Do you have demons?

[spirit1st]

The heart of a person is the spirit of that being.
The mind is different as we both agree .I have cast out demons and even satan himself .
But anyone I think can cast him out in the name of JESUS CHRIST .as the bibles shows .But one guy ?the demons jumped on him .But you see ?the demons all know GODS kids and fear them .Because we have a certain about of power over them .They put evil thoughts in all peoples minds .But can not take over a christ ,one born of GOD .As this scriptuire clearly shows >

1Jo 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

1Jo 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
This speaks of our spirits .

Mat 10:25 It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub, how much more shall they call them of his household?

I see no sense on going on with this ,but believe as you will ?
Col 3:10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:
1Jo 4:17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.

 

[kwag_myers]

I see no sense on going on with this ,but believe as you will ?

This is very important. The Sons of Sceva did not understand demonic activity and they got into trouble (Acts 19:14-16). Also, Jesus' disciples in Matthew 17:14-21 did not understand the importance of being prepared ahead of time.

We are called to reign as kings and priests (Revelation 5:10). Our priestly service is to worship the Lord. Our kingly service is to put Satan and his demons under the authority that God has given us.

The problem that I have with your position is that it goes against the nature of God. We are saved by grace, but we must choose to grow in spirit as we submit to God's Word and allow the Holy Spirit to work in us (and through us). And for those who do, your scriptures (that you've provided) certainly do apply. But there are instances that I think show what happens to those who do not (or can not) allow themselves to be changed by the power of the Holy Spirit.

The thief on the cross was just minutes away from his death when he accepted Jesus. Was he truly a child of God? There's no mention of a demon being cast out of him. And the Holy Spirit hadn't come upon the earth yet. Still, Jesus assured the thief that he would be saved.

Was Judas Iscariot a Christian? He believed that Jesus was the Messiah, yet we are told in Luke 22:3 that Satan entered him.

Consider the Parable of the Ten Virgins (Matthew 25). They all were waiting on the Bridegroom, but only five of them were allowed in to the wedding feast. This, to me, explains the difference between those who yield to the Holy Spirit (represented by the oil) and those who do not.

 

[jess321]

i said yes but i don't mean the 'movie' demons i mean like pride, fibbing, and things like that. i think demons are the voice in the back of your head that silences your conscience.

 

[spirit1st]

I see your position as wrong and takeing from GODS GLORY ?
You see GOD is a perfect spirit .We are ,when born again ?perfect spirits .all the angels in heaven are perfect spirits .GOD wanted beings like HIM SELF .perfect beings .When we are with out sin ?we are perfect beings .many ,many scriptures tell us this .But is rejected because a few scriptures say we are sinners .and much more say we are not .But they are all right .
So our understanding is flawed .
because you know well ?We are spirit soul and body .3 parts . one part evil or sin full [the body ]
one part can go either way ,soul or mind
same because it must be retrained ,to accept the things of the spirit and take on the thoughts of our LORD JESUS CHRIST
The last part ,who we really are is spirit .This is who the LORD died for .it must have a new birth .BORN OF GOD .How could anyone be BORN OF GOD .Yet not be perfect or in HIS image ? Man does not teach this as a whole .it is taught but not too much .The scriptures are rejected in most cases .because if you believe you are a sinner and like the world ,you are controled easy .as you never accept the power of being GODS son ..You see how not many have the signs or not much of the gifts or other things ,GOD SAID WE WOULD HAVE .
Man kind wants to be taught by man kind ? different greek and other books .All scripture is true .it all must fit together perfectly


1Jo 4:17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.


If we accept this scripture ?Then e must say to our selves ?HOW IS HE NOW ?Well ,HE is perfect and sin less .HE is in new jerusalem . Gal 4:26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.



Eph 3:15 Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named,
Eph 3:16 That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man;
Eph 3:17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,
Eph 3:18 May be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
Eph 3:19 And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fullness of God.


You see here?We are compared and part of those in heaven .Why ?because we spiritually or in our spirit are already perfect .
But looking at the seen ?we see sin ?because the flesh is .
But not the inner man ,born of GOD .


1Jo 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

1Jo 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

So many accept the one and reject the other ?But both are true.
Because one speaks of the spirit BORN OF GOD the other speaks of the flesh ,
But even our minds can sin ?if we allow it ?

