Ezk 29

[Roro1972]

I have read where Egypt was overrun in the past but I have not found where they were desolate for 40 years. did I miss the 40 year desolation of Egypt somewhere? Egypt is not in Ezk 38 so it may be Ezk 29 has not occurred.. Any help would be appreciated.

 

[th1b.taylor]

I have read where Egypt was overrun in the past but I have not found where they were desolate for 40 years. did I miss the 40 year desolation of Egypt somewhere? Egypt is not in Ezk 38 so it may be Ezk 29 has not occurred.. Any help would be appreciated.

Sorry Roro, I had to check to insure was not talking from an empty head. This is leading up to my favorite chapter of this book where the Israel of today prophesied in the gathering of those dry bones. No, Egypt has not suffered this judgement but I believe it will soon.

 

[Roro1972]

Sorry Roro, I had to check to insure was not talking from an empty head. This is leading up to my favorite chapter of this book where the Israel of today prophesied in the gathering of those dry bones. No, Egypt has not suffered this judgement but I believe it will soon.

would you think it relates to Isa 19

 

[th1b.taylor]

would you think it relates to Isa 19

As I see it, yes. And I believe we are witnessing the beginning of these prophesies being fulfilled.

 

[smaller]

I have read where Egypt was overrun in the past but I have not found where they were desolate for 40 years. did I miss the 40 year desolation of Egypt somewhere? Egypt is not in Ezk 38 so it may be Ezk 29 has not occurred.. Any help would be appreciated.

3 Speak, and say, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I am against thee, Pharaoh king of Egypt, the great dragon that lieth in the midst of his rivers, which hath said, My river is mine own, and I have made it for myself.

Who is the great dragon in scripture? It is not pharaoh, a flesh man nor is it physical ground or physical rivers.

Revelation 12:9
And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

 

[Roro1972]

the reason they made that statement about it being their river they made is the dam they built hundreds of years later.

 

[smaller]

the reason they made that statement about it being their river they made is the dam they built hundreds of years later.

You are welcome to see it that way, of course. But I don't think the great dragon, his works or ways are connected that way. Word associations with water are a deep and long spiritual study, and have little if anything to do with physical waters. Nor do the waters of the dragon connect that way.

Revelation 12:16
And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

 

[Roro1972]

You are welcome to see it that way, of course. But I don't think the great dragon, his works or ways are connected that way. Word associations with water are a deep and long spiritual study, and have little if anything to do with physical waters. Nor do the waters of the dragon connect that way.

Revelation 12:16
And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

Oh smaller I do not understand it. I am trying to. and I am sure my puny brain has thoughts that need correcting on this subject I do not think my thoughts are right at all just putting them out to receive comments from you and other so I can start to better understand. If I do not share my thoughts you or some one else can not correct me.Now my main question was not the dragon it was had Ezk 29 been fulfilled or is it still yet to come.Thanks

 

[smaller]

Oh smaller I do not understand it. I am trying to. and I am sure my puny brain has thoughts that need correcting on this subject I do not think my thoughts are right at all just putting them out to receive comments from you and other so I can start to better understand. If I do not share my thoughts you or some one else can not correct me.Now my main question was not the dragon it was had Ezk 29 been fulfilled or is it still yet to come.Thanks

A strictly literal understanding of scripture is not going to do any reader a favor. There are 3 parties to scripture. God, man and devils. Two of the parties are unseen. So literal sights are only seeing the external/physical/flesh aspects of scripture when the "meat" is in the unseen portions.

Egypt is not the physical land of Egypt. Here is the Spirits sight of Egypt:

Revelation 11:8
And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

Scripture will purposefully pull you away, eventually, from trying to "force fit" the information into a strict literal external physical sight. There is an entirely different construct in Spiritual sights.

FOR EXAMPLE, Paul viewed the lives of Abraham, Sarah, Isaac, Hagar, Ishmael and THE LAW as what? Yeah, an ALLEGORY! Gal. 4. And if that much was allegory (this does NOT deny that they were 'real people' btw!) then ALL of it is.

What good is there to look at it from the natural/physical/external? Very little will be seen in that direction, if anything.

 

[smaller]

After spending, literally, YEARS studying eschatology and O.T. scriptures I had to throw away everything I thought I knew and started over. It was not easy to let go of a strict literal study format.

But scripture demanded to look to the unseen.

