Covid 19 virus plus vaccine was meant to kill us.

[Milk-Drops]

The point is: The 14,000 that had been vaccinated and then died less than 60 days later were the ones diagnosed with "covid."

That is not what your paper said. If you want to play fallacy bingo what you are doing is called motivated reasoning or begging the question. You did not demonstrate that the people died by the vaccine. Free already pointed out the paper said "other" causes. You are assuming covid.

That's because you haven't performed due diligence. The excess deaths are off the charts.

No, I have kept up with the data. Deaths started going down in 2021 once the vaccine started getting widely distributed. That I'd total deaths. Considering the US is in the upper 80% vaccinated, there would be a noticeable impact of people dieing. All reports that less then 0.01% of the less the 0.01% of people who got a vaccine injury died.

I worked in medical at the start of covid. It was chaos at our local hospital for months.

The number of confirmed deaths from COVID-19 is far below the pandemic’s full death toll.

Excess mortality during the Coronavirus pandemic (COVID-19)

Explore data on COVID-19 excess mortality across the world.

ourworldindata.org

Yeah, you are definately using motivated reasoning. The article goes into the total deaths and provides a graph. You see a peak of deaths at the end of 2020, then a massive drop off in May of 2021 when vaccines were widely available to everyone. Then a small spike when the delta variant hit, then a drop withe the release of the booster. Did you just see excess death in the title and didn't read the article?

 

[RedPill]

You did not demonstrate that the people died by the vaccine. Free already pointed out the paper said "other" causes. You are assuming covid.

Never said they did. Rather, thousands of vaccinated people that died 60 days later had covid listed as the cause of death. Simple. Still want that shot?

Meanwhile, the worldwide "excess deaths" is a no-brainer.

 

[Corn Pop]

Yes, businesses absolutely have the right when the health and safety of customers and staff is an issue.

Amazing how wearing a mask saved lives yet when the jab come out somehow masks were not good enough anymore. No jab, no Job, no jab, no entry. The humble mask become unworthy and got booted from its position of saving lives.

I agree with you that business has the responsibility for the health and safety of there customers but to say only a jab is worthy is a bit overboard. I mean, why when everything was allowed back open to everyone no business said jab only and no jab people were having a cry all the non jabed were there?. It was just compliance.

Why now as covid is still around and peoppes till getting hospitalised, and the seasonal flu each year there is not only those with there annual flu jabs to protect others allowed entry? Yea, that's a bit extreme.

If people are sick they should stay home and have respect towards others as a social responsibility and it also limits the spread of colds and flus, thats always been the common practice in society. No one wants to be around a disrespectful snotty nose who's coughing and sneezing everywhere, and it does put the elderly and others who are immunecompromised at risk of getting seriously sick.

If people are not sick or feeling sick they should not need a jab to prove it as even with a jab people can have covid and it don't stop transmission or mean anything more than someone not sick.

 

[Corn Pop]

I'm jsut a witness for God in this life. When I was forced to stay home in the name of saving lives and those in authority told me "only essential service allowed open" and I went to the local village and the liqour store was allowed open and the Church directly across the road was forced to shut its doors and lock out Christ as Christ and the Gospel was not classed as essential service, yet if anyone (age restircted) wanted to drink whiskey and beers that somehow was classed as essential service.. Then so be it. I didn't make the rules.

Essential services only in the name of saving lives.

I'm just a witness in this world same as all people, but im not the judge. Only God can and will judge all things.

 

[Milk-Drops]

Never said they did. Rather, thousands of vaccinated people that died 60 days later had covid listed as the cause of death. Simple. Still want that shot?

Meanwhile, the worldwide "excess deaths" is a no-brainer.

Yes, I am up to date on all my vaccines including the Covid vaccine and the boosters. You literally don't understand the articles you are referencing. You are asking if I want a vaccine that has less then 0.01% chance of even injuring me. That's less dangerous then driving to India polish, and I do that multiple times a year.

 

[Free]

That's the mainstream evangelical myth. If is was the truth, then it would be easy for you to post scripture that tells us exactly that. But you can't, because there isn't any.

You mean, besides the two passages I gave which clearly command believers to obey the government? If you can't take those at what they plainly and obviously state, then I really can't believe that you are a serious student of the Bible.

It's a cop-out, another old wives tale without scriptural support. Compromising with temporal powers e.g. the soulless State can never lead to redemption or a stronger walk with the King. If you're not grounded in Christ in the first instance, then you will soon enough become influenced or overwhelmed by the Godless State; it's only a matter of degree.

