Catholic Bible Study

[thessalonian]

One thing that really stuck out for me in Augie's confessions is right at the end of book 3 or 4 where he laments the sins he would have committed had he not converted to Christ. This is not something we are asked to do but it has a great point. There was a time not so long ago when I was a prodigal son myself. I caused great pain to those whom I loved. By God's mercy and grace he pulled me out of that pig sty and restored my relationship with the woman whom I am married to and our son so that I could be with them. Praise God. I can however imagine the misery, had I continued on that path. By his grace I did not and so give great thanks for his restoring me to his grace and mercy and toward a life with my wife and son. The sins we would committ, were we not Christian speaks volumes about his great grace that he has given that we might not think about. He truly frees us from our sins which enslave us.

Blessings

 

[CatholicXian]

ttg,

just to add to what Thess said, the Latin (also known as the Tridentine Mass) is still said with permission from the local bishop in many US dioceses. in fact, I usually prefer to attend the Tridentine Mass in my diocese.

Stove,

re: "Catholic guilt"... as Thess said, it's not a bad thing. It's about repentance. When we sin, we ought to feel guilty about that so that we might turn to God who we know will grant us forgiveness and mercy... one of my favorite "acts of contition" to recite in the Confessional starts out "wash me of my guilt and cleanse me of my sins.." (from Psalm 51)

 

[CatholicXian]

oh duh.. my main reason for coming back and finding this thread... I dug out one of my volumes of Anselm's work, this is from a Letter written by Anselm:

To the supreme Pontiff Urban, Lord and Father of the universal Church as it sojourns on earth, Brother Anselm, sinner in life, monk in habit, called to be bishop of the chief city Canterbury (by either the command or the permission of God), [offers] due subjection, with humble service and devout prayers.

Divine Providence has chosen Your Holiness and has appointed you custodian of the Christian faith and life, and ruler of the Church. Therefore, if anything which is contrary to the Catholic faith arises in the Church, there is no one else to whom this response is more safely referred for prudent scrutiny. Therefore, just as I am not able [to send] the present letter more appropriately to anyone else, so I send it to no one more willingly than to Your Wisdom--(1) so that if anything in it needs to be corrected, it may be set right by your judgment and (2) so that what holds to the rule of truth may be confirmed by your authority...

 

[stovebolts]

I'll try and respond later today. But real quick,
I didn't mean Catholic guilt in a negative way. I was trying to say how that freedom found in Christ can be tagged by others as Catholic guilt.

On the other side of the fence though, I can also see where a luke warm christian could be filled with guilt because they simply go through the motions each week... For whatever reason, they just don't "get it"...

Xian,
Thanks for the quote

Thess,

Yes, Books 3 and 4 were great from what I recall from the top of my head.

 

[Oscar3]

Anyone have a question?

I have a question.
About two years ago I had Jury duty and during lunch I had a chance to take the bus over to a cathedral that was near by. I have never been to one before and wanted to check out the Mosolium underneath and so forth. What an awsome place it was. Anyway as I was taking a tour I noticed people lighting candles. I never asked but always wondered what that was about. For every candle they lit they placed and offering in a jar.
Whats that about.
Thanks Oscar

 

[CatholicXian]

Anyone have a question?

I have a question.
About two years ago I had Jury duty and during lunch I had a chance to take the bus over to a cathedral that was near by. I have never been to one before and wanted to check out the Mosolium underneath and so forth. What an awsome place it was. Anyway as I was taking a tour I noticed people lighting candles. I never asked but always wondered what that was about. For every candle they lit they placed and offering in a jar.
Whats that about.
Thanks Oscar

Hey Oscar,

Lighting candles is about prayer... (the offering is usually to help cover the cost of buying new candles, etc.), usually a person who lights a candle, also says a prayer for a particular person/intention.

It's also a bit symbolic, the candle burns symbolizing the constant desire/burning in our heart for God to hear and answer our prayer... and (this is the cool part, I think) if you've ever watched a candle go out, there's a little wisp of smoke that curls and rises and this symbolizes our fervent prayer rising to Heaven-- to God.

It's not permitted (and is definitely bad manners) to blow out a candle... they are intended to burn continuously until they go out on their own.

