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Holy Lie

Classik

Classik

Member
Holy lie

What is a lie? A lie is a lie, huh? A lie is like calling a black ‘white’ or calling a white ‘black’. There are accounts of people who told lies in the bible.
Ananias and Sapphira told lies and the Holy Spirit killed them instantly.
How much little is a little lie – and how much insignificant is a tiny lie? Can we justify a lie and call it common sense?
Do we remember the man that told a lie about the wife in the OT? He said to the king his wife was his sister. He did that to preserve his life. Abraham actually did this. Genesis 20:2
At times fathers in attempt to hurriedly dismiss their kids and go to work lie to them. Their kids tell them: ‘buy me a toy, dad.’ They pretend they will do that but don’t really do that. They want to dismiss their children. Another lie?

A boy runs towards you and hurriedly runs into your apartment. You look forward and discover some group of armed men coming towards your direction. From the look of things you know they are going to kill this boy. They men stop and ask you: ‘did you notice and boy run across here? Will you say yes and deliver the boy to them or will you tell a holy lie? ;) (This is similar to the account of Rahab the prostitute that saved the two Israelite Spies. Joshua 2 and 6)
How much insignificant is a little lie before God?
Is there a verse that says: all liars will have their part in the lake of fire? Rev. 21:8 :dunno :shrug :confused
 
:chin That's very thought out. Though I'd like to add my 2cents about the whole issue. I really believe that God understands, especially if you told a lie to save somebodies life. When you read the rest of the story about that woman who lied; she was actually kept alive because of it, correct? When Israel came back to take the place, they left her home unharmed.

We have to be careful not to become religious about small matters. Being critical about every "small" sin, would quickly turn us into a Pharisee. God knows our hearts. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to justify these white lies. Lying is still lying! Becoming a historical revisionist is to become a lier :shame but lets make sure we don't major on the minors.

As far as all liars going to take part in the lake of fire. Do you think telling a lie just before you die will send you to hell? Or does God see into the hearts of men AND KNOW that afterwards you will repent and return?

Very good question :thumbsup, we do need to strive to become holy, and it's good to see your trying to do so. God bless you!
 
If its not the truth, its a lie. There is no such thing as '' just telling a story'' a ''fib'' a ''white lies.'' Nope they are all black lies. Bad
 
There is no getting around the fact that Rahab lied and was not only immensely blessed because it (allowed to live, to join in the congregation of Israel, became the grandmother of a King) she was also one of the four women mentioned in our Lord's ancestry.

I realize that some people struggle with this... I once read a seven page dissertation on how Rahab the harlot couldn't possibly be Jesus' ancestor because it does boggle the mind... but nonetheless, unless one wants to twist, turn, obfuscate and befuzzle the issue... Rahab lied... and was blessed for it.
 
There are other instances of pretending or leading someone to infer incorrectly.

Joshua 8:15 "And Joshua and all Israel made as if they were beaten before them, and fled by the way of the wilderness."

1 Samuel 21:13 "And he changed his behaviour before them, and feigned himself mad in their hands, and scrabbled on the doors of the gate, and let his spittle fall down upon his beard."

Luke 24:28 "And they drew nigh unto the village, whither they went: and he made as though he would have gone further."

2 Thessalonians 2:11 "And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:"
 
Sadly, lying is virtually 'normal' these days and it probably always was. People generally lie for their own ends - to get some advantage. I try very hard not to do anything like that but I am sure to have embellished a good tale now and again.

I do however think that there are times when a lie is justified or even a good thing. A lie can be acceptable if it is for the greater good. You wouldn't expect a captured enemy to reveal all he knew about his troop movements and plans would you. He will lie for his 'greater good' and we can all think of thousands of similar examples even if it is just telling your wife that her new hair style looks nice.:yes

The bigger problem, to my mind, is where we get 'official' lying. Politicians and journalists are possibly the worst people for distorting the truth but it occurs big-time in business and even in churches. In the early days of magic lanterns they were quite widely used by ministers to conjure up images in church. Obviously that would have been a totally convincing lie to the congregation who would never have heard of such 'technology'.
 
Justin_Gilpin said:
That's very thought out. Though I'd like to add my 2cents about the whole issue. I really believe that God understands, especially if you told a lie to save somebodies life. When you read the rest of the story about that woman who lied; she was actually kept alive because of it, correct? When Israel came back to take the place, they left her home unharmed. We have to be careful not to become religious about small matters. Being critical about every "small" sin, would quickly turn us into a Pharisee. God knows our hearts. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to justify these white lies. Lying is still lying! Becoming a historical revisionist is to become a lier but lets make sure we don't major on the minors. As far as all liars going to take part in the lake of fire. Do you think telling a lie just before you die will send you to hell? Or does God see into the hearts of men AND KNOW that afterwards you will repent and return? Very good question , we do need to strive to become holy, and it's good to see your trying to do so. God bless you!
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Welcome :wave. You said: 'Do you think telling a lie just before you die will send you to hell?'How about Annanais and the wife?And how about peolpe who plan ahead to tell a lie in order to justify a case? ;)
 
Aardverk said:
The bigger problem, to my mind, is where we get 'official' lying. Politicians and journalists are possibly the worst people for distorting the truth but it occurs big-time in business and even in churches.
Click to expand...
Politicians and journalists? :bigfrown They made doctorate degree in lying....worldclass liars! Elegant liars.
 
handy said:
--.. Rahab lied... and was blessed for it.
Click to expand...
I dont believe God blesses anyone for telling a lie.
But He could have given her mercy, since she risked her life by hiding the men.