There is only one lawgiver (James 4:12). This one lawgiver is the Lord (Isaiah 33:22). Man does not have authority to make laws, but only the authority to make ‘ordinances’ which enforce Laws already in existence, which are the Laws of God. To obey the so-called ‘laws’ conjured up by the worldly governing authorities is to set aside the gospel of our Lord, and place oneself under a separate government, other than his.

Bondmen of Christ are not citizens of any country on this earth, our citizenship is in heaven, and so our first loyalty is to God, not "our" country (Ephesians 2:19, Philippians 3:20). Ours is a better, heavenly country (Hebrews 11:16).


Light has no fellowship with darkness. We're not to settle for a bible study in the basement of the brothel, but to build our own city on a hill. Again, compromising with temporal powers can never lead to redemption.


Then cite scripture and enlighten us all rather than posting mere opinion.

I did. You have not. You also haven't in another thread. In both threads you demonstrate a serious lack of understanding of biblical exegesis and hermeneutics. You continually proof-text verses, divorcing them from their contexts and applying them in ways that completely misrepresent what is being said. That is to misuse and abuse Scripture. You also continually force a false division between the sacred and profane, in a way that the Bible does not do so. It displays a level of ignorance of how God works in the world and intends his children to live in the world.

They can do whatever their worldly master tells them they can do - they signed on to his program!

Yes, because they have rights.

That's what you were told to do by those running the show for a season. But you were lied to.

Nope, not at all. The vaccines significantly helped to reduce severe disease, hospitalizations, and deaths. That's what they were made for and they are effective at doing so, at least for the variants to which they apply.

There is no virus, only radiation poisoning/toxicity.

You may as well deny the sky is blue; only someone who is out of touch with reality would make such a claim.

 

[Free]

I'm jsut a witness for God in this life. When I was forced to stay home in the name of saving lives and those in authority told me "only essential service allowed open" and I went to the local village and the liqour store was allowed open and the Church directly across the road was forced to shut its doors and lock out Christ as Christ and the Gospel was not classed as essential service, yet if anyone (age restircted) wanted to drink whiskey and beers that somehow was classed as essential service.. Then so be it. I didn't make the rules.

Essential services only in the name of saving lives.

I'm just a witness in this world same as all people, but im not the judge. Only God can and will judge all things.

At least a part of that was likely to keep people from going through alcohol withdrawal, which is extremely difficult and requires, or at least should be done with, medical supervision.

 

[RedPill]

You mean, besides the two passages I gave which clearly command believers to obey the government? If you can't take those at what they plainly and obviously state, then I really can't believe that you are a serious student of the Bible.

Bust out your passages here and now.

I did. You have not. You also haven't in another thread. In both threads you demonstrate a serious lack of understanding of biblical exegesis and hermeneutics. You continually proof-text verses, divorcing them from their contexts and applying them in ways that completely misrepresent what is being said. That is to misuse and abuse Scripture. You also continually force a false division between the sacred and profane, in a way that the Bible does not do so. It displays a level of ignorance of how God works in the world and intends his children to live in the world.

This is all bloviation, the classic preemptive attempt to dismiss without actually doing the work.

Yes, because they have rights.

Indeed, and so they also have duties. Ooops! There's the rub!

Nope, not at all. The vaccines significantly helped to reduce severe disease, hospitalizations, and deaths. That's what they were made for and they are effective at doing so, at least for the variants to which they apply.

Again, your mere opinion of "vaccines" proves nothing.

You may as well deny the sky is blue; only someone who is out of touch with reality would make such a claim.

The conditioning runs deep. When someone is so out of touch with reality, the last thing on their mind is performing due diligence and their only refuge is the blue sky.

 

[Corn Pop]

I find it amazing how Fauci got a preemptive pardon.

 

[Corn Pop]

I don't know why people got a hard time for being sceptical over a new medical product and did not consent. When it comes to medical many products get recalled and most things medical always come with some type of risk even if it's low, that's why everything medical is always at the persons consent and the advice comes from a Doctor who will give there advice but will never force it as the person has to consent, and as no one wants to be held accountable if things go wrong, and it is written in civil rights, well in my country anyhow. Every person has the right not to be subjected to medical or scientific experimentation without that person’s consent, followed by Everyone has the right to refuse to undergo any medical treatment.

I mean most people who took the jab it was at there consent and choice, yet if someones livelihood is held against them and told if they don't consume a product then they have find another way to feed there family the next week and keep a roof over there head to pay the rent, no jab, no job, so they took it and got some serious side effect like pericarditis or died as some have from the jab, I mean that would be a different story. That's basically forced.

 

[Corn Pop]

 

[Corn Pop]

Amazing when someone in a position of authority says those who do not comply and do what they want them to do they will go out looking for them, and really go out the next year looking for them and go looking for that minority.

