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Charismatic Bible Studies - 1 Peter 2:18-25

Hidden In Him

Charismatic
Staff member
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Winning Darkness Over To Light Through Love, Not Condemnation, Part 2

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Facing trouble at work? Just as in times of old, Satan is still manipulating people into committing evils against Christians in the workplace, even in ways that bring up legal questions. Some Christians commit sin in the workplace and bring mistreatment upon themselves rather than the enemy having to do it. But those who serve the Lord Jesus Christ honorably will be attacked regardless, and all manner of lies and slanders may be used against them to justify mistreatment. But the call of God was never to return evil for evil, nor fall victim to the strategies of evil spirits, but to overcome evil with good. Such was the case with slaves who had to endure abusive masters, and it was something Peter now began to address.

18 Slaves, be submissive to your masters with all fear, not only to the good and gentle, but also to the harsh. 19 For this is commendable, if because of conscience toward God one endures grief, suffering wrongfully. 20 For what credit is it if, when you are beaten for your faults, you take it patiently? But when you do good and suffer, if you take it patiently, this is commendable before God. 21 For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that you should follow His steps 22 “Who committed no sin, nor was deceit found in His mouth”; 23 who, when He was reviled, did not revile in return; when He suffered, He did not threaten, but committed Himself to Him who judges righteously; 24 who Himself bore our sins in His own body on the tree, that we, having died to sins, might live for righteousness—by whose stripes you were healed. 25 For you were like sheep going astray, but have now returned to the Shepherd and Overseer of your souls. (1 Peter 2:18-25)

Notice that the exhortation here was to act in such a way that it would return others, even the cruel and the harsh, back to the Shepherd and Overseer of their souls, the Lord Jesus Christ. This is what overcoming evil with good was all about. But it was often easier said that done, because mistreatment of slaves was common in ancient times, just as it was in the United States before eventually being abolished.

The fate of a slave depended largely on the temperament of his or her master. Masters could punish slaves brutally for real or perceived infractions. Sexual abuse of slaves was also common. Slave work included hard labor as well as skilled service like tutoring, bookkeeping, and estate managing. Masters often freed slaves—and for numerous reasons, including as a reward for obedience and loyalty... Some parables depict cruel treatment of slaves, such as the parable of the wicked tenants. Slaves are disposable: they suffer beatings and death at the hands of tenants (Matt 21:33-44, Mark 12:1-12, Luke 20:9-18). (Slavery In The New Testament, Bible Odyssey. org)

That slaves could be imprisoned and tortured by their masters is plainly seen in the parable of the unforgiving servant, who never had pity on his fellow slave even after his master had shown pity to him. The parable teaches that we must show mercy to others as the Lord has shown mercy to us, of course, but underlying the entire story is the fact that masters could sometimes be quite heavy handed with those slaves they took great displeasure in.

23 Therefore the kingdom of heaven is like a certain king who wanted to settle accounts with his servants. 24 And when he had begun to settle accounts, one was brought to him who owed him ten thousand talents. 25 But as he was not able to pay, his master commanded that he be sold, with his wife and children and all that he had, and that payment be made. 26 The servant therefore fell down before him, saying, ‘Master, have patience with me, and I will pay you all.’ 27 Then the master of that servant was moved with compassion, released him, and forgave him the debt. 28 “But that servant went out and found one of his fellow servants who owed him a hundred denarii; and he laid hands on him and took him by the throat, saying, ‘Pay me what you owe!’ 29 So his fellow servant fell down at his feet and begged him, saying, ‘Have patience with me, and I will pay you all.’ 30 And he would not, but went and threw him into prison till he should pay the debt. 31 So when his fellow servants saw what had been done, they were very grieved, and came and told their master all that had been done. 32 Then his master, after he had called him, said to him, ‘You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt because you begged me. 33 Should you not also have had compassion on your fellow servant, just as I had pity on you?’ 34 And his master was angry, and delivered him to the torturers until he should pay all that was due to him. 35 “So My heavenly Father also will do to you if each of you, from his heart, does not forgive his brother his trespasses.” (Matthew 18:23-35)

Are these principles still being taught today concerning seeking to convert the unsaved from darkness into Light, even if it means having to endure mistreatment? Those in the West live in free countries where slavery has been abolished now, so the mentality is more to fight for one's rights as a free citizen. But does this help in converting the lost, or have we abandoned Christian teachings in the process of growing used to enjoying our freedoms?


The Non-Christian Response

The Satanist mantra is to take matters into your one's hands, and if one has been done an injustice to take vengeance upon the evil doer, so that they won't do it again. This seems reasonable to men, so they adopt it and adhere to it. The trouble is that instead of overcoming evil with good, it simply teaches men to acquiesce to evil and knuckle under to it, becoming just as evil or even more evil than the next man if necessary in order to see that justice is served.

This filters down into milder forms, such as the bad "scriptural" advice some legal firms are giving to Christians these days.