Now the question is ?DID HE TAKE OUR SINS or not?Are they gone or are they just hid ?
I believe HE took my sins and they are gone and if I do sin again ?I ask ,repent and they too are gone .If this is true ?Which I believe.Then what is left?NOT sin .HE gets all the glory ,because HE did it all .HE said it is finished .We do ot die and see our salvation .We see it now .or we do not have it .It starts when we are born into the kingdom .The new birth .
NEW CREATURE .JESUS CHRIST is and was ,the 1st new creature ,then we ,when BORN AGAIN are created like HIm .Only the HOLY SPIRIT can reveal this and we then would have to accept it .

1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, Eph 5:27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.
This is the new birth and this is who we are after the birth .


Eph 2:4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, by (grace ye are saved;)
Eph 2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
Phi 3:20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ:
Joh 17:16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
Joh 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.


Brother .You should ASK the HOLY SPIRIT to reveal ALl truth in these scriptures as there are many more that show this same thing.Many seeds have been planted in our hearts which are not true and take from the work JESUS CHRIST did for us .Because hE bought us right back where man started .before sin took us from our relationship with GOD .
Yet I see?man kind desires to stay weak and sin full and not able to overcome .But we are called to over come everything ,just as our LORD DID .We follow HIm ,in every way .


THIS IS OUR NEW NATURE!
2Pe 1:3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
2Pe 1:4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.


2Co 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

Rom 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

THIS is the part that must be changed ,and we control how much like the LORD we become .




This scripture can only be speaking of our spirits ?Do you agree?
1Jo 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

 

[kwag_myers]

i said yes but i don't mean the 'movie' demons i mean like pride, fibbing, and things like that. i think demons are the voice in the back of your head that silences your conscience.

Actually, these are strongholds of our flesh (2 Corinthians 10:4). I've yet to see anyone with a demon of pride. Consider Proverbs 16:5.

I see your position as wrong and takeing from GODS GLORY ?
You see GOD is a perfect spirit .We are ,when born again ?perfect spirits .

I don’t dispute that. As I’ve said repeatedly, our souls are gradually regenerated if we allow the Word and the Holy Spirit free reign in our lives.

all the angels in heaven are perfect spirits .

If that's true, then how did Satan fall? Is he not an angel?

GOD wanted beings like HIM SELF .perfect beings .When we are with out sin ?we are perfect beings .many ,many scriptures tell us this .But is rejected because a few scriptures say we are sinners .and much more say we are not .But they are all right .
So our understanding is flawed .
because you know well ?We are spirit soul and body .3 parts . one part evil or sin full [the body ]
one part can go either way ,soul or mind
same because it must be retrained ,to accept the things of the spirit and take on the thoughts of our LORD JESUS CHRIST
The last part ,who we really are is spirit .This is who the LORD died for .it must have a new birth .BORN OF GOD .How could anyone be BORN OF GOD .Yet not be perfect or in HIS image ? Man does not teach this as a whole .it is taught but not too much .

If we are perfected instantly when we accept Jesus as our Savior, how is it that Peter writes;
"And when people escape from the wicked ways of the world by learning about our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and then get tangled up with sin and become its slave again, they are worse off than before. It would be better if they had never known the right way to live than to know it and then reject the holy commandments that were given to them." 2 Peter 2:20-21
This is, to me anyway, a clear indication that Christians can allow themselves to be overcome by the world. That doesn't sound very "perfect" to me. We see this again in the letter to Thyatira (Revelation 2:18-29). These are clearly Christians who once walked in God's ways but have fallen to the temptations of the flesh.

Brother .You should ASK the HOLY SPIRIT to reveal ALl truth in these scriptures as there are many more that show this same thing.Many seeds have been planted in our hearts which are not true and take from the work JESUS CHRIST did for us .Because hE bought us right back where man started .before sin took us from our relationship with GOD .
Yet I see?man kind desires to stay weak and sin full and not able to overcome .But we are called to over come everything ,just as our LORD DID .We follow HIm ,in every way .

These scriptures, while very true, do not support your position that a Christian can not allow themselves to be demonised. The New Testiment if full of warnings about this. And why? If it were impossible, why all the warnings?

Rom 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

THIS is the part that must be changed ,and we control how much like the LORD we become .

