Drug Control

[Jake]

I posted this video awhile back in another thread, and will post it here, too. It is Bill Gates talking about reducing population using vaccines. He and the WHO use vaccines in other nations, it can not be proven nor can it be disproven, that it is here, too. But in those vaccines, they use sterlization meds, too, in the hopes it will control world population because of the global warming hype. Those people do NOT know they are given sterlization meds. We really do not know exactly what is in the vaccines used on american kids.

[video=youtube;WUJMR3BUm2s]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUJMR3BUm2s&feature=related[/video]

 

[tim-from-pa]

Do you want to actually source any of your clains against medicine? Any Medical journal will do.

Be specific. My statements were generalized with some examples. The idea I was trying to convey was that government does not allow people the choice to take "illegal" drugs, but there is an (unspoken) push for most people to take prescription medicine, much of it is useless like cholesterol medicine. For that particular example, just Google "cholesterol conspiracy". I even read lately mainstream liberal leftist articles that questioned the role of cholesterol and how confused doctors are about it; I can't remember where I read that off hand, but I did read it take my word for it.

Another article in Google news health right now says that there's a study out that although less salt decreases BP (I heard it's negligible anyway from another source), that people with less salt in their diet do not live longer. If that's the case, why deprive yourself taste? What's the purpose of restricting it then? A person may die sooner of boredom! :D

The moral of the story: They do want us to take medications, but the type that makes someone rich, not to overall help people.

 

[tim-from-pa]

I posted this video awhile back in another thread, and will post it here, too. It is Bill Gates talking about reducing population using vaccines. He and the WHO use vaccines in other nations, it can not be proven nor can it be disproven, that it is here, too. But in those vaccines, they use sterlization meds, too, in the hopes it will control world population because of the global warming hype. Those people do NOT know they are given sterlization meds. We really do not know exactly what is in the vaccines used on american kids.

[video=youtube;WUJMR3BUm2s]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUJMR3BUm2s&feature=related[/video]

Yeah, I posted this video as well on another thread. After all, who would know more about viruses than Bill Gates with his crummy OS? : He probably has McAfee making the medicine. :D

 

[Jake]

Yeah, I posted this video as well on another thread. After all, who would know more about viruses than Bill Gates with his crummy OS? : He probably has McAfee making the medicine. :D

Good point! The world should be virus-free about now with the quests of Bill Gates! If all else fails, he could spend them away.

 

[Jab-Jab]

there is an (unspoken) push for most people to take prescription medicine, much of it is useless like cholesterol medicine. For that particular example, just Google "cholesterol conspiracy".

This is what I want you to cite. I don't do conspiracy theories. If you have reports of how this medicine is useless, then great, show me. Otherwise I really don't feel like reading maybes, could bes, and I thinks. The main reason is that its unprovable and turns into circular reasoning really quick.

I even read lately mainstream liberal leftist articles that questioned the role of cholesterol and how confused doctors are about it; I can't remember where I read that off hand, but I did read it take my word for it.

You may have read it, but it dosen't mean that its true. That is why I asked for sources.

Another article in Google news health right now says that there's a study out that although less salt decreases BP (I heard it's negligible anyway from another source), that people with less salt in their diet do not live longer. If that's the case, why deprive yourself taste? What's the purpose of restricting it then? A person may die sooner of boredom! :D

Have a link? And I also wonder how this disproves BP meds, since if a person is going to have a stroke, its a good thing to give them medicine to lower the pressure to avoid it.

They do want us to take medications, but the type that makes someone rich, not to overall help people.

Who is they?

 

[Nick]

Yeah, I posted this video as well on another thread. After all, who would know more about viruses than Bill Gates with his crummy OS? : He probably has McAfee making the medicine. :D

 

[tim-from-pa]

You may have read it, but it dosen't mean that its true. That is why I asked for sources.

You can Google that yourself, unless you are lazy. I came here to basically support what you said and all you are doing is attacking me. Because let's face it, no matter who I quote you are not going to believe it because your mind is made up already. You are going to want a mainstream medical source. Well, guess what? they are all going to say the same thing that pushes basically establishment philosophy. That's the beauty in disagreements in the medical world. There's some renowned doctors who disagree and support it with evidence and statistics against mainline thinking ---- and then years later the establishment says, "Oh, yeah I guess they were right!".

