[_ Old Earth _] First Human Embryos Edited in U.S.

[Barbarian]

Uh.... maybe ask a university professor.

You were offering opinions. I thought you knew about it. It's a simple question: The gorilla gene for cytochrome C is identical to the human gene. If a gorilla gene for this enzyme was somehow grafted onto a human's DNA, would he then be only part human?

Are you saying that the DNA of a Gorilla and that of a Human, over all, are indistinguishable from each other?

I said that? (Barbarian checks) No, it turns out that I said the gene for cytochrome C is identical, right down to individual atoms in humans and gorillas. (that's true for chimps and orangs, too, but there's one atom difference between apes and monkeys).

Seriously?

Are you saying that the DNA of these skulls will have no ability to determine that they are, in fact, not human....or human hybrids with another being?

Someone mentioned that's off-topic. But apparently, it's human DNA.

I always thought that DNA could distinguish between two different humans in such a way that it is applicable in a court of law... Yet, you are telling me that Gorilla DNA and Human DNA is identical...???

I'm telling you that the gene for cytochrome C is identical in all apes, including humans. (which of course means it's identical in all humans)

I think you are using your genetic nomenclature and detail to muddy the water...

Perhaps you don't know what "gene" means. It's a section of DNA that codes for a protein.

Kinda like when someone doesn't really have a response without admitting that they are wrong, and cannot defend their point so they post some elaborate math problem....

This is middle school science. Pretty much everyone has heard of it, although a lot of people don't pay much attention.

I get it.... you have education in genetics...

If you got through 8th grade, you were exposed to this.

.it impresses me not.

Apparently, it didn't impress you the first time you heard it, either.

 

[Barbarian]

Anything man does could be used for both good and evil.
In this case, it's very scary.
Brave New World.
Here we come.
Humans as product.
Great.

It has massive potential for abuse. Some of it could be extremely dangerous. There are, and should be, tight controls on experimentation with humans in this regard. You're right about the potential. There have already been some breakthroughs in gene therapy which can reverse genetic defects in humans. That's a good thing. But "designer humans" would pose huge dangers.

We should be very cautious.

 

[GodsGrace]

It has massive potential for abuse. Some of it could be extremely dangerous. There are, and should be, tight controls on experimentation with humans in this regard. You're right about the potential. There have already been some breakthroughs in gene therapy which can reverse genetic defects in humans. That's a good thing. But "designer humans" would pose huge dangers.

We should be very cautious.

Yes Barb, I agree.
But these controls never really work.
It something could go wrong, it will.
Nuclear plants.
Artificial sugar.
We always find out when it's too late.
I believe designer humans are on the way.
I won't be around for it... but our kids.

 

[Jacks Bratt]

You were offering opinions. I thought you knew about it. It's a simple question: The gorilla gene for cytochrome C is identical to the human gene. If a gorilla gene for this enzyme was somehow grafted onto a human's DNA, would he then be only part human?



I said that? (Barbarian checks) No, it turns out that I said the gene for cytochrome C is identical, right down to individual atoms in humans and gorillas. (that's true for chimps and orangs, too, but there's one atom difference between apes and monkeys).





Someone mentioned that's off-topic. But apparently, it's human DNA.



I'm telling you that the gene for cytochrome C is identical in all apes, including humans. (which of course means it's identical in all humans)



Perhaps you don't know what "gene" means. It's a section of DNA that codes for a protein.



This is middle school science. Pretty much everyone has heard of it, although a lot of people don't pay much attention.



If you got through 8th grade, you were exposed to this.



Apparently, it didn't impress you the first time you heard it, either.

So, the truth comes out.... It is a section of DNA..... thank you. That's all I wanted to know.

So, in light of this new illumination on the fact that the argument is concerning a section of DNA that is already understood to be identical in the two beings...

In any research that I have done... this is called a "known" value or marker.

It is then ignored when looking for discrepancies.

I am sure that if you gave the DNA of a Gorilla and the DNA of a Human, to any accredited laboratory... they could determine which one is which with zero error.

I can then assume that if these skulls are of a different being, the same accredited laboratory would be able to state if they were human, similar to human, or not similar to humans in any way.

To post something with specific terminology such as you have... I find misleading and an attempt to cloud the issue.

Not unlike saying "well they have two arms and two legs, two ears, two eyes a nose and a mouth... all located in the same general area so how do you expect to tell them apart".......... nothing but fluff.

 

[Barbarian]

So, the truth comes out.... It is a section of DNA..... thank you. That's all I wanted to know.

That's what a gene is. I thought you knew. Eight-grade science.

I am sure that if you gave the DNA of a Gorilla and the DNA of a Human, to any accredited laboratory... they could determine which one is which with zero error.

Not if it happened to be the cytochrome C gene. That is identical in all apes.

I can then assume that if these skulls are of a different being, the same accredited laboratory would be able to state if they were human, similar to human, or not similar to humans in any way.