Sometimes, devout Christians let their faith convince them that they do not need to seek justice here on Earth. If they endure abuse or discrimination in the workplace, they may tell themselves that their suffering now may translate into heavenly rewards later. However, the lessons Christ offered during His life include recommendations that people make use of the systems in place for their protection. The parable of the talents is a famous biblical story in which Jesus discusses a master giving three servants funds in the form of talents. The ones who took risks ultimately secured the greatest return on the investment and are the ones praised the most. They properly analyzed the circumstances and took assertive actions based on their understanding of the world. The one who simply held onto what he was given, on the other hand, received nothing but castigation for being too lazy and fearful to act. It’s clear from the parable that Jesus wants his followers to do something similar. God does not involve Himself in the minutia of day-to-day human life. It is therefore incumbent upon the faithful to make use of the systems and tools in place for their protection on Earth to make the most of what they have in life. Workplace protection laws prohibit employers from discriminating against workers based on protected characteristics like their race, sex and religion. Instead of accepting mistreatment meekly and forgiving an employer, it is often better for workers to leverage the systems in place for their protection by taking legal action. Not only does proper action protect that specific worker from misconduct, but it could reimburse them for the losses they have experienced because of unfair workplace behavior. (How fighting workplace discrimination reflects Christian values, on behalf of Randle & Randle Attorneys At Law, LLC)

This is incredibly bad interpretation and spiritual advice from a supposedly Christian source, but to the natural mind it sounds quite reasonable. Defend yourself. Don't allow yourself to be cheated. But the focus is entirely upon self, and while bringing litigation may be within our legal rights, how does it work to help overcome evil with good and lead darkness into Light? There is an inherent condemnation in bringing litigation against others, and what effect will it have? What if the one who did us wrong has better lawyers and the injustice committed against us goes unpunished? What if evil spirits help sway a judge against us? Bitterness could take root when we expected to receive justice yet received none, and evil ends up overcoming good in our hearts over being cheated even worse. And what of the evil-doer? Will they see the error of their ways in cheating an innocent person, or will they just see the need to defend themselves against accusations of wrong-doing?

The apostle Paul understood these things, and knew that the end goal was to overcome evil with good, which is why he commanded the Corinthians much differently. His instruction was that they handle their own legal affairs, and if it was going to lead to resentment, just accept the wrong so that bitterness never take root.
 
4 If then you have judgments concerning things pertaining to this life, do you appoint those who are least esteemed by the church to judge? 5 I say this to your shame. Is it so that there is not a wise man among you, not even one, who will be able to judge between his brethren? 6 But brother goes to law against brother, and that before unbelievers! 7 Now therefore, it is already an utter failure for you that you go to law against one another. Why do you not rather accept wrong? Why do you not rather let yourselves be cheated? 8 No, you yourselves do wrong and cheat, and you do these things to your brethren! (1 Corinthians 6:4-8)

But some might say, "Are we just supposed to allow ourselves to be cheated, conned and robbed?" But this is where the supernatural gifts of God come into play.


The True Christian Response

When it comes to supernatural gifts, our God is no respecter of persons, and both slave and master alike could move in them during Old and New Testament times if He so chose to manifest His Power to others. Slaves could prove themselves more powerful than kings or governments when the Lord moved upon them in power to turn an evil situation completely on its head.

Such was the case with Joseph, who was sold into slavery and abused. His prophetic gifts were initially ignored. But Joseph rose to a position of great authority because the Spirit of God was upon him. The Pharaoh called him out of prison to interpret his dreams, and not only recognized Joseph's interpretation to be coming from God, but realized in the process that no one would be better suited to run the kingdom, given that Joseph could clearly hear God's voice:

33 "Let Pharaoh select a discerning and wise man, and set him over the land of Egypt. 34 Let Pharaoh proceed to appoint overseers over the land and take one-fifth of the produce of the land of Egypt during the seven plentiful years. 35 And let them gather all the food of these good years that are coming and store up grain under the authority of Pharaoh for food in the cities, and let them keep it. 36 That food shall be a reserve for the land against the seven years of famine that are to occur in the land of Egypt, so that the land may not perish through the famine.” 37 This proposal pleased Pharaoh and all his servants. 38 And Pharaoh said to his servants, “Can we find a man like this, in whom is the Spirit of God?”3 39 Then Pharaoh said to Joseph, “Since God has shown you all this, there is none so discerning and wise as you are. 40 You shall be over my house, and all my people shall order themselves as you command. Only as regards the throne will I be greater than you.” (Genesis 41:33-40)

The power of God changed a man from being a slave to second in command over an entire kingdom overnight, and the same could have easily happened in New Testament times. Paul described a situation where the Spirit of God spoke prophetically during a service to an unsaved person and they were completely changed by the experience, saying, "If all prophesy, and there comes in one who does not believe, or one who is unlearned, he is convicted by all and judged by all, and thus are the secrets of his heart made manifest. And so, falling down on his face he will worship God, and report that God is in you of a truth." (1 Corinthians 14:24-25).

But what if the person has no intention of being turned, but is instead intent on using the believer? Do we have no recourse other than to be abused? The gifts of the Spirit again come into play here, and can protect us in such instances. He is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart, and can reveal whether others are seeking just compensation or trying to exploit us for all we are worth.

A case in point involved a dream a brother sent me roughly a month ago. I had been having trouble with a legal situation, because the owner of my original website had shut it down, and appeared tone holding 10 years of my work ransom. He suddenly was placing it up for sale for thousands of dollars, claiming I had somehow misled him on some false pretense. I sensed this was a scam, and merely an excuse to exploit me. But after consulting with my wife I decided to offer him $2,000 for it, even though I actually owed him nothing. This however was met with being stonewalled, and a flat decline, which I sensed again was a deliberate attempt to use extortion on me.

