Conversion, is a Daily Experience

[Jay T]

When the Apostle Paul said: "I die daily" (1 Corinthians 15:31).
What did he mean ?

One of the tasks of the Holy Spirit, is to bring conviction of sin, to people.

The more I study God's word, the more I realize out of harmony with God I am, and therefore I need a new conversion experience daily, to renew my commitment, to live as God would have me to live.

It is a step by step journey, day by day.

I NEVER say: "I'm Saved"...as though it is a done deal, and there is nothing left for God to do, in making me a better person.

BUT, I can say: I'm in the process of being 'saved'.

My job as a Christian, is to prove satan wrong, and prove God is right !
Temptations, are the daily (sometimes hourly) tests, of proving who is right and who is wrong.

It is my responsibility, to choose who will win, in each encounter.

The 10 commandments as found in Exodus 20:3-17, is the mirror of Christian perfection, it is God's standard of Righteousness (Psalms 119:172).

That is why God says: "Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them. (Psalms 119:165).
WHY ?
Because they have no guilty conscience to bother them, as they are in perfect harmony with the will of God !

I want to be in that state of mind, don't you ?

And, daily conversion, to Jesus Christ guarantees just that !

 

[Solo]

Salvation is one time occurance which lasts the entire life of a born again believer.

One is born again at the instance of His "conversion" when his eyes and ears are opened by the Holy Spirit to see and hear the spiritual truths in the Word of God concerning the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

This Gospel teaches that one must repent (turn from one's own way of living and turn to God's way of living), believe that Jesus was the payment for the wages of one's sins, that Jesus died and was resurrected so that those who believe might also be resurrected, and then follow Jesus Christ in obedience.

After one is born again, he begins a life of sanctification, or building ones life on the foundation of Jesus Christ. When a born again beliver walks in the Spirit, gold, silver, and precious stones will be built on the foundation of Jesus Christ, and it will remain even through the fire. If one continues to walk in the flesh, only wood, hay, and stubble will be built on the foundation of Jesus Christ, and it will be burnt up on day, but the born again believer will be saved (1 Corinthians 3:11-15)

11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; 13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 1 Corinthians 3:11-15)

Then if a born again believer is saved one time for eternity, what does Paul mean when he says he dies daily? In Romans 7 he explains the war that goes on within born again believers between the flesh which is sold under sin, and the inward man which delights in the law of God.

20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. 21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me. 22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man: 23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. 24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death? 25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin. Romans 7:20-25

Born again believers must offer themselves up as a daily sacrifice, dying to self, and living for the one who bought them. They are to grow and mature in their new found spiritual life by daily being transformed by the renewing of their minds, not being conformed to this world, so that they may prove what is good, acceptable, and perfect will of God.

1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. 2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. Romans 12:1-2

Paul teaches born again believers to walk in the Spirit so that they do not fulfill the desires of the flesh.

This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. Galatians 5:16

Those who are not born again cannot walk in the Spirit; they can only walk in the sinful flesh.

 

[ChristineES]

Oh, honestly, we do not need convert daily. That is ridiculous. :roll: I certainly don't become an atheist in my sleep nor a Hindu while I am taking a walk.

 

[Solo]

Oh, honestly, we do not need convert daily. That is ridiculous. :roll: I certainly don't become an atheist in my sleep nor a Hindu while I am taking a walk.

SDACD or OBAABA, that is the question?!

Translated Seventh-day Adventism Convert Daily or Once Born Again, Always Born Again!

 

[ChristineES]

That's a new one on me. :

 

[cyberjosh]

When the Apostle Paul said: "I die daily" (1 Corinthians 15:31).