But this is a process. Why else would Paul instruct us in this manner?
"Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset [us], and let us run with patience the race that is set before us," Hebrews 12:1

This scripture can only be speaking of our spirits ?Do you agree?
1Jo 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Of coarse I agree. But this is talking about the continuous practice of sin. Here it is in the Amplified:
"No one born (begotten) of God [deliberately, knowingly, and habitually] practices sin, for God's nature abides in him [His principle of life, the divine sperm, remains permanently within him]; and he cannot practice sinning because he is born (begotten) of God."
And what about Galatians 5:17? How is it that this struggle can continue? Or Galations 6:9, "And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not." And Romans 7:15, "For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I."

 

[spirit1st]

1Jo 4:17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.
what does this scripture say too you ?

Col 3:10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

1Jo 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.


1Jo 2:14 I have written unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I have written unto you, young men, because ye are strong, and the word of God abideth in you, and ye have overcome the wicked one.






Mat 13:19 When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.




2Co 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

We become 100% NEW CREATURES .
Because we are BORN OF GOD .JUST LIKE OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST .
We are new ,none ever like us .WE are BORN AFTER THE @ND ADAM <JESUS CHRIST
1Co 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.


Now it is true angels and demons are spirits .But they are not made in the image of GOD .But we are .AS far as satan ,He is made of rocks and stones .



Eze 28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
Eze 28:15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
Eze 28:16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
Eze 28:17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.
Eze 28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.
Eze 28:19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.
Eze Job 1:12 And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD.
Ti 5:15 For some are already turned aside after SataRev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
Rev 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
Rev 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

We see demons can enter people and pigs ,and I would guess about anything,We see angels came to earth looking like men .


1Co 3:17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.


2Co 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?


2Co 6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you.
2Co 6:18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

MUCHLESS HAVE IT DWELL WITHIN YOU .

The MOST IMPORTANT THING IN A PERSONS LIFE .Is to become a BABY AGAIN .A new birth .BORN OF GOD .WE know it when it happens .
Other wise we go on our own understanding and our own righteousness .Which will produce death .

2Co 7:1 Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.
Joh 17:26 And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.
light and darkness cannot live together .

1Jo 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.


Rom 11:16 For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches.


Rom 15:16 That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering the gospel of God, that the offering up of the Gentiles might be acceptable, being sanctified by the Holy Ghost.



Eph 5:27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.


This body is not only without demons ,but is sin less .THey are the true church ,BORN OF GOD .
Joh 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth forever.
NOT possible to corruptible these beings.


Be HOLY AS I AM HOLY .can not mean except for your demon?of course not .

demons can put evil thoughts in our minds .But all we need do is reject them and the leave to try another or we can MAKE THEM LEAVE ,by telling them to get out ,take you dumb thoughts with you .in the name of JESUS CHRIST .They must obey .The power is in the name .every demon knows gods kids and fear them .

 

[spirit1st]

You know brother we are to walk in our spirits ,led by HIS .Which is automatic .But if we do not stay walking in our spirit ,we start leaning to our old thionking .Then ,I have found ,we need to fast again .
fast is a great tool for us .
Isa 58:6 Is not this the fast that I have chosen? to loose the bands of wickedness, to undo the heavy burdens, and to let the oppressed go free, and that ye break every yoke?
It breaks EVERY YOKE or anything that has hurt us spiritually .Because our spirits are more powerful than the flesh .and will control it if we let it .We know ?Our spirit are not of this world and wants only to serve the LORD ..But our minds need to be renewed .
Once we take on his mind .We will not sin .sinning is disobeying GOD .The new creature never does nor will .So all our problems are in the flesh or the mind .Where our real battle is .

 

[kwag_myers]

A person becomes a Christian the moment they accept Jesus as Savior, Yes, or No?

You're tell me that a person who is demonized "never really knew God". To know Him is a process, we don't instantly know everything (Ephesians 4:15).

I've been a Christian for a long time and I watched as many Christians turned away from the Lord as the Charismatic Movement stopped moving. They didn't understand the principle of eating fresh manna. Instead, they became dissillutioned and many even became bitter against the Lord. And that's the opening that Satan is looking for.

I've seen it too many times for you to change my opinion on this. In fact, I prayed with an elderly man this evening who confessed Jesus as His Savior, but was obviously under the oppression of an unclean spirit. To make a statement like, "they never really knew God" implies that you have the ability to judge a person's relationship with God, and I don't see that in the Bible. Yes, we are to judge the fruit, but only God can judge the heart.

