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Bible Study In My Fathers House.

Now, that's how to disagree! That kind of discussion seeds unity. Oh, I wish I was that well spoken, as chopper & the Sisters.

I have it in my heart, but not my fingertips.

I'll not post any rapture views which would derail the topic, but I will make the one point that, the great tribulation is not 7 years, but 3 1/2...

A good morning and blessings be upon you all today...:)
 
Hi Chopper
You can also look at those verses in different angles.
In John 14:2
Whom was He speaking to?
To His disciples,
He was speaking of His departure, His crucifixion...
Mansion, Strong's #3438, meaning abode, abide
As you read on you get the meaning, you cannot read just one verse.
John 14:16
Give you another Comforter, that He may abide with you forever.
John 14:17-21, 23
For He dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
I will not leave you comfortless I will come to you.
Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more, but ye see me, because I live, ye shall live also.
At that day ye shall know that I am in My Father, and ye in Me, and I in you.

If a man love Me, he will keep My words, and My Father will love him,
We will come unto him, and make Our abode with him.

This is not speaking about some secret rapture, if so the disciples would had gone.
You seen what they went through.

Rev.4:2-4
John was taken up in the Spirit, nothing about the church.
Jasper, sardine stone, rainbow, like unto an emerald.
Read Exodus 39:8-14, breastplate, 12 tribes of Israel....
Jasper, emerald, sardius..
Thus, I believe the other 12 are the 12 Apostles.
Signifying breast plates.
12 Patriarchs
12 Apostles
12 denotes Governmental perfection
Other numbers follow the laws which govern the smaller numbers, as being their factors, sums, products or multiplies, 24 is 12x2, a higher form of 12.

Parable of 10 virgins
You will find the Millennium temple in Ezek. Chapters 40-48
Here on Earth, Mt. Olive...
The 5 foolish had to go to where they buy and sell, the so called Anti Christ, receive the Mark..
Matt.25:10
And while the 5 foolish went to buy, the Bridegroom came.
And the door was shut...
Then them saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
Must be here not heaven...
Then of course, I know you not.
They became the harlot, spiritually.

I just don't see any rapture into it, my beliefs....

Hi again Diane. I've taken the time to study your take on this verse....Revelation 4:4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

My take on this verse is different than yours in that I believe it's speaking of the redeemed Believers in Christ Jesus and nothing to do with Israel or the Old Covenant. Here's why...."White Garments" God promised the Saints in Sardis that they would be clothed in white garments....Revelation 3:5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment.

Secondly, the "golden crowns". To the Church at Smyrna, Jesus promised the faithful in Revelation 2:10b...."be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life. This is what John is seeing here. Not Angels, or Israel. White garments and Crowns refer to New Covenant Believers in Christ Jesus.

You say, "Whom was He speaking to? To His disciples" I take that as you're implying that this is for ONLY the Disciples and not for all Believers....Look please at.... John 14:6 "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." That includes us in context.

There ya go. That's my take on these things. Bless you Diane. You're a true Servant of Jesus the Son of God and a wonderful Student of the Word of God. I love you! :hug
 
Now, that's how to disagree! That kind of discussion seeds unity. Oh, I wish I was that well spoken, as chopper & the Sisters.

I have it in my heart, but not my fingertips.

I'll not post any rapture views which would derail the topic, but I will make the one point that, the great tribulation is not 7 years, but 3 1/2...

A good morning and blessings be upon you all today...:)

You are right my good and old friend Edward. Boy, you and I go back some and I've always liked what comes from your heart. I know that you have a wealth of Truth in your wonderful heart that Jesus Himself put there. We all communicate differently, and in the Holy Spirit, He causes us to understand each other thru the eyes of Love and it comes out great.

I love you bunches my Dear Brother Edward. "O Lord Jesus, please bless your Servant Edward with a heart that can now communicate what great love that you have placed there for Your Glory, give Edward the words of expressed Love."
 
Hi again Diane. I've taken the time to study your take on this verse....Revelation 4:4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

My take on this verse is different than yours in that I believe it's speaking of the redeemed Believers in Christ Jesus and nothing to do with Israel or the Old Covenant. Here's why...."White Garments" God promised the Saints in Sardis that they would be clothed in white garments....Revelation 3:5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment.

Secondly, the "golden crowns". To the Church at Smyrna, Jesus promised the faithful in Revelation 2:10b...."be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life. This is what John is seeing here. Not Angels, or Israel. White garments and Crowns refer to New Covenant Believers in Christ Jesus.

You say, "Whom was He speaking to? To His disciples" I take that as you're implying that this is for ONLY the Disciples and not for all Believers....Look please at.... John 14:6 "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." That includes us in context.

There ya go. That's my take on these things. Bless you Diane. You're a true Servant of Jesus the Son of God and a wonderful Student of the Word of God. I love you! :hug
Very interesting..
But the difference I believe is the timing,
Rev.4:1 I believe it refers to the Lord's Day, the millennium.
This is John's future.
Rev.4:2
I was in the Spirit..
Rev.1:10
I was in the Spirit on the Lord's Day....
The Day of the Lord...
Yes, I agree He was speaking to us also, but He was speaking to His disciples also.

