[_ Old Earth _] Are there consequences to believeing in evolution?

[Gabe]

I see that intellectual bullying is alive and well in the theistic evolutionary belief system.

If you are referring to coelacanth, he is not a theist. Besides (if you want to generalise), when it comes to bullying fellow believers, YE creationists win the contest hands-down. You need only read some of the posts made in this forum by creationists, to realise that.

 

[GojuBrian]

I was referring to barbarian, but your point is noted.

I suppose intellectual bulliers come in all flavors. :D

 

[Barbarian]

It's always a bad idea to suggest one is ignorant, if one doesn't know for sure.

Intellectual Bullying attempt:

You can do some research on that "rumor" and decide for yourself. Your choice, after all.

Barbarian's response:
I have a degree in microbiololgy. I've done graduate work in immunology. I'm no HIV expert, but I do know what the evidence is in this case.

GojuBrian seems rather miffed that the bullying backfired this time. For the obvious reasons.

 

[Gabe]

I was referring to barbarian, but your point is noted.

IMO there was no intellectual bullying (or something that could be mistaken for it) by Barbarian and I don't think Fembot took his comments as such.

 

[Fembot]

It's always a bad idea to suggest one is ignorant, if one doesn't know for sure.

Intellectual Bullying attempt:

You can do some research on that "rumor" and decide for yourself. Your choice, after all.

I did not attempt to bully you. I suggested that you do your own research on what you called rumors (other people's beliefs)

Barbarian's response:
I have a degree in microbiololgy./i]

As for your microbiology degree: 3 Whoooo hooo
So what? Is every grad automatically a genius or expert on a subject? Not saying you aren't but that does not help your case IMO. Now if you said you lead the best research team in the country, I'd say you have a better chance of knowing the truth. But I am not one to put 100% trust in man.

 

[Fembot]

I see that intellectual bullying is alive and well in the theistic evolutionary belief system.

What are you talking about?

Btw, your kids are CUTE (show your photo forum)

 

[Fembot]

I recall in history a time where leading scientists taught society that black people weren't humans but in fact monkeys. They went out of there way to show research studies! hhhhmmmm
Does anyone else recall this moment in history. To whoever believed that mess!

Psalms 149:4
For the LORD takes delight in his people; he crowns the humble with salvation.

Proverbs 11:2
When pride comes, then comes disgrace, but with humility comes wisdom

Proverbs 16:18-19
Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall. Better to be lowly in spirit and among the oppressed than to share plunder with the proud.


If you know your history

Then you would know where you’re coming from -Bob Marley

 

[GojuBrian]

Thankyou!

I was referring to the poster who was arguing his point based on his education level.

 

[GojuBrian]

I recall in history a time where leading scientists taught society that black people weren't humans but monkeys. Does anyone else recall this moment in history. To whoever believed that!

Psalms 149:4
For the LORD takes delight in his people; he crowns the humble with salvation.

Proverbs 11:2
When pride comes, then comes disgrace, but with humility comes wisdom

Proverbs 16:18-19
Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall. Better to be lowly in spirit and among the oppressed than to share plunder with the proud.

Darwin's evilution has always been very racist and sexist.

 

[Fembot]

I recall in history a time where leading scientists taught society that black people weren't humans but monkeys. Does anyone else recall this moment in history. To whoever believed that!

Psalms 149:4
For the LORD takes delight in his people; he crowns the humble with salvation.

Proverbs 11:2
When pride comes, then comes disgrace, but with humility comes wisdom

Proverbs 16:18-19
Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall. Better to be lowly in spirit and among the oppressed than to share plunder with the proud.

Darwin's evilution has always been very racist and sexist.

Yes. But I can believe in a creatures evolving (plants, organisms, humans) AND believe that God plays a role in that. I don't see the two as black and white. This is my stance. I don't let men ball park me. Because I believe in evolution and creation doesn't mean someone can come along and link me with Darwin or anyone else's theories.

I'm not saying you are linking me Goju. I'm just reiterating my opinion on the matter.

 

[GojuBrian]

What do you think has evolved and do you have biblical back up for this?

No, I wasn't linking you in, I was responding to the racism and sexism in darwinistic evolution.

I can see adaptation and we can prove adaptation, not evolution.

 

[Barbarian]

What do you think has evolved and do you have biblical back up for this?

All populations evolve. We can observe it happening. And the evidence is overwhelming that all living things on Earth have a common ancestor. The Bible doesn't say, either way, but then God left some things for us to find out for ourselves.

No, I wasn't linking you in, I was responding to the racism and sexism in darwinistic evolution.