I'm not commenting on your arguement following this point but you took that verse out of context. Look at what Paul is talking about:

And why do we stand in jeopardy every hour? I affirm, by the boasting in you which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily. If, in the manner of men, I have fought with beasts at Ephesus, what advantage is it to me? If the dead do not rise, “Let us eat and drink, for tomorrow we die!â€Â

Paul is talking about all the peril and trials he has been through, remember he had been whipped, stoned, beaten with clubs, left for dead, shipwrecked, etc., etc. He was asking them, "If there is no ressurection from the dead then why do I endure all of this?" Paul asked this in more than one of his letters. It would be better to eat drink and be merry than endure sufferings for the sake of Christ if Christ did not rise and there is no ressurection for the dead. Also when Paul speaks of boasting he does so "as foolish" for their sakes (2 Corinthians 11:16), because Paul used "boasting" often sacastically to get his points across. He is speaking metaphoricially about how close he comes to death in his peril each day.

 

[Solo]

I'm not commenting on your arguement following this point but you took that verse out of context. Look at what Paul is talking about:

And why do we stand in jeopardy every hour? I affirm, by the boasting in you which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily. If, in the manner of men, I have fought with beasts at Ephesus, what advantage is it to me? If the dead do not rise, “Let us eat and drink, for tomorrow we die!â€Â

Paul is talking about all the peril and trials he has been through, remember he had been whipped, stoned, beaten with clubs, left for dead, shipwrecked, etc., etc. He was asking them, "If there is no ressurection from the dead then why do I endure all of this?" Paul asked this in more than one of his letters. It would be better to eat drink and be merry than endure sufferings for the sake of Christ if Christ did not rise and there is no ressurection for the dead. Also when Paul speaks of boasting he does so "as foolish" for their sakes (2 Corinthians 11:16), because Paul used "boasting" often sacastically to get his points across. He is speaking metaphoricially about how close he comes to death in his peril each day.

You are correct Cyber, but you know that Jay T does not care about context!! :o

 

[Jay T]

You are correct Cyber, but you know that Jay T does not care about context!! :o

Why should I.....when Jesus Christ said.....
Matthew 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

If you're so worried about context, why aren't you doing what Jesus Christ said.......

"IF..you love me, keep my commandments", (John 14:15).
AND....the context of Christ's statement came from:
Exodus 20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
#2.)
20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness [of any thing] that [is] in heaven above, or that [is] in the earth beneath, or that [is] in the water under the earth:
20:5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God [am] a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth [generation] of them that hate me;
20:6 And showing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

#3.)
20:7 Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.
#4.)
20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
20:10 But the seventh day [is] the sabbath of the LORD thy God: [in it] thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that [is] within thy gates:
20:11 For [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them [is], and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

 

[Solo]

Why should I.....when Jesus Christ said.....
Matthew 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

If you're so worried about context, why aren't you doing what Jesus Christ said.......

"IF..you love me, keep my commandments", (John 14:15).
AND....the context of Christ's statement came from:
Exodus 20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
#2.)
20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness [of any thing] that [is] in heaven above, or that [is] in the earth beneath, or that [is] in the water under the earth:
20:5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God [am] a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth [generation] of them that hate me;
20:6 And showing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

#3.)
20:7 Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.
#4.)
20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
20:10 But the seventh day [is] the sabbath of the LORD thy God: [in it] thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that [is] within thy gates:
20:11 For [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them [is], and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

I keep Jesus' commandments, and when I sin, I ask for forgiveness thanking him for the work that he did on the cross. I thank my God that Jesus Christ gave himself for me, and not after I became good enough to accept, but while I was yet a sinner.

I not only keep the Sabbath day holy, I keep all seven of the days of the week holy.

 

[unred typo]

I keep Jesus' commandments, and when I sin, I ask for forgiveness thanking him for the work that he did on the cross. I thank my God that Jesus Christ gave himself for me, and not after I became good enough to accept, but while I was yet a sinner.

I not only keep the Sabbath day holy, I keep all seven of the days of the week holy.

You forgot to say that when you sin, you repent. Unless you turn from your sin, there is no forgiveness allowed you.

