Household salvation?

[T. E. Smith]

Acts 16:25-34 says:

25 About midnight Paul and Silas were praying and singing hymns to God, and the prisoners were listening to them, 26 and suddenly there was a great earthquake, so that the foundations of the prison were shaken. And immediately all the doors were opened, and everyone's bonds were unfastened. 27 When the jailer woke and saw that the prison doors were open, he drew his sword and was about to kill himself, supposing that the prisoners had escaped. 28 But Paul cried with a loud voice, "Do not harm yourself, for we are all here." 29 And the jailer called for lights and rushed in, and trembling with fear he fell down before Paul and Silas. 30 Then he brought them out and said, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" 31 And they said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household." 32 And they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all who were in his house. 33 And he took them the same hour of the night and washed their wounds; and he was baptized at once, he and all his family. 34 Then he brought them up into his house and set food before them. And he rejoiced along with his entire household that he had believed in God.

The part I put in bold is the thing I am most interested in. Some Christians emphasize individual salvation, that only the individual who believes can be saved. But here it appears that if the one man, the jailer (head of the household) believes, then his household will be saved. It is never stated that his household believed, only that "he had believed in God", and his family did not rejoice in their own belief but rather in his.

Perhaps I am extrapolating too much here. What do you all think about this? Is "household salvation" a biblical concept? How should we understand this passage?

 

[JLB]

Acts 16:25-34 says:

The part I put in bold is the thing I am most interested in. Some Christians emphasize individual salvation, that only the individual who believes can be saved. But here it appears that if the one man, the jailer (head of the household) believes, then his household will be saved. It is never stated that his household believed, only that "he had believed in God", and his family did not rejoice in their own belief but rather in his.

Perhaps I am extrapolating too much here. What do you all think about this? Is "household salvation" a biblical concept? How should we understand this passage?

And he brought them out and said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?”
So they said, “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.” Then they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all who were in his house. And he took them the same hour of the night and washed their stripes. And immediately he and all his family were baptized. Acts 16:30-33


Notice that they spoke the “word of the Lord” (the message of Christ) to all his household and his household became baptized.

• Then they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all who were in his house. And he took them the same hour of the night and washed their stripes. And immediately he and all his family were baptized.

JLB

 

[Northman]

It was a blessing bestowed on that family. Best to not treat God like a science where if He blesses one person one way that He is going to bless all in the same fashion.

It's like anything else in the bible you read, whether it's granted wisdom or healings or whatever. Jesus healed some lepers but not all lepers. God granted wisdom to Solomon but not all kings. God goes out of the way to make sure nobody is ever able to predict/map what he does.

 

[hawkman]

Acts 16:25-34 says:

The part I put in bold is the thing I am most interested in. Some Christians emphasize individual salvation, that only the individual who believes can be saved. But here it appears that if the one man, the jailer (head of the household) believes, then his household will be saved. It is never stated that his household believed, only that "he had believed in God", and his family did not rejoice in their own belief but rather in his.

Perhaps I am extrapolating too much here. What do you all think about this? Is "household salvation" a biblical concept? How should we understand this passage?

Let us go back a few verses in the chapter and get some more info .

16 And it came to pass, as we went to prayer, a certain damsel possessed with a spirit of divination met us, which brought her masters much gain by soothsaying:

17 The same followed Paul and us, and cried, saying, These men are the servants of the most high God, which shew unto us the way of salvation.

18 And this did she many days. But Paul, being grieved, turned and said to the spirit, I command thee in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her. And he came out the same hour.

19 And when her masters saw that the hope of their gains was gone, they caught Paul and Silas, and drew them into the marketplace unto the rulers,

20 And brought them to the magistrates, saying, These men, being Jews, do exceedingly trouble our city,

21 And teach customs, which are not lawful for us to receive, neither to observe, being Romans.

22 And the multitude rose up together against them: and the magistrates rent off their clothes, and commanded to beat them.

Paul and Silas were right in the middle of a mighty move of God's Spirit . All of Acts Chapter 16 shows us this . I would think the jailor knew all that had happened and why Paul and Silas were put in his charge in jail .