You mean like claiming blacks are intellectually and spiritually inferior? But Henry Morris, who made that claim, was the founder of the largest creationist organization in the world. Modern scientists aren't racists because evolutionary theory has shown that there are no biological human races. But creationists like Morris and Bob Jones continued to blather about such racist claptrap into the 90s.

Darwin, as you probably know, was considered a progressive on race for his day, because unlike many creationists, he opposed slavery, and asserted that all men were entitled to freedom and dignity.

I can see adaptation and we can prove adaptation, not evolution.

Adaptation is evolution. It's just evolution small enough that it doesn't scare you.

 

[Barbarian]

I recall in history a time where leading scientists taught society that black people weren't humans but in fact monkeys.

Hmmm... the last scientist of any note to deny that blacks were the same species as other humans was Agassiz, who died around 1900. He was very opposed to the idea of evolution, BTW. Modern science shows that there is no such thing as biological human races. There is more variation within any "race" you might want to designate, than there is between them.

They went out of there way to show research studies! hhhhmmmm
Does anyone else recall this moment in history. To whoever believed that mess!

Darwin thought that there were less-evolved humans, but he never thought they were descended from monkeys. He thought we were all one species, having evolved from ape-like ancestors.

 

[coelacanth]

Darwin's evilution has always been very racist and sexist.

People can be racist or sexist. Evolution is a process by which living organisms change over time. If people decide to abuse and misapply information learned from evolutionary studies in order to assert superiority or commit atrocities, it is the PERSON doing such horrible things, and it wouldn't even take evolutionary theory to do it. It would be the same sort of misapplication that I would assume you would consider genocide to be if the genocide were based on the thinking that the book of Joshua says it's ok with God to slaughter innocents.

 

[Fembot]

They went out of there way to show research studies! hhhhmmmm
Does anyone else recall this moment in history. To whoever believed that mess!

Darwin thought that there were less-evolved humans, but he never thought they were descended from monkeys. He thought we were all one species, having evolved from ape-like ancestors.

I didn't mention Darwin. There were several researches which claimed blacks were monkeys. Just as recent as the early 1900's and during cilvil rights. But the time doesn't matter. As I stated A TIME IN HISTORY, not a specific time period.
Please don't divert from the fact that I was proving a point: not every research is to be trusted.

 

[Fembot]

We are one race, correct. But this is poor research stories at their finest. Pg 20 first passage. Doesn't matter how long ago. This is a great example of poor research studies.

http://books.google.com/books?id=lGF6wu ... 1#PPR17,M1

 

[Barbarian]

I don't think I've read any scientific papers like that. And yes, there certainly are people who thought blacks were inferior to whites for genetic reasons:

Yet the prophecy again has its obverse side. Somehow they have only gone so far and no farther. The Japhethites and Semites have, sooner or later, taken over their territories, and their inventions, and then developed them and utilized them for their own enlargement. Often the Hamites, especially the Negroes, have become actual personal servants or even slaves to the others. Possessed of a genetic character concerned mainly with mundane matters, they have eventually been displaced by the intellectual and philosophical acumen of the Japhethites and the religious zeal of the Semites.
Henry Morris, founder of the Institute for Creation Research, in "The Beginning of the World"

Complete codswallop, of course. He was no geneticist. It's just a bit of racial slander he tried to dress up in semi scientific terms.

BTW, a study of kids in British orphanages shows a slight, but significant difference in intelligence between black and white kids. But the black kids have the higher IQs. I doubt if it's really racial, but it sort of puts Henry's claim in the dumpster.

In this country, the "data" from the Yerkes study of army inductees is often cited to show a difference. Much is made of the fact that whites scored higher on the test.

What they don't want to admit is that northern blacks scored higher than southern whites.

 

[Fembot]

What do you think has evolved and do you have biblical back up for this?

No, I wasn't linking you in, I was responding to the racism and sexism in darwinistic evolution.

I can see adaptation and we can prove adaptation, not evolution.

I already answered this. If it's in this thread, I can copy and paste it for you ?

 

[coelacanth]

One person whose views on the topic of evolution and morality is very interesting is Peter Singer (bioethics professor at Princeton best known from his animal liberation views). His moral standpoint is not one that everyone who accepts evolution agrees with, obviously, but it is well thought out and worth taking a look at for a logical view of morality that contradicts a few traditional Christian moral principles and advancing others in various ways.

[Edit: typo]

 

[Crying Rock]

Who were the first Caucasians in Europe:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/scien ... 78537.html

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/scien ... opup&ino=2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7B7bVD_DkM4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnzCu-EZVGk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeOqD3uMIRs


Any doubts here that Carly is Caucasian?

Any doubts here that Europe's current population is dominated by Caucasians?