Your pious statement lacks legitimacy. God does not ask us to set apart all days, nor does that make logical sense. That’s like saying, “In honor of your birthday, I’m taking off work for the rest of my life.†He asks us to work six days and set apart the seventh day as a day of rest in honor of the rest from his work that he took on the seventh day in creation.

I think your problem is a misunderstanding of the concept of keeping something ‘holy.’ The seventh day is to be set apart from the other six days. Yes, you can be set apart from sin every day, and you should strive for this daily as JayT’s OP suggests, but there should be a ‘specialness’ about the seventh day in honor of God’s request to rest as he did on that day.

 

[Solo]

You forgot to say that when you sin, you repent. Unless you turn from your sin, there is no forgiveness allowed you.

Your pious statement lacks legitimacy. God does not ask us to set apart all days, nor does that make logical sense. That’s like saying, “In honor of your birthday, I’m taking off work for the rest of my life.†He asks us to work six days and set apart the seventh day as a day of rest in honor of the rest from his work that he took on the seventh day in creation.

I think your problem is a misunderstanding of the concept of keeping something ‘holy.’ The seventh day is to be set apart from the other six days. Yes, you can be set apart from sin every day, and you should strive for this daily as JayT’s OP suggests, but there should be a ‘specialness’ about the seventh day in honor of God’s request to rest as he did on that day.

You poor soul. Is there anything that you understand about the Word of God? I'll keep you in my prayers.

 

[unred typo]

You poor soul. Is there anything that you understand about the Word of God? I'll keep you in my prayers.

Would you mind being more specific about which of my statements do not agree with the Bible? Pray that the Lord will grant words to refute clearly what is in error. I’ll wait for his answer.

 

[Jay T]

You forgot to say that when you sin, you repent. Unless you turn from your sin, there is no forgiveness allowed you.

You're statement is most accurate !

This is one of the dangers of, "Once Saved, Always Saved".
It is the attitude that sins, are not too big a deal, and that God will overlook them.

IF that were the case God would have to apologize to Adam & Eve for kicking them out of Eden for so small a sin as they committed......

The tide of woe that flowed from the transgression of our first parents is regarded by many as too awful a consequence for so small a sin, and they impeach the wisdom and justice of God in His dealings with man.

But if they would look more deeply into this question, they might discern their error. God created man after His own likeness, free from sin.
The earth was to be peopled with beings only a little lower than the angels; but their obedience must be tested; for God would not permit the world to be filled with those who would disregard His law.

Yet, in His great mercy, He appointed Adam no severe test.

And the very lightness of the prohibition made the sin exceedingly great. If Adam could not bear the smallest of tests, he could not have endured a greater trial had he been entrusted with higher responsibilities.

Had some great test been appointed Adam, then those whose hearts incline to evil would have excused themselves by saying, "This is a trivial matter, and God is not so particular about little things." And there would be continual transgression in things looked upon as small, and which pass unrebuked among men.

But the Lord has made it evident that sin in any degree is offensive to Him.

 

[cyberjosh]

JayT,

You seem to have hijacked your own thread somewhat. Do you disagree or agree with what I said earlier about the the proper context?

 

[Fnerb]

JayT,

In almost every post I have seen by you, you almost always post the 10 Commandments. It almost sounds as if you are saying that we are going to sin, even if we repent, if we do that same sin we aren't forgiven. You are human, we are all born into sin and have no control over it. Read Romans 7:14-20 Paul gives us an excelent example of this. Great law example. We can never live up to God's standards.

You are going to sin. It is in your nature. But read Romans 8:1-2 ...

It doesn't say, "Because I was able to stop sinning I was saved." No, it says, "there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus".

 

[Jay T]

JayT,

In almost every post I have seen by you, you almost always post the 10 Commandments. It almost sounds as if you are saying that we are going to sin, even if we repent, if we do that same sin we aren't forgiven. You are human, we are all born into sin and have no control over it. Read Romans 7:14-20 Paul gives us an excelent example of this. Great law example. We can never live up to God's standards.

Be sure to tell Jesus that when you see HIM on Judgment Day.
Tell HIM that HE was wrong for saying: 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this [is] the whole [duty] of man.

