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Ark Plan Sparks Church-State Controversy

Lewis

Lewis

Member
Ark Plan Sparks Church-State Controversy

Noah's Park: Kentucky 'Ark Encounter' Plans Full Scale Replica of Noah's ArkDisneyland has its castle and Epcot has its ball, but the centerpiece of a planned theme park in Kentucky will be something altogether different -- a full-scale replica of Noah's Ark.
Developers in Kentucky are drawing up plans for a $150 million theme park called the Ark Encounter, to be built on a biblical scale. The ark alone will be taller than a three-story building, the deck longer than 35 tennis courts. Constructed out of timber using dimensions from Genesis, planners say it will be big enough to fit 600 train cars inside.

Watch this important video here on page 1 and 2
http://abcnews.go.com/Travel/planne...park-kentucky-sparks-church/story?id=12326873


Watch "World News with Diane Sawyer" for more on this story tonight on ABC.
"We think the ark and the account of Noah's flood, even though it happened 4,000 or 5,000 years ago, can actually speak volumes today to our culture," said Mark Looy, a developer of the park who co-founded the nearby Creation Museum.
The park won't have any rides, but plans suggest that there will be plenty to do. In addition to the full-scale wooden ark, there will be live stage shows, museums, theaters, a petting zoo, and even a Tower of Babel.
While the Bible says it took Noah 100 years to build his ark, the Kentucky version should take closer to three years. Though its creators are just now settling on a site for the park, they say it should open in the spring of 2014 near Williamstown in northern Kentucky.

Kentucky Offers Tax Breaks for Ark Project

Kentucky's Democratic governor has signed on to the plan, promising almost $40 million in tax breaks for a project that is expected to create 900 jobs. According to a feasibility study for the park, 1.6 million visitors could show up in the first full year alone, and the project could generate $250 million in state revenue.
"Bringing new jobs to Kentucky is my top priority, and with the estimated 900 jobs this project will create, I am happy about the economic impact this project will have on the Northern Kentucky region," said Gov. Steve Beshear at a press conference announcing the plans.
The governor describes it as a lifeboat for his struggling state, but not everyone is aboard. The ark has opened up the flood gates of controversy, with critics charging that it's a direct violation of the separation of church and state.
"A private company can build a theme park about the Bible. But the government shouldn't be using its money to advance religion. That's what's unconstitutional about this," said Erwin Chemerinsky, a constitutional scholar at the University of California, Irvine School of Law. "It's wrong to force people to pay tax dollars to support religions they don't belong to."


Ark Plan Sparks Church-State Controversy

The governor has dismissed the criticism, saying Ark Encounter is above all else an economic development project and that the tax breaks don't violate the separation of church and state.
"The people of Kentucky didn't elect me governor to debate religion. The elected me governor to create jobs, and that's what we're doing here," said Beshear. "Our laws don't allow us to discriminate as to entertainment subject matter of a theme park. And as long as it is legal and meets all of our criteria, I think it's clearly constitutional."
Ark Encounter's creators are hardly the first to identify religion as a potent tourist attraction. Christian-themed shows are a staple at the midwestern entertainment hub, Branson, Missouri, and even in New York City, a glittering nativity scene has been one of the highlights of the Radio City Christmas Spectacular for decades.
In Orlando, a Bible-themed park has been open for years. The 15-acre Holy Land Experience seeks to bring biblical stories to life, including daily recreations of the Last Supper, Christ's death on the Cross, and his resurrection. There's even a spot where guests can pose walking on water with Jesus.
The Ark's developers have also operated the popular and controversial Creation Museum in Petersburg, Ky., since 2007, located about 40 miles away from the planned ark park. The museum features high-tech exhibits like animatronic dinosaurs, illustrating the museum's narrative that God created dinosaurs and man at the same time, an idea that many Christians would dispute.
Some 1.2 million visitors have toured the Creation Museum since it opened, making it both popular and profitable, but not built with state funding.
Planned Noah's Ark Encounter Park in Kentucky Sparks Church-State Controversy - ABC News
 
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I only read the first paragraph, but that is AWESOME! I'd go to the States to see it! :thumbsup
 
Yeah Nick but some secular people are already trying to shoot it down, but the governor said that his only concern is that the state makes money out the Ark. All this is in the videos. I would go down there to see that. I think that Christians should get behind this, because if there is enough of us behind it, it will go through. But many Christians today are so selfish, that they won't get behind anything.
 