OK here's some doctors, but I expect you'll have some critic about them no matter what because you already disagree. I believe in alternate health but depending what side you take, i.e. the natural method, or the druggie-drugged headed method to health, each type of person will find their own sources. Believe me, there's no shortage of sources to what I said. Have fun reading:

The Cholesterol Conspiracy by Ladd McNamara
Conrad Chiropractic » The Cholesterol Conspiracy
Low Cholesterol? Don't Brag Quite Yet - New York Times
High Cholesterol Reduces Heart Attack Risk in Over-50s - The Cholesterol Truth

My favorite Internet doctor who says the same thing I did:
The Douglass Report

Oh, and here's the salt article I mentioned yesterday:

Study: Salt Might Not be So Bad - WBAY-TV Green Bay-Fox Cities-Northeast Wisconsin News

 

[Jab-Jab]

It seems like everyone here wants to be offended.

So far in the 3 main threads I've interacted in the 3 sentences that have caused me the most grief are:

I think people deserve personal liberties, which includes an indiviuals choice of what they put into their own body.

I have read several journals and papers on Global warming and took time to research it.

I would like you to source your cliams.

These three sentences turned into storms because instead of people asking for clarification, they turned it into chances to take jabs at me or assume my entire personal out look.

Why can't you guys simply put down your swords and ask for clarification? It seems this is a forum filled with wanabe victims, rather than people wanting to have discussions.

 

[tim-from-pa]

It seems like everyone here wants to be offended.

So far in the 3 main threads I've interacted in the 3 sentences that have caused me the most grief are:

I think people deserve personal liberties, which includes an indiviuals choice of what they put into their own body.

I have read several journals and papers on Global warming and took time to research it.

I would like you to source your cliams.

These three sentences turned into storms because instead of people asking for clarification, they turned it into chances to take jabs at me or assume my entire personal out look.

Why can't you guys simply put down your swords and ask for clarification? It seems this is a forum filled with wanabe victims, rather than people wanting to have discussions.

It's because you are abrasive in tone. I am an empath and can tell where a person is coming from. And I'll bet the same with your personal life has dramas, too, and you are probably wondering why the whole world is nuts. I think there's a subconscious reason why you chosen your handle to reflect you. :D

But I can brush that all aside and forget and back to the subject I gave several references. Are they mainline? No. of course not. But if someone was an atheist and asked me to prove something about God, I would not rely on the atheists to prove my point. I would use theologians.

Same way with health. There's the drugged up medical way, and there's natural way each side has their experts, and I gave a small sample of the myriads who say what I did.

As for the illegal drugs you are talking about, as a Libertarian, I was attempting to say I agree with your premise before this drama somehow unfolded to my surprise. Tobacco, pot, etc are natural, but even natural things have a limit. For those who smoke, for example, should use natural tobacco and not the factory-made stuff with all the junk added. Think of the native Americans. They smoked and you did not hear about lung cancer. But then again, they did not puff on a peace pipe every five minutes like some people do cigarettes. They did so more in moderation. The same can be said of pot, alcohol, opiates such as poppy or whatever.

Then, as for the medicines out today, even mainline news articles are quoting (see above) about the dangers of some drugs and the cure is worse for the health than the malady. I rather smoke pot, drink alcohol, smoke tobacco, or load up on poppy seeds sooner than take that fabricated stuff ---- it's not natural is my point---- it's reversed, they outlaw the natural stuff and try to push the synthetic.

 

[Pebbles]

It's not such a terrible idea. Have you heard about safe injecting rooms?

You can already buy clean needles least here in the UK you can I dunno about other countries their isn't any regulations on the supply of of most medical materials.

I have to inject my estrogen obviously not the same I know as their isn't any euphoria or physical dependence, I get my needles from the same suppliers that supply the NHS. And they aren't expensive.
Needles & Syringes

Ta Da! For the supplies I need they cost me £17.99 for 200needles + 100syringes which is about $25-$30
That would last me with my bi/weekly shot nearly 2 years.

The problem is that individuals that are high on such drugs like heroin REFUSE to buy clean needles or inject safely £10 is part way to another fix for individuals dependent on heroin. They would skip it.

