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Can a Person Get Saved Without Understanding The Trinity

Z

zotah

Member
I was saved at the age of 9 years old. And my whole life has had Jesus Christ as my personal Lord and Saviour.

My question is, If I got saved without knowing or understanding clearly that Jesus is Almighty God.

Does that mean that salvation is based completely on excepting Christ as your Lord and personal Saviour.

Or does it meant that you can not be saved until you understand that Jesus is God and also except him as your Lord and saviour.

The Bible says: I am the way the truth and the life no man cometh to the Father except by me.

It wasn't until later I understood that Jesus was God. So does that mean I really wasn't saved in the first place or does that mean my salavation really didn't come to be until I did understand that fact.

Another words is salvation of understanding that Jesus is God a requirment to being saved?

The reason I bring this up is that Philip in John 14:8-9 didn't even understand that Jesus was God up until this point:

John 14:8-9 (KJV) Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us. Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

So here we see Philip didn't even know up until this point in time that Jesus was God the Father and yet it would seem Philip was saved already trusting in Jesus.

Another Question: Can a person get saved if they don't believe that Jesus is God. What if someone trust Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Saviour but absolutly does not believe that Jesus is God.

If you answer that is imposible to be saved and believe that Jesus is not God then you have to say that a person can't be saved at all without the full understanding that Jesus is God.

You see my point,

Please let me know what you think?

Thanks,
Zotah
 
zotah said:
I was saved at the age of 9 years old. And my whole life has had Jesus Christ as my personal Lord and Saviour.

My question is, If I got saved without knowing or understanding clearly that Jesus is Almighty God.

Does that mean that salvation is based completely on excepting Christ as your Lord and personal Saviour.

Or does it meant that you can not be saved until you understand that Jesus is God and also except him as your Lord and saviour.

The Bible says: I am the way the truth and the life no man cometh to the Father except by me.

It wasn't until later I understood that Jesus was God. So does that mean I really wasn't saved in the first place or does that mean my salavation really didn't come to be until I did understand that fact.

Another words is salvation of understanding that Jesus is God a requirment to being saved?

The reason I bring this up is that Philip in John 14:8-9 didn't even understand that Jesus was God up until this point:

John 14:8-9 (KJV) Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us. Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

So here we see Philip didn't even know up until this point in time that Jesus was God the Father and yet it would seem Philip was saved already trusting in Jesus.

Another Question: Can a person get saved if they don't believe that Jesus is God. What if someone trust Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Saviour but absolutly does not believe that Jesus is God.

If you answer that is imposible to be saved and believe that Jesus is not God then you have to say that a person can't be saved at all without the full understanding that Jesus is God.

You see my point,

Please let me know what you think?

Thanks,
Zotah
Click to expand...

TO be saved,,,you must believe that Christ lived and died for your sins....YOu dont have to understand everything to a T,,,but once you become saved you should begin learning.........God kept salvation as easy as possible for our sakes......
 
zotah said:
I was saved at the age of 9 years old. And my whole life has had Jesus Christ as my personal Lord and Saviour.

My question is, If I got saved without knowing or understanding clearly that Jesus is Almighty God.

Does that mean that salvation is based completely on excepting Christ as your Lord and personal Saviour.

Or does it meant that you can not be saved until you understand that Jesus is God and also except him as your Lord and saviour.

The Bible says: I am the way the truth and the life no man cometh to the Father except by me.

It wasn't until later I understood that Jesus was God. So does that mean I really wasn't saved in the first place or does that mean my salavation really didn't come to be until I did understand that fact.

Another words is salvation of understanding that Jesus is God a requirment to being saved?

The reason I bring this up is that Philip in John 14:8-9 didn't even understand that Jesus was God up until this point:

John 14:8-9 (KJV) Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us. Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

So here we see Philip didn't even know up until this point in time that Jesus was God the Father and yet it would seem Philip was saved already trusting in Jesus.

Another Question: Can a person get saved if they don't believe that Jesus is God. What if someone trust Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Saviour but absolutly does not believe that Jesus is God.

If you answer that is imposible to be saved and believe that Jesus is not God then you have to say that a person can't be saved at all without the full understanding that Jesus is God.

You see my point,

Please let me know what you think?

Thanks,
Zotah
Click to expand...

Salvation is a process. Its not something that happened to you and now you are saved.I know many preach this, but its not true. You are on a road to salvation. It started and as you can see, you grew with time as the Lord started opening your eyes . Now , if you stay the course, you will be saved. You must be born from above through the Word of God.
 
The gospel is very simple, so simple that no only can a child understand it, a child's faith is the best example of faith according to Christ.

I believe that once you are born-again, you are on a journey of discovery. You discover things about your Savior that you would never have believed possible and it's a journey that will have no end.

