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Growth Do you Force your Religion on Others?

Sandy Zalecki

Sandy Zalecki

Member
"Knowledge puffs up, but love edifies. And if any think that he know anything, he know nothing yet as he ought to know. But if anyone loves God, that one is known by him." 1 Cor. 8:1-2

I usually don't like to talk about politics, but this one is very near and dear to my heart so I am going to voice my opinion about the Supreme Court ruling on the Hobby Lobby issue. My daughter-in-law works for Hobby Lobby and that is why I am concerned about it.

I feel the ruling was fair. I don't think that a corporation or anyone should be forced to pay for something they oppose for religions and moral grounds. The owners of Hobby Lobby are Christians and they do not not want to pay for the morning after pill because they consider it abortion which they do not agree with.

Is this ruling an infringement on religious freedom or a correct ruling because the government has overstepped its bounds by forcing someone to do something they disagree with on moral and religious grounds? I believe it is the latter. Why should the owners of Hobby Lobby even have to go to court? Why was the government forcing them to pay for the morning after pill in the first place?

Now, Hobby Lobby is being accused of forcing their religion on others. How is that? They have never passed out a track to me when I entered the store. My daughter-in-law who is a Christian has never been forced to accept Christianity as her religion just because she works there. If a woman does not like the fact that Hobby Lobby won't pay for the morning after pill she is free to get another job.

This whole thing smells of yet another attempt to marginalize Christians and take our Christian heritage away from us. I for one think we should be more forceful in spreading our religion. We have lost so much. The only way we are going to get it back is to speak up and be prepared to take the persecution that follows. My hat is off to Hobby Lobby for standing up for what they believe.
 
do keep in mind and perhaps you can verify that hobby lobby doesn't want to hire gays. which I think is wrong.im not for gay marriage but what one does with sex and even if its a sin isn't a reason to not to hire. otherwise we that own a business shouldn't hire, adulterers, and fornicators.
 
I still fear this has the potential to open the door for some smart and money hungry lawyers to use this as a basis for all kinds of unforseen consequences, many of which Christians will be screaming about if and when they happen. When you hold the power of ruining a person's livlyhood in your hands, forcing them to comply with your religious belifs can be done by the things you withold from them just as easily as the things you require of them or give to them. Does Hobby Lobby provide anything like Bible studies or such things to their employees during their paid working hours in order to teach and encourage Christian morals? If they are truly concerned with the morals of their employees they would invest in things like this. I don't believe God honors a person's following of a Christian moral just because they have had their abiliity to go against that moral taken away by someone else.
 
Obadiah said:
I still fear this has the potential to open the door for some smart and money hungry lawyers to use this as a basis for all kinds of unforseen consequences, many of which Christians will be screaming about if and when they happen. When you hold the power of ruining a person's livlyhood in your hands, forcing them to comply with your religious belifs can be done by the things you withold from them just as easily as the things you require of them or give to them. Does Hobby Lobby provide anything like Bible studies or such things to their employees during their paid working hours in order to teach and encourage Christian morals? If they are truly concerned with the morals of their employees they would invest in things like this. I don't believe God honors a person's following of a Christian moral just because they have had their abiliity to go against that moral taken away by someone else.
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I read that the insurance companies had or were discussing providing those things for no charge to the customer that objected to paying for them. If this is so it will be interesting to see if there is still an objection raised. It would seem to me that if this is a moral issue there would be. It shouldn't matter whether they were paying for it or not, they should object to it being on their policy period.
 
kiwidan said:
I would never force my belief on anyone. Its the individuals choice what they want to believe. Thats what choice is. Thats why Adam and eve sinned. God has given choices. Was it not God who hardens hearts?. Is it not God then who can soften hearts?. Plant a seed and then its up to the individual to study and read or ask questions if they want to know more and the real truth and God is big enough to do the rest of the work. Everyone knows there is a church down the road. Its there choice if they want to go and there choice to open the word and study for themselves rather than just listening to someone else. Thats why the Word was written.
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ok so I want an abortion, pay for it. its the law that you must.
 
kiwidan said:
I will give to the law what is the laws. Its only money, what they do with the money is there own business.
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so one could say that it was lawful to turn jews over the germans. and that is was moral. after it was a law that the germans and non jews were to comply and not hold jewish babies, boys and girls and so forth from the german ss whom turned them over for their protection and to make the economy strong. im sure god would agree with you when man says it not murder, its not. funny how that works
 
Deborah13 said:
I read that the insurance companies had or were discussing providing those things for no charge to the customer that objected to paying for them. ...
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I've been wondering if they would do this. I'll bet the cost of drawing up and keeping track of separate policies for every company that objects to paying for certain things will cost the insurance companies more money than the cost of providing a few free pills at wholesale cost once in a while. And I'll bet the reduction in cost of the policy (if they go that route) will only be a few cents per person (the wholesale cost of the pills they actually expect to pay for, divided by the number of people insured). The big insurance companies have people who are very good at calculating these things.
 
Obadiah said:
I've been wondering if they would do this. I'll bet the cost of drawing up and keeping track of separate policies for every company that objects to paying for certain things will cost the insurance companies more money than the cost of providing a few free pills at wholesale cost once in a while. And I'll bet the reduction in cost of the policy (if they go that route) will only be a few cents per person (the wholesale cost of the pills they actually expect to pay for, divided by the number of people insured). The big insurance companies have people who are very good at calculating these things.
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That's why I'm so curious about what they would do. To me that would be really a sign of true intentions of the objection.
 
