I learned somthing New Today

[Spirit Driven]

No where in the Bible does it say God is A Christian..............

He is Soveriegn of All
He is the LORD of Hosts, he is God who does as he pleases in all the heavens and the Earth.... I say All Honor Power and Glory be to his name.

He is not a Christian though, that word is a Human term made up by men.
Scripture tells us many times and over and over Again that he is God the Father of Jesus his only begotton Son.

Nowhere in the Bible does it say God is Jesus, which is not so surprising really, or there would have been nobody to raise Jesus from the Dead.

Even Jesus himself said nobody can come to the Father except by me, remember just after Jesus was Baptised by John, how the holy Spirit manifested itself as a Dove and a voice was heard from the heavens... this is my only begotton Son with whom I am well pleased.

Yes indeed God the Father, and Jesus his only begotton Son, born of a Woman.
The sons of Men and the Son of God share that in common, being born of a Woman.
Sometimes I wonder how anybody could believe otherwise, because Scripture constantly refers to Jesus as the only begotton Son of the living God, and if you do not believe what scripture plainly tells us..... then what is there left to say to those who do not believe the Gospel ?


Grace and Peace to you

 

[MrVersatile48]

John 1, Colossians 1 & Hebrews 1 are clear that Christ is the Almighty Creator in human form

John 1

The Word Became Flesh

1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning.

3Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4In him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood[a] it.

6There came a man who was sent from God; his name was John. 7He came as a witness to testify concerning that light, so that through him all men might believe. 8He himself was not the light; he came only as a witness to the light. 9The true light that gives light to every man was coming into the world.

10He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him. 11He came to that which was his own, but his own did not receive him. 12Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God 13children born not of natural descent,[c] nor of human decision or a husband's will, but born of God.

14The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only,[d] who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.


Col 1

The Supremacy of Christ

15He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him.

17He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. 18And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy. 19For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him

Hebrews 1 (New International Version)

The Son Superior to Angels

1In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe. 3The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word.

After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven. 4So he became as much superior to the angels as the name he has inherited is superior to theirs.
5For to which of the angels did God ever say,
"You are my Son;
today I have become your Father[a]"? Or again,
"I will be his Father,
and he will be my Son"[c]? 6And again, when God brings his firstborn into the world, he says,
"Let all God's angels worship him." 7In speaking of the angels he says,
"He makes his angels winds,
his servants flames of fire."[e]

8But about the Son he says,
"Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever,


Jesus said, "I & the Father are one" - John 10:30

"He who has seen Me has seen the Father" - John 14

He said, "Before Abraham was, I am"

Thomas said, "My Lord & my God" - Jesus accepted his worship

Jesus is called 'the Lord' because He is God incarnate

God bless!

Ian

 

[Poke]

No where in the Bible does it say God is A Christian..............

Here's the problem I see: If Jesus isn't God, then there are two gods - which is not acceptable (even if Jesus were just a demigod).

Who is Jesus, if not God? Who is the man who is uniquely "of God"? Who is this man through whom all things were created? Who is this man who is THE way of our salvation?

 

[Lewis]

How and when was the word "Christian" first used? The term 'Christian' was used to describe a follwer of Christ in terms of the world, from the world’s point of view. The pagans at Antioch called the apostles "Christians" first (Acts 11:26; 26:28) and used it derogatorily because the apostles didn’t follow the commercial world of the pagans. "Christian" is an adjective, not a noun. The substance is not in the word "Christian", the substance is in the heart of the man it is attempting to describe, and which the pagan user cannot see. Christ never called himself a Christian, Christ never called his followers Christians. The apostles never called each other Christians. Christ never used an adjective to describe himself. So how are we to identify ourselves then? The disciples called each other, "brethren", "disciples", "apostles", "servants", "believers", "followers", "the faithful", "the elect", "the called", and "saints." We can also identify ourselves as "bondservants" of Christ. But I see no harm in calling ourselves Christian' because it lets people know who we are.