As to whether or not a person who "absolutly does not believe that Jesus is God", again, one can be saved believing this, but as the Spirit works truth within their life, they should come to a much better understanding. If one is stiff-necked and stone-faced opposed to opening their heart to this truth, then I would exhort them to more fully examine their confession, their reason for believing that they are saved.
 
Can a person be saved without understanding that Jesus is God? Yes, I believe so. However, if one is truly saved then I believe that when confronted with the truth about Christ - that He is God in flesh - they will accept it. If they refuse, then I would question whether they have truly been born again by faith in the actual risen Lord Jesus.

An example I know personally is a an ex-Muslim guy I used to work with. He was saved before he was taught that Jesus is God, but as soon as he was told, he believed it.
 
How about this.
Scripture proves that Jesus IS the Word and that the Word IS God.

While a person probably doesnt have to have it all nailed down WHEN they become saved, Id say that I personally believe that WHEN a person knowingly and willingly DECIDES that they do not believe that Jesus is God in spite of what scripture shows, that I would begin to question the direction their walk was about to go in...ie I think they would be entering a realm of self deception that wont stop at just rejecting the Trinity
 
If having a perfect understanding of the Trinity was a pre-requisite for salvation, then none of us would be saved. :)
 
My friend,

I had the similar problem too. That why I cannot tell myself at which point of my life that I was saved. Because I misunderstood some foundational knowledge of who Jesus is.

I am so sad, why no one in the above commenters seem to see that you hold the non-orthodox Christian faith?!! Why one one saw that and point this out?

I am not dare to say someone must not be saved if he has not significant knowledge of God. (lack of knowledge)

But I am dare to say someone cannot be saved if he hold the non-orthodox Christian faith(opposite to what true Christian believe). In other word, if someone has a doctrine in his mind to believe Jesus is not God. The person cannot be saved.

Unfortunately, according to your own word.

"So here we see Philip didn't even know up until this point in time that Jesus was God the Father and yet it would seem Philip was saved already trusting in Jesus."

Even if you get it right Jesus is God. Your text show that up to the time that you left this question, you were not saved.(since my reply is one year later, I do not know what do you believe now.)

Do you know that you believe the heretical teaching?

According to the orthodox Christianity, you cannot be considerable yourself saved.
Because Jesus is not the Father, the Father is not the Son. And Jesus is the Son.

Read the anthanasian creed.
The Anthanasian Creed speaks of that mystery


This is the faith that all true Christians should hold. and the creed is not a denominational view. It is accepted by a lot of Churches as their confession of faith.

Also, be quick to know the true of God! If you feel confusing, read this doctrine by
ICCP:
Trinity
http://www.churchcouncil.org/ICCP_org/Documents_ICCP/English/08_Trinity_A&D.pdf

Seek help! if your even your pastor do not able to answer your question. send me e-mail and discuss with me.!
I am willing to talk of the holy Trinity and the two natures of Christ (He is 100%God and 100% man) in the soon future(probably within this month) in my blog.
Protestant Learners' Garden

It is urgent! look at what the teachings of the 2000 years orthodox Christianity without delay.
 
zotah said:
I was saved at the age of 9 years old. And my whole life has had Jesus Christ as my personal Lord and Saviour.

My question is, If I got saved without knowing or understanding clearly that Jesus is Almighty God.

Does that mean that salvation is based completely on excepting Christ as your Lord and personal Saviour.

Or does it meant that you can not be saved until you understand that Jesus is God and also except him as your Lord and saviour.

The Bible says: I am the way the truth and the life no man cometh to the Father except by me.

It wasn't until later I understood that Jesus was God. So does that mean I really wasn't saved in the first place or does that mean my salavation really didn't come to be until I did understand that fact.

Another words is salvation of understanding that Jesus is God a requirment to being saved?

The reason I bring this up is that Philip in John 14:8-9 didn't even understand that Jesus was God up until this point:

John 14:8-9 (KJV) Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us. Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

So here we see Philip didn't even know up until this point in time that Jesus was God the Father and yet it would seem Philip was saved already trusting in Jesus.

Another Question: Can a person get saved if they don't believe that Jesus is God. What if someone trust Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Saviour but absolutly does not believe that Jesus is God.

If you answer that is imposible to be saved and believe that Jesus is not God then you have to say that a person can't be saved at all without the full understanding that Jesus is God.

You see my point,

Please let me know what you think?

Thanks,
Zotah
Click to expand...

Zotah,

"Faith leads to understanding", not the other way around.

This is an axiom over 1500 years old.

Regards
 
Cornelius said:
Salvation is a process. Its not something that happened to you and now you are saved.I know many preach this, but its not true. You are on a road to salvation. It started and as you can see, you grew with time as the Lord started opening your eyes . Now , if you stay the course, you will be saved. You must be born from above through the Word of God.
Click to expand...

Hello again Cornelius,

You are correct, salvation is a process, but the Scriptures ALSO show it as a past event that once happened - the point where we are first justified by God.