A couple days later, our brother Hawkman sent me the following dream to confirm it. The "gun" was that website, simply because the work on it was like a weapon that could be used against the enemy. But the one now offering to "sell" it was obviously crooked:

I am in a group of men... A man tells me has a gun for $150 and I tell him I will buy it. I am looking for the $100 dollar bill in my billfold and having trouble finding it amongst my other bills. The man is peeking into my billfold as I search for the proper change, and drops the gun into my lap. I find the $100 dollar bill and hand it to him while I find 2 twenties and one 10 to make $150. When I hand him the other $50 dollars he said the $100 dollar bill was fake, and now shows me a different $100 than the one I gave him. I now stand up and place the revolver into his mouth and tell him to say it was a real $100 I gave to him and he does, but then recants as soon as I remove the gun from his mouth. I then tell all the other men it was a real $100, and they now know who has possession of it. Now there will be a fight over the $100 dollar bill.

The Spirit of God was protecting me from being exploited here. Certainly we are to overcome evil with good, but when evil means only to exploit us, the Lord uses things like this to keep it from happening. I knew now that if I sent him the money in private like I had done with fees and things, he would simply deny receiving it and then keep asking me for more until he bled me dry. If need be, I will simply let 10 years of my work go by the wayside. My wife encouraged me that I could probably rewrite it all even better the next time anyway. But whatever the outcome, I won't allow myself to become bitter, nor will I be held over a barrel. I want to see my former friend come to Christ, but early on it may involve showing Him that those who serve the True and Living God will not be exploited.


Questions And Applications

1. Name a few situations where divine insight from the Spirit of God would come in handy in the work place, or in legal matters, and how they could help in keeping evil from getting the victory or turning those in darkness to light.

2. Describe a situation or two in your past where divine revelation from the Spirit of God might have helped you deal with a certain situation on the job.

3. Joel prophesied that we would see visions and dream dreams, and that prophecies regarding great judgments from God will be coming forth (see Joel 2:31). Do you believe that things like what happened with Jospeh could happen in the earth once again, and men and women who are little more that slaves could be elevated to places of prominence in their countries in the End-times, simply by offering kings and rulers sage advice that saves their countries from destruction?
 
Questions And Applications

1. Name a few situations where divine insight from the Spirit of God would come in handy in the work place, or in legal matters, and how they could help in keeping evil from getting the victory or turning those in darkness to light.
I don't really require special "words from God" in the form of prophecy to be guided in some of these troublesome work situations. I'm retired now, but when I was working I was provoked by a co-worker who was annoyed by my "Christianity." I simply stayed away from him, but continued to be friends otherwise. The last time I saw him, he said he now believed in Christianity.

I had a superior in my job who kept me at a lower position, and a system that kept my pay at a low level. Ultimately, I retired early, and determined to engage in a form of self-employment--I really had been doing this for years as a kind of 2nd job.

I'm a believer in prophecy and dreams, but I think the more common means of guidance from the Lord is simply dealing with what is put before us, and dealing with it properly, with the right heart. Dreams have a way of bringing out our inner thoughts and motives, whether as a warning or as an encouragement. Or they may be projecting something that is still future.
2. Describe a situation or two in your past where divine revelation from the Spirit of God might have helped you deal with a certain situation on the job.
See above.
3. Joel prophesied that we would see visions and dream dreams, and that prophecies regarding great judgments from God will be coming forth (see Joel 2:31). Do you believe that things like what happened with Jospeh could happen in the earth once again, and men and women who are little more that slaves could be elevated to places of prominence in their countries in the End-times, simply by offering kings and rulers sage advice that saves their countries from destruction?
Yes. God is always showing us the spiritual depravity in the world, that living apart from Christ is an exercise in futility and produces only problems. When we live in righteousness in an unrighteous world, ultimately we will be shown to be righteous, and will receive some measure of favor from God.

I cannot say what will happen in the future. Each country is different. Daniel gives us a great blueprint for the endtimes. That's what I follow.

On this subject I will add this much. "There is a time for war and a time for peace." It requires Wisdom to know how to deal with each situation with the right attitude.

My wife and I were tormented by a truck driver behind us, an impatient young men who drove up behind us closely, and then trailed off, then came up behind us again, repeatedly. I could not go faster because the cars in front of me were going about 5 mph below the speed limit--no way to bypass them.

We came to a round about, and couldn't enter, because a car simply wouldn't merge in unless the round about was completely clear. We finally got into the round about when the truck behind us slammed into us--completely his fault.

We pulled over and the young man apologized, admitted his fault, and said he simply didn't see us--his truck was pretty high up, and our compact was low down. We thought we were fine, and drove home.

But the next day the car wouldn't start, and it ended up totalled. We thought we were fine, but we both ended up with neck problems for a year.

The insurance company told us to get treatment for the necks problems, and she would check on the car damage. Later, the insurance company said they wouldn't pay for the chiropractic treatments on my wife.

This was a considerable amount of money for us, so we were compelled to get an attorney, and ended up winning the case. Oddly, the attorney had worked, in the past, for this very insurance company and knew the people there! ;)

So I believe there is a time to fight back on matters of justice, and not just let things go in order to be a "witness to Christ." It's how I had to treat the unjust insurance person that determined whether I was acting appropriately as a Christian. I hope this helps somebody....
 
I don't really require special "words from God" in the form of prophecy to be guided in some of these troublesome work situations. I'm retired now, but when I was working I was provoked by a co-worker who was annoyed by my "Christianity." I simply stayed away from him, but continued to be friends otherwise. The last time I saw him, he said he now believed in Christianity.

