Christianity and FreeMasonry

[agua.]

I'm not sure if this is one of those subjects not allowed.

Should a Christian be a Mason ?

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

Not should, but could be, and then only early on. as he learns the Truth and speaks out about the Truth, they will kick him out even if he wants to stay.

 

[agua.]

Ok I didn't know that they kicked people out. What about a mature Christian can they keep the tenets and oaths of Masonry and be a faithful follower of Jesus ?

 

[Mike S]

Ok I didn't know that they kicked people out.

We don't kick Christians out of Freemasonry.

What about a mature Christian can they keep the tenets and oaths of Masonry and be a faithful follower of Jesus ?

Of course. Most Freemasons are Christian, and the oaths we take in masonry are symbolic only.

 

[agua.]

We don't kick Christians out of Freemasonry.

I didn't think so.

Of course. Most Freemasons are Christian.

Ok I assume you're a Freemason Mike. Did you take the Masonic oaths ?

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

Ok I didn't know that they kicked people out. What about a mature Christian can they keep the tenets and oaths of Masonry and be a faithful follower of Jesus ?

that's not possible. Short personal example: in tulsa they have slashed the tires of women working at government offices who spoke out about the ungodliness of freemasonry.

it seems to have a lot of adherents like the roman group - ready acceptance of what they publicize as if good, and denial of the actual truth (more and more opposed to Yeshua and to the Gospel written in Scripture found out the higher up one goes; but at some point, Yhwh just gives up a person to believe what they want to believe - He won't override their free will even to save them(Christ already died for them, there's no more to do if they continually reject the truth)).

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

(just like in some religious groups - "IF" someone stays quiet about their own 'supposed' Christianity, they might be allowed to stay. But if they speak up for the Truth, out they go! )

 

[Mike S]

I didn't think so.



Ok I assume you're a Freemason Mike. Did you take the Masonic oaths ?

Yes, to both.

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

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[agua.]

Yes, to both.

Did you stand on one leg blindfolded with the left trouser rolled up while running your thumb across your throat while saying " I'll have my throat cut and tongue ripped out body buried in the rough sands ...." etc ?

Also do you accept that there is more than one acceptable identity of God and that you must depend on Masonry to give you light.?

 

[Mike S]

Did you stand on one leg blindfolded with the left trouser rolled up while running your thumb across your throat while saying " I'll have my throat cut and tongue ripped out body buried in the rough sands ...." etc ?

Each masonic jurisdiction has different ways of taking degree oaths. This sounds a little, but not exactly, like what we do. Every one of our masonic oaths is part of a more lengthy lecture, which always includes the explanation using language similar to "all of our masonic oaths and penalties are symbolic only. The only disciplinary actions are censure, or expulsion from the lodge."

Also do you accept that there is more than one acceptable identity of God and that you must depend on Masonry to give you light.?

For membership, there is a requirement that one believe in a supreme being. During open lodge proceedings we refer to the supreme being as "grand architect of the universe." It's a description of a characteristic of God, not the name of different god. If there are Christians, Jews, and Muslims in lodge, each will hear that as describing his own understanding of the nature of God. And, of course, the Bible is filled with various ways of describing God as best as we can understand Him.

We don't discuss specific religions in lodge, but, of course, out of lodge we discuss religion, politics, sports, etc. as any other group of guys do.

 

[agua.]

Each masonic jurisdiction has different ways of taking degree oaths. This sounds a little, but not exactly, like what we do. Every one of our masonic oaths is part of a more lengthy lecture, which always includes the explanation using language similar to "all of our masonic oaths and penalties are symbolic only. The only disciplinary actions are censure, or expulsion from the lodge."


For membership, there is a requirement that one believe in a supreme being. During open lodge proceedings we refer to the supreme being as "grand architect of the universe." It's a description of a characteristic of God, not the name of different god. If there are Christians, Jews, and Muslims in lodge, each will hear that as describing his own understanding of the nature of God. And, of course, the Bible is filled with various ways of describing God as best as we can understand Him.

We don't discuss specific religions in lodge, but, of course, out of lodge we discuss religion, politics, sports, etc. as any other group of guys do.

Thanks Mike for your aswers I have no further questions at this stage :D Oh there was one question you may have missed though if you don't mind me asking again.

Do you believe you must depend on Freemasonry to give you light ( understanding of truth ?)

 

[Gary]

Of course. Most Freemasons are Christian, and the oaths we take in masonry are symbolic only.

Would you mind posting those oaths?
.

