Is homosexuality really that bad?

[Pebbles]

][/B] There's also the idea that we Christians shouldn't try to govern the way non-Christians live. We should be more concerned about those within the church. We should stand out from society. On the other hand, if we must decide whether or not to support legislation to make homosexual marriages legal, I will always vote against it because I could never in good conscience support it.

Homosexuality is wrong for God's people. We have no place telling non-Christians what they should do and not do. They in turn shouldn't tell us how to control matters within our Church.

Muslims Marry Jews marry, Confucians marry, Buddists marry, marriage existed before the time of Jesus, yet it's apparently modern christianity that holds a monopoly on it's definition.

Thing is they arn't telling you to perform gay marriages, nobody is going to force your church to perform ceremonies that you aren't comfortable or would violate your moral code. doing I don't understand where such misinformation comes from... they will go elsewhere to other churches, or secular registers what these laws are about is the state recognizing those unions as valid. It's not an interference in your church at all.


You'd vote against it simply because you can? That's basically it isn't it? whenever an opportunity to harm another arises you take it.

I honestly expect no different.

If it was somehow compelling you to perform those ceremonies or be part of them I'd understand your open hostility. but it dosen't it's not a part of your church.


Roles reversed is your attitude what you'd want to see in others reflected at you?

If there was a law targeting and attacking Christians and excluding them from some function work or freedom of religion, would you rather I vote based on the liberal principle.
"Everyone has a right to believe whatever they choose to even if I strongly disagree with it"

or rather indulge that vindictive emotive hurt part of myself that says.
"I hate them I want them to hurt bleed and cry like I have to."

 

[Rhea]

Rhea, this topic has so many angles, no one conversation could include all the implications. I disagree with the main point of your post, but I agree with most of what you said.

Same here. I agree with most of what you've said.

Yes, I agree that gossip, hatred and slander are examples of things that eat destructively at our society, and our society's marriages with great destruction. Much MUCH more so than whether gays exist, cohabit or are married. I would so love to add my voice to any organization who thought those things should be made into a target of positive propaganda. And just general meanness, too. That "outrage" and "flaming" kind of behavior.

I agree with you that society does not benefit when religion try to tell the non-religious how to behave, while there are still problems within the religion. Though I don't see why voting for the thing that you say you don't support helps. It still ends up governing the non-christians to be forced to behave as Christians, no matter how you slice it. It's not "supporting" it to let non-christians live as non-christians, in my opinion, but I can see that others think it is.

And I agree completely with the idea of having churches administer a Church union. That makes good sense and would provide a nice thing for the congregation to make it special again because outside of homosexuality, it's already mostly a legal meaning and homosexual marriages don't really change that. It seems like a logical thing for churches, mosques and synagogues to do.

But as I said, my opposition to marriage isn't about saving people from sin. I think you're missing the mark when you claim this is what we are trying to do.

Fair enough. I was going on the "I can't condone it" theme that I hear which sounds like they are saying that allowing gay marriage makes them a party to the sin somehow.

I don't think atheists have a horse in this race anyway. If we're just the result of globs of gue, then homosexuality, murder, rape or anything else is not inherently wrong.

You are mistaken if you think atheists have no categories of right and wrong just because they do not create them from a religious perspective. There are other ways to arrive at society-wide mores and the atheists have been successfully doing this for millennia. You can see this by the fact that most atheists do not run out and commit rape and murder. That is another topic, and an interesting one, but just taking the obvious evidence from society, atheists live quite sociably ~however they do it~ and very definitely have a horse in the race of the civil rights of our fellow citizens.

 

[Adstar]

I'm from New York.

Last week in New York, gay marriage became legal. There were celebration in the streets of Manhattan. They were on the magnitude of when Obama was elected. It was a very cheerful scene, like we just won WWII all over again.

...I feel like I should celebrate with them.

My question:
As a Christian, I know homosexuality is bad, but is it really that bad?

All sin is bad. Anyone who sins and does not have the forgiveness through the Messiah Jesus shall not be forgiven. That’s very serious indeed.