The idea of using a dirty used needle is alien to me... More than anything else it would be EXCRUCIATINGLY painful aswell as dangerous. From somone who's had alot of injections, anything but the sharpest needles feel like driving a knitting needle through your leg. And even the sharp ones feel like a hornet bezerking you.

 

[Potluck]

I'm wondering why these drugs were outlawed in the first place.
Do we think we're wiser today able to handle drugs in a manner we previously could not?

 

[Pard]

I'm wondering why these drugs were outlawed in the first place.
Do we think we're wiser today able to handle drugs in a manner we previously could not?

If we could handle drugs in a mature manner today then no one would care about drug legislation because no one would be doing drugs.

Drug use is juvenile at best. All drug use comes back to a single underlying factor:

The user wants rapid and drastic change.

The drugs don't even have to be illegal for this to be true. People don't want to do things the hard way they don't want to be adult about it. They just want it to be done as quickly as possible.

"Oh I don't like my life... I guess I'll go get some heroin."

"Oh I'm fat... I guess I'll go get some weight-loss pills."

"Oh I'm weak... I guess I'll go get some anabolic steroids."

It's all boils down to the same thing: being childish.

--

Clean needles are fine and dandy but I'd like to see the statistics on drug abuse in areas that provide clean needles. It seems to me that the lack of needles is a very good deterrent. I have friends who have told me that the only thing that kept them from shooting up some drug was that they couldn't find clean needles and they didn't want to get AIDS.

The heroin capitol of Connecticut has clean needles program. Since it was introduced in 2003 heroin use has gone up... Now you could argue that it is only expected that it would go up but at the same time I've got to imagine there is a correlation between FREE CLEAN needles being handed out to people and an increase in heroin abusers.

 

[Christ_empowered]

Even if drug abuse goes up, decriminalization (or legalization) and access to free or reduced cost needles would reduce the societal costs of drug abuse. Fewer people in jail or prison, fewer crimes committed to get money for drugs, fewer families destroyed by expensive drug habits.

I don't think anyone on this board approves of drug abuse. I personally think it is immoral and sinful. I don't, however, think that we should throw addicts into prison or clog up our legal system with "crimes" that involve dealing in or possession of controlled substances. The War on Drugs has been and continues to be an absolutely abysmal failure. As sad and sinful as I think drug abuse is, I think legalization might be the best way to reduce society's burden in dealing with the issue.

 

[Pard]

Even if drug abuse goes up, decriminalization (or legalization) and access to free or reduced cost needles would reduce the societal costs of drug abuse. Fewer people in jail or prison, fewer crimes committed to get money for drugs, fewer families destroyed by expensive drug habits.

Look at it this way. You legalize drugs alright?

So you say that the price to keep people in prison will go down? This is true (80% of CT prison pop. is in for drug related charges)

Fewer crimes? Don't think so (assuming you mean non drug crimes). Drugs don't be come free once they become legalized. Fact is drug prices will go UP not down. Alcohol (in the USA) was cheaper during Prohibition than it was before or after. Same will go for drugs. Don't think the government won't attach its fingers into the drug market. They will raise the taxes on drugs so high (as a "deterrent"). People will still be stealing in order get that money. They steal already in order to get money for thier watered down chemically infested tax-free drugs. Imagine how much more they will need to steal once drugs become regulated and taxed.

No fewer families will be destroyed. More will be destroyed and the term "destroyed" will find a new meaning. Drugs will cost even more (as I said above). And if drugs are legal more people will begin to use them. A recent study (I'll look for it) showed that 56% of Americans between the age 18 and 32 who do not do drugs would begin to use drugs if they were legal. It gets even worse when you look at that same age bracket but who only use cannabis. Something like 87% of cannabis users would try "hard" drugs if they were legalized. That's more families hurt not less.

Besides if the prisons and jails are emptied of all the crack heads and meth addicts were will they go? The streets. You want our streets to get any more dangerous than they already are?

I'd much rather fight a failing war on drugs than watch as legalization destroys us in its own way.

 

[Nick]

Pard, Sydney has a safe injecting room. Apparantly its been working well to reduce drug abuse and overdose, as well as providihg safw needles, education and support. I'll see if I can get hold of some information for you.