For those "not a sheep" . . . what next?

[Deavonreye]

When you have been face to face with the truth, nothing can sway you. The Qu'ran is a comic book in comparison to the Bible.

Muslims would say the same about the bible being "a comic book" compared to the Qu`ran. That's not the point. It obviously holds enough "truth" for a multitude of people. Sure, I don't believe the claims therein either. But the POINT is. . . . you are unable to believe that book and belief system to be true. That same reasoning is why many can't believe your book and belief system to be true.

Again, someone's personal convictions aren't enough to convince others that theirs is "the truth".

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Re: Crispy Critters -

"I can't REJECT who I've never formally met. . . . and words in a book is not my definition of HAVING met."

Can't argue with THAT observation. But if you never "Met" God - then why did you think you were a "Christian"??

"Christian Faith" essentially begins with a "Meeting - generally a "Conviction of Sin" - which leads into saving faith.

Since "Calvinism" in that respect means little or nothing (it's nothing but another "religious theory"), there would be no reason to assume that you're not AS viable a candidate for salvation as anybody else.

Our last pastor began his relationship with God by standing in his living room and screaming: "$%$#$@#!! If You're there - PROVE IT!!!!" And God did.

 

[Alabaster]

Muslims would say the same about the bible being "a comic book" compared to the Qu`ran. That's not the point. It obviously holds enough "truth" for a multitude of people. Sure, I don't believe the claims therein either. But the POINT is. . . . you are unable to believe that book and belief system to be true. That same reasoning is why many can't believe your book and belief system to be true.

Again, someone's personal convictions aren't enough to convince others that theirs is "the truth".

I can't believe in a god that doesn't exist. Allah is a lifeless idol and nothing more.

God Almighty has power that I can call upon and that lives within me. It is His power found in the Holy Spirit of God that convicts men of their sin and draws them to Him for cleansing and justification and relationship! 3

 

[Deavonreye]

I can't believe in a god that doesn't exist. Allah is a lifeless idol and nothing more.

God Almighty has power that I can call upon and that lives within me. It is His power found in the Holy Spirit of God that convicts men of their sin and draws them to Him for cleansing and justification and relationship! 3

But my point is that the muslim is equally as sure in his belief that Allah IS. Actually, they see Allah as the same person as the god found in the Old Testament. Here's the thing, . . . only an insane or highly irrational person would believe that which he knows to be false!

 

[Deavonreye]

Re: Crispy Critters -

"I can't REJECT who I've never formally met. . . . and words in a book is not my definition of HAVING met."

Can't argue with THAT observation. But if you never "Met" God - then why did you think you were a "Christian"??

"Christian Faith" essentially begins with a "Meeting - generally a "Conviction of Sin" - which leads into saving faith.

Since "Calvinism" in that respect means little or nothing (it's nothing but another "religious theory"), there would be no reason to assume that you're not AS viable a candidate for salvation as anybody else.

Our last pastor began his relationship with God by standing in his living room and screaming: "$%$#$@#!! If You're there - PROVE IT!!!!" And God did.

Well, I don't curse at any deity that might be listening, but I am equally motivated.

Anyway, I am really not sure if I was a christian or not. At the time, I WAS quite convicted of sin, said "the sinner's prayer" sincerely, firmly believed all that was being taught to me, and enjoyed going to church. I probably would have still been there if I hadn't come across things on the internet that caused me to begin questioning. When I did start wondering about certain things, I lived that way while still trying to be faithful. When I attempted to discuss my issues, I was told that I need to "read the bible all the way through". I did and found many things that I could not reconcile with "a god of love and mercy". It was then that I realized that what I was reading wasn't written by any divine source, but was much more equal to the pettiness of mankind back in the time it was acknowledging.

Just a bit of information from my past.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Deception -

Anyway, I am really not sure if I was a christian or not.

That pretty much says it "all".

There are MANY things in the Word that DON'T "reconcile with "a god of love and mercy".

But of course, God isn't "monolithic" and ONLY a "god of love and mercy". He's also a God or WRATH, and of JUDGEMENT - as the Word clearly states. That you (and the rest of us) are still alive today is clear evidence of His Love and Mercy (since we've sinned against him, and are worthy of death). Yet He died for us - that we could live.