 

[Spirit Driven]

Non Believers try to argue a dual nature of God, they always will because they are Non Believers, in the Gospel.
The Simple fact is Jesus really did die on the Cross at Calvary, and if his Father did not raise him from the Dead, he would still be dead today.

Remember God will send a delusion in the end times of this Eon, that delusion is already here for many.

Scripture plainly states in dozens of Instances that Jesus is the Son of the living God..... not God himself, a classic example was where Jesus prayed to God just before he raised Lazerus from the Dead..... read the scripture concerning this.... I should not have to be reminding you about the Gospel.


Grace and Peace to you

 

[Poke]

Scripture plainly states in dozens of Instances that Jesus is the Son of the living God..... not God himself, a classic example was where Jesus prayed to God just before he raised Lazerus from the Dead..... read the scripture concerning this.... I should not have to be reminding you about the Gospel.

You didn't answer my question. Who is Jesus? Is THE Son of God a mere man or another god? Or, is Jesus God?

Even if Jesus were a mere man, why pray to God? God knows what's in our hearts. I believe Jesus prayed to set an example for us. Christians believe that Jesus made himself a man, as such, he limited himself in many ways.

 

[jgredline]

J Vernon McGee says this;

The Gospel of John introduces the Lord Jesus Christ with three tremendous statements:

In the beginning was the Word,

And the Word was with God,

And the Word was God.

The Word is one of the highest and most profound titles of the Lord Jesus Christ. To determine the exact meaning is not easy. Obviously the Lord Jesus Christ is not the logos of Greek philosophy; rather He is the memra of the Hebrew Scriptures. Notice how important the Word is in the Old Testament. For instance, the name for Jehovah was never pronounced. It was such a holy word that they never used it at all. But this is the One who is the Word and, gathering up everything that was said of Him in the Old Testament, He is now presented as the One In the beginning. This beginning antedates the very first words in the Bible, In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. That beginning can be dated, although I do not believe that anyone can date it accuratelyit is nonsense to say that it is 4004 b.c., as Usshers dating has it. It probably goes back billions and billions of years. You see, you and I are dealing with the God of eternity. When you go back to creation He is already there, and that is exactly the way this is used in the beginning was the Word. Notice it is not is the Word; it was not in the beginning that the Word started out or was begotten. Was (as Dr. Lenske points out) is known as a durative imperfect, meaning continued action. It means that the Word was in the beginning. What beginning? Just as far back as you want to go. The Bible says, In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth (Gen. 1:1). Does that begin God? No, just keep on going back billions and trillions and squillions of years. I can think back to billions of years back of creationmaybe you can go beyond thatbut lets put down a point there, billions of years back of creation. He already was; He comes out of eternity to meet us. He did not begin. In the beginning was the Word He was already there when the beginning was. Well, somebody says, there has to be a beginning somewhere. All right, wherever you begin, He is there to meet you, He is already past tense. In the beginning was the Word five words in the original language, and there is not a man on topside of this earth who can put a date on it or understand it or fathom it. This first tremendous statement starts us off in space, you see.

The second statement is this, and the Word was with God. This makes it abundantly clear that He is separate and distinct from God the Father. You cannot identify Him as God the Father because He is with God. But, someone says, if He is with God, He is not God. The third statement sets us straight, and the Word was God. This is a clear, emphatic declaration that the Lord Jesus Christ is God. In fact, the Greek is more specific than this, because in the Greek language the important word is placed at the beginning of the sentence and it reads, God was the Word. That is emphatic; you cannot get it more emphatic than that. Do you want to get rid of the deity of Christ? My friend, you cannot get rid of it. The first three statements in Johns gospel tie the thing down. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Scofield says this;

1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. Word Gr. "Logos" (arm. "Memra," used in the Targums, or Heb. paraphrases, for God). The Greek term means, (1) a thought or concept; (2) the expression or utterance of that thought. As a designation of Christ, therefore, Logos is peculiarly felicitous because, (1) in Him are embodied all the treasures of the divine wisdom, the collective "thought" of God 1 Corinthians 1:24; Ephesians 3:11; Colossians 2:2,3 and, (2) He is from eternity, but especially in His incarnation, the utterance or expression of the Person, and "thought" of Deity John 1:3-5,9,14-18; 14:9-11; Colossians 2:9. In the Being, Person, and work of Christ, Deity is told out. 1:5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not. comprehended Or, apprehended; lit. "laid not hold of it."

http://www.pro4machineworks.com/The_doc ... S_GOD.html

 

[lovely]

Mr. V, good post, even though your Scriptures were ignored.