This fact makes it confusing sometimes to speak with others on "salvation" because of the variety of definitions.

Regards
 
This was an interesting find from a thread long since responded to. I believe in order to have complete confidence in your salvation, you do need to have come to accept the Gospel in full. But can people be saved without understanding everything? I'd say most certainly, they can. I believe people need to respond to the extent of the revelation they are given, no matter how detailed it is. Jesus spoke to this in Luke 12.

Luke 12 (NIV)
47 “The servant who knows the master’s will and does not get ready or does not do what the master wants will be beaten with many blows. 48 But the one who does not know and does things deserving punishment will be beaten with few blows. From everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked."

I don't see this as saying there will be punishment for those who haven't been capable of discerning the Gospel, but for those who:

  • have been given the revelation
  • Don't seek to understand the revelation
  • don't respond to the revelation (or worse)
  • refuse to understand and respond to the revelation
there can be the expectation that they will be facing terrifying Judgment. God's Mercy is unknown, and this person's fate is in His Hands. But a person who is given a limited revelation of the Truth, would seem to be on solid ground if they respond accordingly.
 
zotah said:
The Bible says: I am the way the truth and the life no man cometh to the Father except by me.

It wasn't until later I understood that Jesus was God. So does that mean I really wasn't saved in the first place or does that mean my salavation really didn't come to be until I did understand that fact.

Another words is salvation of understanding that Jesus is God a requirment to being saved?

The reason I bring this up is that Philip in John 14:8-9 didn't even understand that Jesus was God up until this point:

John 14:8-9 (KJV) Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us. Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

So here we see Philip didn't even know up until this point in time that Jesus was God the Father and yet it would seem Philip was saved already trusting in Jesus.
Click to expand...

I cannot agree with you that this passage teaches that Jesus is not God. In fact, it is just the opposite. This is a wonderful trinitarian passage. I think there is much more going on in the context. Let me start in John 14:1.....

1 Let not your heart be troubled: believe in God, believe also in me.
8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
Jesus had announced that he was going away. This troubled the disciples. Different disciples had different questions and comments. Philip's request was actually very biblical. In the OT, Moses request was to see God. God allowed Moses to see something, but Moses could not look on his face and live. Philip may have been thinking of Moses experience and his request was to see the Father. It is interesting to note that Philip requested to see the "Father." The term "Father" does not prove a trinitarian concept, but could be implicitly understood in a trinitarian way. This would lead to the conclusion that Philip was already aware of the deity of the Son, Jesus. Nevertheless, his request to see the Father was patterned after Moses experience on Sinai.

9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and dost thou not know me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; how sayest thou, Show us the Father?
10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I say unto you I speak not from myself: but the Father abiding in me doeth his works.
11 Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake.
12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, he that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto the Father.
13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
14 If ye shall ask anything in my name, that will I do.
15 If ye love me, ye will keep my commandments.
16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may be with you for ever,
17 even the Spirit of truth: whom the world cannot receive; for it beholdeth him not, neither knoweth him: ye know him; for he abideth with you, and shall be in you.

The above passage uses the term "Father" how many times? While the passage is not an explicit teaching on the deity of Christ and the Trinity, both doctrines are implicit within the text. Jesus declares several things.
* He declares his equality with the Father. The one who has seen Christ, has seen the Father. If the Father were present on earth, what would he look like, what works would he do? He would look and act exactly as Jesus had done.
* Jesus declares his different personhood from the Father. Jesus is not the Father, this can be seen by the fact that he must go to the Father. Such a thing cannot be done if Jesus is the same person as the Father. They are the same being, but different persons. Also, Jesus will pray to the Father. He is not praying to himself, but he is praying to another person (but not another being).
* Finally, Jesus implies the equality of another comforter, the Spirit of Truth. This can be found in verses 16-17. The key word is "another." There are two ways to say the word "other" or "another" in greek. The term "heteros" means another of a different kind. We use this word in Engish in the word "heterosexual." This refers to a sexual union with a different gender. This is not the word used in verse 16 for "another." The word is "allos" which refers to "another of the same kind." By the use of this term, John is declaring the equality of Jesus and the Spirit of Truth.

In essence, I think John 14 does implicitly reflect that the writer of this Gospel had a trinitarian concept of the equality of the three persons mentioned in this text, but also in their complete equality. While the text does not assert that Jesus, the Father, and the Spirit of Truth are one in essence (One God), other texts declare that this equality reflects a "one God."

While this post as more to do with exegesis of John 14 then answering your question. However, others have already stated similar things that I would state anyway. A denial of the doctrines of the trinity, or the full and complete deity of Christ would mean a person is not saved. Of course your question has to do with ignorance and not outright denial. I don't see how it is possible to be taught of the meaning of the cross work of Christ accurately, and not also teach the deity of Christ and the doctrine of the trinity. That would seem to be an imcomplete gospel to me.
 
zotah said:
I was saved at the age of 9 years old. And my whole life has had Jesus Christ as my personal Lord and Saviour.