23 And when they had laid many stripes upon them, they cast them into prison, charging the jailor to keep them safely:

24 Who, having received such a charge, thrust them into the inner prison, and made their feet fast in the stocks.

Not only were Paul and Silas cast into prison but they were even restrained while there !
Now think about what kind of man would be in charge of the jail ? He would be a strong man no doubt maybe a large man , after all he was chosen to keep prisoners in jail without benefit of firearms . A tough guy .

25 And at midnight Paul and Silas prayed, and sang praises unto God: and the prisoners heard them.

26 And suddenly there was a great earthquake, so that the foundations of the prison were shaken: and immediately all the doors were opened, and every one's bands were loosed.

27 And the keeper of the prison awaking out of his sleep, and seeing the prison doors open, he drew out his sword, and would have killed himself, supposing that the prisoners had been fled.

The jailer would have been in shear panic upon seeing the doors open . A supernatural event right there in his jail . The jailer understood the God that Paul and Silas served was responsible for the event .

28 But Paul cried with a loud voice, saying, Do thyself no harm: for we are all here.

29 Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and fell down before Paul and Silas,

30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

So here is the tough guy , the jailor , at Paul and Silas's feet asking what he needs to do for salvation .
How did Paul and Silas know the jailor's household would be saved ? The Holy Spirit could have very well revealed it to them or they knew from past experience that it would happen .

32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.

33 And he took them the same hour of the night, and washed their stripes; and was baptized, he and all his, straightway.

34 And when he had brought them into his house, he set meat before them, and rejoiced, believing in God with all his house.

What was it like at the jailor's home ? I am sure the jailor told his family the whole story , just imagine how excited the jailor must have been . What kind of shock must it have been to the family to see the tough guy jailor now with joy and tears in his eyes and the love of God showing through ! Salvation would of had no problem spreading through the household .

 

[Vinny37]

A copy-paste from a book.

[Ac.10: the water-baptised had first been listening to Peter’s message, when out of the blue that heedful household had been spirit-baptised and spoke in language they had not learnt (44; 11:14-5). On that basis, they were water-baptised. Had babies really heeded Peter, then been spirit-baptised and then spoken God’s praises?

Ac. 16:32-4: all in the Jailer’s household were old enough to understand Paul, and to individually rejoice.

Ac. 18:8: the entire household of a synagogue leader, Crispus, believed. Even had they had a baby who believed, would Paul’s team have known that it had believed, and would it not then have been water-baptised, based on its own faith? The text adds that other Corinthians—including Gaius—heard, believed, and were water-baptised.

1 Cor. 16:15 specifies that Stephen’s household helped other Christians—pray tell, how did any babies help out?

In fact the only household description that doesn’t implicitly rule out babies from water-baptism, is that of Lydia’s household. But with four negative accounts, why assume that the fifth had any baby, then assume that Luke would have counted any babies into his report? I visit a family which has a baby. I tell you that while there, we all played Monopoly. Do you assume that any baby would have joined in? To support a big doctrine on a hypothetical little baby joining the party, is a very big ask indeed.]

As to the definition of salvation, I’d say it was into Level 3 (the church), rather than Level 4 (eternity). I do not hold that one can only get the heaven via the church, but I do hold that the church is a salvific blessing for mortal years, so is a good opportunity if offered.

 

[D-D-W]

IMO the typical individualistic concept of salvation is inadequate. God deals with us first and foremost in groups - nations, clans, families, congregations; amd after that as individuals.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

It was a blessing bestowed on that family. Best to not treat God like a science where if He blesses one person one way that He is going to bless all in the same fashion.

It's like anything else in the bible you read, whether it's granted wisdom or healings or whatever. Jesus healed some lepers but not all lepers. God granted wisdom to Solomon but not all kings. God goes out of the way to make sure nobody is ever able to predict/map what he does.

Jonah found it very easy to predict what he does.

 

[T. E. Smith]

God goes out of the way to make sure nobody is ever able to predict/map what he does.

This does not sound like a trustworthy, reliable God.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

This does not sound like a trustworthy, reliable God.

Exactly which is why that is not how he is known to be by anyone who walks with Him.

 

[Northman]

This does not sound like a trustworthy, reliable God.

Just because God doesn't allow Himself to be manipulated doesn't mean he isn't trustworthy. In modern terms, God isn't a simp and there is no language usable to force Him to do what you want.