 

[spirit1st]

WE must be BORN AGAIN .Many say they believe in JESUS CHRIST ,even demons believe and know HE IS LORD .We must accept HIm as LORD of our lifes .This means HE rules .The bible teaches many are called .Few choosen .Just because a person knows ?Does not make them BORN OF GOD .As I thought I was a christain ,and died .I found out I was not .Because we are too know HIm personally as FATHER .We are to talk with HIm daily .
Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: is this true to each of us ?
Mar 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Mar 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
Mar 16:18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
is this true?
Well they are ,But I understand fully that not all are grown in the LORd and must be taught by the HOLY SPIRIT .
You can see many not born of GOD ,will be in the great tribulation .Now we all would like to believe we are 100% saved ? But I think ?Few accept HIM as there LORD AND MASTER .They may say it .But they decide everything in there lifes .They judge quick,with out asking the HOLY GHOST ,HE is here to teach us .But will not ,if we do not ask or accept HIS TRUTHS .Which come to us in our minds .Few understand ,HE waits day and night for us to ask .I can not say who is saved or not.I do not think many who are not saved would think they are not?But everyone BORN OF GOD knows they belong too the LORD .
But this is clear!
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Now these people knew of him ,and i think even said the sinners prayer .But I think?they never accepted HIM as LORD AND MASTER .HE MUST HAVE HIS PLACE IN OUR LIFES .

NO everyone will accept him as savior,But not everyone will accept him as LORD .
I say ?NO demon can dwell with the HOLY SPIRIT .Now they can put many evil thoughts in a person ,but can not live in that being.

You reject this ?or misunderstand it ?
1Jo 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.


PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 5:41 pm Post subject:

1Jo 4:17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is,

Do you see how powerful this vs. is ?As HE is in the perfect city of NEW JERUSALEM ,WE ARE NOW .Could HE have a demon dwelling in HIM .OF COURSE NOT .
HE says ,I did not say .But HE said .We are like HIM now .I fully understand ,many will not believe this scripture and even get mad .But it is in the bible as well as many more just like it .
Rom 12:1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
Luk 1:75 In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life.
What kind of birth is this ?
Joh 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

What kind of nature do we now have?
2Pe 1:3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
2Pe 1:4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

partakers of HIS NATURE .This is why we are like HIM NOW .

2Pe 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
1Pe 1:4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,


Phi 3:20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ:
Everything we say is going there to become truth .

Mat 16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Mat 18:18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

How powerful are our words?
Joh 20:23 Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.
Mat 21:21 Jesus answered and said unto them, Verily I say unto you, If ye have faith, and doubt not, ye shall not only do this which is done to the fig tree, but also if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; it shall be done.

Mar 11:23 For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.
Mar 11:24 Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.

1Jo 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

2Co 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
EVERYTHING BECOMES NEW ,Because we are no longer of this world .
Our rules are in new jerusalem .Where the things not seen can be seen .With these rules ,we can walk on water or many things not normal on the earth .
They live by LOVE and truth there .Nothing is impossiable.
But of course it must be in the LORD will .


1Pe 1:16 Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.
1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth forever.

THIS SEED WE ARE BORN OF ?IT CAN NOT BE CORRUPTED .
We can either believe the living word or reject it ?
or we can change it to match our minds .
Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
1Co 2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
1Co 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
Gal 6:8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.
Gal 6:18 Brethren, the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. Amen.

The spirit born of GOD is highter and can control the flesh 100%

Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh.
But it may take some effort ?

 

[kwag_myers]

NO everyone will accept him as savior,But not everyone will accept him as LORD .

The people in Matthew 7:21-23 call Him Lord. So, you're saying that they don't really mean it? I don't think so. I think they really believed that they were serving their Lord. These are probably very religious people. But they failed, in one way or another, to allow the Holy Spirit to teach them the truth about God's ways and His Word.

I say ?NO demon can dwell with the HOLY SPIRIT .Now they can put many evil thoughts in a person ,but can not live in that being.

You reject this ?or misunderstand it ?

I don't think you're reading my posts. I agree that no demon can dwell with the Holy Spirit. But if we grieve the Holy Spirit and He leaves, doesn't that open the door for a demon? We're still Christians, right? Otherwise, who is God talking to in Matthew 7:21-23?