I had a superior in my job who kept me at a lower position, and a system that kept my pay at a low level. Ultimately, I retired early, and determined to engage in a form of self-employment--I really had been doing this for years as a kind of 2nd job.

I'm a believer in prophecy and dreams, but I think the more common means of guidance from the Lord is simply dealing with what is put before us, and dealing with it properly, with the right heart. Dreams have a way of bringing out our inner thoughts and motives, whether as a warning or as an encouragement. Or they may be projecting something that is still future.

Well it's good to be pointing it out. I think the Spirit of God leads us through wisdom as well. But honestly Randy, I would still classify this as a form of divine instruction and insight, or what was termed "word of wisdom" when applied to situations like the ones described in this study. James said wisdom needed to be prayed in, with the implication that it was not simply inherent within us or a given just because we were believers (James 1:4-8). And wisdom was presented in James as something to be prayed for in exactly these kinds of situations, such as when being exploited or abused by rich employers (James 5:4, James 2:1-6).

But yes, we are called to walk in insight from God on how to react, no matter what the means. If they apply the teaching in James, even people who do not believe in the gifts are actually operating in them whether they realize it or not.
 
We pulled over and the young man apologized, admitted his fault, and said he simply didn't see us--his truck was pretty high up, and our compact was low down. We thought we were fine, and drove home.

But the next day the car wouldn't start, and it ended up totalled. We thought we were fine, but we both ended up with neck problems for a year.

The insurance company told us to get treatment for the necks problems, and she would check on the car damage. Later, the insurance company said they wouldn't pay for the chiropractic treatments on my wife.

This was a considerable amount of money for us, so we were compelled to get an attorney, and ended up winning the case. Oddly, the attorney had worked, in the past, for this very insurance company and knew the people there! ;)

So I believe there is a time to fight back on matters of justice, and not just let things go in order to be a "witness to Christ." It's how I had to treat the unjust insurance person that determined whether I was acting appropriately as a Christian. I hope this helps somebody....

I like your openness and honesty, and here I would say this: Sometimes overcoming evil with good may involve keeping an injustice from being carried out, as I referred to in my situation of potentially being exploited by a friend. It does not help good overcome evil to simply get steamrolled. And it's possible in your situation that the same would apply. I don't think that law firm I cited is anywhere near able to rightly divide all this, judging by their interpretation of the Parable of the Talents and the application they were putting forward. But I do think it's possible in situations like yours to keep evil from gaining an unnecessary advantage. Paul made use of something similar in citing his Roman citizenship in order to maintain his rights.

The question, however, is this: Are we truly being led of the Spirit? Are we receiving instruction from Him on how to proceed? I could get a lawyer in my situation, and trust me, ten years of your life's work being held hostage by someone you thought was your friend is not a pleasant experience, nor an insignificant one for me. But I'm getting no leading to do that in my case. And I have seen churches and pastors and ministries go after one another in the courts in situations similar to mine, where money, or lands, or intellectual properties are involved. I am being led to potently just allow myself to be wronged as Paul taught, and lose my work, then go taking someone to court as a believer in Christ who has the King of Kings backing him up. I have to believe there are likely a number of people whom the Lord would lead the same way in similar cases, rather than just give in to the knee jerk reaction to defend their legal rights.

So I think that like nearly all things, it boils down to this: Are we truly being led by the Holy Spirit in what we should do specifically in any given situation? And for that, I think divine revelation from God will be in order.

Your thoughts? And blessings in Christ for your responses. Always interesting discussing the word of God with you. :thumbsup2
 
Well it's good to be pointing it out. I think the Spirit of God leads us through wisdom as well. But honestly Randy, I would still classify this as a form of divine instruction and insight, or what was termed "word of wisdom" when applied to situations like the ones described in this study. James said wisdom needed to be prayed in, with the implication that it was not simply inherent within us or a given just because we were believers (James 1:4-8). And wisdom was presented in James as something to be prayed for in exactly these kinds of situations, such as when being exploited or abused by rich employers (James 5:4, James 2:1-6).

But yes, we are called to walk in insight from God on how to react, no matter what the means. If they apply the teaching in James, even people who do not believe in the gifts are actually operating in them whether they realize it or not.
Of course. In the insurance situation, my wife felt that the insurance company should know that their representatives, in dealing with the public, should not give bad advice. She told her to immediately seek medical aid with her whiplash problem, which suggested that they would cover a situation like this. But later they didn't, and my wife had to fight them on it.

This had happened to me on the job. An ankle problem on my job I reported to my superiors, and their office instructed me to immediately pursue medical help. Later, their insurance refused to cover my expenses. I had to fight back, and won. They had to know their policy of giving instant advice was wrong, and ended up hurting people. We are responsible to share what we know or have learned when our knowledge can fix things for others.

The issue isn't so much our attitude in fighting back, taking vengeance, getting even, or demanding rights in a carnal way. Rather, it is addressing a policy problem with companies that need to know the results of their policies, how it impacts others in a negative way.

I don't see "fighting back" in this way as "worldly wisdom." Many years ago, a pentecostal teacher named Judson Cornwall taught us that God gives the Church spiritual gifts so that we more naturally become like God.

We speak in tongues to speak more like Christ all the time. We exercise gifts of power so that we are open to hearing from God in matters that require power. We exercise gifts of wisdom and knowledge so that we go to God *all the time* to live by His spiritual word.