 

[Northman]

Jonah found it very easy to predict what he does.

Anything about the future that comes out the mouth of a prophet is a relay of info from the Holy Spirit, even if it's the knowledge that you need to be thrown off the boat in order for the storm to cease.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Anything about the future that comes out the mouth of a prophet is a relay of info from the Holy Spirit, even if it's the knowledge that you need to be thrown off the boat in order for the storm to cease.

Not according to the prophets. Jonah was not told this as he went on board. He was only told to go somewhere. But He knew how God would react, counter to what you claimed.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Just because God doesn't allow Himself to be manipulated doesn't mean he isn't trustworthy. In modern terms, God isn't a simp and there is no language usable to force Him to do what you want.

This is quite good. Do you think He allows Himself to be summoned when believers sing that He’s (has to be) here? I mean believers WANT him to attend their services and so does He submit and allow their words to manipulate him upon demand?

 

[Northman]

But He knew how God would react, counter to what you claimed.

Jonah knowing that God would be displeased is not Jonah knowing details about what is going to happen to him. There is no scripture that even gives a hint that Jonah knew the ordered steps to his journey. The theme is in the context, not outside of what was being discussed. The idea is that you do not know what God is going to do and you cannot create a scenario in which you make God perform a scripted action. In this case, the topic is salvation, and someone outside of being in the family right now is musing about there being a thing such as a household salvation doctrine. A blessing is being mistaken for what someone may feel or want to be a common course of action. For someone who claims to have read the bible more times that a regular believer, he seems to have either glossed over or skipped or whatever a whole whack of text from Jesus about Him dividing households.

This is quite good. Do you think He allows Himself to be summoned when believers sing that He’s (has to be) here? I mean believers WANT him to attend their services and so does He submit and allow their words to manipulate him upon demand?

Go back to the Sunday school type simplicity. God really is everywhere.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Jonah knowing that God would be displeased is not Jonah knowing details about what is going to happen to him. There is no scripture that even gives a hint that Jonah knew the ordered steps to his journey. The theme is in the context, not outside of what was being discussed. The idea is that you do not know what God is going to do and you cannot create a scenario in which you make God perform a scripted action. In this case, the topic is salvation, and someone outside of being in the family right now is musing about there being a thing such as a household salvation doctrine. A blessing is being mistaken for what someone may feel or want to be a common course of action. For someone who claims to have read the bible more times that a regular believer, he seems to have either glossed over or skipped or whatever a whole whack of text from Jesus about Him dividing households.

The statement that we do not know what God is doing to do is plain wrong. Jonah knew what God was going to do depending upon what the people did. There are some who actually do know what God is going to do depending upon the comment. But it is somewhat ironic that you do not believe that we can know what God is going to do and insist that you know that God is everywhere, something God does.

Go back to the Sunday school type simplicity. God really is everywhere.

Snide comment.

 

[WIP]

Northman said:
Go back to the Sunday school type simplicity. God really is everywhere.

Snide comment.

When I read the post, I didn't see this as a snide comment so I'm not sure it was meant that way. I think Northman could be just saying not to over think or over complicate things.

 

[T. E. Smith]

if God has no body, saying he is everywhere extends the concept of location "where" into a realm in which we have no idea what it means or how to use it.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

When I read the post, I didn't see this as a snide comment so I'm not sure it was meant that way. I think Northman could be just saying not to over think or over complicate things.

Truth is complicated

 

[MouseWhistle]

Maybe the jailers whole family was considered for salvation because typically the man of the house as head of household led the family.

When he believed, all would believe. And as such what naturally followed was family baptism.

God gave himself to save the world and take its sins upon himself on the cross.

Maybe saving a family is the microcosm of that promise and plan.

 

[D-D-W]

if God has no body, saying he is everywhere extends the concept of location "where" into a realm in which we have no idea what it means or how to use it.

You are using Greek logic again. Yes, God has no body (a Spirit); and yet He DOES have a body. See Rev 1.13-15 to see what HIS body looks like. If your logic framework cannot handle both truths, get another one.

And He is everywhere; but some places His presence is made visible and tangible (like the Shekinah in the temple) and other times/places completely imperceptible.