THIS SEED WE ARE BORN OF ?IT CAN NOT BE CORRUPTED .

Again, I agree, but we have the ability to become corrupted if we give in to the desires of the flesh.

 

[spirit1st]

1Jo 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

 

[spirit1st]

1Jo 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth forever.

Well do we believe this is incorruptible or not?
You see ?Once born of GOd ,we can not be take over ,oh we can sin .But the LORD will only let this go so far .Then we either repent or kiss this world good bye .
1Co 5:5 To deliver such a one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

we all have demons put evil thoughts in our minds .we must reject them .

I will NEVER LEAVE OR FORSAKE YOU .THESE ARE OUR LORDS WORDS .
You accept them ?

YOU SEE it is done?HE has saved us
2Ti 1:9 Who hath saved us, and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

Gal 6:8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.
you see?the flesh will suffer if we walk in sin .not the spirit .that is why ?so many are sick in the flesh .

Gal 6:18 Brethren, the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. Amen.
Eph 2:22 In whom ye also are builded together for a habitation of God through the Spirit.
but even in the flesh ,we can be healed and move on in the vLORd ,if we obey his word and do as he says .But of course FAITH does it all .

 

[bmeasure]

I wrote this in another forum, so let me see what kind of input I get here.

I'm starting this topic for the purpose of gaining as much theological, practical, and experiential knowledge as possible from reading Scripture, and studying the actions of them both in the Old and New Testaments. Personal experience is welcome, but please keep it based on theology and know what you are talking about. I highly recomend a book by Derek Prince called "They shall expell demons".

First it's best to accurately define what a demon is. It is first found in the NT as daimon or daimonion in the original Greek(depending on which books), both of which have been interpreted as demon in the English language. Other wording for demons is unclean spirits, evil spirits, spirit of an unclean demon, and even devil (which comes from Greek diabolos). Generally the term devil should be kept for Satan himself, since it translates as "slanderer" and only refers to demons 3 times in the NT. All of the above terms will be considered synonymous with "demon" for purposes of this study.

Demons can also be described as spiritual beings with an intense craving to occupy physical bodies. They seem to prefer humans to animals, but can use either (remember Legion). They seem to prefer animals to going without a body. They also show 5 traits consistent with having personality:
1) Will
2) Emotion
3) Intellect
4) Self Awareness
5) Ability to Speak

Two Theories of where demons come from:
1) They are some of the fallen angels associated with Satan and his rebellion against God.
2) They are disembodied spirits of a pre-Ademic race that perished under some judgement of God not recorded in detail in Scripture.

There isn't enough information that I know of or have read to accurately be able to choose either one of these theories or another. It could very well be neither, but I have read several things which cause me to lean more towards the second theory.

Without taking up too much more room I'll make a few points to back up my belief. I can add more later after hearing some input from others. First is the fact that angels have never shown any need to inhabit a human's body. They have always been able to appear as solid bodies whenever they choose to. Demons are known to have intense cravings for inhabiting bodies. It would make sense to me that whatever the race of beings was that lived before the creation of "our" earth with Adam would have had to be utterly and dispicably evil and corrupt in all their ways. There must not have been even one good being in the entire planet. Now if that was the case, and these creatures, like us, were made to be eternal, then their spirits would still be roaming the earth. This assumes that God did not place them in some place like Hell. Now wouldn't it make sense that spirits who have been so utterly corrupted by sin, and who loved to do vile and detestable acts in their lives would still have those same tendencies in their afterlife? These spirits would be absolutely thrilled with the opportunity to influence other bodies to act out whatever sinful cravings destroyed them originally.

Another thought was that the NT teaches us that Jesus, the disciples, and all believers are to cast out demons with "a word" spoken as commands. It never does talk about the disciples or Christ having to assault or defend themselves by physical means. Yet Scriptures state: "We battle not against flesh and blood, but against Power, Principalities, Rulers of Darkness, and Spiritual Wickedness in high (heavenly) places." This says that we "wrestle" with these type of beings! Obviously it's in prayer and such, but it also claims "high or heavenly places" which refers to the sky. I want to express very quickly how the Bible describes the 3 Heavens. 1st heaven is the sky, 2nd is outer space, 3rd is God's home....Heaven. Angels were cast out of Heaven, but not out of the heavenlies. in fact the scripture I just quoted spoke of these creatures inhabiting the heavenlies, but that they were all named as some type of leadership, for the most part.