Poke, this was my thought exactly...

Poke wrote:

Here's the problem I see: If Jesus isn't God, then there are two gods - which is not acceptable (even if Jesus were just a demigod).

So true, especially since we know that Christ was/is worshipped, and we are free to do so.


J, I have great respect for the late Mr. McGee's teaching.

I think that the Eternal Covenant is ignored by those who do not believe that Christ is God...that would explain how His Father, through the Holy Spirit, raised Him from the dead. It also explains why satan tempted Christ the way he did. It also clearly explains who the arm of the LORD is and how He was/is able to be our High Priest, and Sacrifice.

 

[jgredline]

Mr. V, good post, even though your Scriptures were ignored.

Poke, this was my thought exactly...

Poke wrote:

Here's the problem I see: If Jesus isn't God, then there are two gods - which is not acceptable (even if Jesus were just a demigod).

So true, especially since we know that Christ was/is worshipped, and we are free to do so.


J, I have great respect for the late Mr. McGee's teaching.

I think that the Eternal Covenant is ignored by those who do not believe that Christ is God...that would explain how His Father, through the Holy Spirit, raised Him from the dead. It also explains why satan tempted Christ the way he did. It also clearly explains who the arm of the LORD is and how He was/is able to be our High Priest, and Sacrifice.

Actually Lovely
I read Mr V's post and also thought it was great, which is why I did not post many of the verses he quoted. :D
Thanks Mr V
and thanks Lovely

 

[Lewis]

I was just talking about the Christian comment made in the first post.

 

[WMD]

Did you know that Jesus was not a Christian either?

Isnt it funny how people start threads like this one.... ridiculous discussions used to spark a debate with the intention of starting heated arguments. Does anyone else notice this too, or am I reading between the lines too much?

 

[Gabbylittleangel]

No where in the Bible does it say God is A Christian..............

He is Soveriegn of All
He is the LORD of Hosts, he is God who does as he pleases in all the heavens and the Earth.... I say All Honor Power and Glory be to his name.

He is not a Christian though, that word is a Human term made up by men.
Scripture tells us many times and over and over Again that he is God the Father of Jesus his only begotton Son.

Nowhere in the Bible does it say God is Jesus, which is not so surprising really, or there would have been nobody to raise Jesus from the Dead.

Even Jesus himself said nobody can come to the Father except by me, remember just after Jesus was Baptised by John, how the holy Spirit manifested itself as a Dove and a voice was heard from the heavens... this is my only begotton Son with whom I am well pleased.

Yes indeed God the Father, and Jesus his only begotton Son, born of a Woman.
The sons of Men and the Son of God share that in common, being born of a Woman.
Sometimes I wonder how anybody could believe otherwise, because Scripture constantly refers to Jesus as the only begotton Son of the living God, and if you do not believe what scripture plainly tells us..... then what is there left to say to those who do not believe the Gospel ?


Grace and Peace to you

Hmm. This verse says that it was the Spirit that raised up Jesus from the dead.

Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

Ironically, the verse right before it, refers to Christ in you.

Rom 8:10 And if Christ [be] in you, the body [is] dead because of sin; but the Spirit [is] life because of righteousness.

and the one before that says the Spirit of God dwells in you:

Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

as do these:

1Cr 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and [that] the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

2Ti 1:14 That good thing which was committed unto thee keep by the Holy Ghost which dwelleth in us.

Then there is this one, that says that God dwelleth in us.

1Jo 4:12 No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.

