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I need help answering questions from an athiest

L

LeeLee

Guest
My cousin is an athiest and has been asking me about contradictions and inconsistencies in the bible. I'm not sure how to answer her. I have told her that in order to fully understand the word of God, she will need allow God to open her eyes. She says she doesn't understand that concept.

Here is her question:
I've never understood the concept that you must first believe in god in order to understand the bible and believe what it says. I would expect a divinely inspired book be perfectly written, free of contradictions internally and externally. But that's not what I see. I can't get past these hurdles. I'm asking you how you do because I'm genuinely curious to understand others perspectives. Your pastor, in this video is says the bible is the "Truth" and you can't cherry pick what you believe and follow. I want to know how you determine what is the truth, how do you move past these hurdles that I can't move past, when there are obviously so many contractions within the bible?

I had posted a video of a sermon my pastor did on Sunday. That is how this all came about. I really would like to help her but I'm unsure how to give her an answer she can understand. Please help me.
 
I struggled in this area at one time. In fact, I wrote an essay in college once about what I perceived as contradictions in the Bible. It wasn't until I sat down and read the entire Bible cover to cover that I finally began to recognize a change in my views. When you pick out specific verses they can often be taken out of context but when you study the whole of Scripture you begin to develop a deeper understanding of who God is relative to who we are. What I primarily began to understand was that God is above all, Creator of all, Almighty, Perfect, and He is the potter. Once I came to grips with this understanding, I began to look at God from an entirely different perspective.
 
She did. Here are some contradictions she sent me:


1. Matthew 2:15, 19 & 21-23 The infant Christ was taken into Egypt. Luke 2:22 & 39 The infant Christ was NOT taken to Egypt.

2.Has anyone ascended up to heaven? Elijah went up to heaven: "And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven." 2 Kings 2:11 "No man hath ascended up to heaven but he that came down from heaven, even the son of man." John 3:13 i
 
LeeLee said:
She did. Here are some contradictions she sent me:


1. Matthew 2:15, 19 & 21-23 The infant Christ was taken into Egypt. Luke 2:22 & 39 The infant Christ was NOT taken to Egypt.

2.Has anyone ascended up to heaven? Elijah went up to heaven: "And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven." 2 Kings 2:11 "No man hath ascended up to heaven but he that came down from heaven, even the son of man." John 3:13 i
Click to expand...
It is true that no one ascended into heaven, except for Christ. Elijah was taken up into heaven, meaning he did not do it on his own.
 
LeeLee said:
My cousin is an athiest and has been asking me about contradictions and inconsistencies in the bible. I'm not sure how to answer her. I have told her that in order to fully understand the word of God, she will need allow God to open her eyes. She says she doesn't understand that concept.
Click to expand...
Welcome to CF.net LeeLee. :wave2

Just a thought, but to learn math you need ears to hear, or eyes to read. The same is told us in Joh 3:3, Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. Without spiritual ears and eyes God’s kingdom doesn’t even make sense to them.

Faith is a quality of sense given us (Rom 12:3) to act upon the obvious (Rom 1:20) is paramount in things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen (Heb 11:1).

Rom 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Rom 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Heb 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
 
LeeLee said:
She did. Here are some contradictions she sent me:


1. Matthew 2:15, 19 & 21-23 The infant Christ was taken into Egypt. Luke 2:22 & 39 The infant Christ was NOT taken to Egypt.

2.Has anyone ascended up to heaven? Elijah went up to heaven: "And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven." 2 Kings 2:11 "No man hath ascended up to heaven but he that came down from heaven, even the son of man." John 3:13 i
Click to expand...

Your cousin did not get these verses studying things for themselves. Your cousin is getting these things from someone else, and wants to listen to and follow the wrong thing.

The Word of God has Zero contradictions. I don't answer the fool that thinks so, as the Word is spiritual discerned, and with a wrong heart, there is no getting through to a rock head. You can prove one thing, they have another.

The sorry thing is that if we listen to these rock heads, it might effect our own faith if we are not rooted in the Word. So something simple to explain, is not even seen by us, even though its right in front of us. This is what happens when we get wrapped up in the spirit of confusion.

The word says we are to compare spiritual with spiritual, (Scripture with scriptures) We just focus on one scripture, then we can get confused.

What did Jesus say:
If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?
(Joh 3:12)
And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.

Where is Jesus getting all this knowledge of Heavenly things? He came from Heaven, He has seen it, He knows it, and He is revealing it to us.

(Joh 8:23)
And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
(Joh 3:13)
Joh 6:62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?