What if the fallen angels were subject to Satan, and ruled the heavenlies just like the "prince of the power of air over Persia" who battled against Gabriel for 2 weeks after Daniel had prayed for the dream interpretation? What if these fallen angels were, in charge (Powers, Principalities, Rulers of Darkness, etc.) of the lesser creatures called demons? This would seem to make sense to me then. It would seem to back up that angels are constantly fighting in the heavenlies (good and fallen angels) while the demons are trapped on the firmament of the earth and have tasks of harming us.

Also, if you have ever heard some of the names of demons or seen the ways they act on their natures, you would certainly question your belief of them being fallen angels. Think of Adultery, Fear, Envy, Self-Pity, Witchcraft, Hatred, etc. These just don't bring up the image of angelic beings, even fallen ones. Granted that in a fallen state God could have reduced them to these pitiful states, but it wouldn't make sense then, that these creatures if decreased in ability would be able to contend with Holy Angels sent by God to perform tasks in the Earth. There is a whole lot we could get into, but I'd like to get some other input first.

****break- Someone asked a question, then I replied****

[quote:974b7]Since I do not believe in supernatural spirits of any kind, I shall probably not participate in this thread very much. I do have one simple question, however, right here at the beginning. What makes you think that a race of beings lived before "our earth" was created, and what makes you think they must have been evil?

Good question! I actually forgot to make a brief explaination of these theories. Let me remind you all that there is little information in the Bible regarding this stuff, but there are clues that are hard to explain away. These should point at some indication of the fall of Satan, 1/3 of the angels, and people who inhabited the earth during that time. Without further biasing your views, please Read these scriptures:

Isaiah 14: 12-23 (notice especially v. 20, 21)

Ezekiel 28: 12-19

Now that you can form your own opinions, I would like to add that I do NOT buy into there being a race BEFORE Adam. I only stated in the last post that I was leaning a bit more toward the second idea, in other words I don't buy into demons being fallen angels at all. I listed those two theories, because they are two of the most prominent ideas of how demons were brought into this world. They are not my theories, in fact I got them from the book I named in my first post.

Since we have brought this up, I'd like to say that another "theory" which I haven't heard from anyone, but have been recently tossing around in my head, is that they are the spirits of the Nephalim (sons of the fallen angels and human women.) I'm sure this theory will have holes in it also, but I'm just tossing scripture around trying to find out for myself all the facts. Some things are purposely hidden by God, and it is futile to search for them, but IF HE HAS left clues, then I want to know about them. I'm a studier of the Word, not just a reader.

Back on subject, I'd like to refrain from various Gnosis, alternate Creation, and Pre-Adamite conversations, unless they closely tie in with responses to demonic origins. You are welcome to your opinions, but I don't buy into those theories because I believe God's Word is perfect!
[/quote:974b7]
Now since this thread wasn't started by me, you don't have to follow any of my requests at the end, but instead refer to the original poster. I just thought this was some interesting stuff I had been learning, and wanted to share. Any insight?

 

[spirit1st]

demons are all fallen angels ,satan is leading them . they are evil and hate man kind ,they put many evil thoughts in peoples minds .and decieve many

 

[Imagican]

Let me add the parable of the man cleaning his house. By all indications this is in reference to a man finding the truth, (accepting Christ), then after a while slidding back to his old ways. It says that at first a demon was forced to leave, but after a while returns to find the man a more desirable place to be than before and brings many other demons with him.

I believe that without a doubt it is refereing to one that had already recieved the truth, cast away his demon, and slides back allowing not only the one demon to return but offers sanctuary to many others also.

 

[spirit1st]

Many are called ,few choosen
These are those called ,But not BORN OF GOD .They never were reborn .The NEW BIRTH is the key to an enternal life with OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST.
Many have no understanding ,of the spirit.
Everything is spiritual 1st with us .Then we see the results in the flesh .
The key is accepting JESUS CHRIST has LORD and MASTER .Until HE has control ?We are not HIS !
Most will only accept HIm as SAVIOR .
But we must be led by HIS HOLY GHOST .
We seem too want to decide ,his will in everything?

 

[kwag_myers]

1Jo 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

So you no longer sin, is that what you're telling me?