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Leave it to the radicals to shoot the idea down! They are so quick to cut the idea down but don't realize that this project will take a long time and people of all races and creeds will be able to find employment through this project!

I would love to visit the Ark one day. How amazing would it be to stand inside or walk around and imagine what Noah went through.
 
I think the park would be fun for Christians, but we shouldn't jump to conclusions before we here both sides.

I don't think this violates any separation on its cover. As long as the tax cuts are just for the jobs, then that's legal. If its for the park itself, that's a no no.

Until we find the full story and find out exactly what was being criticised, or who is criticizing it. It would be a good idea to not turn this into a "the word hates me" thread.

;)
 
Exactly what church is are they trying to seperate?

Good job atheists in Kentucky, the legislator guts out a tax break to generate jobs and they try to kill it.

well done bozo's
 
This would be interesting to see, but note my cautionary question below.

Lewis W said:
Ark Plan Sparks Church-State Controversy

Noah's Park: Kentucky 'Ark Encounter' Plans Full Scale Replica of Noah's ArkDisneyland has its castle and Epcot has its ball, but the centerpiece of a planned theme park in Kentucky will be something altogether different -- a full-scale replica of Noah's Ark.
Developers in Kentucky are drawing up plans for a $150 million theme park called the Ark Encounter, to be built on a biblical scale. The ark alone will be taller than a three-story building, the deck longer than 35 tennis courts. Constructed out of timber using dimensions from Genesis, planners say it will be big enough to fit 600 train cars inside.

Watch this important video here on page 1 and 2
Planned Noah's Ark Encounter Park in Kentucky Sparks Church-State Controversy - ABC News
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An interesting sound-byte I noticed in the first video is the reporter asking, "Why not two of every animal?" presumably asking why they are not planning on putting two of every kind of animal in the ark/museum, and the guy answers "Because we are talking about 10,000 pairs of animals" - and, as with most sound-bytes, it is left hanging there.

Does this help or hurt the Genesis story as told? Meaning is this an adequate representation?

I suppose it depends on people's criterion for "different animals" between animals of related species. For example will there be a lion, a tiger, a cheeta, a leopard, a panther, a jaguar, and a puma/cougar/mountain lion in the ark/museum (or rather were there all these types of animals on Noah's ark?), or were ther originally fewer types of cats in Noah's day that later rapidly diversified (via microevolution & natural breeding [as we did with house cats] - an idea creationists generally do not object to)? We know that saber-tooths died out at some point also.

Anyway, can't you just anticipate the scenario where an atheist comes to the ark/museum and taunts snidely, "What? Didn't have enough room....?"

-Josh
 
Depending on the species you probably wouldn't be able to restore a population from just two species the only way you could do so would be through inbreeding whitch would result in a huge loss of genetic diversity in most species and depending on the species the loss might be so acute that the species isn't viable for wild repopulation. This was unfortunatly observed with some species of Cheetah in victorian era where they just inbred a whole load of them set them free and they all died of a virus whitch obliterated there population. 5000 years wouldn't be sufficent for genetic diversity to return and speciation to occur it would take much longer.

Not only that there is a problem with this idea the fact is most aquatic species can only survive in specific water conditions still water/Salt water/Warm/Cold if the rain was so bad that it flooded the planet the seawater would have mixed and most aquatic life would have died out unless noah took those aquatic species aswell. Of course this isn't accounting for canrivours and the diverse diets for all those species the tonnage of such a vessel would have to be absolutely massive.

It's possible that noah knew of quantum folding to fit all those animals in however if that was the case then the bouyancy of such a vessel would be effected. :/ It dosen't work out.
 
