samuel told Fox News. "A lot of babies would've lost their lives if that didn't happen."

On Aug. 19, 1999, photographer Michael Clancy shot the "Fetal Hand Grasp"  his picture of a 21-week-old fetus grasping a doctor's finger during innovative surgery to correct spina bifida. Nearly four months later, on Dec. 2, Samuel Armas was "born famous."

The photo, which first appeared in USA Today on Sept. 7, 1999, quickly spread across the globe as proof of development in the womb and was later cited during congressional debates on the Partial-Birth Abortion Ban Act, which passed in 2000.

"It's just a miracle picture, a miracle moment," Clancy told FOXNews.com. "It shows the earliest human interaction ever recorded."

Samuel, now 9 and living in Villa Rica, Ga., said the photo likely gave countless "babies their right to live" and forced many others to debate their beliefs on abortion, something he's proud of."

LifeNews.com reports what the mother said and the once pro-abort photographer of this event now pro-life speaker.

"He identifies it more in terms of a pro-life message more than anything," she said. "This photo happened and God used it to show people that this baby in mom's tummy is alive. He's pleased that his photo conveyed that message."

Michael Clancy, the photographer who took the now-famous picture, told Fox News he supported legal abortion before the picture and now he makes a living sharing the story with pro-life groups.

"And that's what I'm going to do, keep telling this story," he said. "It can change people's hearts. What started off as an assignment turned into a responsibility to keep telling the story behind it."

On Michael Clancy's blog he writes:

"The story of Samuel reaching from the womb is a story about blessings. At 43 years old I came to what I call, “The end of myself.†God had blessed me when HE put a camera in my hand, but that wasn’t enough. I wanted/needed more. HE led me to the tiny church in the mountains of North Carolina and guided me through HIS path to salvation. Three months after I professed my faith to my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, I received the assignment to photograph Samuel’s surgery. I had always wanted someone in my life I loved so much I was willing to die for them. Someone that was willing to die for me. I found HIM! HE had patiently waited for me, and HE blessed me with Love, Forgiveness, Works, and such blessing there was not enough room to receive it. Bless you, Michael C."-Emphasis is Michael's own. Glory be to God.
Now in the 2 pictures below one when he grew to be 9 and the other when he grabbed the doctors hand, suppose they had killed him, he would not be here to be the beautiful boy that he now is. And don't forget to watch this video, of the baby, interacting with the doctor.
http://www.youtube.com/verify_age?&next ... r_embedded

 

[kenmaynard]

Id this a subject we should even be discussing, people are debating whether fibbing is a sin and the majority of the people have said yes fibbing is a sin. YET WE HAVE CHRISTIANS WHO STILL DEFEND ABORTION
ABORTION IS MURDER AND SHOULD BE SEEN AS MURDER

So are you saying that the Dr and mother should be tried in court for murder? If convicted how long should they spend in prison?

 

[Lewis]

^

Well then , all you guys that talk big , let's say a gynae tells you that your pregnant wife's life is in grave danger unless the foetus is aborted .... what will you do ?


:bigfrown :o

Are you a abortion advocate or something ?

 

[kenmaynard]

^

Well then , all you guys that talk big , let's say a gynae tells you that your pregnant wife's life is in grave danger unless the foetus is aborted .... what will you do ?


:bigfrown :o

Are you a abortion advocate or something ?

I don't think one has to be an abortion advocate to realize the issue is not always black and white. The law says we have the right to defend ourselves. If the pregnancy is a real threat to the mothers life it is abortion in self defense. Why did you avoid the question? Do you believe abortion should never be legal under any circumstance even if it will kill the mother?

 

[Lewis]

No trade offs

 

[Caroline H]

I don't think one has to be an abortion advocate to realize the issue is not always black and white. The law says we have the right to defend ourselves. If the pregnancy is a real threat to the mothers life it is abortion in self defense. Why did you avoid the question? Do you believe abortion should never be legal under any circumstance even if it will kill the mother?

Abortion to save the mother’s life

Between 1967 and 1990, only 151 abortions have been carried out to save the mother's life, a figure amounting to 0.004% of all abortions. (Dr Michael Jarmulowicz, cited in The Physical and Psycho-Social effects of Abortion on Women: A Report by the Commission of Inquiry into the Operation and Consequences of The Abortion Act, June 1994 p. 5)

In 1992, a group of Ireland's top gynaecologists wrote: "We affirm that there are no medical circumstances justifying direct abortion, that is, no circumstances in which the life of a mother may only be saved by directly terminating the life of her unborn child." (John Bonner, Eamon O'Dwyer, David Jenkins, Kieran O'Driscoll, Julia Vaughan, 'Statement by Obstetricians', The Irish Times 1 April 1992)

When Dublin's National Maternity Hospital (where 10% of all births in Ireland occurred) investigated the 21 deaths of pregnant women there between 1970-1979, they found that not a single one of those deaths could have been avoided by abortion. (Irish Medical Journal 1982 vol. 75, pp. 304-306)

Ireland, a country where the unborn child is constitutionally protected, has the lowest maternal death rate in the world. The UK, where abortion is available practically on demand, has over five times Ireland's maternal death rate. (World Health Organisation: maternal deaths, three-year average)

Developments in medicine mean that the 'abortion to save the mother's life' argument is becoming harder and harder to justify. It is now possible for women with heart defects to carry a baby to term with expert help and life-threatening conditions such as cancer can often be treated without harming the unborn child. Women facing difficult pregnancies have a right to the best available medical support.

Direct abortion is the deliberate killing of an unborn child. Treatment to save the life of the mother that results in the death of the child as an expected but not intended side effect is not a direct abortion, e.g. in the case of an ectopic pregnancy. In this situation, the baby begins to develop in the woman's fallopian tube and has to be removed or the tube will rupture and cause the death of the woman. This involves the unavoidable death of the unborn baby but the aim of the operation is to save the mother not to kill the baby.
http://www.spuc.org.uk/students/abortion/mothers