My question is, If I got saved without knowing or understanding clearly that Jesus is Almighty God.

Does that mean that salvation is based completely on excepting Christ as your Lord and personal Saviour.

Or does it meant that you can not be saved until you understand that Jesus is God and also except him as your Lord and saviour.

The Bible says: I am the way the truth and the life no man cometh to the Father except by me.

It wasn't until later I understood that Jesus was God. So does that mean I really wasn't saved in the first place or does that mean my salavation really didn't come to be until I did understand that fact.

Another words is salvation of understanding that Jesus is God a requirment to being saved?

The reason I bring this up is that Philip in John 14:8-9 didn't even understand that Jesus was God up until this point:

John 14:8-9 (KJV) Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us. Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

So here we see Philip didn't even know up until this point in time that Jesus was God the Father and yet it would seem Philip was saved already trusting in Jesus.

Another Question: Can a person get saved if they don't believe that Jesus is God. What if someone trust Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Saviour but absolutly does not believe that Jesus is God.

If you answer that is imposible to be saved and believe that Jesus is not God then you have to say that a person can't be saved at all without the full understanding that Jesus is God.

You see my point,

Please let me know what you think?

Thanks,
Zotah
Click to expand...


Hi, you seem to be sincerely a 'spiritually' sweet person. And this is how 'i' understand it. When one comes to Christ & gives up 100% [TOTALLY] and regardless of how much how much Truth he has or what Church he is in (or none! as seen in Rom. 2:14-15 that came to God by His Nature) it is as found in Rom. 8:1 'IN CHRIST FINDS NO CONDEMNATION'

OK: PERFECT [at that point!] Read on to verse 14 & we find that we are now still REQUIRED to be LED OF THE HOLY GHOST! From perfect babes into mature 'grown/ups'. And this is what the Godhead requires of ALL OF THEIR CREATION. See Nah. 1:9 And NO, surely most will have no part of giving self up ALL OF THE WAY HOME! Check out Cain in Gen. 4:7 even, with a one on one 'fatal' conservation warning with God!

So the Truth is that NO ONE IS O.S.A.S.!

--Elijah
 
I do not believe in a Trinity. I believe in one God who has three responsibilities—Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. An analogy might be a man who is simultaneously a husband, father, and son.
 
Before this turns into a debate on the Trinity, just a friendly reminder to stick to the OP. "Can a Person Get Saved..." Just making preemptive measures to keep this discussion on track.

Thanks. :)
 

What do you think of this verse?

"If you do not believe that I AM, you will die in your sins." (John 8:24)

Note: In the original Greek, there is no "He" after "I AM".
 
Mike said:
Before this turns into a debate on the Trinity, just a friendly reminder to stick to the OP. "Can a Person Get Saved..." Just making preemptive measures to keep this discussion on track.

Thanks. :)
Click to expand...

LOL....yes, a person can get saved without understanding the Trinity.

My own understanding of God has changed over the last 40 years. I believe God is greater than man's understanding. A "person" is a human being, and yet we use that term in the trinity. We start out as little children and then we grow in understanding and maturity as the Holy Spirit works in our lives.

1 John 2:12-14 said:
I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name's sake.

I write unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I write unto you, young men, because ye have overcome the wicked one. I write unto you, little children, because ye have known the Father.

I have written unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I have written unto you, young men, because ye are strong, and the word of God abideth in you, and ye have overcome the wicked one.
Click to expand...
 
glorydaz said:
LOL....yes, a person can get saved without understanding the Trinity.

My own understanding of God has changed over the last 40 years. I believe God is greater than man's understanding. A "person" is a human being, and yet we use that term in the trinity. We start out as little children and then we grow in understanding and maturity as the Holy Spirit works in our lives.
Click to expand...
This is begging the question, is it not?

I lean towards people not being saved if they don't believe Jesus is God and not the Father. But that he isn't the Father is abundantly clear and then the deity of the Holy Spirit gets pulled into as well.


Just a reminder that this thread is over 1 year old so some posters may not get responses.
 
OF course -

Of course you can -

Which is a GOOD thing, since NOBODY ever has, Nobody does now, and Nobody EVER WILL "Understand the trinity".

All you need to know to get saved is that you're a Hopeless sinner (Which the Holy Spirit will show you in living color when He CONVICTS you of your sin), and that Jesus (Whoever He is) is the ANSWER to that problem.

Then, of course you start to find out what happened - the Bible is a really GOOD source, along with Church, and Christian fellowship.

And you'll learn a bunch of stuff, and probably discard and RE-learn a bunch of stuff as well.

No biggie.
 
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