All of this is, in fact, revelation, when our wisdom is coming from being informed from above. And it comes more regularly when we believe in it and practice it.

That being said, I agree that there is a grave danger in "demanding rights" with the wrong attitude. And backyard justice is not justice at all.

But even Paul utilized the "justice system," so to speak when he called out his Roman oppressors while not asking if he was a Roman with Roman rights. Paul demanded, rightfully, his rights as a Roman citizen.

And Jesus even suggesting that we need to be more wise in dealing with people who are worldly wise. We are not to be worldly. But part of living by revelation is the wisdom in knowing how to turn the enemies weapons back upon themselves, with the proper character.

Luke 16.8 “The master commended the dishonest manager because he had acted shrewdly. For the people of this world are more shrewd in dealing with their own kind than are the people of the light. 9 I tell you, use worldly wealth to gain friends for yourselves, so that when it is gone, you will be welcomed into eternal dwellings."

Here, Jesus suggests that we have to manage in an ungodly world, and put up with some of their injustices. But we can utilize what good is in them to appeal to that part of them to bringing about greater good, to show that God is good.
 
I like your openness and honesty, and here I would say this: Sometimes overcoming evil with good may involve keeping an injustice from being carried out, as I referred to in my situation of potentially being exploited by a friend. It does not help good overcome evil to simply get steamrolled. And it's possible in your situation that the same would apply. I don't think that law firm I cited is anywhere near able to rightly divide all this, judging by their interpretation of the Parable of the Talents and the application they were putting forward. But I do think it's possible in situations like yours to keep evil from gaining an unnecessary advantage. Paul made use of something similar in citing his Roman citizenship in order to maintain his rights.

The question, however, is this: Are we truly being led of the Spirit? Are we receiving instruction from Him on how to proceed? I could get a lawyer in my situation, and trust me, ten years of your life's work being held hostage by someone you thought was your friend is not a pleasant experience, nor an insignificant one for me. But I'm getting no leading to do that in my case. And I have seen churches and pastors and ministries go after one another in the courts in situations similar to mine, where money, or lands, or intellectual properties are involved. I am being led to potently just allow myself to be wronged as Paul taught, and lose my work, then go taking someone to court as a believer in Christ who has the King of Kings backing him up. I have to believe there are likely a number of people whom the Lord would lead the same way in similar cases, rather than just give in to the knee jerk reaction to defend their legal rights.

So I think that like nearly all things, it boils down to this: Are we truly being led by the Holy Spirit in what we should do specifically in any given situation? And for that, I think divine revelation from God will be in order.

Your thoughts? And blessings in Christ for your responses. Always interesting discussing the word of God with you. :thumbsup2
Funny! While you were writing this I was writing another response, and we quoted the same example from Paul's appeal to his Roman citizenship. This is called "living in the light!" ;)

Anyway, thank you for the balanced approach. And in return, I want to thank you for bringing up the subject, because even today the Lord's been dealing with me for getting too angry, politically. I just realized today that I was shadow-banned on a political website, probably because I was a little over the top.

I probably get too wrapped up in politics, even though politics is one of my "things." That's why I was so disappointed in 2020. When things don't go our way, we get "carnal."

And when I get "nasty" in politics, or even on these forums, discussing subjects I'm emotional about, I end up taking it out on my wife. Not good!! That's when I know I've gone too far! ;)

It's good to have spouses and brothers who hold you accountable. It's one of the ways God deals with us, in a revelational way, assuming we are open to God's word to our conscience.
 
Your thoughts? And blessings in Christ for your responses. Always interesting discussing the word of God with you. :thumbsup2
While I was in this conversation with you I was working on challenging the assessment of our property by our County Assessor. Last year they gave us a high assessment, which I challenged and won. Actually, they still valued us high, I felt, but it was a compromise, and I accepted it.

This year they've done the same thing again, valuing our property too high. So I challenged it again, and spent a good portion of a day providing comparables, figures, and data pertinent to our case.

I showed that they used erring comparisons, and had to send all of the necessary paperwork down to the County office to challenge the assessment in a limited period of time.

Just a short time ago, I received a phone call from that office, informing us that they've reevaluated their assessment, and are pretty much going to revise the assessment back to where it was last year. No huge increase! [happiness!]

If I had let this go and played dead I would be paying perhaps 1000 dollars more per year. This isn't chump change to me. So I do think that people make mistakes, and we need to deal with it, as much pain as it may cause us.

This is just the other side of the coin. In your case I'd be tempted to let it go. I haven't said this because you're the one feeling the pain--not me. That's a lot of work to have stolen from you, which you can never really recover.

So this may be what the Lord is telling you, to let it go--not that the brother is going to just see the light, convert, apologize, and return you your property, but that before your Father in heaven, you're acting like His son.

That means everything, even if it has caused you a ton of suffering. My deepest sympathies....
 
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Many years ago, a pentecostal teacher named Judson Cornwall taught us that God gives the Church spiritual gifts so that we more naturally become like God.

We speak in tongues to speak more like Christ all the time. We exercise gifts of power so that we are open to hearing from God in matters that require power. We exercise gifts of wisdom and knowledge so that we go to God *all the time* to live by His spiritual word.

All of this is, in fact, revelation, when our wisdom is coming from being informed from above. And it comes more regularly when we believe in it and practice it.