THAT'S "love and Mercy" - big time.

But He's totally "up front" with us about the simple fact that He WILL be judging when the time comes, and then "Mercy and Grace" are OVER and those who REJECT his provision for them will be dealt with eternally.

Sounds like you've bought into several of the enemy's favorite lies. You need to ask God about that.

 

[savedbygrace57]

For those not of the Sheep !

Jn 10:


26But ye believe not,[Why ?] because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

And They believe not also because they were never ordained to eternal life acts 13:48

And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

 

[Deavonreye]

Re: Deception -

Anyway, I am really not sure if I was a christian or not.

That pretty much says it "all".

Yes, . . . they typical "you didn't believe the right way". :gah

. . . . You need to ask God about that.

Asked for 30 years [YES, sincerely].

 

[Alabaster]

God always answers. He is no respecter of persons. If one believes that God isn't answering, then that person either isn't listening, or doesn't like the answer.

The bitterness I am seeing in such a poster is revolting, as he is actually usurping God as God and sitting in judgment of Him, bidding the Lord God Jehovah to play by his rules.

 

[savedbygrace57]

Re: For those not of the Sheep !

Jn 10:


26But ye believe not,[Why ?] because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

And They believe not also because they were never ordained to eternal life acts 13:48

And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

Only those ordained to eternal life believe, and they are His Sheep who are ordained to eternal life.

Heaven was prepared for the Sheep as indicated here Matt 25:

34Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you [My Sheep] from the foundation of the world:

This means, the goats, whom He never knew, and obviously His eternal kingdom was not prepared for, had another place prepared for them.

Matt 25:

41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand [goats], Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

This was prepared for them from the foundation too. And they are being fitted or prepared for it..as the vessels of wrath rom 9:

22What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

That word fitted is the greek word:

katartizō and means:

to fit out, equip, put in order, arrange, adjust
to fit or frame for one's self, prepare

So from the foundation the goats had prepared for them, the same place that was prepared for the devil and his angels, and in the mean time, their physical lives are preparing them for it, the lake of fire .

God arranged these things from of old..

 

[Deavonreye]

God always answers. He is no respecter of persons. If one believes that God isn't answering, then that person either isn't listening, or doesn't like the answer.

The bitterness I am seeing in such a poster is revolting, as he is actually usurping God as God and sitting in judgment of Him, bidding the Lord God Jehovah to play by his rules.

Once again. . . . . "I didn't do my believing the right way".

I do not "sit in judgement" against any deity. I sit in judgement of what a religion claims of its deity. There is a big difference. And if there have been "rules to play by", they aren't mine. I just tend to agree with those who have gone before me.

And, my the way, having a strong feeling against an ideology . . . doesn't equate to "bitterness". I don't recall placing labels on you, but if I have, I'll try to refrain as well.

 

[Alabaster]

Once again. . . . . "I didn't do my believing the right way".

I do not "sit in judgement" against any deity. I sit in judgement of what a religion claims of its deity. There is a big difference. And if there have been "rules to play by", they aren't mine. I just tend to agree with those who have gone before me.

And, my the way, having a strong feeling against an ideology . . . doesn't equate to "bitterness". I don't recall placing labels on you, but if I have, I'll try to refrain as well.

You don't need religion. You need the word of God. Get into it, believe in Jesus Christ and get on board. Let Him show you what to believe and what not to believe. Let Him lead you in how to live and love others.

The life lived in Christ is the most fulfilling and rewarding life one can ever live!

 

[Deavonreye]

I'd really like to . . . but I'm afraid that it wouldn't be the life you live. My brain just works differently . . . "belief without adequate evidence" is a huge barrier. Only time will tell, though.

 

[Alabaster]

I'd really like to . . . but I'm afraid that it wouldn't be the life you live. My brain just works differently . . . "belief without adequate evidence" is a huge barrier. Only time will tell, though.

Yes, God is knocking on your heart's door. You only need to open it and welcome Him in, and He will come in and give you all the proof you need. It is only by faith that we believe. The convincing is done in the spiritual, by the work of Holy Spirit.