Then there is this one that speaks of Christ dwelling in your heart:

Eph 3:17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,

So, we have the Spirit, God, and Christ dwelling in our hearts.

 

[scutato]

scutato's quick thoughts:

1. God is: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit

2. Jesus did not create everything. Notice that all the verses Mr. V pointed out said that BY Jesus or THROUGH Jesus all things were created. Without Him, nothing was created, but it was the Father or the Spirit (my personal thought is it was the Father) who created everything through Jesus. What does this mean? I have no idea.

3. Of course Jesus wasn't a Christian. He's the Christ, why would He worship Himself?

4. Jesus is worthy of worship, as He is God (as is the Father, and the Holy Spirit). We don't worship multiple gods. Jesus, the Father, and the Holy Spirit together are God. I'll look up some proof verses for it later when I'm less rushed

5. Finally, and this one's a shock when you really think about it: the Father has more authority than Jesus Christ. This is further proof that they're not identical beings, but separate.

Why?

1 Corinthians 15:24:

24Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

25For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

26The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

27For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.

28And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

 

[airdrop]

Since Spirit Driven ignored Mr V's scripture references, maybe this won't be ignored.

From the universalist bible itself:

John 1:1 "In the beginning was the word, and the word was toward God, and God was the word."

http://www.concordant.org/version/CLNT/004John/004John01.html

Spirit Driven, why the difference between your opinion, and the book you claim as correct?

 

[Poke]

John 1:1 "In the beginning was the word, and the word was toward God, and God was the word."

Instead of the CLNT, how about the New World Translation?

John 1:1 "In [the] beginning the Word was, and the Word was with God,
and the Word was a god."

How about the Inspired Version?

John 1:1 "In the beginning was the gospel preached through the Son. And the gospel was the word, and the word was with the Son, and the Son was with God, and the Son was of God."

Any Mormons in the house? Dude, that's whack. Fajizzle. Doesn't Joseph Smith know that Jesus was a son of a god? Someone get him a book on Mormonism.

 

[mutzrein]

Here we go again . . .

Somewhere in Romans: May the God who gives endurance and encouragement give you a spirit of unity among yourselves as you follow Christ Jesus, so that with one heart and mouth you may glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[Spirit Driven]

Scripture plainly states in dozens of Instances that Jesus is the Son of the living God..... not God himself, a classic example was where Jesus prayed to God just before he raised Lazerus from the Dead..... read the scripture concerning this.... I should not have to be reminding you about the Gospel.

You didn't answer my question. Who is Jesus? Is THE Son of God a mere man or another god? Or, is Jesus God?

Even if Jesus were a mere man, why pray to God? God knows what's in our hearts. I believe Jesus prayed to set an example for us. Christians believe that Jesus made himself a man, as such, he limited himself in many ways.

Jesus was given all power and authotirty in Heaven and on Earth when God raised him from the Dead, he is now seated at the right hand of God.

One day Jesus will hand the Kingdom over to the Father, after the restitution of all things, and be SUBJECT to the Father also.

Until that time comes Jesus has the Authority to rule... but he is not God.


Grace and Peace to you

 

[Spirit Driven]

Look People,
I have been given the notion to post this here from my heart ok.

First of all, I apolagise for calling anybody an unbeliever, if they believe that God and Jesus are the same person.... you are entitled to believe what you like..... because if your Faith is in Jesus Christ.... your my brother...end of story.

Why should I care if you choose to believe that he is also God, even though I believe scripture states the opposite.


Grace and Peace to each and every one of you.

 

[mutzrein]

Jesus was given all power and authotirty in Heaven and on Earth when God raised him from the Dead, he is now seated at the right hand of God.

Amen . . . and scripture tells us that God has placed all things under Jesus feet EXCEPT Himself.

 

[Poke]

Jesus was given all power and authotirty in Heaven and on Earth when God raised him from the Dead, he is now seated at the right hand of God.

Yes. But, you still have not answered this question: Is Jesus God, a god, or a man?