I agree with Him. While I'm at it, I'll tell you one verse that always amazed me and it's the one about how Jesus never "bruised a reed." Peter says sometime very close in another few verses:

21 For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that you should follow His steps: 22 “Who committed no sin, Nor was deceit found in His mouth”; 23 who, when He was reviled, did not revile in return; when He suffered, He did not threaten, but committed Himself to Him who judges righteously; 24 who Himself bore our sins in His own body on the tree, that we, having died to sins, might live for righteousness—by whose [g]stripes you were healed.
 
And when I get "nasty" in politics, or even on these forums, discussing subjects I'm emotional about, I end up taking it out on my wife. Not good!! That's when I know I've gone too far! ;)

Oh God... don't do that, LoL. I usually face some sort of reprisal, like "Get out of the kitchen" or "stay out of my bed. I just made it." She usually understands and can tell when I'm in a bad mood on something, but if it's in any way directed at her I always get this vibe like, "I don't need to hear your problems. Get yourself fixed" LoL.
It's good to have spouses and brothers who hold you accountable. It's one of the ways God deals with us, in a revelational way, assuming we are open to God's word to our conscience.

I completely agree, and I'll not be saying any more about it, LoL. :thumbsup
 
Just a short time ago, I received a phone call from that office, informing us that they've reevaluated their assessment, and are pretty much going to revise the assessment back to where it was last year. No huge increase! [happiness!]

If I had let this go and played dead I would be paying perhaps 1000 dollars more per year. This isn't chump change to me. So I do think that people make mistakes, and we need to deal with it, as much pain as it may cause us.

This is another good example to talk about, because there can be instances when nobody particularly cares, such as government workers who are just doing a job. I mean, they might be trained to overcharge people, but are they going to really care when someone fights back at it? No. Then it becomes a matter of expediency to simply get you out of their hair. I think this again falls under the category of losses the Lord does not simply want us eating. If He would direct me not to take it from someone I was personally involved with for over ten years, He certainly would have no problem saying to not let it happen with a passive stranger.

Now there is a verse that says, "Do not resist evil"... and it actually includes in legal situations, so maybe we should add it to the discussion. But I again don't think it involves people who have no real intention of sining against you, and therefore would not be "resisted" in any sense, But what do you think about this passage in light of what we have been saying:

38 “You have heard that it was said, ‘An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.’ 39 But I tell you not to resist an evil person. But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also. 40 If anyone wants to sue you and take away your tunic, let him have your cloak also. 41 And whoever compels you to go one mile, go with him two. (Matthew 5:38-41)
 
This is another good example to talk about, because there can be instances when nobody particularly cares, such as government workers who are just doing a job. I mean, they might be trained to overcharge people, but are they going to really care when someone fights back at it? No. Then it becomes a matter of expediency to simply get you out of their hair. I think this again falls under the category of losses the Lord does not simply want us eating. If He would direct me not to take it from someone I was personally involved with for over ten years, He certainly would have no problem saying to not let it happen with a passive stranger.

Now there is a verse that says, "Do not resist evil"... and it actually includes in legal situations, so maybe we should add it to the discussion. But I again don't think it involves people who have no real intention of sining against you, and therefore would not be "resisted" in any sense, But what do you think about this passage in light of what we have been saying:

38 “You have heard that it was said, ‘An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.’ 39 But I tell you not to resist an evil person. But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also. 40 If anyone wants to sue you and take away your tunic, let him have your cloak also. 41 And whoever compels you to go one mile, go with him two. (Matthew 5:38-41)
That's one of those matters that require some thought before answering. In reading the life of David in the Bible I sometimes wondered how he knew when to take vengeance and when not to? David didn't seem to hesitate to put some people to death. And others, who were his enemies, he not only spared, but honored them. Great question!

Some people oversimply the problem by stating that the OT was Law and the NT is Grace. But it was the same God in both testaments.

So clearly, this didn't present a quandary to Jews, to see that under circumstances of God's word, vengeance could be taken and at other times vengeance could not be taken.

I think God gets to decide how we respond to an issue. I think Jesus was just reminding us that we should not automatically assume God has put into our hand the sword of justice.

Sometimes justice should be instant, and other times lagging behind. God gets to decide, which makes being able to hear God all the more important! And we do that best by walking with Him, and not merely by consulting our confused consciences.

God has established authorities who mete out justice God's way. And even though some corrupt their positions, God has put them there until He sees fit to remove them.

There are occasions where it falls upon us to defend ourselves or our own family. In that case we need to be especially attentive to how God leads, because doing harm to anybody made in God's image is a bad thing if not done under God's supervision.
 
Now there is a verse that says, "Do not resist evil"... and it actually includes in legal situations, so maybe we should add it to the discussion. But I again don't think it involves people who have no real intention of sining against you, and therefore would not be "resisted" in any sense, But what do you think about this passage in light of what we have been saying:

38 “You have heard that it was said, ‘An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.’ 39 But I tell you not to resist an evil person. But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also. 40 If anyone wants to sue you and take away your tunic, let him have your cloak also. 41 And whoever compels you to go one mile, go with him two. (Matthew 5:38-41)
I should probably say more about this passage because for many it does appear to make a contradiction. Did Jesus try to undo what God had ordered Israel to do under the Theocracy of Moses' time?

Israel had been ordered to serve up an "eye for an eye," to return upon malicious activity what that activity deserved. Was Jesus now suggesting that justice should not be done?