I know the bible verses that condemns homosexuality as a sin. I understand the reasoning behind why it's condemned.

Do you?

But to the same token, so are many other sins. So why are Christians so against homosexuality? at least strongly against it becoming legal?

Christians are against all sin.

Now my stance is as far as the laws of the governments of the world are concerned i do not care what laws they bring in. As i do not see the governments of this world to have anything to do with God but only to do with politics of popular opinion and elitists special interests.

But the reason why there is such a reaction to state declaring homosexuality to be ok is that it undermines the Christian message that homosexuality is a sin. You do not see Christians protesting in the streets passionately advocating that murder is sin. why? Because the state and the general community agree that murder is wrong. therefore there is no sense of urgency within the Christian community to take such action.

But the current push in society in regard to homosexuality is the push designed to put societies stamp of approval on the homosexual lifestyle, to pronounce it OK. Christian feel moved to react against this push, Christians must reveal that homosexuality is sin, if they do not then people will not seek the atonement of there sins through the Messiah Jesus because of this sin.

There are so many other sins in the bible, why is this one so special that we choose to fight so hard from becoming legal?

Because the Legal status puts into the minds of the general population that it is not wrong/sin. This is in direct conflict with the Christian belief that the Homosexual act is wrong/sin.

If our reasoning is that this is a sin, then shouldn't we also fight to make marriage infidelity illegal? or other religions? or dishonor parents? or even lying?

Once again as a Christian i do not care about what the laws of the state are. in the examples you give above the important thing is that the general society still looks upon infidelity as wrong/sin, they also believe that children behaving badly towards there parents is wrong and lying is wrong. So therefore Christians do not feel the need to launch campaigns on these issues that are generally accepted by the wider community as sin.

My guess to why is homosexuality is easy to not-do. As human (sinful) nature, we love to pick out the fault of someone else that our-self is not guilty of. This attitude of "I'm not sinning like you" or in essence "I'm holier than thou" is actually arrogance, which is a sin.

Some may be motivated by such attitudes but sadly they are self delusional if they believe they are without Sin. But as i stated before the Main reason i believe there is such a strong reaction to the issue of Homosexual lifestyle is the strong belief among Christians that sin must be recognised as sin before one can seek forgiveness for such sin. When forces in society seeks to establish that a sin clearly defined in the scriptures is not sin Christians are moved to resist such a movement and continue to resist no matter what the laws of state are.

So in a way, it's actually a sin to fight against gay marriage. We complain about the sawdust in their eye, we didn't notice the plank in ours?

People should acknowledge their own sin to God. This is true. But the faults in an individual does no justify the faults in another.

It seems having Christians fight strongly against gay marriage being legal actually pushes society into allowing it to be legal. It makes the pro gay marriage party seem like the victim. Also, there is no concrete proof that gay marriage is bad for anyone other than from our own source (the bible).

Any thoughts?

The "gay community" is actually a victim of the groups seeking to have their lifestyle accepted as good. As a Christian i believe all sins (apart from blasphemy of the Holy Spirit) are forgivable through the Messiah Jesus. But a person who has been lead to believe that s sin is not sin will never seek forgiveness for that sin, because they do not recognise it as sin.

The movement that seeks to establish acceptance of the homosexual lifestyle is actually (knowingly or not) seeking to eternal damnation of homosexuals.

Christians who seek to establish in the wider community the acceptance that the homosexual lifestyle is sin are actually seeking the Eternal salvation of Homosexuals.

So those who seem to be for them are actually bringing about there eternal death. And those who would seem to be against them are actually seeking to save them for eternal Life.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[tiwtiwtiw]

protecting the sanctity of marriage

Here's a thought, polygamy is allowed in bible and yet illegal. Should Christians protest to government to make polygamy legal? Are we the ones defining what is sanctity of marriage or is God?

 

[tiwtiwtiw]

...

So then yes, it is that bad. Don't have much disagreemnt on that with me.

Now what should we do? Is it worse for Christians to go after it so harshly?

