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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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File Sharing
- Thread starter Oats
- Start date
T
Theofilus
Guest
It depends on the files being shared. If you legally own the files and are legally allowed to distribute them, then it's fine. But if you're talking about copyrighted files, such as computer programs, music, movies and such (which I assume you are), then it is illegal. Since the Bible tells us to obey the civil authorities, then doing anything illegal is wrong.
Well, I have struggled myself with this for a time until God intervened. This may seem a relatively small issue but to me it played a huge role in learning about God's ways.
Technically, file sharing as such is not wrong or immoral. If I shared a picture of mine or a thesis that I wrote, there is absolutely nothing wrong in that. Same goes with downloading such stuff which are owned by the uploaders. But I don't suppose that's what we are concerned with.
When it comes down to sharing copyright content - then that's where we waver.
I justified it initially on the basis of how the copyright owners are being unscrupulous and monopolistic, on the basis of how I am not doing anything illegal and that the uploaders were the guilty party, on the basis of me not benefiting monetarily from this, on the basis of lack of fair opportunities warranting these 'desperate' measures, on the basis of a larger good trumping a small 'grey zone' etc..
But all these were unnecessary as time went on - I had no issues with this as I never thought about its moral aspects.
But some time after I began believing in Christ, this verse was brought to my attention -
Rom 13:1 Let every soul be subject to the higher authorities. For there is no authority but of God; the authorities that exist are ordained by God.
It translated like this in my mind - "It is God's will for you to be subject to the law of your land as long as it doesn't violate God's will."
Then I began to debate with myself for a while. It had become such a habit that to imagine life without it seemed a little difficult and even weird. What was so wrong in this? Perhaps I could be more temperate? Then I remembered this verse -
1Co 6:12 Someone will say, "I am allowed to do anything." Yes; but not everything is good for you. I could say that I am allowed to do anything, but I am not going to let anything make me its slave.
"I am not going to let anything make me its slave" - it struck me hard. Why was I debating with myself so furiously? Why had I justified this in so many ways earlier? Am I not free to do anything I choose - can I not just stop this without having such a strong reaction within myself.
Now, it was no longer for the sake of morality that I wanted to stop file sharing - I just wanted to stop to see if I could act on my will - to see if I could stop doing something that I've been at for a long time, whenever I chose. That was when I felt a flood of objections pop up in my mind, trying to convince me otherwise, on this issue. - "If you can't see what's wrong in it, why do you have to stop"? - "Obviously, you can stop anything you set your heart to - what's the necessity now"? - and so on.
But I just felt compelled[I realize now that this was God working in me] to stop it then and there. It felt so burdensome to quit - I just couldn't do it. Then I thought back to when I began believing in Christ. I had undergone the same pattern of experience - my resistance and God's overcoming it. Then just in a moment, I was revealed there was something in me that I needed to be freed from - that I could not act on my own will because there was nothing good in my flesh - and that God had to act in me - and just like that, a huge boulder was rolled away - I felt light and I knew I no longer needed to practice piracy.
After that, my mind cleared and I understood this -
Rom 14:23 ...and all that is not of faith is sin.
What is faith?
Rom 14:5 ... every man be[ing] fully persuaded in his own mind.
If I had been fully persuaded in my mind that this was not wrong, I wouldn't have thought about it at all - just like I don't give a second thought about whether I'm doing something wrong in choosing this shirt to wear and not that.
This might seem a small issue to attribute so much importance to - but this gave me some very important truths.
Technically, file sharing as such is not wrong or immoral. If I shared a picture of mine or a thesis that I wrote, there is absolutely nothing wrong in that. Same goes with downloading such stuff which are owned by the uploaders. But I don't suppose that's what we are concerned with.
When it comes down to sharing copyright content - then that's where we waver.
I justified it initially on the basis of how the copyright owners are being unscrupulous and monopolistic, on the basis of how I am not doing anything illegal and that the uploaders were the guilty party, on the basis of me not benefiting monetarily from this, on the basis of lack of fair opportunities warranting these 'desperate' measures, on the basis of a larger good trumping a small 'grey zone' etc..
But all these were unnecessary as time went on - I had no issues with this as I never thought about its moral aspects.
But some time after I began believing in Christ, this verse was brought to my attention -
Rom 13:1 Let every soul be subject to the higher authorities. For there is no authority but of God; the authorities that exist are ordained by God.
It translated like this in my mind - "It is God's will for you to be subject to the law of your land as long as it doesn't violate God's will."
Then I began to debate with myself for a while. It had become such a habit that to imagine life without it seemed a little difficult and even weird. What was so wrong in this? Perhaps I could be more temperate? Then I remembered this verse -
1Co 6:12 Someone will say, "I am allowed to do anything." Yes; but not everything is good for you. I could say that I am allowed to do anything, but I am not going to let anything make me its slave.