I don't think so. In my opinion, Jesus was addressing the fallen state of Israel in his own time, still under the Theocracy of the Law. The judges of Israel, including the priests, were corrupt, and were not likely to rule in favor of believers in Jesus. The Romans held to the ultimate reins of power, and their brand of "justice" could not be resisted.

In a time like this Jesus suggested that Christians act like Israel had been instructed to act right before the Babylonian Captivity. They were to capitulate to their captors, and acknowledge the word of the Lord by submitting even to ungodly leaders.

They were to acknowledge the authority God had given even to evil rulers. It was an acknowledgment of authority God had given to men, even though they were not good.

So I have no doubt that if righteous rule had reigned in Israel, justice would've been properly meted out, and evil men would not have been allowed to do harm to society. And most of us live in spiritually-compromised societies, where both the rulers and the society are ignorant of the ways of God and exercise their authority in a compromised way. We still have to submit to them.

Jeremiah 27.12 I gave the same message to Zedekiah king of Judah. I said, “Bow your neck under the yoke of the king of Babylon; serve him and his people, and you will live. 13 Why will you and your people die by the sword, famine and plague with which the Lord has threatened any nation that will not serve the king of Babylon? 14 Do not listen to the words of the prophets who say to you, ‘You will not serve the king of Babylon,’ for they are prophesying lies to you. 15 ‘I have not sent them,’ declares the Lord. ‘They are prophesying lies in my name. Therefore, I will banish you and you will perish, both you and the prophets who prophesy to you.’”
 
That's one of those matters that require some thought before answering. In reading the life of David in the Bible I sometimes wondered how he knew when to take vengeance and when not to? David didn't seem to hesitate to put some people to death. And others, who were his enemies, he not only spared, but honored them. Great question!

Some people oversimply the problem by stating that the OT was Law and the NT is Grace. But it was the same God in both testaments.

So clearly, this didn't present a quandary to Jews, to see that under circumstances of God's word, vengeance could be taken and at other times vengeance could not be taken.

I think God gets to decide how we respond to an issue. I think Jesus was just reminding us that we should not automatically assume God has put into our hand the sword of justice.

Oh man, wonderful post. And you are exactly right here, which is the difference between a Spirit-led believer and a carnal one. The law was just that, the law. But our God looks on the heart. One is simple and the other complex and nuanced. This is the reason for the gifts IMO, and why they still need to be in operation. We are supposed to be able to supernaturally look upon the heart as well, see it accurately by the power of God, and judge righteous judgment. Because there ARE all sorts of different circumstances, and all kinds of different people. Where their HEART is is actually the most important thing to know in judgment, at least for those willing to forgive and see someone converted through mercy. Are you making the right move in showing it to them, or will they simply take it for granted and sin again? The Spirit of God reveals where a man's heart is, even King David. He sinned greatly, and sinned a sin worthy of death. But God looked upon his heart when others were not willing to, and saw the man was deeply repentant. So judgment was carried out, but he was not destroyed despite a grave sin, because despite how evil it all was David was willing to judge himself as a wicked man, and be converted back to righteousness and humility.

Those who saw what God saw had mercy on him as well. But others simply assumed he was forsaken. Never the right thing to do to assume that God cannot show mercy, because He can when he sees that a soul truly despises what they have done and is willing to repent.
 
Israel had been ordered to serve up an "eye for an eye," to return upon malicious activity what that activity deserved. Was Jesus now suggesting that justice should not be done?

I don't think so. In my opinion, Jesus was addressing the fallen state of Israel in his own time, still under the Theocracy of the Law. The judges of Israel, including the priests, were corrupt, and were not likely to rule in favor of believers in Jesus. The Romans held to the ultimate reins of power, and their brand of "justice" could not be resisted.

I will give you my answer and leave it up for debate. Let me quote it again:

38 “You have heard that it was said, ‘An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.’ 39 But I tell you not to resist an evil person. But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also. 40 If anyone wants to sue you and take away your tunic, let him have your cloak also. 41 And whoever compels you to go one mile, go with him two. (Matthew 5:38-41)

I think these situations referred to were when the believer had no control over the situation and was basically in a position of subjugation, in which case you either handled it graciously or not. The slave could be slapped in the face for disobedience over anything, and a Jewish citizen was at the mercy of the Roman army. So neither could simply weigh their options. The person being sued had no choice of whether they would be taken to court or not. So the command here was, "In situations where you are forced and have no choices in the matter ... turn the other cheek to suggest you will obey, and humbly; walk with him two miles to suggest you will obey, and considerately; grant the person what they believed they were being cheated out of, and warmly/ lovingly." In circumstances where you are forced like this, and have no choice, the way to overcome evil with good in such a place is through submission to the other person in love.

Not an easy pill to swallow, but does that resonate with you or no? To me it would seem to make sense in it's proper context.
 
I will give you my answer and leave it up for debate. Let me quote it again:

38 “You have heard that it was said, ‘An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.’ 39 But I tell you not to resist an evil person. But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also. 40 If anyone wants to sue you and take away your tunic, let him have your cloak also. 41 And whoever compels you to go one mile, go with him two. (Matthew 5:38-41)

I think these situations referred to were when the believer had no control over the situation and was basically in a position of subjugation, in which case you either handled it graciously or not. The slave could be slapped in the face for disobedience over anything, and a Jewish citizen was at the mercy of the Roman army. So neither could simply weigh their options. The person being sued had no choice of whether they would be taken to court or not. So the command here was, "In situations where you are forced and have no choices in the matter ... turn the other cheek to suggest you will obey, and humbly; walk with him two miles to suggest you will obey, and considerately; grant the person what they believed they were being cheated out of, and warmly/ lovingly." In circumstances where you are forced like this, and have no choice, the way to overcome evil with good in such a place is through submission to the other person in love.