What is Jesus saying here? No man has been in Heaven, came down to reveal what was seen, and ascended back up. Elijah or Enoch have not been back. Only Jesus has. Elijah did not come from Heaven either.

So no man has gone up to Heaven, that came from Heaven.

Not that complicated.

Mike.
 
@LeeLee Welcome to our fellowship, we are glad to have you.

Both Knotical and Brother Michael have given the understanding that I have of this scripture.

I will also add that Jesus is talking to a Jewish Pharisee. They had written some of the Talmud (oral law) at that time. Among the Jews was the belief that when Moses went up on Mt Sinai, that he had actually ascended into heaven to receive the Law from God and returned to give it to the people. Jesus may have been addressing this incorrect teaching, as well.
Adam Clarke's Commentary
 
Brother Mike said:
The Word of God has Zero contradictions. I don't answer the fool that thinks so, as the Word is spiritual discerned, and with a wrong heart, there is no getting through to a rock head. You can prove one thing, they have another.
Click to expand...


So, is that your advice to the OP, to not answer the rock head that for all we know is just a bit confused by something that can be genuinely confusing?

Brother Mike said:
Your cousin did not get these verses studying things for themselves. Your cousin is getting these things from someone else, and wants to listen to and follow the wrong thing.
Click to expand...

Where did you get this info you post as fact?
 
Kenny_ms said:
So, is that your advice to the OP, to not answer the rock head that for all we know is just a bit confused by something that can be genuinely confusing?



Where did you get this info you post as fact?
Click to expand...

Best to let me have it in a P.M, not a thread folks are seeking help in.
 
Brother Mike said:
Best to let me have it in a P.M, not a thread folks are seeking help in.
Click to expand...

This is concerning that help they are seeking so appropriate for the thread I think.

However, if you prefer not to answer that's up to you.
 
My experience: Google is your friend. Don't rely on outside sources to do your talking for you--because you can find anything to support any position you like on Google. BUT, it is also a useful research tool and you can look up and try to explore specific issues through it.
Have a conversation, talk about specific issues and points of concern.
 
questdriven said:
My experience: Google is your friend. Don't rely on outside sources to do your talking for you--because you can find anything to support any position you like on Google. BUT, it is also a useful research tool and you can look up and try to explore specific issues through it.
Have a conversation, talk about specific issues and points of concern.
Click to expand...

Agree, Google is a wonderful tool if used properly.

Don't believe everything you hear but hear everything and make your own judgment.

Not always, but sometimes I at least seriously consider what "most" believe and what just sounds right.
 
Theres no contradictions. I have done the test.

For example, in one gospel there was 1 angel and in the other there was 2 angels. Who is right? And is it contradiction.?. No. One witness seen 1 angel and another witness seen 2 angels. They both give the own seperate account of what they had seen.

If i seen 2 members on the forum and you come on 5 mins later and see 5 members we are both right with our own witness accounts.

Thats how the gospels work.
 
First link is the general search and there appear to be several opinions, or at least sites with info on this to choose from.

Second and third links, are just a couple of those sites.

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=2+Kings+2:11+contridiction

http://lukehistorians.com/?p=42
http://www.apologeticspress.org/apcontent.aspx?category=6&article=654

This gets to be a little like work I know but it is your cousin, so it may be worth sticking with them for a bit on this. We are after all talking eternity here, so what's a few minutes/hours in the scheme of things, but maybe that's why you stopped by, you know all that. :)

Get educated on what they ask and that education may be useful down the line too. You're the one talking to them and not us so you will better be able to determine their attitude and how to proceed.
 
And again the anger of the LORD was kindled against Israel, and he moved David against them to say, Go, number Israel and Judah.
(2Sa 24:1)

And Satan stood up against Israel, and provoked David to number Israel.
(1Ch 21:1)
 
Seems the LORD lets satan loose when hes angry, then ties him back up like a starving wolf when hes happy. satans on the LORDS leash given only limited powers from the Almighty.
 
kiwidan said:
Seems the LORD lets satan loose when hes angry, then ties him back up like a starving wolf when hes happy. satans on the LORDS leash given only limited powers from the Almighty.
Click to expand...

Wow, Scholars stumped for years, and all kinds of convoluted ideas about it. Here you come, and nail it.
Both scriptures are correct:

God is already Angry, Scripture does not really tell us why as there seems to be a gap there in the previous chapter. God must not have been to happy with David either. Through God's Judgement, the devil gets a place. So in effect through the Judgement, God is responsible, which caused Satan to entice David to number the troops. We see this effect in many places in the OT.

Thumbs up on that answer.
 
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