I think that people will come to this Ark and some will be saved because of the Biblical questions that will be asked, and this will provide great chances for evangelizing. And also there are millions of secular places to go to and take your families so why can't we have a place that shows what God has done to the saved and the non saved. This country was founded by Christians even though they had a lot of things wrong like slavery, it was founded upon the Bible, but yet outside of our churches we have nothing. And when something does come along it gets shot down by the secular and Christians alike.
 
craigmn3 said:
Exactly what church is are they trying to seperate?
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The government is not allowed to endorse any religion. Simple

Good job atheists in Kentucky,
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What proof do you have that it was atheists, and do you have any real names that you want to bring to this? Or are you just mad because they are an easy target?
the legislator guts out a tax break to generate jobs and they try to kill it.
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No, that's not what seems to be going on here. What is being debated is what exactly these tax cuts are going for. If its just for the jobs, then its ok, but if its for the park itself, then that would be an endorsement which is illegal for the government to do.

well done bozo's
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Until you can give me a group's name and or the names of real people, I only see one bozo.
 
Hey, can I get some tax payer money to build Hindu Land? It could create Jobs, and we could even put some fun rides and museums there. Won't it be great?!

Think of all the jobs it will create! :)
 
This is another topic, but there is no such thing as Separation of Church and State. and please don't give me that letter that Jefferson wrote because it don't cut it.
 
Lewis W said:
This is another topic, but there is no such thing as Separation of Church and State. and please don't give me that letter that Jefferson wrote because it don't cut it.
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I also know you won't accept the first amendment, constitutional article stating no religious tests can be given, and you won't accept the treaty of tripolli, and you won't accept any of the founder's ideas about why religion and government shouldn't mix.

Its quite easy to state that there is no evidence if you refuse to accept any.
 
Pebbles said:
Depending on the species you probably wouldn't be able to restore a population from just two species the only way you could do so would be through inbreeding whitch would result in a huge loss of genetic diversity in most species and depending on the species the loss might be so acute that the species isn't viable for wild repopulation. This was unfortunatly observed with some species of Cheetah in victorian era where they just inbred a whole load of them set them free and they all died of a virus whitch obliterated there population. 5000 years wouldn't be sufficent for genetic diversity to return and speciation to occur it would take much longer.

Not only that there is a problem with this idea the fact is most aquatic species can only survive in specific water conditions still water/Salt water/Warm/Cold if the rain was so bad that it flooded the planet the seawater would have mixed and most aquatic life would have died out unless noah took those aquatic species aswell. Of course this isn't accounting for canrivours and the diverse diets for all those species the tonnage of such a vessel would have to be absolutely massive.

It's possible that noah knew of quantum folding to fit all those animals in however if that was the case then the bouyancy of such a vessel would be effected. :/ It dosen't work out.
Click to expand...

This post doubts the Biblical record.

This is a Christian site. Maybe if there is a desire to come here and doubt the Biblical record, then maybe another site would be preferable to post on, but I'm not a mod, anyway.
 
farouk said:
This post doubts the Biblical record.

This is a Christian site. Maybe if there is a desire to come here and doubt the Biblical record, then maybe another site would be preferable to post on, but I'm not a mod, anyway.
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pebbles isnt a christian and while i disagree with that position of hers. but it doesnt violate the tos.
 
farouk said:
This post doubts the Biblical record.

This is a Christian site. Maybe if there is a desire to come here and doubt the Biblical record, then maybe another site would be preferable to post on, but I'm not a mod, anyway.
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Okay I've done it again... I'm merely trying to make a convoluted point that the story dosen't make any sense if taken literally but I don't wish to outright say that such ideas are impossible, and potentially offend some people. With me patronizingly saying that they are stupid. because that's just not a good way of going about it.

Perhaps the story of noahs flood was more symbolic. As some stories in the bible are apparently according to yourselfs intended to be taken metaphorically or the point wasn't clearly known.
Ie the story where jesus had a fat off rage at a fig tree and smashed it up with the holy wroth. Isn't a story about fig trees begin objects of your deities hate but apparently more about bearing fruit.
 
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