Can Christians Smoke Cigarettes?

[farouk]

I'm glad I quit and you sound like you really are too!

But yes, you are absolutely right: there is, and should be, give and take. (Some Christians of a legalistic mindset, single issue campaigners, etc., seldom see it this way, though.) There should be some flexible give and take, though. Like you say, those who didn't want to be around you and me when we smoked, had the right not to be. And while it might have been good for our general humility for people to have moralized against us, yet it was really about you enjoying being a smoker and not about someone else enjoying eating chocolate. (How many preachers' wives have been denied participation in the Lord's Supper because they may enjoy eating chocolate?)

Oh my, you mean people have been denied communion because they smoke? I've not heard of this before and it just sounds wrong. Isn't the main point of communion for the seeker to examine his own heart? I would think that unforgiveness would be the largest sin obstacle.
Well this is certainly interesting..

[MENTION=96902]FloatingAxeHead[/MENTION]: I don't think it often happens, but....

And you're absolutely right: 1 Corinthians 11 says: 'Let a man examine himself, and so let him eat...'

Blessings.

 

[Sparkey]

Oh my, you mean people have been denied communion because they smoke? I've not heard of this before and it just sounds wrong. Isn't the main point of communion for the seeker to examine his own heart? I would think that unforgiveness would be the largest sin obstacle.
Well this is certainly interesting..

And there we are, again coming right to the point. How refreshing it is to hear from you, and I do mean this in all sincerity. Blessings and godspeed, FloatingAxeHead and to all who join here in Spirit and in Truth.

So funny it is to me, a person who considers himself a "man of words" to have to read twice yet again. What did I hear when I read, "you mean people..." Well, it was a veiled insult, but that is only indicative of the flaw that is found in my ear, in me. Was there just a second there, as I read your words, that I heard somebody say that we were being mean spirited? If so, it was only in me. Not you. I know this is not what you have said. May we, may I, be reminded again and again, even as often as I need, that it is imperative to hear hearts and intent and to strive to take off my blinders as we seek to speak and understand and partake here, please? I ask this of God, for only He is able, and I too need it, all too often.

In the meantime, yes. I have read twice and do understand that yours was a question, "Do you mean to say that there are other people who might think this way?"

Yes, there are. There are church ladies (of both genders), and I do not mean the one who only calls herself that in jest, she is special and dear to me very... but there are those who may be satirized rightly by that old Saturday Day Live program as "church ladies" and they are roaming about here and there. Thankfully not many. I hope to not be found in that bunch, but rather to be counted here, among the saints of God.

~Sparrow

 

[fishbreath]

[MENTION=13142]Sparrowhawke[/MENTION] (I hope I got that tag right?)
Heavens no I hope to not ever come across as mean-spirited in the least. As a matter of fact I have little patience for those who are mean spirited (as a recent 'mean spirited' PM sender has just discovered, lol).
What I meant to say is that I don't think it's for people to dictate to someone whether they can take communion or not and that it's up to the person to examine their own heart.

 

[Sparkey]

Yes, [MENTION=96902]FloatingAxeHead[/MENTION] that tag worked. The little trick that I found for that function is to separate the tag by spaces, before and after because there is no member named (@farouk) As a moderator (a guy with a green colored name) I get lots of notifications. One such might be a report that our members may send when they get mean-spirited Private Messages. It's good for everybody to know how this works.

IN every thread and down there at the bottom, you will see a little triangle icon with an (!) in it. That is the report button and members may use it to signal moderators for their attention. The post is reported, and during that process the person who reports, who has noticed a violation of the Terms of Service by themselves or by another, may also comment. So If I were to say that you are a mean-spirited person (and lie like that) you would be right to consider your choice to just take the insult and offer it to the Lord for him to forgive or to report it and offer it to your Staff members for their attention. Both work. It's set up so that you get the choice, but really? There is no reason for anybody to have to take abuse here. Period.

There are many staff members here to serve our membership and even the unregistered guests that just stop by to browse and be friendly looky-loo lurkers. It's all good for we are indeed becoming epistles, written by God, known and read of men.

The other part of the Report Function is that after you have replied (it sounds like you've taken care of that little matter already) you may still wish to report. Even a Private Message here on the ChristianForums.net carries with it that capactity for signaling for help. It's that same little black triangle at the bottom left edge of the message, the one with an exclamation point (!) in it.

