How is this true?

[r3alink]

Would Jesus have to be generally accepted as reality to be true in your personal opinion?

Can we make an idol out of our own methods of determining what's true, even though its known to Christians that God resists the proud, and humbles the wisdom of this world?

I was just making a philosophical statement, thats all.

 

[r3alink]

In the case of scripture prophecy, it is imagined truth as opposed to real truth. i.e. The Lost are more and more certain that homosexuality is an acceptable life style in the eye of God... but that is a lie. They are deluded.

I can also concede that homosexuality is a delusion, but I dont need bible god to conclude such a thing.

 

[th1b.taylor]

Don't worry I was not replying to you, but I was only updating my original post.

Oky doky, I just didn't know, may God bless.

 

[Malachi]

What I am trying to say is that reality is only a function of not succumbing to delusion and when one succumbs to a delusion they fall victim to abnormality.
(Reality is just the absence of delusion)

And how do you know that this statement in itself is not delusional? One would need to clearly define reality and normality before talking about delusion. You have not provided those definitions. Within a madhouse everyone outside is considered abnormal.

 

[Deborah13]

Is delusion the truth or imaginary?

It's what Willie T said.
Face it, many of the world think you are delusional. :biggrin

And all of us who believe the Bible.

 

[r3alink]

And how do you know that this statement in itself is not delusional? One would need to clearly define reality and normality before talking about delusion. You have not provided those definitions. Within a madhouse everyone outside is considered abnormal.

What I'm saying is reality is only defined by the absence of delusion, that in fact reality is the state of not being delusional.

 

[r3alink]

It's what Willie T said.
Face it, many of the world think you are delusional. :biggrin

And all of us who believe the Bible.

I think myself to be delusional about a great many things, but I have never needed others to tell me what my delusions are, otherwise I'd be in denial.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

I can also concede that homosexuality is a delusion, but I dont need bible god to conclude such a thing.

I agree. The Bible refers to this as the nature of things being a law that governs mankind and by which he will judge a person for lack of any other law above and beyond that.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

I think myself to be delusional about a great many things, but I have never needed others to tell me what my delusions are, otherwise I'd be in denial.

I disagree. When we travel in our cars you and I depend on road signs to warn us that we are deluded if we think we can continue at the posted speed limit and negotiate the curve in the road ahead. There's no way to know that by ourselves ahead of time. If we depend on our own knowledge and foresight we won't realize we need to slow down before the curve until we're already in the curve where it's too late to slow down in order to make the curve safely. This analogy is easily applied to many other situations and circumstances of life.

 

[r3alink]

I disagree. When we travel in our cars you and I depend on road signs to warn us that we are deluded if we think we can continue at the posted speed limit and negotiate the curve in the road ahead. There's no way to know that by ourselves ahead of time. If we depend on our own knowledge and foresight we won't realize we need to slow down before the curve until we're already in the curve where it's too late to slow down in order to make the curve safely. This analogy is easily applied to many other situations and circumstances of life.

I kinda understand your analogy, but it has always been the case that a person can only admit their delusion so long as they are not in denial. As denial will prevent a critical analysis of the situation, such as a driver exclaming to the police that the speed camera was wrong even after they are presented with the evidence to the contrary .

 

[Deborah13]

I think myself to be delusional about a great many things, but I have never needed others to tell me what my delusions are, otherwise I'd be in denial.

Quite right. 2
Seeing I'm not in denial about at least this one issue, I can warn my friend, so she isn't in denial either. It may be blunt and seem unkind but you know tough love and all that. :wink

 

[r3alink]

Quite right. 2
Seeing I'm not in denial about at least this one issue, I can warn my friend, so she isn't in denial either. It may be blunt and seem unkind but you know tough love and all that. :wink

You can't change yourself or anyone else untill you or they admit to being deluded, the function of denial is to detached you or a person from inner examination. This is due to the delusions self defensive mechanism, that will cause psychology pain to you or the person in order to protect itself.

 

[th1b.taylor]

It's what Willie T said.
Face it, many of the world think you are delusional. :biggrin

And all of us who believe the Bible.

You're right. We, the Christians that follow God, are based in truth and are able to see how delusional the world has become and according to the New World definition posted earlier by someone, we are the delusional party because we do not believe as the majority does.

 

[th1b.taylor]

You can't change yourself or anyone else untill you or they admit to being deluded, the function of denial is to detached you or a person from inner examination. This is due to the delusions self defensive mechanism, that will cause psychology pain to you or the person in order to protect itself.

Okay, you make arguments based on your truth but that, appears to be delusional. You have said that you do not need God to determine what delusion is. I noticed the common, worldly, lack of respect in the spelling, small g, and the illogical conclusion of not needing God and instantly looked to see if you were at least claiming to follow God and I see that you have been honest and said no.

Truth is absolute and never has been, is not and never will be conditional nor relational. Without the God of the Bible, the God of Creation, truth would, indeed be relative and subject to redefining from time to time.

And then there is the Great Truth that God has made a path for you and I to return to Him and to avoid awakening to the truth of Him is, at best, in an Eternal Vacuum, where we would never be able to reach Him again. You have not reasoned just how much you need Him to base all of reality on.

Praying.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

You can't change yourself or anyone else untill you or they admit to being deluded, the function of denial is to detached you or a person from inner examination. This is due to the delusions self defensive mechanism, that will cause psychology pain to you or the person in order to protect itself.

Self preservation is the driving force of all men and women separated from God. When Adam was cast out of God's protective environment where all his needs were met he became afraid. A fear we have all inherited from him. It is because of this fear that all of us fall into the natural path of defending ourselves through devices like lying, cheating, stealing, hatred, jealousy, envy, divisiveness, contentiousness, rebellion, adultery, etc.

Those are the natural defensive mechanisms we are all doomed to walk in to one extent or another as fallen men and women of creation. But in Christ we renounce those sinful, defensive ways and return to the Father who guards us and supplies our needs so that we don't have to resort to those old sinful ways to protect ourselves and make life good. In place of our old hurtful ways are the ways of peace, love, joy, forgiveness, kindness, faithfulness, etc. They begin to flourish within us instead. The peace we have made with God through Christ gives us the confidence to walk in these new ways instead of our old hurtful ways. We spend the rest of our natural lives learning to depend on God instead of depending on our old ways to make it through life safely.

The delusion is thinking that the ways of fallen man--strife, rage, contentions, brutality, threats, lying, immorality, etc.--are the way you live safely and successfully in this life. A person must, as you say, come out of denial and renounce those old ways, find forgiveness through Christ for having walked in those old ways, and receive God's Holy Spirit to transform them into a person who is no longer deluded by the ways of the world and walks in increasing measure in the ways of God.

 

[Jesse]

Reality is normality not succumbing to delusion. Once you succumb to delusion you are no longer normal.

What is the criteria for something to be considered a reality?

If and ever we can agree upon the criteria for what reality is, our minds will play tricks to cause us to believe one or more of those criteria has been met. A delusion will also cause us to believe something happened when it did not.

Then there is the problem that reality can be relative to culture, era, etc. What is reality for one culture, is not so for another. We may never know how one's reality is different than our own.

Then we have metaphysical reality which is objective, it has nothing to do with our senses our desires, it doesn't change regardless if you want them changed or not. Let's say something that is impossible to perceive can not exist. People do not have the ability to perceive something that does not exist in objective reality. Yet, there are some people that do believe that they can perceive something that does not exist and that is a delusion.

God and His absolute Truth is not dependent upon our perception, it's objective regardless how anyone feels, regardless of people's experiences, etc.