To post something with specific terminology such as you have... I find misleading and an attempt to cloud the issue.

Getting down to specifics clarifies issues. The question, which remains unanswered, is "if you transferred the gorilla gene for cytochrome C to a human, would that person be no longer fully human?"

Not unlike saying "well they have two arms and two legs, two ears, two eyes a nose and a mouth... all located in the same general area so how do you expect to tell them apart".......... nothing but fluff.

I showed you a non-fuzzy picture of one of the skulls. It has two parietal bones and the usual occipital bone, just as in humans. I will predict internal nares, the zygomatic arch composed of parts of the temporal and zygomatic bones, and a notable chin lacking a simian shelf. Also three ossicles in the middle ear, rather than one.

Those features would indicate evolution from a fish, through reptiles to mammals. It would be more than a little incredible if some other organism evolved all those features independently.

 

[Jacks Bratt]

That's what a gene is. I thought you knew. Eight-grade science.



Not if it happened to be the cytochrome C gene. That is identical in all apes.





Getting down to specifics clarifies issues. The question, which remains unanswered, is "if you transferred the gorilla gene for cytochrome C to a human, would that person be no longer fully human?"



I showed you a non-fuzzy picture of one of the skulls. It has two parietal bones and the usual occipital bone, just as in humans. I will predict internal nares, the zygomatic arch composed of parts of the temporal and zygomatic bones, and a notable chin lacking a simian shelf. Also three ossicles in the middle ear, rather than one.

Those features would indicate evolution from a fish, through reptiles to mammals. It would be more than a little incredible if some other organism evolved all those features independently.

Listen, there will be Hybridization in the end times. Just like there was in the beginning. They have skulls that are not human. They have the technology to determine if these skulls are hybrids, human, not human, gorilla or otherwise.
You say you have showed a picture of "one" of the skulls that was "just as in humans". So what.... there are billions of skulls "just like humans". This does not negate the hundreds that they are finding that are NOT human.

You have stated that gorillas and humans have a section of DNA that is identical to that of humans. Yet they can still tell if "Delbert" or "DIgbert" was the one the raped "Missy".

So, I will conclude that, even though there are skulls that are similar to human in bone structure, AND there is portions of DNA identical in gorilla and humans...THAT,

There are skulls that are not Human and Not gorilla, of which they are testing the DNA...

AND, they will be able to determine if this DNA is HUMAN or otherwise...

 

[Jacks Bratt]

Oh yeah, it's all over Youtube. I just searched for Dr. Roger leir and a bunch came up. Here's one. I haven't watched this one, but I bet the info is in here about changing the DNA, because that's what he said before in a video.

Fantastic video. Thanks for the link.

 

[Barbarian]

Listen, there will be Hybridization in the end times.

Don't see any reason to think so.

Just like there was in the beginning. They have skulls that are not human.

I know you want to think so. But there's no evidence for that.

They have the technology to determine if these skulls are hybrids, human, not human, gorilla or otherwise.

Yep. They could sequence the entire genome from DNA in those skulls, and if it was outside normal human, we'd know. Show us that.

You say you have showed a picture of "one" of the skulls that was "just as in humans".

One of the skulls claimed to be aliens. But as you see, they aren't.

You have stated that gorillas and humans have a section of DNA that is identical to that of humans. Yet they can still tell if "Delbert" or "DIgbert" was the one the raped "Missy".

Every one of us has maybe a dozen mutations that didn't exist in either of our parents. So it's easy to see. But no human has a different version of cytochrome C.

So, I will conclude that, even though there are skulls that are similar to human in bone structure,

Identical bones, so far as the evidence we've seen so far.

Let us know when you can show us the DNA from those skulls is not human.

 

[Edward]

Don't see any reason to think so.

Really!! Lol. So all this Transhumanism research that they do...implanting computer chips into people trying to make them better..is just a big lie? Mass hypnosis? Lol. Man you must not get out much if you don't knew what their doing in the labs with genetics & physics and post humanism or whatever it is they call it...Computer chips make a hybrid too.

 

[civilwarbuff]

OK, once more let's get off the subject of alien skulls and implanting computer chips into people and stick to the OP.........

 

[Barbarian]

Really!! Lol.

Yep. So far, all the evidence shows them to be completely human.

So all this Transhumanism research that they do...implanting computer chips into people trying to make them better..is just a big lie?

So far, no computer chips in those skulls.

Mass hypnosis? Lol.

Random much?

Man you must not get out much if you don't knew what their doing in the labs with genetics & physics and post humanism or whatever it is they call it...Computer chips make a hybrid too.

No more than any other prosthesis.

 

[jasonc]

OK, once more let's get off the subject of alien skulls and implanting computer chips into people and stick to the OP.........

But that's boring ,we can't have that.

