??? God's "happy" when you're happy????

[th1b.taylor]

plainly, as it is written somewhere , "the world loves its own"....
and there's even 'churches' placed under that umbrella (identified in the letters to the ekklesia in Revelation 1 - 3, and further,)
that aren't Christian but are christian (i.e. they worship god with their lips..... etc etc).

True.

 

[Danus]

Danus,
Christians, today, live their lives in heresy, intentionally. I am oft verbally assaulted when I explain that every Christian is not saved but the term "Christian" has been forced to evolve into encapsulating every person in attendance at any service and, simply, that is not true. It is even not true of the occupants of the Pulpit. People desire it to be true but the seventh chapter of Matthew has been so perverted by lost men extracting the first verse and using it to shush the Christian message until, largely because of unsaved men and women inside the assembly, everybody willfully sins and does not judge the fruit of the people in attendance

When we look at how Victoria was and is banned from flying, I believe it was South West Airlines, and then we watch, objectively, the TV Shows of the Worship Service there and put it together with the lack of some of the missing preaching on homosexuality and there is something wrong. Then ex-members like Doc Holiday come along and, over coffee, explains why they left that assembly and Judgement must be used, no matter the disdain encountered. When Doc explained the management structure I did not believe him but after others confirmed the presense of active homosexuality, both in the assembly and in the governing structure, there is great heresy there.

As I was exploring where to begin my journey in the Church (the last quarter of '89) I watched Joel preach and I was struck with the knowledge that he, his mom and his wife had become great motivational speakers but I was reading my Bible then and I could not justify some of his or their messages that were being pushed. Other than the coupling of Bill Cosby to make the clip funny, I see a great message that screams at the Christian to awaken. You have offered a wake up call and you have done so with humor.

I used to watch Joel on Sunday morning while waiting for my wife and kids to get ready for church. This was years ago. The thing that struck me most the first time I watched him, was size of the congregation, the fact that he filled an arena, and how he would hold up the bible and say "This is my Bible. I am what it says I am. I can do what it says I can do." and the congregation would repeat that in unisense. I figured he'd preach from that book, but instead all he's ever done is loosely refer to it.

On the one hand he's heretical and it would be a sin of omission not to speak out against this guy, others like him, and their false ministries. On the other hand it almost doesn't matter, because truth is self-evident (self evident, meaning to truths self) and those with the truth can discern it. God makes sure of that.

I think the best thing to do when it comes to Joel Olsteen is to point out the heresy, point out the miss teaching and how it's not biblical, but also do that with as much compassion as we can. That's the hard part, because lets face it. Joel just seems like such a nice guy don't he? .....but that's the sheep's clothing isn't it?

The thing about the wolves is they are not going to come to us as someone we need to watch out for. The devil comes to us as our friend, someone, or something, that seems nice, seems to make sense, speaks to us on terms we can relate to, since we are sinners. Joel pushes that button and makes it seem on the side of God.

What people don't like to hear is that God is a God of Wrath and Judgment against sin, and we are sinners by nature. He's a God of Love, Mercy, and Forgiveness, true, but He's a God of Wrath first. His love, mercy, and forgiveness, and the blessing He bestows are are the centerpiece of the Gospel, but that means nothing unless we first understand His Wrath and Judgment, and where we stand in that. Just "acting good" is not what the Christian life is about.

I like your opening statement about "Christians" living in willful heresy today. I know exactly what you mean. The term Christian has been hijacked and applied to many things that are not Christian at all. But, the understanding of salvation in terms of what a Christian is, still packs it's meaning, and we will just keep speaking up.

 

[th1b.taylor]

I used to watch Joel on Sunday morning while waiting for my wife and kids to get ready for church. This was years ago. The thing that struck me most the first time I watched him, was size of the congregation, the fact that he filled an arena, and how he would hold up the bible and say "This is my Bible. I am what it says I am. I can do what it says I can do." and the congregation would repeat that in unisense. I figured he'd preach from that book, but instead all he's ever done is loosely refer to it.

On the one hand he's heretical and it would be a sin of omission not to speak out against this guy, others like him, and their false ministries. On the other hand it almost doesn't matter, because truth is self-evident (self evident, meaning to truths self) and those with the truth can discern it. God makes sure of that.

I think the best thing to do when it comes to Joel Olsteen is to point out the heresy, point out the miss teaching and how it's not biblical, but also do that with as much compassion as we can. That's the hard part, because lets face it. Joel just seems like such a nice guy don't he? .....but that's the sheep's clothing isn't it?

The thing about the wolves is they are not going to come to us as someone we need to watch out for. The devil comes to us as our friend, someone, or something, that seems nice, seems to make sense, speaks to us on terms we can relate to, since we are sinners. Joel pushes that button and makes it seem on the side of God.

What people don't like to hear is that God is a God of Wrath and Judgment against sin, and we are sinners by nature. He's a God of Love, Mercy, and Forgiveness, true, but He's a God of Wrath first. His love, mercy, and forgiveness, and the blessing He bestows are are the centerpiece of the Gospel, but that means nothing unless we first understand His Wrath and Judgment, and where we stand in that. Just "acting good" is not what the Christian life is about.

I like your opening statement about "Christians" living in willful heresy today. I know exactly what you mean. The term Christian has been hijacked and applied to many things that are not Christian at all. But, the understanding of salvation in terms of what a Christian is, still packs it's meaning, and we will just keep speaking up.

I have not made it out of bed today, sickly. I'm always happy when others have seen the truth that is, sometimes, difficult to find in the world today and I have marked you, on my personal record, as one seeking truth. God bless and a great worship is wished for you and yours this morning.