Deborah13 said:
That's why I'm so curious about what they would do. To me that would be really a sign of true intentions of the objection.
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Yep, because in reality this means that Hobby Lobby is still paying for policies that provide abortion pills. The fact that the policy may be a few cents cheaper doesn't change the fact that they are still ultimately paying for abortion pills. As I've said a number of times, smart lawyers are going to find all kinds of ways to exploit this court decision.
 
geez, religion is getting worse than politics lately. Peripherally, it sounds honorable what hobby Lobby is doing, but i will admit to not following the story closely so am not well informed of the details. I think that people should be able to run their business any way they want to and institute any policy they so desire. this is a facet of Capitalism I think. if people do not like it, let them work or shop elsewhere. I am self employed for well over 20 years and i think I should be able to set policy as i wish in my company.

I try not not to consider politics, sin, religion, lifestyle or anything else in consideration of my business and in dealing with customers. I'm not there to judge them or to talk lifestyle with them, I'm there to work. However, I will admit to giving preference to customers whose house shows evidence of the Lord therein. Oh, and widows and so forth. I've had the thought to give discounts to Christians before, but it is not anything that I have instituted as a carved in stone policy. It's too hard to tell for one thing. just because someone has a picture of the Lord on the wall doesn't mean they have a Godly heart and walk with God, some just like the clean cut good image that is associated with it.

I do not force my religion on people in the least. I will mention God with a 'Praise the Lord' in conversation or something similar, which could open the door to a good conversation, and if the people freak out for any reason it could be said to just be an expression. In other ways we can let our light shine before men in our conduct and speech, and sometimes they will say something about God in response to this! People can perceive the light of God in others. If we seek to draw closer to God and develop our relationship with Him, and walk in Christ, and Christ in us...This can say more than 1000 words can and people will pick up on the love and the light.
 
Edward said:
...I think that people should be able to run their business any way they want to and institute any policy they so desire...
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Yeah, on the surface this sounds like a good idea. That is until companies or organizations that you really need to do business with start instituting policies that you don't like or can't live with. This is a very slippery slope and is why we need a certain amount of laws that govern what companies must do and can't do.
 
Obadiah said:
Yeah, on the surface this sounds like a good idea. That is until companies or organizations that you really need to do business with start instituting policies that you don't like or can't live with. This is a very slippery slope and is why we need a certain amount of laws that govern what companies must do and can't do.
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Yeah, it used to be America. :sad

But between the government butting in and trying to control everything, and people in business trying to mix business with their beliefs to an unreasonable extent...we went downhill.

:bricks
 
jasonc said:
do keep in mind and perhaps you can verify that hobby lobby doesn't want to hire gays. which I think is wrong.im not for gay marriage but what one does with sex and even if its a sin isn't a reason to not to hire. otherwise we that own a business shouldn't hire, adulterers, and fornicators.
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I don't know their specific policy on hiring gays. I know they inform people before they are hired that they are a Christian based company. I don't suppose that many gays would want to work for a Christian based company, but I'm not sure of their policy. I would have to ask my daughter-in-law. She is a store manager. I'm sure she knows what their policy is.
 
Good morning to you all brothers and sisters! :)

I'll be sure to take Hobby Lobby more of my business since I have learned that they're a Christian based company. :)
 
Obadiah said:
I still fear this has the potential to open the door for some smart and money hungry lawyers to use this as a basis for all kinds of unforseen consequences, many of which Christians will be screaming about if and when they happen. When you hold the power of ruining a person's livlyhood in your hands, forcing them to comply with your religious belifs can be done by the things you withold from them just as easily as the things you require of them or give to them. Does Hobby Lobby provide anything like Bible studies or such things to their employees during their paid working hours in order to teach and encourage Christian morals? If they are truly concerned with the morals of their employees they would invest in things like this. I don't believe God honors a person's following of a Christian moral just because they have had their abiliity to go against that moral taken away by someone else.
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They are a very blessed company. At one time they were paying a fine of a million dollars a day for not providing the morning after pill. It was just a drop in the bucket. My daughter-in-law says their store makes so much money they don't know what to do with it. The Lord has blessed them in many ways. They don't provide Bible studies for their employees, I do know that, but they are very blessed.
 
I always shop a Hobby Lobby for my arts and crafts material. But then I also get the employee discount. They allow family members of employees to shop at a discount also.
 
kiwidan said:
Now your changing and talking about individual human beings from talking about money and funding. They are different.

Am i the one having an abortion?. No.
Am i paying for it. No.
Was i the one who personally handed over the funds to someone who was going to have an abortion?. No.

Its like if i donate you a dolla. It is now your dolla. What you do with that dolla is now your choice and not my responsibility. You cannot come back and blame me because you dropped it and lost it down a drain.
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in America, individuals people like me can work for myself and be a corporation legally. therefore I have no rights per that above argument against hobby lobby which isn't a corporation in that it has stock, to my knowledge, therefore since theres this argument of if wear this suit im exempt from morals what is the reason to live out the faith?
 
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