 

[Sinthesis]

Ezekiel 29 has already occurred. It prophesied the turmoil within Egypt's political and religious system culminating in their conquest by Persia in 525BC.

 

[Roro1972]

Ezekiel 29 has already occurred. It prophesied the turmoil within Egypt's political and religious system culminating in their conquest by Persia in 525BC.

I have read commentaries that say that to but others say there was not 40 years of desolation so it could not be????????

 

[reba]

from me... is it forty years asin from march 2 1951 to March 2 1991 or could it be a generation

from matt henry...

This explains the foregoing prediction, which was figurative, and looks something further. Here is a prophecy,
I. Of the ruin of Egypt. The threatening of this is very full and particular; and the sin for which this ruin shall be brought upon them is their pride, Eze_29:9. They said, The river is mine and I have made it; therefore their land shall spue them out. 1. God is against them, both against the king and against the people, against thee and against thy rivers. Waters signify people and multitudes, Rev_17:15. 2. Multitudes of them shall be cut off by the sword of war, a sword which God will bring upon them to destroy both man and beast, the sword of civil war. 3. The country shall be depopulated. The land of Egypt shall be desolate and waste (Eze_29:9), the country not cultivated, the cities not inhabited. The wealth of both was their pride, and that God will take away. It shall be utterly waste (wastes of waste, so the margin reads it), and desolate (Eze_29:10); neither men nor beasts shall pass through it, nor shall it be inhabited (Eze_29:11); it shall be desolate in the midst of the countries that are so, Eze_29:12. This was the effect not so much of those wars spoken of before, which were made by them, but of the war which the king of Babylon made upon them. It shall be desolate from one end of the land to the other, from the tower of Syene even unto the border of Ethiopia. The sin of pride is enough to ruin a whole nation. 4. The people shall be dispersed and scattered among the nations (Eze_29:12), so that those who thought the balance of power was in their hand should now become a contemptible people. Such a fall does a haughty spirit go before.
II. Of the restoration of Egypt after awhile, Eze_29:13. Egypt shall lie desolate forty years (Eze_29:12) and then I will bring again the captivity of Egypt, Eze_29:14. Some date the forty years from Nebuchadnezzar's destroying Egypt, others from the desolation of Egypt some time before; however, they end about the first year of Cyrus, when the seventy years' captivity of Judah ended, or soon after. Then this prediction was accomplished, 1. That God will gather the Egyptians out of all the countries into which they were dispersed, and make them to return to the land of their habitation, and give them a settlement there again, Eze_29:14. Note, Though God will find out a way to humble the proud, yet he will not contend for ever, no, not with them in this world. 2. That yet they shall not make a figure again as they have done. Egypt shall be a kingdom again, but it shall be the basest of the kingdoms (Eze_29:15); it shall have but little wealth and power, and shall not extend its conquests as formerly; it shall be the tail of the nations, and not the head. It is a mercy that it shall become a kingdom again, but, to hu


Eze 29:1 In the tenth year, in the tenth month, in the twelfth day of the month, the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
Eze 29:2 Son of man, set thy face against Pharaoh king of Egypt, and prophesy against him, and against all Egypt:
Eze 29:3 Speak, and say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against thee, Pharaoh king of Egypt, the great dragon that lieth in the midst of his rivers, which hath said, My river is mine own, and I have made it for myself.

Again Mat Henry
Ezekiel 29:1-7

Here is, I. The date of this prophecy against Egypt. It was in the tenth year of the captivity, and yet it is placed after the prophecy against Tyre, which was delivered in the eleventh year, because, in the accomplishment of the prophecies, the destruction of Tyre happened before the destruction of Egypt, and Nebuchadnezzar's gaining Egypt was the reward of his service against Tyre; and therefore the prophecy against Tyre is put first, that we may the better observe that. But particular notice must be taken of this, that the first prophecy against Egypt was just at the time when the king of Egypt was coming to relieve Jerusalem and raise the siege (Jer_37:5), but did not answer the expectations of the Jews from them. Note, It is good to foresee the failing of all our creature-confidences, then when we are most in temptation to depend upon them, that we may cease from man.

I am not saying this is so just adding to the mix

 

[Roro1972]

from me... is it forty years asin from march 2 1951 to March 2 1991 or could it be a generation

from matt henry...