 

[JohnDB]

DNA is only a small piece of the puzzle.
RNA is the bulk of the puzzle.

And not much research is going into this.

Two people can have identical DNA but vastly different RNA. And at the same time be healthy or sick with vastly different diseases. These guys are stumbling around in the dark. Sometimes RNA is fairly straightforward... sometimes not. RNA is what interprets your DNA.

 

[Jacks Bratt]

OK, once more let's get off the subject of alien skulls and implanting computer chips into people and stick to the OP.........

No offense.... but....it is all the same topic.

The aliens are not from another planet. They are demons.

In the days before Noah, the angles hybridized with humans and they were punished.
Then, they played with the DNA of all the animals as well... Thus we get "all flesh was corrupted" and "Noah was perfect in his generations".

The bible says "as it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be with the coming of the son of man"

Now we have man playing with the DNA of humans and demons implanting humans with DNA altering devices.

The DNA of the skulls will show that there was other, more intelligent, larger and more powerful beings.... a remnant of the days of Noah.

Some scholars believe that the "number of the beast" will actually alter your DNA and give a pseudo immortality. Thus "you will cry for death but death will not come".

There is history of man messing with hybrids in order to produce a "super soldier".

Yes, this science could be used for the good of man... like curing genetic illnesses, However... when has a discover only been used to benefit mankind and not to its full potential as a weapon or to overstep the will of God... and in this case bring longer life and maybe immortality?

Remember what the snake said..."you will be like God"...... see any resemblance there?

To ignore the potential here, to be blind to see the connection.... that is what the enemy wants.

All this stuff is connected and very evil.

 

[civilwarbuff]

No offense.... but....it is all the same topic.

The aliens are not from another planet. They are demons.

In the days before Noah, the angles hybridized with humans and they were punished.
Then, they played with the DNA of all the animals as well... Thus we get "all flesh was corrupted" and "Noah was perfect in his generations".

The bible says "as it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be with the coming of the son of man"

Now we have man playing with the DNA of humans and demons implanting humans with DNA altering devices.

The DNA of the skulls will show that there was other, more intelligent, larger and more powerful beings.... a remnant of the days of Noah.

Some scholars believe that the "number of the beast" will actually alter your DNA and give a pseudo immortality. Thus "you will cry for death but death will not come".

There is history of man messing with hybrids in order to produce a "super soldier".

Yes, this science could be used for the good of man... like curing genetic illnesses, However... when has a discover only been used to benefit mankind and not to its full potential as a weapon or to overstep the will of God... and in this case bring longer life and maybe immortality?

Remember what the snake said..."you will be like God"...... see any resemblance there?

To ignore the potential here, to be blind to see the connection.... that is what the enemy wants.

All this stuff is connected and very evil.

Go back and read the OP JB, there is nothing there about aliens or demons. It has to do with being able to 'edit' or change the dna of a human embryo and whether that is a good/bad thing. So please try to stay on topic.

 

[Barbarian]

RNA is the bulk of the puzzle.

And not much research is going into this.

A quick search on PubMed for RNA research papers turned up over 951,000 citations.

 

[Barbarian]

Now we have man playing with the DNA of humans and demons implanting humans with DNA altering devices.

Show us that. Checkable source.

 

[Jacks Bratt]

Show us that. Checkable source.

Before I go and do a bunch of digging, I need to know exactly what will be acceptable as a "checkable" Source.

What is it that you will use to determine a source that is "checkable" to your standard of approval?

 

[Edward]

Before I go and do a bunch of digging, I need to know exactly what will be acceptable as a "checkable" Source.

What is it that you will use to determine a source that is "checkable" to your standard of approval?

I've been through that with him. Anything you post that agrees with you is not a checkable valid source, and anything he can post otherwise, is...Lol

 

[Jacks Bratt]

Go back and read the OP JB, there is nothing there about aliens or demons. It has to do with being able to 'edit' or change the dna of a human embryo and whether that is a good/bad thing. So please try to stay on topic.

So, "Civilwarbuff".... This is from the first line of your OP:

"The first known attempt at creating genetically modified human embryos in the United States has been carried out by a team of researchers in Portland, Oregon, MIT Technology Review has learned."

Now that we are looking at the same introductory topic...let me ask you something.

When people are saying that they are experimenting with a new technology for the good of humanity.... does it not, usually, end up being used against humanity, or in a different way than it was intended?

Like Zyklon B, Nuclear Fusion, Rockets, Dynamite, the list goes on...

Do you really think that science will confine the "genetic modification or human embryos" for purposes of good and positive uses?

I believe that it is very foolish to believe that this Genetic exploration is not already being put to use for military purposes that are kept secret due to the ethics of the experimentation.


Ecclesiastes 1:9King James Version (KJV)

9 The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
Matthew 24:37-39King James Version (KJV)

37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Nothing should surprise us. The world is corrupt and the corrupt control the world