Romans 7:14-25 (NLT); "14 The law is good, then. The trouble is not with the law but with me, because I am sold into slavery, with sin as my master. 15 I don't understand myself at all, for I really want to do what is right, but I don't do it. Instead, I do the very thing I hate. 16 I know perfectly well that what I am doing is wrong, and my bad conscience shows that I agree that the law is good. 17 But I can't help myself, because it is sin inside me that makes me do these evil things.
18 I know I am rotten through and through so far as my old sinful nature is concerned. No matter which way I turn, I can't make myself do right. I want to, but I can't. 19 When I want to do good, I don't. And when I try not to do wrong, I do it anyway. 20 But if I am doing what I don't want to do, I am not really the one doing it; the sin within me is doing it.
21 It seems to be a fact of life that when I want to do what is right, I inevitably do what is wrong. 22 I love God's law with all my heart. 23 But there is another law at work within me that is at war with my mind. This law wins the fight and makes me a slave to the sin that is still within me. 24 Oh, what a miserable person I am! Who will free me from this life that is dominated by sin?* 25 Thank God! The answer is in Jesus Christ our Lord. So you see how it is: In my mind I really want to obey God's law, but because of my sinful nature I am a slave to sin."

Now, if Paul struggled with sin, I find it difficult to appreciate your position on 1 John 5:18. This would conflict with 2 Corinthians 4:16, i.e., what purpose does it serve for our inward man to be renewed?

 

[spirit1st]

Flesh is sin full .
Spirit once born of GOD ?is not!
Mind must be trained !
1Jo 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
What are youi saying?This does not fit in with your thinking?

 

[kwag_myers]

Flesh is sin full .
Spirit once born of GOD ?is not!
Mind must be trained !

Exactly. And that's the potential problem area, the mind (soul). If we continue to humble ourselves to the Word and the work of the Holy Spirit, we have nothing to fear. However, if we reject the Word, even a verse, we grieve the Holy Spirit and open the door to demons.

 

[Green^Horn]

For those that don't understand the post:

Do demons exist?

yes

Is demon posession possible?

yes

How would one recognize a demon?

that depends on whether or not the demon is manifesting itself or not, if the demon is not manifesting itself then one requires the gift of desernment of spirits in order to know if another is posessed.

What would be the obvious signs of demon posession?

here are two sure fire signs: super human strength, and an eerie voice that sounds kind of like many voices speaking at once being played on a tape player that is draging, i know you probably think i'm crazy, but i have actualy witnessed this, and before you ask, no, the person had no electronic device to make him sound that way, it was the demons voice

How would a 'Christian' know if they were posessed?

it is not possible for an unclean spirit to dwell in the same temple with the spirit of God, therefore a true believer cannot be posessed by an unclean spirit unless he first stops believing, and has "trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace"

Did Mary or Jesus identify her demons?(in other words, did Mary know
she was posessed?)

i can't find where the text says, altho i didn't look very hard

Would demons allow their host to know that they were there?

some of the ones i have encountered did and some didn't

How would a demon enter a person?

some enter by invitation, others are there from birth, others from childhood

Wouldn't it stand to reason that if people of a past time when there was much less possible exposure to media and information were capable of being posessed that the people of the present would be much more succeptable now than then?

maybe

How many seperate demons could a person be posessed by?

the answer Jesus got when he asked the demon his name in mar 5:9 leads me to believe that a person can be posessed by many devils,

Mar 5:9 And he asked him, What is thy name? And he answered, saying, My name is Legion: for we are many.

but i do not believe that they are "seperate" as they seem to be very united in their task,

How many demons are serving satan?

millions i supose

If a person claimed to be a 'Christian' yet lived a life of sin would they not be succeptable to demons?

yes i think they would be be succeptable, talking the talk is a far cry from walking the walk

If demonology weren't a much more serious problem than we accept now days why would there have been so much emphasis on 'casting out demons' durring the time of Christ?

the study of demons is not the problem, the problem is that so many who only talk the talk don't have a clue as to what demon possession is. or what to do about it if they did know what it is, they seem to think that it is something that was only around when Jesus was here,

Wouldn't demons change with the times and learn just as any other entity?
In other words wouldn't they become more cunning and capable as time advanced?

i supose

Just a little food for thought

just a little more food for thought:

Mar 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

it's not just for the apostles folks