And as a side note, she had more faith than many do, she was believing if she hid them they would save her and her family. Later they did, and put a scarlet rope in her window, so they would know to save that family. That was a type of our salvation , having faith in the scarlet blood of Jesus to save us.

Just as I was writing this, I had this thought. Perhaps, God forgave her of that lie, because she had acted in faith to be saved, just as when we act in faith toward His Son, all our sins are forgiven. She also became part of the lineage of Jesus.
 
Classik said:
Holy lie

What is a lie? A lie is a lie, huh? A lie is like calling a black ‘white’ or calling a white ‘black’. There are accounts of people who told lies in the bible.
Ananias and Sapphira told lies and the Holy Spirit killed them instantly.
How much little is a little lie – and how much insignificant is a tiny lie? Can we justify a lie and call it common sense?
Do we remember the man that told a lie about the wife in the OT? He said to the king his wife was his sister. He did that to preserve his life. Abraham actually did this. Genesis 20:2
At times fathers in attempt to hurriedly dismiss their kids and go to work lie to them. Their kids tell them: ‘buy me a toy, dad.’ They pretend they will do that but don’t really do that. They want to dismiss their children. Another lie?

A boy runs towards you and hurriedly runs into your apartment. You look forward and discover some group of armed men coming towards your direction. From the look of things you know they are going to kill this boy. They men stop and ask you: ‘did you notice and boy run across here? Will you say yes and deliver the boy to them or will you tell a holy lie? ;) (This is similar to the account of Rahab the prostitute that saved the two Israelite Spies. Joshua 2 and 6)
How much insignificant is a little lie before God?
Is there a verse that says: all liars will have their part in the lake of fire? Rev. 21:8 :dunno :shrug :confused
Click to expand...
Its more like those who live the lie to gain a rep or shakey business knowingly deceiving people for personal gain. If this sin was as sensative as we make it then no one would be saved and Jesus' mission was for nothing, for none of us knows the complete truth to not lie, unknowingly. Your kid (if you have one) lied several times to not get punished (maybe). Since you knew why and he was just scared his discipline wasn't hard or none. Just a little talk eases things. But you don't hold it against them and decide to starve'em or something, right?
 
eduardo said:
Its more like those who live the lie to gain a rep or shakey business knowingly deceiving people for personal gain. If this sin was as sensative as we make it then no one would be saved and Jesus' mission was for nothing, for none of us knows the complete truth to not lie, unknowingly. Your kid (if you have one) lied several times to not get punished (maybe). Since you knew why and he was just scared his discipline wasn't hard or none. Just a little talk eases things. But you don't hold it against them and decide to starve'em or something, right?
Click to expand...
:lolWell. Some chose to suffer persecusion.;)
 
Classik said:
Holy lie

What is a lie? A lie is a lie, huh? A lie is like calling a black ‘white’ or calling a white ‘black’. There are accounts of people who told lies in the bible.
Ananias and Sapphira told lies and the Holy Spirit killed them instantly.
How much little is a little lie – and how much insignificant is a tiny lie? Can we justify a lie and call it common sense?
Do we remember the man that told a lie about the wife in the OT? He said to the king his wife was his sister. He did that to preserve his life. Abraham actually did this. Genesis 20:2
At times fathers in attempt to hurriedly dismiss their kids and go to work lie to them. Their kids tell them: ‘buy me a toy, dad.’ They pretend they will do that but don’t really do that. They want to dismiss their children. Another lie?

A boy runs towards you and hurriedly runs into your apartment. You look forward and discover some group of armed men coming towards your direction. From the look of things you know they are going to kill this boy. They men stop and ask you: ‘did you notice and boy run across here? Will you say yes and deliver the boy to them or will you tell a holy lie? ;) (This is similar to the account of Rahab the prostitute that saved the two Israelite Spies. Joshua 2 and 6)
How much insignificant is a little lie before God?
Is there a verse that says: all liars will have their part in the lake of fire? Rev. 21:8 :dunno :shrug :confused
Click to expand...

Ananias and his wife conspired to make it appear to be true that the total amount of money they had received from the sale of land that they had owned was the intact amount they gave to the apostles to be used for the general welfare of their associates. The apostles rightly judged that it was the sin of lying to the Holy Spirit and both lost the benefit of eternal life when they were confronted by Peter. This recorded incident is certianly a serious blow to the holders of OSAS. And the term "Holy lie" is a construct of thought that has similarity to the same offense of Ananias and his wife. Since no lie has nor ever will be holy the term "Holy lie" itself is a lie.
 
Theodore A. Jones said:
Ananias and his wife conspired to make it appear to be true that the total amount of money they had received from the sale of land that they had owned was the intact amount they gave to the apostles to be used for the general welfare of their associates. The apostles rightly judged that it was the sin of lying to the Holy Spirit and both lost the benefit of eternal life when they were confronted by Peter. This recorded incident is certianly a serious blow to the holders of OSAS.


You got that right! :thumbsup



-- Since no lie has nor ever will be holy the term "Holy lie" itself is a lie.

True, there is no such thing as a holy lie.
But I didn't want to be the one to say it quite like that. :)
Click to expand...


----
 
jonjon1 said:
"Thou shalt not kill" but there was war and it was justified.
Click to expand...

Actually that is pertaining to murder in your heart. Murder and just killing are two different things. For instance, deliberately going out to murder a person because of hate or anger is not the same as accidently killing someone or defending your country
 
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