I have no idea what that means or what there intentions were. But I can understand why they got booted out of power.

 

[Corn Pop]

Everyone could get the jab but some people were hesitant so they really needed to go out and look for them and find them.

That's a great dictatorship statement. Every dictator and tyrant and all the self righteous people since the dawn of mankind would give that a round of applause, I mean that would be a standing ovation.

 

[Free]

Bust out your passages here and now.

I already did, HERE, but you misused Scripture to dismiss them.

This is all bloviation, the classic preemptive attempt to dismiss without actually doing the work.

I can see just how much work there is because of how much you mishandle Scripture, and I know that you won't believe any of it anyway. The fact that you think I haven't given verses proves my point. Your theology is seriously off in a few areas; I just don't have the time to go through it all and explain it to you.

Indeed, and so they also have duties. Ooops! There's the rub!

No idea what your point is here.

Again, your mere opinion of "vaccines" proves nothing.

It isn't mere opinion. Unlike most anti-vaxxers, I actually ran the analysis on the data. There was a direct correlation between the vaccines coming out and a reduction in severe disease, hospitalizations, and deaths. Again and again the data shows that all the potential issues that vaccines cause are also caused by COIVD, but that with COVID, the risks are of orders of magnitude greater.

The conditioning runs deep. When someone is so out of touch with reality, the last thing on their mind is performing due diligence and their only refuge is the blue sky.

I fully agree.

 

[RedPill]

You mentioned what you had posted at #256:

We are commanded to obey all governments, unless they ask us to go against God.

And my reply, in part, was: "That's the mainstream evangelical myth. If is was the truth, then it would be easy for you to post scripture that tells us exactly that. But you can't, because there isn't any.

It's a cop-out, another old wives tale without scriptural support...."

So I'm going take the time now to explain to you and all our readers why it is so important to harmonize scripture with scripture. And I will clearly show you why that faulty "obey all governments" position is nothing more than a satanic ruse meant to appease the sinner and continue to cause massive hemorrhaging within the body of Christ.

Romans 13 was a favorite passage of Adolph Hitler's, used to justify his brand of submission.

There's only one Lawgiver, and the government is on his shoulders (James 4:12). And this would be GODLY government - not the counterfeit most ignorantly insist we should serve today:

"There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another?"

Many stumble with the reality that there is a counterfeit “authority” seeking our obeisance. Satan said, “I will be like the most High” (Isaiah 14:14).

It is Satan’s “higher power” that is behind the merchants, the rich men of the earth, the present temporal “governing authorities."

In reply to the blind opinion that all kings, princes, and governments are set up and "ordained" by God, we will quote the following passage, which is spoken into the ears of Hosea by God Almighty himself. We pray that those who have eyes to see and ears to hear will no longer engage in such opinions:

"They have set up kings, but not by me: they have made princes, and I knew it not."(Hos.8:4)

Also,

"Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing? The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the LORD, and against his anointed, saying, Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us." (Psa. 2:1-3)

There's no Godly ordination there.

When scripture speaks of obeying and submitting ourselves to those who have the rule over us, God’s word is not talking about heathen governments, but those "rulers" within Jesus Christ's assembly. Notice carefully this verse (Heb. 13:17) says these rulers (i.e. “them that have the rule over you”) "watch for your souls":

"Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you."

Governments of men cannot govern or watch for anyone's souls, for they can only govern outward acts, not the inward being. But true spiritual leaders do watch for our souls.

Those who "have the rule over you" at Hebrews 13:17 is specifically defined a few verses earlier in Hebrews 13:7:

"Remember them which have the rule over you, who have spoken unto you the word of God: whose faith follow, considering the end of their conversation.,"

As we can see, scripture itself defines these "rulers" as those who speak the word of God and have faith. Conversely, secular governments avoid, and often forbid, speaking the word of God within their system through outlawing prayer in their schools and replacing it with such unrighteousness as "the theory of evolution," by taking down the "Ten Commandments" from their courtrooms, ad nauseum. These are not the rulers we are to submit to.

It is noteworthy that modern copyrighted “versions” of The Holy Bible have changed the phrase “higher powers” to merely “governing authorities,” thereby obscuring the necessary distinction between Godly authority and ungodly authority, between God’s kingdom and Satan’s kingdom.

In Romans 13, does verse 1 say, ‘let every soul be subject unto all governments’? Or does it say, "let every soul (including governing authorities such as kings, judges, police, etc.) be subject unto the higher powers"? Who do souls belong to? God says:

Ezekiel 18:4, "Behold, all souls are mine."