"I am not going to let anything make me its slave" - it struck me hard. Why was I debating with myself so furiously? Why had I justified this in so many ways earlier? Am I not free to do anything I choose - can I not just stop this without having such a strong reaction within myself.
Now, it was no longer for the sake of morality that I wanted to stop file sharing - I just wanted to stop to see if I could act on my will - to see if I could stop doing something that I've been at for a long time, whenever I chose. That was when I felt a flood of objections pop up in my mind, trying to convince me otherwise, on this issue. - "If you can't see what's wrong in it, why do you have to stop"? - "Obviously, you can stop anything you set your heart to - what's the necessity now"? - and so on.
But I just felt compelled[I realize now that this was God working in me] to stop it then and there. It felt so burdensome to quit - I just couldn't do it. Then I thought back to when I began believing in Christ. I had undergone the same pattern of experience - my resistance and God's overcoming it. Then just in a moment, I was revealed there was something in me that I needed to be freed from - that I could not act on my own will because there was nothing good in my flesh - and that God had to act in me - and just like that, a huge boulder was rolled away - I felt light and I knew I no longer needed to practice piracy.
After that, my mind cleared and I understood this -
Rom 14:23 ...and all that is not of faith is sin.
What is faith?
Rom 14:5 ... every man be[ing] fully persuaded in his own mind.
If I had been fully persuaded in my mind that this was not wrong, I wouldn't have thought about it at all - just like I don't give a second thought about whether I'm doing something wrong in choosing this shirt to wear and not that.
This might seem a small issue to attribute so much importance to - but this gave me some very important truths.
C
Chris
Guest
The thing about file sharing is usually its only done for one reason and that is to get for free something you should rightly pay for. It is rare someone is sharing open source stuff since its freely downloadable anyway.
However it is justified in your mind it is like this with regard to the copyright material, imagine spending thousands of dollars investing in technology then through your own initiative and time creating something useful you ignore your family for working on it days and months on end. you don't get paid until you sell it at he end if at all and then you hope to recoup your wages and investments. . Imagine someone coveting what you made and deciding you are wealthy enough so they steal it and give it to everyone else. Its not right, sorry for being the fun police on it. There are exceptions for things out of print and non copyright..
The other thing about it is It starts with a song then it is windows operating system then it is anti virus software with cracks in it. then your off to the pirate bay and Rapidshare looking at naked girls and stealing stuff. Little by little you compromise honesty and then whats next in your life you compromise. Suddenly you are distant from god because there is unrepentant sin in your life.
My story in 2009 is above that is written from my experience. I felt convicted by god Gave it all up deleted what I could find I stole in digital format, and started buying everything honestly. From that decision onwards my relationship with god improved and blessings flowed into my life more than I could ever have imagined.
The thought of it now scares me in case something changes and my life isn't as good.
That's my 2 cents
ps most file sharing stuff comes with hidden nasties...
However it is justified in your mind it is like this with regard to the copyright material, imagine spending thousands of dollars investing in technology then through your own initiative and time creating something useful you ignore your family for working on it days and months on end. you don't get paid until you sell it at he end if at all and then you hope to recoup your wages and investments. . Imagine someone coveting what you made and deciding you are wealthy enough so they steal it and give it to everyone else. Its not right, sorry for being the fun police on it. There are exceptions for things out of print and non copyright..
The other thing about it is It starts with a song then it is windows operating system then it is anti virus software with cracks in it. then your off to the pirate bay and Rapidshare looking at naked girls and stealing stuff. Little by little you compromise honesty and then whats next in your life you compromise. Suddenly you are distant from god because there is unrepentant sin in your life.
My story in 2009 is above that is written from my experience. I felt convicted by god Gave it all up deleted what I could find I stole in digital format, and started buying everything honestly. From that decision onwards my relationship with god improved and blessings flowed into my life more than I could ever have imagined.
The thought of it now scares me in case something changes and my life isn't as good.
That's my 2 cents
ps most file sharing stuff comes with hidden nasties...
Last edited by a moderator:
makinbacon
Member
Though I agree most file-sharing is the unauthorized sharing of copyrighted material, I disagree that it's rare for people to share open source software and other copyrighted material for which people are authorized to share. There are many websites which host torrents for ISOs of open source software and such.
That said, what really irks me about RIAA, MPAA, and so on, is the labeling of copyright infringement as piracy or stealing. To copy information in no way deprives the creator* of his or her ability to use or possess* the information.
* These are shady words. I am not sure "originality" (i.e., someone creating) exists, or that one can actually "possess" information.
Pard
Member
Well without getting technical... yes file sharing things that are not yours to give is illegal.
To get technical... 'ish. You see file sharing is such a new idea that the laws are WAY behind. By most understandings it is illegal, however is it illegal to give a friend a mix tape? Nope, and that has been going on for decades now. So without getting very detailed, it is a grey area and you should probably take it on a case by case basis. I wouldn't get the self righteous attitude going about how you are "showing those greedy artists" a thing or too, but I wouldn't go out and out right remove your torrent program or block any file sharing website either.