Not an easy pill to swallow, but does that resonate with you or no? To me it would seem to make sense in it's proper context.
Actually, that is exactly what I was trying to say. Thank you for making it even clearer!
 
2. Describe a situation or two in your past where divine revelation from the Spirit of God might have helped you deal with a certain situation on the job.

I did get divine revelation about a job once. I was at a gold mine in the mountains. And we would sleep there, eat there and work there. The first night there, i dreampt that the employees were supersticious of me and they tried running me over with a car repeatedly while going extremely fast, they were trying to kill me. I was too spiritually deaf to understand the revelation. They got me. They railroaded me out of the job. It was a nauseatingly traumatic experiemce. But im happy to be where i am now, and it was probably preparing me for this moment.
3. Joel prophesied that we would see visions and dream dreams, and that prophecies regarding great judgments from God will be coming forth (see Joel 2:31). Do you believe that things like what happened with Jospeh could happen in the earth once again, and men and women who are little more that slaves could be elevated to places of prominence in their countries in the End-times, simply by offering kings and rulers sage advice that saves their countries from destruction?

Anything's possible, despite the satanic system we live in and under. I think that in josephs case, we know it was the apex priority for him to preserve the line of Messiah, and that mission was the center of existence at the time. Everyone in the Spiritual world was watching. Would something happen now to that same degree? Short of a revival, i dont know that anything like that today would be so public. If God does have anyone up to bat on that kind of mission i will be praying for them !!
 
I did get divine revelation about a job once. I was at a gold mine in the mountains. And we would sleep there, eat there and work there. The first night there, i dreampt that the employees were supersticious of me and they tried running me over with a car repeatedly while going extremely fast, they were trying to kill me. I was too spiritually deaf to understand the revelation. They got me. They railroaded me out of the job. It was a nauseatingly traumatic experiemce. But im happy to be where i am now, and it was probably preparing me for this moment.

Let me give you one of mine.

When I was not long out of college I was with this girl. We were contemplating getting married but hadn't been getting along that well lately, but she said she would like to spend the evening together and relax and watch a movie and I was REALLY wanting to do it. I thought, "This is it. Maybe we can patch things up, have a really nice evening together, and start the rest of our lives together." Only they had decided to schedule me that night outside my normal schedule I think, and up till she accepted I had no problems with it, but suddenly I wanted nothing to do with working that night, cuz I was thinking about the rest of my life with her. So I called into work and said I wouldn't be in tonight, and the boss freaked on me and said "No way in Hell." I tried even making a strong excuse of some kind (I forget what it was, but pretty sure I lied, shame to say, trying to get out of it), but the guy was talking like if I didn't come in I was fired. Well, if I had known that night if he were bluffing or not, or if the Lord would have another job for me or not even if I took off anyway, I could have spent that faithful night with her. As it was, I needed the job, so I got furious and apologized to her that I couldn't risk my job and went in to work and the opportunity was gone. I feel like that was the night we might have settled our differences, made up, and dedicated ourselves to one another. As it was, other stuff came up, and it was like the thing remained ill-fated.

Not a great story to tell, but it just goes to show how receiving revelation from God might have completely changed the direction of my life.
 
Yes. God is always showing us the spiritual depravity in the world, that living apart from Christ is an exercise in futility and produces only problems. When we live in righteousness in an unrighteous world, ultimately we will be shown to be righteous, and will receive some measure of favor from God.

I cannot say what will happen in the future. Each country is different. Daniel gives us a great blueprint for the endtimes. That's what I follow.

I once read a prophecy - this was written over 40 years ago - that in the end-times the Spirit of God would be poured out so strongly that some miracles would lead to entire nations being saved; that national leaders would command their nations to take a day off to devote it to seeking the Lord Jesus Christ for deliverance; that the power of God would be such that small children would lay hands on a hospital building and an entire floor of sick patients would be healed in the name of Jesus Christ.

I have to believe that in situations like that the Spirit of God could still move the way he did in ancient times and then some.
 
I once read a prophecy - this was written over 40 years ago - that in the end-times the Spirit of God would be poured out so strongly that some miracles would lead to entire nations being saved; that national leaders would command their nations to take a day off to devote it to seeking the Lord Jesus Christ for deliverance; that the power of God would be such that small children would lay hands on a hospital building and an entire floor of sick patients would be healed in the name of Jesus Christ.

I have to believe that in situations like that the Spirit of God could still move the way he did in ancient times and then some.
Well, I have to be honest and admit that God's word for me today was, "My grace is sufficient for you." Often this word is consolation to the fact you're going to have tough times, but you have Salvation. And that's true.

I was also given the word that even the Small are given powerful and excellent gifts, which together with all will produce the prize. We should humbly acknowledge that all the glory is God's, whether for Great or for Small.

However, I do believe in the greatness of God, and believe that one day "all things truly will be possible." What limits God now is His tolerance for sinners, as He awaits their decisions, for better or for worse.

In the meantime, God's People can expect miracles as they serve the Lord in humility and in faith, producing little or much, depending on the circumstances God has laid upon us.

It's His world, and His plan. We just need to accept it, recognize it, and cooperate with it.
 
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