Deeper question: Is there such thing as different severity levels for different sins?

What did I leave out?

Haha, there's probably a few thousands that you left out. But your point is still well received.

So I think his point was, why this one? Why all the effort on this ONE sin? And does the focus on the one sin represent something worth examining in the self, namely, am I focusing on the one sin that it's easy for me to not be guilty of so that I don't have to think about any logs in my eye while I'm opposing it.

Yes that was my point too.

Who is the better friend?

Very good example. Father is wise.

In our current situation, we're not debating if gay marriage is good or bad. As a Christian's perspective: it is bad. The reason for "is it that bad?" is referring to how Christians handles this sin.

So from your scenario, we're really talking about what's the proper way to take the car key from your friend and drive him/er home (not if we should do it or not).

Currently, it seems like we're breaking their legs, then drive away in their car leaving them crawling home. We are so focused on "drunk driving is bad" that we're willing to do whatever it takes as long as s/he is not techincally drunk while driving. Even if it means causeing other problems.

So how does Jesus deal with it? The woman caught adultery that was about to be stoned... Today's Christians behaves more like the crowed who condems the woman rather than Jesus. Jesus was full of forgiveness and love. He did not have anger against the woman but instead judged the crowed with the famous "he who is without sin cast the first stone" We don't know if the woman changed her life afterwards or just went right back into whoring. But the bible didn't say because that wasn't important. The important part is what Jesus made the crowd realize.

try to make laws to force them to obey Christianity because it's for their own good!"

This reminds me of incidences in history where people were tortured to forced beleive in Jesus. Their defense is "We're hurting their body in order to save their soul. We're doing this for God" Do you think Jesus would praise their actions?

Would you, as a Christian, be happy if this was allowed in the church.

Well... it's already allowed in several states. Besides, what's important is not how happy I am but how happy God is with me at dealing with this. At least from the adultary woman bible story above, God would not want me to be like the crowd.

 

[tiwtiwtiw]

Again, not looking for a debate

Haha... seems like you've had prior experiences expressing these thoughts and sparked annoying endless debates. I know how that feels.

protestution should be legal too?

!!! That's something else I was wondering. But that's really off topic. Maybe I'll ask that in a different thread...

murder, steeling, lieing (sometimes) self abuse ( thinking of drugs) DUI

Yes, it seems like what is legal or not is more cultrual than biblical. Meaning, if the current culture finds something unacceptable in socieity, then it's illegal. So cultrually, homosexuality is becoming more accepted, then it's only natrual that it's made legal. Wouldn't that mean Christians shouldn't take this personally since the law never intended to follow biblical law in the first place?

All men and women are free to pursue life as they need be as long as life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness of others is not infringed.

I agree with this. The fact that us two agree, still only makes this our opinion. We can't force this belief on everyone. Otherwise, we would be just like those we disagree with. Paradoxal isn't it?

God himself!

I do agree. However, saying "this is bad because God says so" to an Atheist is not going to convince anyone of anything. In my experience, that usually just let the atheist think you're unwilling to see from their perspective. In return, why should they see from yours?

I like to refer to the example of the woman caught in adultery...

YES! I was thinking this too, see previous post.

And there are many "gays" that are good & giving people

Reminds me of how the bible tells Christians that we are saved by grace. Which in other words, we are sinful people but saved anyway. I often think, if we are saved by deeds, I am way behind in good deeds. No doubt less than the "gays" that you mentioned.

The answer is NO to those ppl being bad

Well good or bad is relative and subjective. I was using "bad" relative to "sin" Is it a sin? Yes, so therefore it's "bad" However, relatively speaking, there are many gay people who are leaps and bounds better than I, so relative to me, they are REALLY GOOD!

 

[tiwtiwtiw]

Adstar,

First off, appreciate your response. It made me think. I like people who are rational and have reasoning behind their claims. I am emotional at times, so I will try my best to respond rationally as well, please forgive me if I step over the line. here goes:

All sin is bad

So you're saying it's not that bad then? Because if they are all equally bad, then homosexuality is not worse than any other sin.