According to a book I have on sacramentals, the practice of lighting candles in order to obtain some favor most likely has its origins in the custom of burning lights at the tombs of the martyrs in the catacombs. The lights burned as a sign of solidarity wiht Christians still on earth. Because the lights continually burned as a silent vigil, they became known as vigil lights. Vigil Lights (from the Latin vigilia, which means "waiting" or "watching") are traditionally accompanied by prayers of attention or waiting. Another common type of candle offering is the votice light. Such an offering is indicative of seeking some favor from the Lord or the saint before which the votive is placed.

Basically, lighting a candle is a way of extending one's prayer and showing solidarity with the person on whose behalf the prayer is offered.

 

[thessalonian]

Thx CatholicX. I didn't know all that.

 

[Oscar3]

Anyone have a question?

I have a question.
About two years ago I had Jury duty and during lunch I had a chance to take the bus over to a cathedral that was near by. I have never been to one before and wanted to check out the Mosolium underneath and so forth. What an awsome place it was. Anyway as I was taking a tour I noticed people lighting candles. I never asked but always wondered what that was about. For every candle they lit they placed and offering in a jar.
Whats that about.
Thanks Oscar

Hey Oscar,

Lighting candles is about prayer... (the offering is usually to help cover the cost of buying new candles, etc.), usually a person who lights a candle, also says a prayer for a particular person/intention.

It's also a bit symbolic, the candle burns symbolizing the constant desire/burning in our heart for God to hear and answer our prayer... and (this is the cool part, I think) if you've ever watched a candle go out, there's a little wisp of smoke that curls and rises and this symbolizes our fervent prayer rising to Heaven-- to God.

It's not permitted (and is definitely bad manners) to blow out a candle... they are intended to burn continuously until they go out on their own.

According to a book I have on sacramentals, the practice of lighting candles in order to obtain some favor most likely has its origins in the custom of burning lights at the tombs of the martyrs in the catacombs. The lights burned as a sign of solidarity wiht Christians still on earth. Because the lights continually burned as a silent vigil, they became known as vigil lights. Vigil Lights (from the Latin vigilia, which means "waiting" or "watching") are traditionally accompanied by prayers of attention or waiting. Another common type of candle offering is the votice light. Such an offering is indicative of seeking some favor from the Lord or the saint before which the votive is placed.

Basically, lighting a candle is a way of extending one's prayer and showing solidarity with the person on whose behalf the prayer is offered.

Catholic
Thank you very much. I must say it does sound very cool.
Infact it would be a good reminder to pray everytime you see the candle.
Perhaps I will light one in my house.
Oscar

 

[thessalonian]

Some of you I am sure have not seen this before. It has great significance in light of Catholic theology. I wonder how you would apply it.

It is a comparision of the text in 2 Sam 6 and Luke 1, Mary's visitation to Elizabeth. Coincidence?

Both events took place in the hill country of Judah:

Luke 1
39. Now at this time Mary arose and went in a hurry to the hill country, to a city of Judah,

2 Sam 6
2. And David arose and went with all the people who were with him to Baale-judah, to bring up from there the ark of God which is called by the Name, the very name of the LORD of hosts who is enthroned above the cherubim.

Similarity of David and Elizabeth's words in greeting Mary and speaking of the Ark.
luke 1
43. "And how has it happened to me, that the mother of my Lord would come to me?

2 Sam 6

9. So David was afraid of the LORD that day; and he said, "How can the ark of the LORD come to me?"

John leaps before Mary who contains the Lord in her womb.
Luke 1
44. "For behold, when the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby leaped in my womb for joy.

David leaps before the ark in which the Lord resides.
2 Sam 6
16. Then it happened as the ark of the LORD came into the city of David that Michal the daughter of Saul looked out of the window and saw King David leaping and dancing before the LORD; and she despised him in her heart.

Mary stays with elizabeth for 3 mo.

56. And Mary stayed with her about three months, and then returned to her home.

The Ark stays with obemedon for 3 mo.

11. Thus the ark of the LORD remained in the house of Obed-edom the Gittite three months, and the LORD blessed Obed-edom and all his household.

Too many coincidences here for one to not draw a parallel.