 

[Mike S]

Thanks Mike for your aswers I have no further questions at this stage :biggrin Oh there was one question you may have missed though if you don't mind me asking again.

Do you believe you must depend on Freemasonry to give you light ( understanding of truth ?)

One of the questions asked in one of the degrees is "What do you desire." The answer is "Further light in Masonry."

That isn't referring to finding out if your understanding of God is the same as mine, and if not, which understanding is true. That is left to your church, your faith, and your relationship to God. It's about lessons in personal integrity, and honor, and morality. It's about how the working tools of operative masons, such as level, plumb, and square can be metaphors for a life of integrity: acting "on the square," conducting your life and interactions with others "on the level", setting a "plumb-line" in you life as a symbol of rectitude of conduct, integrity of life, and that uprightness of moral character which makes a good and just man. These are the things we try to encourage and grow in ourselves, and in each other in Freemasonry.

 

[Mike S]

Would you mind posting those oaths?
.

I'm not going to post them. If you're interested, they're all pretty much public knowledge, posted on the internet on various sites. Often the oaths are not recognized on those sites as being symbolic, which I can only imagine is just another way of bashing freemasonry.

A fairly good and objective understanding can be found in Richardson's Monitor of Free-Masonry. It was first published as an expose in the 1860s, some of it is out-dated, some of it is inaccurate but in general it's not a bad place to start little research. Here's what one present day reviewer says about it, and I agree.

"The rituals of Freemasonry, more or less. First published as an exposure in the 1850's this book is as a whole relatively accurate as to the degree content, but has many points that are incorrect and / or falsified- and a lot of it is out of date. At best this is a reflection of Freemasonry as it was in the first half of the 19th C. To any of you who take every word of these rituals as literal truth please go to your dictionary and look up the word Symbolic. Recommended for historical research only.

So, if someone is absolutely Jonesing to know what the oaths, and penalties, and signs, and words of Freemasonry are, knock yourself out.

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

Mike, you may truthfully have the faith, integrity and good understanding of the One True Yhwh Creator and Father of the Lord Jesus Christ as you straightly say in your posts.
However, as you readily admitted and posted, that doesn't mean at all that any other , most or few, freemasons share your faith in Jesus Christ.
The history is fraught with innumerable examples of this happening, not just in freemason but also in the world(roman) church and even in mormonism and jws (true believers who came out of those groups whether called out by Yhwh , left freely, or driven out once the leaders knew about the difference in loyalty they had).
To be a true believer of Yhwh in Yeshua while in freemasonry is very rare, just like in the world church (also full of 'symbolism').
But so was Daniel and his faithful few,
and Joseph in egypt,
and corrie ten boom and ecclesia with her in nazi holocaust germany,
and Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the midst of pagan peoples all around them,
and more recently "the conscientious objector" (recent movie about him).
and Keith Green, a faithful trustworthy man of Jesus in the very wicked field of musical entertainment,
and so on and so on.... .... many many others with a true and faithful testimony of Jesus in many many fields traditionally filled with wicked greedy and power hungry men.

Straight up, I and many others have not yet(as far as we know) met another man in freemasonry who is and has remained faithful to Jesus and upright in walking with Him.

You have had a long battle, and it will only get worse in the world(for all of us) as the days go by - harder and harder as we get closer to our final day.

I pray you may continue in the Peace that Jesus gives and His Testimony Faithful and True through all the difficulties , trials and temptations of these last days before He Returns in Glory.

 

[Gary]

I'm not going to post them. If you're interested, they're all pretty much public knowledge, posted on the internet on various sites. Often the oaths are not recognized on those sites as being symbolic, which I can only imagine is just another way of bashing freemasonry.

If the oaths are only symbolic, what's the point in swearing the oath?
.

 

[Gary]

I'm not sure if this is one of those subjects not allowed.

Should a Christian be a Mason ?

I would say no.
.

 

[Mike S]

If the oaths are only symbolic, what's the point in swearing the oath?
.

Gary, I'm not going to judge your faith, and you seem to have made you mind up on this, so my advice is if you believe Freemasonry and Christianity are incompatible, then don't become a mason. If I really have to explain the value of symbolism to you, I don't think you're going to understand anything about Freemasonry.

 

[Gary]

Gary, I'm not going to judge your faith, and you seem to have made you mind up on this, so my advice is if you believe Freemasonry and Christianity are incompatible, then don't become a mason. If I really have to explain the value of symbolism to you, I don't think you're going to understand anything about Freemasonry.

Ok.
.