Also you quoted Rev.2:10
Be faithful unto death....no rapture
Rev.3:5
He that overcometh....
Overcometh what? The tribulation? No rapture...
In Rev.6:9 it states, he saw the souls of them that were slain for the Word of God...
Rev.6:11
And white robes were given unto every one of them....no rapture
Rev.19:8
To her was granted that she be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white, for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.
Rev.3:18
I counsel thee to buy of Me gold tried in the fire..and white raiment, that thou may be clothed, that the shame of thou nakedness do not appear.

Tried in the fire..

2Peter 3:8-12
10, but the Day Of The Lord will come as a thief in the night..The elements ( evil rudiments) shall melt with fervent heat, the earth and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
1
Cor.3:13,14
Every man's work shall be manifest, for the Day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire, and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
If any man's work abide, he shall receive a reward....

God is a consuming fire...

Rev.11:18
Saints get their reward....
The 7th and last trump, after the 2 witnesses are killed.

How, I see things anyways....
Love ya in Christ
 
Now, that's how to disagree! That kind of discussion seeds unity. Oh, I wish I was that well spoken, as chopper & the Sisters.

I have it in my heart, but not my fingertips.

I'll not post any rapture views which would derail the topic, but I will make the one point that, the great tribulation is not 7 years, but 3 1/2...

A good morning and blessings be upon you all today...:)

Edward, I think the same of you as I do Chopper :hug
Yes, it has been shorten..
As you see in Rev.12:14 ----3 1/2
But I believe it has been shorten to 5 months, lol, the tribulation:
Rev.9:5
Love ya in Christ
 
I was in the Spirit on the Lord's Day....
The Day of the Lord...
The Day of the LORD has nothing to do with the Lord's Day (the Christian day of worship and rest). The Day of the LORD corresponds to the Great Tribulation and the awful judgements of the 7th seal.
 
The Day of the LORD has nothing to do with the Lord's Day (the Christian day of worship and rest). The Day of the LORD corresponds to the Great Tribulation and the awful judgements of the 7th seal.
Do you have scripture for that?
You talking about the Sabbath?
 
Do you have scripture for that?
DAY OF THE LORD
Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the LORD cometh, for it is nigh at hand; A day of darkness and of gloominess, a day of clouds and of thick darkness, as the morning spread upon the mountains: a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after it, even to the years of many generations... The earth shall quake before them; the heavens shall tremble: the sun and the moon shall be dark, and the stars shall withdraw their shining: And the LORD shall utter his voice before his army: for his camp is very great: for he is strong that executeth his word: for the day of the LORD is great and very terrible; and who can abide it? (Joel 2:1,2,10,11).

THE LORD'S DAY

I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.
Matthew Henry's comments:
The day and time in which he had this vision: it was the Lord’s day,the day which Christ had separated and set apart for himself, as the eucharist is called the Lord’s supper. Surely this can be no other than the Christian sabbath, the first day of the week, to be observed in remembrance of the resurrection of Christ. Let us who call him our Lord honour him on his own day, the day which the Lord hath made and in which we ought to rejoice. 4. The frame that his soul was in at this time: He was in the Spirit. He was not only in a rapture when he received the vision, but before he received it; he was in a serious, heavenly, spiritual frame, under the blessed gracious influences of the Spirit of God. God usually prepares the souls of his people for uncommon manifestations of himself, by the quickening sanctifying influences of his good Spirit. Those who would enjoy communion with God on the Lord’s day must endeavour to abstract their thoughts and affections from flesh and fleshly things, and be wholly taken up with things of a spiritual nature.II. The apostle gives an account of what he heard when thus in the Spirit.
 
John 14:1 "Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also."


O my friends. Lets bask in the glorious promise of Jesus the Son of God. Over the past forty years of being a bond Servant of Christ Jesus, I have attended to many who were ready to leave this world to go home to be with their Savior.

There have been those who had no fear at all. Those Saints had been faithful to study God's Word regularly and to attend a good Gospel preaching Church that preached not only the Gospel and repentance from dead works but taught the whole council of God. They were ready to go.

Others who did not have the background of such a wonderful relationship with their Lord Jesus, did not have that joy of entering into what Jesus had prepared for them. As a result, I often quoted these verses to them and the Holy Spirit did minister to them.

Are you ready this day to move from this life to the next? Scripture says....
James 4:13 Go to now, ye that say, To day or to morrow we will go into such a city, and continue there a year, and buy and sell, and get gain:
4:14 Whereas ye know not what shall be on the morrow. For what is your life? It is even a vapour, that appeareth for a little time, and then vanisheth away."


O friends, our life could be snuffed out today from a heart attack or other physical trauma. An accident on the highway going to work could happen. A soldier on foreign soil could die from a sniper's bullet. We are not promised another day here. Are you ready"

Lets look at a verse in Revelation....
Revelation 4:2 "And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.
4:3 And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald.
4:4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold."