And the second part of verse 1 tells us who “the higher powers” is: "...For there is no power but of God".

The souls of the governmental powers belong to God, and they are not the higher powers, the higher powers are held by Christ himself (Matthew 28:18). Is our Lord not the higher power, then, if all power has been committed unto him (John 17:2)? Christ is the governor among the nations (Psalms 22:28). All power over earthly kings has been given unto him (Romans 14:9). All judgment has been given unto him (John 5:22, 27). Notice the separation of power in Romans 13:1. All power comes from, and belongs to, God (Psalm 672:11) and not the one exercising it. And remember that most men, especially those constituting the "governing authorities," usually deny that power given to Jesus (2 Timothy 3:2, 5):

“For men shall be...Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away."

Folks know something is wrong with the current setup, but they don't know what it is. I pray this clarifies the conundrum the majority find themselves in, with trying to serve two masters.

Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?
And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty. (2 Cor. 6)

 

[Corn Pop]

I always thought jabs were about helping people get less sick if they get infected and can help.protect the vulnerable, and that is what they said when the jab come out, but jab rates were low so they tried to turn it around using transmission as the argument that if someone did not get jabed they were not saving other peoples lives. No jab, no job. No jab, no entry. At that time was there any science to prove it.

https://www.factcheck.org/2022/10/scicheck-its-not-news-nor-scandalous-that-pfizer-trial-didnt-test-transmission/

 

[Corn Pop]

Telling everyone they must consume some corporations new product or they some sort of a problem and threat to society so they are not allowed to go to work anymore, no jab no job, and they become second class citizens and get less rights than others no jab no entry, all backed up by thin air. Brainwashing the masses to believe it so they can hold a grudge against there neighbour, maybe even there own family.

 

[Free]

So I'm going take the time now to explain to you and all our readers why it is so important to harmonize scripture with scripture. And I will clearly show you why that faulty "obey all governments" position is nothing more than a satanic ruse meant to appease the sinner and continue to cause massive hemorrhaging within the body of Christ.

Romans 13 was a favorite passage of Adolph Hitler's, used to justify his brand of submission.

Does that mean his particular use of it was correct?

Rom 13:1 Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God.
Rom 13:2 Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment.
Rom 13:3 For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval,
Rom 13:4 for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer.
Rom 13:5 Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath but also for the sake of conscience.
Rom 13:6 For because of this you also pay taxes, for the authorities are ministers of God, attending to this very thing.
Rom 13:7 Pay to all what is owed to them: taxes to whom taxes are owed, revenue to whom revenue is owed, respect to whom respect is owed, honor to whom honor is owed. (ESV)

Where does Paul give any qualification whatsoever in stating that we are to "be subject to the governing authorities"? Does Paul say "only as long as the government is godly"? Paul says for everyone to "be subject to the governing authorities," which the context makes clear is a reference to civil governments.

There is only one implicit qualification Paul gives--"For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God."--and that is that God is the supreme authority, so we are to obey civil governing authorities insofar as they don't ask us to disobey or otherwise go against God.

What about what Peter said?

1Pe 2:13 Be subject for the Lord's sake to every human institution, whether it be to the emperor as supreme,
1Pe 2:14 or to governors as sent by him to punish those who do evil and to praise those who do good.
...
1Pe 2:17 Honor everyone. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honor the emperor. (ESV)

Peter tells believers to be subject "to the emperor as supreme" and to "Honor the emperor." Again, does Peter give any qualification that the emperor must be godly? No, there are no qualifications whatsoever given by Peter, which is significant considering that this was likely written during a time of persecution.

There's only one Lawgiver, and the government is on his shoulders (James 4:12). And this would be GODLY government - not the counterfeit most ignorantly insist we should serve today:

"There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another?"

Many stumble with the reality that there is a counterfeit “authority” seeking our obeisance. Satan said, “I will be like the most High” (Isaiah 14:14).

It is Satan’s “higher power” that is behind the merchants, the rich men of the earth, the present temporal “governing authorities."

In reply to the blind opinion that all kings, princes, and governments are set up and "ordained" by God, we will quote the following passage, which is spoken into the ears of Hosea by God Almighty himself. We pray that those who have eyes to see and ears to hear will no longer engage in such opinions:

"They have set up kings, but not by me: they have made princes, and I knew it not."(Hos.8:4)

Also,

"Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing? The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the LORD, and against his anointed, saying, Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us." (Psa. 2:1-3)

There's no Godly ordination there.

When scripture speaks of obeying and submitting ourselves to those who have the rule over us, God’s word is not talking about heathen governments, but those "rulers" within Jesus Christ's assembly. Notice carefully this verse (Heb. 13:17) says these rulers (i.e. “them that have the rule over you”) "watch for your souls":

"Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you."