1 John 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
2:5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
2:6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

You are going to sin.

So then you're saying Jesus Christ was wrong, in saying: 'go and sin no more' ?
John 5:14 & 8:11)

It is in your nature. But read Romans 8:1-2 ...

Never read Romans 6, Huh ?
6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also [in the likeness] of [his] resurrection:
6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with [him], that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
6:8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
6:9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
6:10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
6:12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
6:13 Neither yield ye your members [as] instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members [as] instruments of righteousness unto God.
6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

It doesn't say, "Because I was able to stop sinning I was saved." No, it says, "there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus".

Those who know Jesus Christ as their Savior........
1 John 3:9 "Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God".

On the other hand.......
1 John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

AGAIN....Romans 6:16 comes into play......your choice.....

6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness ?

 

[Fnerb]

So then you're saying Jesus Christ was wrong, in saying: 'go and sin no more' ?
John 5:14 & 8:11)

Nope, not at all. God demands perfection and while I live on this earth, I will never be able to give it to him.

Never read Romans 6, Huh ?

Yes, I have. And I have also read Romans 7:

14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

No matter how hard I try, I will not keep the law and therefore am condemed. But "I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord" for he has delivered me from the law. No I do not keep on sinning. Yes I strive to live a just and holly life. But I also never forget that I am a sinful creature. Born into sin. And that apart from Jesus Christ, I am nothing.

Romans 6:23 -
23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

I am seen as pefect in God's eyes because he looks at me through Jesus.

 

[Solo]

Eternal life is given or restricted prior to judgment day. Eternal life is given at the moment on is born of God when he/she believes on the name of Jesus. If one never believes on the name of Jesus, they are condemned already.

Judgment day is to judge individuals on their works. Those who have eternal life will be judged by the works that they built upon the foundation of Jesus Christ and will given rewards accordingly. Those who do not have eternal life will be judged by the works that they did on earth and will be given punishment accordingly.

Seventh Day Adventists who teach against the Gospel of Jesus Christ will be given greater punishment than those who preached salvation in Christ Jesus.

 

[Jay T]

Eternal life is given or restricted prior to judgment day.

Yes, as revealed in Revelation 22:10 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand.
22:11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.

22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward [is] with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

Eternal life is given at the moment on is born of God when he/she believes on the name of Jesus.

Their names are in the book of life, Yes.
The point thereafter, is to keep their names in the book of life.

If one never believes on the name of Jesus, they are condemned already.

I wouldn't say that.....as satan and his millions of angels believe in Jesus Christ.....and we know where they are going !

Judgment day is to judge individuals on their works. Those who have eternal life will be judged by the works that they built upon the foundation of Jesus Christ and will given rewards accordingly. Those who do not have eternal life will be judged by the works that they did on earth and will be given punishment accordingly.

Seventh Day Adventists who teach against the Gospel of Jesus Christ will be given greater punishment than those who preached salvation in Christ Jesus.

Well, I think that any SDA that teaches against Jesus Christ...is NOT a SDA !

The whole point of being an SDA, is to teach Salvation by faith, in Jesus Christ ALONE, as I have done.
Those who accuse me of doing otherwise have paid absolutely NO attention to what I have been saying.

 

[Solo]

Well, I think that any SDA that teaches against Jesus Christ...is NOT a SDA !

The whole point of being an SDA, is to teach Salvation by faith, in Jesus Christ ALONE, as I have done.
Those who accuse me of doing otherwise have paid absolutely NO attention to what I have been saying.

The Seventh-Day Adventists preach a gospel other than Jesus Christ's. They teach salvation by keeping the law of Moses. Since they teach keeping the law of Moses, they will be expected to keep it perfectly in order to atone for their own sins. All those that believe that Jesus paid the penalty for their sins have crucified themselves with Jesus Christ and abide with Him in heaven awaiting his return to change their corrupt, mortal bodies.