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I don't think it's for people to dictate to someone whether they can take communion or not and that it's up to the person to examine their own heart.

You are exactly right about that. It is an honor that is offered to those whose conscience is clear before God. We are told to do this in remembrance of what our Lord did, as He broke bread and offered. There is something about the breaking of bread that may be expanded so much fuller, especially when customs and manners of that day, that culture and that time are considered.

Here then, in this thread about various cultural taboos which is also a form of communion shared between saints, I would like to offer something from my table, given to me many years ago. It's about bread.

Manners And Customs of Bible Lands
by Fred H. Wight
Copyright @ 1953
CHAPTER FIVE -
Customs at Mealtime

Oh, and I've done my research too. That troubling notice about copyright? This article, and even the whole book has gone into a place that lawyers call "Public Domain" so there is no prick of conscience today as we share. There's more too: The Book Chapter Contents <----- found by clicking here hyperlinks to another website. The link is not an endorsement nor this disclaimer meant to discredit their beliefs. Too much lawyer mumbo-jumbo, suffice it to say that I hope you enjoy as I have.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

In an effort toward clarity, I do not find your statements here to be those that might be depicted as "moralizing" but instead to be better received as putting me in remembrance of those things that we both know to be true. It is acceptable for you to speak in faith to me, a weaker brother. In point of fact I would rise and say that you are admonished to do exactly this and accept your gift with thanks.

Are you kidding me?
All that you have said here today are the words given you by the Holy Spirit.
It has been quite long since someone has spoken to me from deep within their heart about matters that do matter and with conviction.
You may think you sound sad but I see a joy that can only be described as a close relationship with Jesus.
The Apostle Paul spoke some things of himself that we tend to overlook or think he was exaggerating.
The closer we are to God, the more we see ourselves as inadequate.
This is you today Sparrowhawke, and you are an inspiration.

 

[Sparkey]

Are you kidding me?

That is what I want, why my arms are outstretched to Him because this is my desire. But that very reaching is also showing that we are not yet there.... each day closer, learning to lean on each other, walking together for reason. That is why Amos 3:3 walks together with Ecclesiastes 4:9,10

It is because I am still "here a little, there a little, line upon line, precept upon precept," and I have not yet grown up into the maturity we shall be. We shall get there for Jesus shall perform it. We cling to each other and our dependency on seeing things in the flesh. This is exactly the reason that the Logos of God became flesh, so that he could show forth the heart of the father.

Today we cling in our dependance of one another, like drunkards, who, while stumbling may take support one from the other. And you know what? It works! They can get to the store that way, staggering and leaning one onto the other. They know this little secret for it is true that the children of darkness (bless their hearts) are often wiser than we.

Thank you for the blessing, I do offer it to Him who breaks your bread and feeds many.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

It is because I am still "here a little, there a little, line upon line, precept upon precept," and I have not yet grown up into the maturity we shall be. We shall get there for Jesus shall perform it. We cling to each other and our dependency on seeing things in the flesh. This is exactly the reason that the Logos of God became flesh, so that he could show forth the heart of the father.

Jesus is making us perfect, step by step.
When we go to Him, He will make us complete.

 

[farouk]

As a matter of fact I have little patience for those who are mean spirited

[MENTION=96902]FloatingAxeHead[/MENTION]:

Actually I think you'll find that there is quite a bunch of nice folk here, that post regularly; I think they are, anyway. Some ex-smokers, some non- (and never-)smokers and there might also be some smokers!

Blessings.

 

[farouk]

Can christians smoke cigarettes and still be christians?

I forgot to mention that D.L. Moody smoked as well as others in the good old days, Moody is the only one I remembered because I visited his homestead in Northfield, MA. In his study was a big ashtray that he used according to the guide.

C H Spurgeon smoked a pipe.

 

[farouk]

Mmmm, chili fries....

[MENTION=89910]questdriven[/MENTION]:

I guess too much of anything is bad for you...

Blessings.

