Bible Study Concerning that of being evil

[Ormly]

Iniquity is sin, an act of evil-ness; separated-ness from God. In the NT it is taken to mean "lawlessness". "I will do my own thing". Lucifer had that mindset in Heaven and by the willful act of his unsubmitted "self", altered forever his disposition thereby intro'ing sin [evil] into God's creation. Lucifer was the author of it. Sin and evil are one in the same when considering it to be a state of being. It is a relationship either with our "self" [nature] or someone outside our "self" [nature].

The act of sinning is something we do and not necessarily what we are. Adam had a relationship with God. He sinned. David, a man afer God's own heart, sinned. Abraham, Isaac, Jacob they all had relationships with God they all sinned at one time or other. They all did there own thing apart from God; the evil thing, and when they did they [we] paid a price.

Men are born innocent, but in evil; separated from God.

Being born in evil doesn't mean man's nature is any different than Adam's before the transgression. Man can still be righteous, Abel proved that. However, he can't ever be righteous enough to cancel out the evil of the curse he found himself under; that he was born into. Only by someone from the outside coming into his realm could that ever be accomplished. Enter Christ, made flesh.

Comments?

 

[cyberjosh]

I say you generally have the right idea. We however, unlike Adam have inherited that particular trait for an affinity toward evil - the effect of the flesh in us - while I would say Adam and Eve didn't have that affinity before the fall but rather the possibility/potential to do it: Eve being decieved & beguiled and Adam coerced. The flesh however seeks after its own: sin/evilness (thus the affinity). The righteousness of Abel was due to his faith in God (Hebrews 11). Righteousness has ever been an imputed quality given from God, even to Adam and Eve before the Fall - when they were with God in perfect harmony.

Was there a specific aspect of this you wanted to explore more in depth for conversational purposes? I'll wait for your reply.

God Bless,

~Josh

 

[Ormly]

I say you generally have the right idea. We however, unlike Adam have inherited that particular trait for an affinity toward evil - the effect of the flesh in us - while I would say Adam and Eve didn't have that affinity before the fall but rather the possibility/potential to do it: Eve being decieved & beguiled and Adam coerced. The flesh however seeks after its own: sin/evilness (thus the affinity). The righteousness of Abel was due to his faith in God (Hebrews 11). Righteousness has ever been an imputed quality given from God, even to Adam and Eve before the Fall - when they were with God in perfect harmony.

Was there a specific aspect of this you wanted to explore more in depth for conversational purposes? I'll wait for your reply..............God Bless, Josh

We have inherited nothing but the penalty; curse, for Adam's transgression that separates us from God. You might want to consider more about what the curse is and the effect it has had on man being cast out of the "garden". ["garden" here used in the metaphorical sense] Man's nature was never changed, which is the reason I more than purposely emphasize, "effect"

 

[cyberjosh]

You propose that the fallen flesh nature was in Adam and Eve before the Fall? There is a difference between the evil flesh nature and our physical flesh you know. That is why we are told to crucify the flesh and its desires and it is not refering to the physical body. That evil flesh nature I believe was not resident in Adam and Eve before the Fall.

~Josh

 

[Ormly]

You propose that the fallen flesh nature was in Adam and Eve before the Fall?

Where do you get that from my writings?

There is a difference between the evil flesh nature and our physical flesh you know.

I agree[

That is why we are told to crucify the flesh and its desires and it is not refering to the physical body.

I agree again. All I am saying is that flesh, in the sense you mean and how scripture speaks of it here, is the "evil" that must be crucified. For instance, Jesus said, "return not evil for evil". This intimates that we should not give [back]to the [evil] world the Life of Himself, if we indeed possess it. We should reveal Him.

That evil flesh nature I believe was not resident in Adam and Eve before the Fall.

Nor do I believe that. They were also not separated from God before the fall, ergo, not in a state of being evil....only afterwards. I believe we can see how evil is a "relationship" either with someone outside ourselves and/or our very selves.

Orm