This explains the foregoing prediction, which was figurative, and looks something further. Here is a prophecy,
I. Of the ruin of Egypt. The threatening of this is very full and particular; and the sin for which this ruin shall be brought upon them is their pride, Eze_29:9. They said, The river is mine and I have made it; therefore their land shall spue them out. 1. God is against them, both against the king and against the people, against thee and against thy rivers. Waters signify people and multitudes, Rev_17:15. 2. Multitudes of them shall be cut off by the sword of war, a sword which God will bring upon them to destroy both man and beast, the sword of civil war. 3. The country shall be depopulated. The land of Egypt shall be desolate and waste (Eze_29:9), the country not cultivated, the cities not inhabited. The wealth of both was their pride, and that God will take away. It shall be utterly waste (wastes of waste, so the margin reads it), and desolate (Eze_29:10); neither men nor beasts shall pass through it, nor shall it be inhabited (Eze_29:11); it shall be desolate in the midst of the countries that are so, Eze_29:12. This was the effect not so much of those wars spoken of before, which were made by them, but of the war which the king of Babylon made upon them. It shall be desolate from one end of the land to the other, from the tower of Syene even unto the border of Ethiopia. The sin of pride is enough to ruin a whole nation. 4. The people shall be dispersed and scattered among the nations (Eze_29:12), so that those who thought the balance of power was in their hand should now become a contemptible people. Such a fall does a haughty spirit go before.
II. Of the restoration of Egypt after awhile, Eze_29:13. Egypt shall lie desolate forty years (Eze_29:12) and then I will bring again the captivity of Egypt, Eze_29:14. Some date the forty years from Nebuchadnezzar's destroying Egypt, others from the desolation of Egypt some time before; however, they end about the first year of Cyrus, when the seventy years' captivity of Judah ended, or soon after. Then this prediction was accomplished, 1. That God will gather the Egyptians out of all the countries into which they were dispersed, and make them to return to the land of their habitation, and give them a settlement there again, Eze_29:14. Note, Though God will find out a way to humble the proud, yet he will not contend for ever, no, not with them in this world. 2. That yet they shall not make a figure again as they have done. Egypt shall be a kingdom again, but it shall be the basest of the kingdoms (Eze_29:15); it shall have but little wealth and power, and shall not extend its conquests as formerly; it shall be the tail of the nations, and not the head. It is a mercy that it shall become a kingdom again, but, to hu


Eze 29:1 In the tenth year, in the tenth month, in the twelfth day of the month, the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
Eze 29:2 Son of man, set thy face against Pharaoh king of Egypt, and prophesy against him, and against all Egypt:
Eze 29:3 Speak, and say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against thee, Pharaoh king of Egypt, the great dragon that lieth in the midst of his rivers, which hath said, My river is mine own, and I have made it for myself.

Again Mat Henry
Ezekiel 29:1-7

Here is, I. The date of this prophecy against Egypt. It was in the tenth year of the captivity, and yet it is placed after the prophecy against Tyre, which was delivered in the eleventh year, because, in the accomplishment of the prophecies, the destruction of Tyre happened before the destruction of Egypt, and Nebuchadnezzar's gaining Egypt was the reward of his service against Tyre; and therefore the prophecy against Tyre is put first, that we may the better observe that. But particular notice must be taken of this, that the first prophecy against Egypt was just at the time when the king of Egypt was coming to relieve Jerusalem and raise the siege (Jer_37:5), but did not answer the expectations of the Jews from them. Note, It is good to foresee the failing of all our creature-confidences, then when we are most in temptation to depend upon them, that we may cease from man.

I am not saying this is so just adding to the mix

Thanks reba
I have been looking for some one to show the 40 year desolation back in that time all the commentaries I read do not mention or count from yr to yr to account for the 40 year from Neber taking over and scattering the people. Several say
it occurred just no one show the 40yr count that is why I thought it has not happened. And I can be wrong for sure it could have had a 40 year desolation and some dont see it.Im not a scholar by any stretch of the word. One other thing that has me puzzled is in Ch 38 Egypt is not listed in the countries going against Israel so it made me think ch 29 could happen soon if it has not.

 

[Sinthesis]

Thanks reba
I have been looking for some one to show the 40 year desolation back in that time all the commentaries I read do not mention or count from yr to yr to account for the 40 year from Neber taking over and scattering the people. Several say
it occurred just no one show the 40yr count that is why I thought it has not happened. And I can be wrong for sure it could have had a 40 year desolation and some dont see it.Im not a scholar by any stretch of the word. One other thing that has me puzzled is in Ch 38 Egypt is not listed in the countries going against Israel so it made me think ch 29 could happen soon if it has not.