It is only your mind that is insisting that you need solid evidence. Tell Him about it. He will prove Himself to you beyond any measure of doubt. But you need to lay aside your tendency toward unbelief.

 

[ProphetMark]

Yes, God is knocking on your heart's door. you only need to open it and welcome Him in, and he will come in and give you all the proof you need. It is only by faith that we believe. The convincing is done in the spiritual, by the work of Holy Spirit.

It is only your mind that is insisting that you need solid evidence. Tell Him about it. He will prove Himself to you beyond any measure of doubt. But you need to lay aside your tendency toward unbelief.

Where's the biblical evidence for this? I've been a christian for about 30 years and this isn't my experience. I still have strong doubts even after all this time.

 

[Deavonreye]

I hear what you're saying, Mark. I, TOO, was a christian for around 30 years, and had a sincere desire for it. If god didn't 'prove it to me spiritually' by that amount of time, then IF he is true, he doesn't want me. When I think back at the higher spiritual times in my life, it all was due to "how others were acting", and I was drawn in to the "peer pressure" of it all, . . . or I was in an extremely horrific moment in my life, and my emotions drew me to attempt to find ANY type of help during that difficult time. But even then, when I was crying out to god with all I had, I still heard and felt nothing.

Some people are able to see "faith" as all they need. I couldn't be honest in that way. I would feel hypocritical. Towards the end of my "christianity", I was hypocritical in it, and can't do that anymore.

 

[savedbygrace57]

If one is not a sheep, they are a goat a tare..

 

[Alabaster]

Where's the biblical evidence for this? I've been a christian for about 30 years and this isn't my experience. I still have strong doubts even after all this time.

In your 30 years of being a Christian you have never been convinced of anything that is true? Brothers and sisters in Christ know this stuff. They know by the study of the scriptures that all truth is brought home to us by Holy Spirit, and they know that when there is doubt they can run to Jesus with it and He will give us assurance.

1 Thessalonians 1:5
For when we brought you the Good News, it was not only with words but also with power, for the Holy Spirit gave you full assurance that what we said was true. And you know of our concern for you from the way we lived when we were with you.



Has there been a particular moment in time in your life where you reckoned with God concerning your direction in life and your sin and you accepted Jesus as your personal Saviour and made Him your Lord? Someone gifted by the prophetic (I assume by your username that is your claim) shouldn't be suffering with strong doubts. Jesus wants to bear them away!

 

[Alabaster]

I hear what you're saying, Mark. I, TOO, was a christian for around 30 years, and had a sincere desire for it. If god didn't 'prove it to me spiritually' by that amount of time, then IF he is true, he doesn't want me. When I think back at the higher spiritual times in my life, it all was due to "how others were acting", and I was drawn in to the "peer pressure" of it all, . . . or I was in an extremely horrific moment in my life, and my emotions drew me to attempt to find ANY type of help during that difficult time. But even then, when I was crying out to god with all I had, I still heard and felt nothing.

Some people are able to see "faith" as all they need. I couldn't be honest in that way. I would feel hypocritical. Towards the end of my "christianity", I was hypocritical in it, and can't do that anymore.

You cannot know God apart from faith.

Romans 3:27
Can we boast, then, that we have done anything to be accepted by God? No, because our acquittal is not based on obeying the law. It is based on faith.

Romans 4:5
But people are counted as righteous, not because of their work, but because of their faith in God who forgives sinners.

Romans 4:16
So the promise is received by faith. It is given as a free gift. And we are all certain to receive it, whether or not we live according to the law of Moses, if we have faith like Abraham’s. For Abraham is the father of all who believe.

 

[Deavonreye]

The apostles weren't left with "faith" after the crucifixion. Jesus showed up to them in person to prove that he was raised. It is obviously okay for him to do so or it wouldn't have been done. Was their "faith" removed?

Regardless, as I said, without something other than "the testimony of other people telling me THIS belief system is THE only true one", I cannot just "have faith" in it and NOT feel like a hypocrite. I've gone past the point of a person being able to "just have faith".