As I do not see the governments of this world to have anything to do with God but only to do with politics of popular opinion and elitists special interests.

I agree that's how governments work. So since that's the case, why even bother fighting for Christian morals in law? You're saying it's a lost cause. Is it just to say "we fought" so our conscience is clean?

But the current push in society in regard to homosexuality is the push designed to put societies stamp of approval

So what that Society puts approval stamps on it?

Jews don't eat pork, but pork is legal to eat. Pork is approved in socieity. Jews are not protesting to make pork meat illegal. Are Christians so easily influenced by socieity? So in order to keep this sin away from Christians, we must ban it in socieity? Are Christians really that weak? Can't we be more like the Jews with pork? Have a firm establishment of this is what we believe and keep it.

Everyone knows Jews don't eat pork. Didn't need a law to make everyone aware this is what Jews beleive.

Are you saying when society says it's ok means Christians says it's ok?

Because the Legal status puts into the minds of the general population that it is not wrong/sin. This is in direct conflict with the Christian belief that the Homosexual act is wrong/sin.

So Christians rely on law status to tell the population what we beleive in? Why can't we just tell the population ourselves?

...general society still looks upon infidelity as wrong/sin...

Since all sin are bad ...and they are all equal... then the sin of homosexuals equals sin of lying. Have you ever lied?

if yes, doesn't that make you same as homosexuals in the eyes of God?

Then how can one homosexual say to another "you're sinning!"

The "gay community" is actually a victim of the groups seeking to have their lifestyle accepted as good.

The "gay community" already thinks their lifestyle is good. Christians have always said homosexuality is bad. A change in law would change this?

I haven't met any gay person who thought their lifestyle is a sin and seeks forgiveness. Don't think a change of law would change that thinking.

But the faults in an individual does no justify the faults in another.

Doesn't the bible says do not judge one another? I think the point of what Jesus's message is love, not condem. In other words, focus on your own sins, quit picking on others. ...because you are just like them!

When one realize one's just as bad as a murder, one stop condeming the murder's sin. Jesus said just by having hate in your heart, you have committed murder. Jesus said just by lusting, you have committed adultery. We are just like the homosexuals. How can we turn to them and say "you're bad" when we are just as bad? This is why we are saved by grace. Grace is only given to the undeserved. If you deserve it, it's no longer grace. Our sins are forgiven, so how can we turn around and critisize other's sins? Like Jesus said about the one who owes money and had his debt forgiven. But later turns around and make someone who owes him money pay.

My point is, a Christian's main focus on eliminating sin should be on their own sin and no one else's. In this case, quit picking on the gays and let them be. We can only try to convince them our believes, forcing them is not the way. It's not what Jesus would want us to do.

Like the saying "you have to quit smoking first before you fight 2nd hand smoke"

 

[Rhea]

But the reason why there is such a reaction to state declaring homosexuality to be ok is that it undermines the Christian message that homosexuality is a sin. You do not see Christians protesting in the streets passionately advocating that murder is sin. why? Because the state and the general community agree that murder is wrong. therefore there is no sense of urgency within the Christian community to take such action.

But the current push in society in regard to homosexuality is the push designed to put societies stamp of approval on the homosexual lifestyle, to pronounce it OK. Christian feel moved to react against this push, Christians must reveal that homosexuality is sin, if they do not then people will not seek the atonement of there sins through the Messiah Jesus because of this sin.

But in the context of the OP, this doesn't make any sense as the be-all and end all of Christian efforts to make illegal something that could endanger a soul by allowing non-Christians to think it's not a sin (think about that sentence for a sec...).

Because by that logic, you should be protesting HARDER to make the American Atheists and Freedom From Religion Foundation illegal. You should make blasphemous cartoons illegal ASAP! Because mocking the holy spirit is much more dire for the soul than homosexuality.

Yet, you don't care. Nobody's claiming that it is a Christian's job to legislate a ban on Holy Ghost-mocking cartoons. No one is donating money to get constitutional amendments for it.