 

[fishbreath]

Actually I think you'll find that there is quite a bunch of nice folk here, that post regularly; I think they are, anyway. Some ex-smokers, some non- (and never-)smokers and there might also be some smokers!

lol, yes of course! I am sure in a forum this size there will be all shapes & sizes of people, all whom are loved greatly by God and whom He desires a fabulously close relationship with. Thank heavens for He who sits as a refiner of gold and silver

 

[farouk]

Actually I think you'll find that there is quite a bunch of nice folk here, that post regularly; I think they are, anyway. Some ex-smokers, some non- (and never-)smokers and there might also be some smokers!

lol, yes of course! I am sure in a forum this size there will be all shapes & sizes of people, all whom are loved greatly by God and whom He desires a fabulously close relationship with. Thank heavens for He who sits as a refiner of gold and silver

[MENTION=96902]FloatingAxeHead[/MENTION]: I can see that you may have been reading Malachi chapter 3... (One of my favorite books; short but very searching.)

Blessings.

 

[fishbreath]

I forgot to mention that D.L. Moody smoked as well as others in the good old days, Moody is the only one I remembered because I visited his homestead in Northfield, MA. In his study was a big ashtray that he used according to the guide.

CS Lewis both drank and smoked (cigarettes & cigars) .. lol .. God can work with us regardless (I'm not condoning it but it's true He can work with us regardless)

 

[farouk]

PS: What I would strongly add by way of suggestion to anyone reading this forum who is not, and has not been, a smoker, is: it's not a habit worth starting! definitely not!

This is not a matter of legalism or interfering; just plain common sense.

Blessings.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

It's interesting that nobody seems to be concerned about their personal witness when trying to determine if smoking is okay or not. But look how we consider famous Christians and their habits when discussing the issue.

Forgoing our legitimate Christian rights and liberties is a very difficult discipline of the faith. But it is one that the Christian love we are so sure we have as Christians demands we walk in. You get a lot of flack when you talk about curbing personal liberties in Western society these days. That seems to be off the table when it comes to negotiating terms of obedience in Christianity. Nobody's interested in doing that. But this is what Paul says about that:

15 If your brother or sister is distressed because of what you eat, you are no longer acting in love. Do not by your eating destroy someone for whom Christ died. 16 Therefore do not let what you know is good be spoken of as evil. 17 For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit, 18 because anyone who serves Christ in this way is pleasing to God and receives human approval.

19 Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification. 20 Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a person to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble. 21 It is better not to eat meat or drink wine or to do anything else that will cause your brother or sister to fall. (Romans 14: NIV)


Somewhere along the line, Christianity became all about freedoms and liberties and no restraints, even calling those things 'legalisms'. But Paul says you are loving your neighbor when you restrain your liberties for the sake of that person. Christian love demands that you consider the consequences to others when you decide what you can and can't do.

 

[farouk]

[MENTION=88699]Jethro Bodine[/MENTION]:

C H Spurgeon smoked.

 

[Sparkey]

Somewhere along the line, Christianity became all about freedoms and liberties and no restraints, even calling those things 'legalisms'.

Somewhere along the path and along the way, called "The Way of the Lord," there shall come a balance and a balanced scale where Mercy and Justice strike the chord of the sound wound around our hearts.

Seems to me that the whole issue of "cigarettes" and blowing smoke might be a symbol or analogy for other unmentioned sin. It is something that may be discussed in polite society and examined publically even at a thanksgiving dinner table where all members gather. We might refrain from smoking (especially at that table) and must refrain from the very symbolic act of taking a puff from a cigar and blowing it directly into the face of another. That's not what is happening here, but it is a lesson that may be discussed. I would ask for forgiveness if the smell of what I'm trying to say offends. We are told to ask [God] and know that He shall give life. I do need prayer, need others to ask God for me in this and in all things.

 

[evenifigoalone]

I don't disagree, per se. It is a valid reason to not smoke, although I'm not sure if the world at large considers smoking something Christians don't do or not or even if they actually consider it a moral matter. If that is the case, then certainly it could affect your testimony.

As far as others are concerned, though, I just see it as up to the individual conscience. And aside from it being unhealthy, addictive, and expensive, I guess I just don't view smoking as all that bad. Maybe because I've been around it all my life. My father (note: NOT my step dad) smoked. My step uncle smoked. Some people from the church I grew up in smoked. Some were ex-smokers.

But...would I smoke? No. Would I recommend that others do? Certainly not!

 

[Nick]

[MENTION=88699]Jethro Bodine[/MENTION]:

C H Spurgeon smoked.

So?

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[Rollo Tamasi]

[MENTION=88699]Jethro Bodine[/MENTION]:

C H Spurgeon smoked.

So?

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Nick, is that a cup of coffee?