Governments of men cannot govern or watch for anyone's souls, for they can only govern outward acts, not the inward being. But true spiritual leaders do watch for our souls.

Those who "have the rule over you" at Hebrews 13:17 is specifically defined a few verses earlier in Hebrews 13:7:

"Remember them which have the rule over you, who have spoken unto you the word of God: whose faith follow, considering the end of their conversation.,"

As we can see, scripture itself defines these "rulers" as those who speak the word of God and have faith. Conversely, secular governments avoid, and often forbid, speaking the word of God within their system through outlawing prayer in their schools and replacing it with such unrighteousness as "the theory of evolution," by taking down the "Ten Commandments" from their courtrooms, ad nauseum. These are not the rulers we are to submit to.

It is noteworthy that modern copyrighted “versions” of The Holy Bible have changed the phrase “higher powers” to merely “governing authorities,” thereby obscuring the necessary distinction between Godly authority and ungodly authority, between God’s kingdom and Satan’s kingdom.

In Romans 13, does verse 1 say, ‘let every soul be subject unto all governments’? Or does it say, "let every soul (including governing authorities such as kings, judges, police, etc.) be subject unto the higher powers"? Who do souls belong to? God says:

Ezekiel 18:4, "Behold, all souls are mine."

And the second part of verse 1 tells us who “the higher powers” is: "...For there is no power but of God".

The souls of the governmental powers belong to God, and they are not the higher powers, the higher powers are held by Christ himself (Matthew 28:18). Is our Lord not the higher power, then, if all power has been committed unto him (John 17:2)? Christ is the governor among the nations (Psalms 22:28). All power over earthly kings has been given unto him (Romans 14:9). All judgment has been given unto him (John 5:22, 27). Notice the separation of power in Romans 13:1. All power comes from, and belongs to, God (Psalm 672:11) and not the one exercising it. And remember that most men, especially those constituting the "governing authorities," usually deny that power given to Jesus (2 Timothy 3:2, 5):

“For men shall be...Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away."

Folks know something is wrong with the current setup, but they don't know what it is. I pray this clarifies the conundrum the majority find themselves in, with trying to serve two masters.

Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?
And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty. (2 Cor. 6)

Pretty much every passage you give ignores the context and you have even pitted Scripture against itself. Your entire post is you making connections where there are none, to the point of appealing to verses on church authority as though they apply to civil authority, and so completely misunderstand the relationship between civil governments and God's rule and authority over those governments.

Romans 13 and 1 Peter 2 are very clear in what they plainly state and no amount of twisting by you is going to change that.

 

[RedPill]

...appealing to verses on church authority as though they apply to civil authority...

You're reading copyrighted versions of the Holy Bible, and are rightly weak as a result. The word "civil" does not even appear in the Holy Bible. Stop adding worldly stuff to what is holy.

If we look at the rest of the Romans 13 passage, we see it is not referring to a government that is "ordained of God" in the sense that he allows it to come to power despite the act that it is evil. It is speaking of a government that is "ordained of God" in the sense that it is lawfully ruling in accordance with biblical principles of righteousness.

You've converted the scriptural "higher powers" into mere man's "government" - similar to the "possession" misdirect. You don't even know how your ESV came into being. You've been hornswoggled by a reliance on the words of mere men and their copyrighted inventions.

 

[Free]

You're reading copyrighted versions of the Holy Bible,

Which is utterly irrelevant.

and are rightly weak as a result.

No, it has absolutely no bearing on the matter.

The word "civil" does not even appear in the Holy Bible. Stop adding worldly stuff to what is holy.

Do you know that the NT was written in Greek, including Romans? You are making an idol of the KJV, something which God tends to hate.

If we look at the rest of the Romans 13 passage, we see it is not referring to a government that is "ordained of God" in the sense that he allows it to come to power despite the act that it is evil. It is speaking of a government that is "ordained of God" in the sense that it is lawfully ruling in accordance with biblical principles of righteousness.

It is saying that all governments are ordained by God. Do you reject the biblical idea that God uses even evil governments to do his will and that he puts them into place for those purposes?

You've converted the scriptural "higher powers" into mere man's "government" - similar to the "possession" misdirect.

That is what it means. The Bible wasn't written in English, even the old, outdated English of the 1600's, just so you know.

You don't even know how your ESV came into being.

Don't assume.

You've been hornswoggled by a reliance on the words of mere men and their copyrighted inventions.

"The words of mere men"? You mean just like the KJV is the words of mere men? You are no different, except that I haven't given myself over to the demonic idea that the KJV is the only true Bible.