Theologians have argued in favor of several interpretations of these twenty four Elders. Keeping with Christian wording, Elders are not angels or Israel. They are believers in Christ Jesus and are seated where His Throne is in Heaven, more than likely, the New Jerusalem before it comes to the new earth. These are the raptured Saints who will behold the Tribulation period and the saving of Israel by the 144,000.

I point this out because as John see's it, the promise of entering the Kingdom of God is a reality. The rapture is a reality, and to die and go on to be with Jesus is a reality.

O my friends. lets all get more serious about our relationship with Christ Jesus and stimulate our spirituality with consistent Bible study and prayer. Lets take the parable of the 10 virgins as an example....

Matthew 25:1 "Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.
25:2 And five of them were wise, and five were foolish.
25:3 They that were foolish took their lamps, and took no oil with them:
25:4 But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps.
25:5 While the bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept.
25:6 And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.
25:7 Then all those virgins arose, and trimmed their lamps.
25:8 And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.
25:9 But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves.
25:10 And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.
25:11 Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
25:12 But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.
25:13 Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh."

This is a very serious parable. Only half of those who wanted to be united with Jesus were ready. In my mind, I believe that the "oil" represents the Holy Spirit which is very active in those who have regular Bible study, devotions, Church attendance, and other fellowship with believers who are ready to meet Jesus the Son of God. Lets be like the five virgins who were ready.
Thank you for this post. It is attractive to my heart and I want to be READY!
 
Actually John 14:1-4 itself presents a pre-Tribulation Rapture, so Chopper is spot on. Let's take a closer look.
Let not your heart be troubled: = there is no Tribulation period for the saints of God. The trials and afflictions of the saints are not the same as the judgement of the unbelieving and ungodly during the Tribulation period (Daniel's 70th week).
ye believe in God, believe also in me. = Jesus is God, so to believe in Christ is to be Rapture ready
In my Father's house are many mansions = mansions to be in the New Jerusalem, which is the eternal home of the saints, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit
if it were not so, I would have told you = we must believe Christ regarding this without the shadow of a doubt
I go to prepare a place for you = Christ is the firstfruits of the resurrection of the Church, therefore He is preparing a place in the New Jerusalem
And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again
= an absolute guarantee that Christ will come FIRST for His saints at the Rapture, then WITH His saints at the Revelation.
and receive you unto myself = Jesus descends PERSONALLY for His saints at the Rapture. But He sends forth His angels to gather the elect (believing Jewish remnant) at His Second Coming (Mt 24:31).
that where I am, there ye may be also = where is Christ? Seated at the right hand of the Father in Heaven. Therefore where will the saints be eternally? Around the throne of God.
Hallelujah!!!
 
DAY OF THE LORD
Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the LORD cometh, for it is nigh at hand; A day of darkness and of gloominess, a day of clouds and of thick darkness, as the morning spread upon the mountains: a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after it, even to the years of many generations... The earth shall quake before them; the heavens shall tremble: the sun and the moon shall be dark, and the stars shall withdraw their shining: And the LORD shall utter his voice before his army: for his camp is very great: for he is strong that executeth his word: for the day of the LORD is great and very terrible; and who can abide it? (Joel 2:1,2,10,11).

THE LORD'S DAY

I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.
Matthew Henry's comments:
That still doesn't confirm it was on the Sabbath.
Heard a trumpet....
Just confirms to me it is the day of the Lord.
The 7th trump, the last, the kingdoms of our Lord, and of His Christ.Rev.11:15
Reward the saints, Rev.11:18


1Cor.15:52, at the last trump
1Thess.4:16, for the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven.......
And with the trump of God.
 
No claim to be a greek scholar not even close.. I will say just using Strong's one could read John 14 :2 to say In My Father's family are positions : if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

We all know the passage: Let not your heart be troubled. You believe in God, believe also in Me. In My Father's house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, so that where I am, you may be also. Jn 14:1-3

The word for Mansion here “mona” (μοναι) in Greek is a place, an abode. The 1611 King James romantic English translators must have thought, “The ultimate, the best abode is a mansion and being with God would be just that “the best”. Their idea was right.
When thinking on this I ask, What is God’s HOUSE?
Isa 57:15 Says, For so says the high and lofty One who inhabits eternity; whose name is Holy;
If God’s house is eternity Jn 14:2 could read.

In eternity the dwelling of, God There is a place for ME!

And as we look at that place the story only gets better and better. ”Oykeeah” (οικια) in Greek is the home of a family. The Majesty of the Self-existent Holy God made a place for me but so much more than a dwelling in eternity. He made a place for me in the Family of God.

Ro 8:14-17 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.For you have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear, but you have received the Spirit of adoption by which we cry, “Father My Father!”

The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are the children of God. And if we are children, then we are heirs; heirs of God and joint-heirs with Christ; so that if we suffer with Him, we may also be glorified together.

14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
 
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