Just use common sense.
To get technical... 'ish. You see file sharing is such a new idea that the laws are WAY behind. By most understandings it is illegal, however is it illegal to give a friend a mix tape? Nope, and that has been going on for decades now. So without getting very detailed, it is a grey area and you should probably take it on a case by case basis. I wouldn't get the self righteous attitude going about how you are "showing those greedy artists" a thing or too, but I wouldn't go out and out right remove your torrent program or block any file sharing website either.
Just use common sense.
C
Chris
Guest
the thing is can you press the download button with a completely clear conscience and be satisfied the site you got it off that you would be viewing and supporting you would be happy to be visiting if Jesus was looking over your shoulder. if you can do that then no problem
Last edited by a moderator:
Michael
Member
That's a problem that I have/had. I would actively roam scene-release sites looking for new software/music and the such. I had so much pirated stuff on my computer and ipod that is now gone. I deleted everything that I stole via the web. It was hard. I love music. Music is my passion/my heart/my escape. I've listened to it ever since I was a child. When I was going through my ipod deleting things I did not pay for, I felt like God was watching over my shoulder making sure I got rid of everything that was not mine. I kept catching myself being stubborn about it. I kept trying to find a "way" to keep some files on my ipod just so I could delete it later on. I found the feeling I had inside me was uncomfortable. Maybe it was God telling me to be honest with myself and to rid of the stolen property?
It's still kind of hard & awkward today knowing that a vast majority of the stuff I listen to daily is now gone from my library. But, there is this sense in me that tells me this is the right thing to do. I realize it is a sin to steal what is not yours. Even for so long, I never gave it much thought as to downloading music as a "sin." Just never occurred to me in that sense. My eyes were opened to it and now I will gladly pay for something if I want it.
Makes me wonder: How would I feel if I made a software, or made music knowing people were stealing it? It would make me feel like I'm working for free! I am sure I would be angered by others stealing something that I worked my tail-end off for. Not just it being a sin, but to put yourself in others shoes who make products to help/please us in life, wouldn't the best thing to do is show your support to them and appreciation by paying for their products?
Me thinks so.
It's still kind of hard & awkward today knowing that a vast majority of the stuff I listen to daily is now gone from my library. But, there is this sense in me that tells me this is the right thing to do. I realize it is a sin to steal what is not yours. Even for so long, I never gave it much thought as to downloading music as a "sin." Just never occurred to me in that sense. My eyes were opened to it and now I will gladly pay for something if I want it.
Makes me wonder: How would I feel if I made a software, or made music knowing people were stealing it? It would make me feel like I'm working for free! I am sure I would be angered by others stealing something that I worked my tail-end off for. Not just it being a sin, but to put yourself in others shoes who make products to help/please us in life, wouldn't the best thing to do is show your support to them and appreciation by paying for their products?
Me thinks so.
C
Chris
Guest
That's a problem that I have/had. I would actively roam scene-release sites looking for new software/music and the such. I had so much pirated stuff on my computer and ipod that is now gone. I deleted everything that I stole via the web. It was hard. I love music. Music is my passion/my heart/my escape. I've listened to it ever since I was a child. When I was going through my ipod deleting things I did not pay for, I felt like God was watching over my shoulder making sure I got rid of everything that was not mine. I kept catching myself being stubborn about it. I kept trying to find a "way" to keep some files on my ipod just so I could delete it later on. I found the feeling I had inside me was uncomfortable. Maybe it was God telling me to be honest with myself and to rid of the stolen property?
It's still kind of hard & awkward today knowing that a vast majority of the stuff I listen to daily is now gone from my library. But, there is this sense in me that tells me this is the right thing to do. I realize it is a sin to steal what is not yours. Even for so long, I never gave it much thought as to downloading music as a "sin." Just never occurred to me in that sense. My eyes were opened to it and now I will gladly pay for something if I want it.
Makes me wonder: How would I feel if I made a software, or made music knowing people were stealing it? It would make me feel like I'm working for free! I am sure I would be angered by others stealing something that I worked my tail-end off for. Not just it being a sin, but to put yourself in others shoes who make products to help/please us in life, wouldn't the best thing to do is show your support to them and appreciation by paying for their products?
Me thinks so.
Exactly right how can god bless us to do his work if we do it with stolen stuff. To me using a PC with dodgy software its a bit like driving a stolen car around doing ministry work with it. OI bought all my stuf student versians because I can. it cures the guilts cheaply. win 7 was 49 bucks ( upgrade)
I am going to look some more and see if there is anything else I missed mp3 wise in my library.
i found a good legal substitute for music that's free if you have an iphone tunein radio app lets you record streamed music 181 fm has breaks in the music you can skip through the songs. that's if you want it for free. Tell you the truth i get bored of the songs pretty easy and delete and do again.