How do you want to define desolation? This is the term applied to Judah during the Babylonian captivity.

Jer 25:11 - And this whole land shall be a desolation, and an astonishment; and these nations shall serve the king of Babylon seventy years.​

 

[smaller]

Thanks reba
I have been looking for some one to show the 40 year desolation back in that time all the commentaries I read do not mention or count from yr to yr to account for the 40 year from Neber taking over and scattering the people. Several say
it occurred just no one show the 40yr count that is why I thought it has not happened. And I can be wrong for sure it could have had a 40 year desolation and some dont see it.Im not a scholar by any stretch of the word. One other thing that has me puzzled is in Ch 38 Egypt is not listed in the countries going against Israel so it made me think ch 29 could happen soon if it has not.

We might understand that in scripture the terms "wilderness" and "desert" denote places where "man" does not dwell.

There are deserts and wilderness presented in scripture that we do not see with flesh eyes in the scriptures. HERE for example:

Luke 11:24
When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest; and finding none, he saith, I will return unto my house whence I came out.

We can NOT see with flesh eyes where unclean spirits walk when they are gone out of their house, which is MAN.

 

[Malachi]

No, Egypt has not suffered this judgement but I believe it will soon.

Correct. This is yet future, as is most of Ezekiel's prophecy.

 

[th1b.taylor]

Correct. This is yet future, as is most of Ezekiel's prophecy.

Narrow minded Prophecy Readers are what scare me to death. I can, if I chose to, take any portion of prophecy and apply it to some past world event. But people err because they see prophecy as applying to this or to that and then it is finished and this is not so.

i.e. I have loved Obidiah since shortly after being converted and saved. Why? I see Edom, Rome and the United States there. All three held an Eagle in a nest of stars as a symbol of their independence and strength, for one thing. Did all of the prophecy of this short book happen to Edom, I have no doubt it did. Did all of it happen to Rome? History says records it did. Has all of it happened to the US? No, the last third of it has begun but I believe it will, yet, be much worse before the end.

Do I get a lot from the Grand Poo Fah Group? You know it, most of them cannot see past Edom because their eyes are blinded to the truth. Most of these people are say so Christians and that is the condition of the Church today.

 

[smaller]

Oh smaller I do not understand it. .Now my main question was not the dragon it was had Ezk 29 been fulfilled or is it still yet to come.Thanks

And fwiw Roro, if you read the opener of Ezk. 29, Ezekiel was directed to prophesy against the great dragon.

Now, we might ask ourselves if we've seen any dragons, ever?

Uh, no.

Sometimes we have to look deeper into the waters:

2 Son of man, set thy face against Pharaoh king of Egypt, and prophesy against him, and against all Egypt:
3 Speak, and say, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I am against thee, Pharaoh king of Egypt, the great dragon

A great deal of the discourses of the Prophets is directed to spiritual wickedness and spoken by SIMILITUDE.

If we have not been given our Spiritual degree in similitude, and try to force fit these things into the world of flesh/physical, they will not and CAN NOT compute. Never will.

Scripture does deal with the unseen. The Prophets had the curtains of their flesh eyes CLOSED and the Spiritual eyes forced open. And they write difficult things to understand, to flesh eyes.

To be a prophet is to be blind to the physical world and to not hear the physical world. They are being shown deeper matters of the Spirit.

Isaiah 42:19
Who is blind, but my servant? or deaf, as my messenger that I sent? who is blind as he that is perfect, and blind as the Lord's servant?

22 But this is a people robbed and spoiled; they are all of them snared in holes, and they are hid in prison houses: they are for a prey, and none delivereth; for a spoil, and none saith, Restore.

Did any of them see a physical robber? Were any of them in physical holes? Were any of them in actual prison. Were any of them prey for a predator?

Not by sight, they were not. These were spiritual conditions all, in the adverse senses of every term.

It's also why it's quite pointless to try to see in the external, what the Prophets spoke in similitude.

 

[Roro1972]

How do you want to define desolation? This is the term applied to Judah during the Babylonian captivity.

Jer 25:11 - And this whole land shall be a desolation, and an astonishment; and these nations shall serve the king of Babylon seventy years.​

as in Ezk 29: v 11 is their proof this v11 has happened