So many other things that society does NOT agree with you on ("you" general - christians who feel legislation of christian sins is appropriate to force non-christians to follow christian mores), and you do not protest them.

The OP question of "why," I, think is very very interesting.
Why ban homosexuality under the logic that it shows people not to think it's okay, but not ban
- atheist societies and their advertising
- anti god cartoons
- business on Sundays (everyone is thinking it's okay!! Even Christians!!!!!)
- atheist marriages
- material possessions
etc

Because the Legal status puts into the minds of the general population that it is not wrong/sin. This is in direct conflict with the Christian belief that the Homosexual act is wrong/sin.

And the legal status of the above put it in the mind of the population that it's not wrong/sin to mock the holy ghost, do business on Sundays, be atheist. (Not to mention wear cotton/linen blends and serve goat braised in goat milk!)

Once again as a Christian i do not care about what the laws of the state are.

Except to the extent that you will use them to force non-christians to follow Christianity, force them to accept your belief that it's a sin?

But as i stated before the Main reason i believe there is such a strong reaction to the issue of Homosexual lifestyle is the strong belief among Christians that sin must be recognised as sin before one can seek forgiveness for such sin. When forces in society seeks to establish that a sin clearly defined in the scriptures is not sin Christians are moved to resist such a movement and continue to resist no matter what the laws of state are.

Unless it's the sin of blasphemy, then they are not moved.
Unless it's the sin of defiling the sabbath, then they are not moved.
Unless it's the sin of pre-marital sex, then they are not moved.

The "gay community" is actually a victim of the groups seeking to have their lifestyle accepted as good. As a Christian i believe all sins (apart from blasphemy of the Holy Spirit) are forgivable through the Messiah Jesus. But a person who has been lead to believe that s sin is not sin will never seek forgiveness for that sin, because they do not recognise it as sin.

So one might expect you to lead a campaign to make blasphemy of the holy spirit illegal so that people won't be moved to lose their soul to eternal damnation because society's "free speech" tells them it's not a sin?

Christians who seek to establish in the wider community the acceptance that the homosexual lifestyle is sin are actually seeking the Eternal salvation of Homosexuals.

So those who seem to be for them are actually bringing about there eternal death. And those who would seem to be against them are actually seeking to save them for eternal Life.

As you are bringing about the eternal death of thousands by not seeking to outlaw the "religious humor" section of atheist message boards. Only moreso, because there's no repentance on it.
...

Do you see why it is confusing for Christians to focus on this ONE sin? There are many many others that society says are okay, with not a peep from the Christian community.

"Covet your neighbor's goods" is the foundation of free-market capitalism and the advertising industry seeking to make us covet things so we'll go buy them. We all think it's great to react to an ad and covet the good!! Head on down to the mall and sin.

 

[Adstar]

Adstar,

First off, appreciate your response. It made me think. I like people who are rational and have reasoning behind their claims. I am emotional at times, so I will try my best to respond rationally as well, please forgive me if I step over the line. here goes:


So you're saying it's not that bad then? Because if they are all equally bad, then homosexuality is not worse than any other sin.

No matter what the varying damage/hurt that happens in this life that stems from sin. In the end all unforgiven sin has the same eternal result. So while stealing a pen from a workplace and murdering a bystander on the street have far different effects on the community and individuals. On an eternal level stealing a pen from work will end it eternal separation from God if it is unforgiven, same with murdering another human being.

So yes all sin is equally bad in the eternal scheme of things if unforgiven.

And no different sins have varyingly different impacts upon people in this life.

I agree that's how governments work. So since that's the case, why even bother fighting for Christian morals in law? You're saying it's a lost cause. Is it just to say "we fought" so our conscience is clean?

Personally do not "fight" to make the laws of God the laws of the state. But if the state is wise and wants to run a state that produces good outcomes it will seek to mimic the laws of God and make similar laws part of its laws.

What i do is reveal sin no matter what the laws of the state are. I stand on what God has revealed to me through the scriptures no matter what. If the state decides in the future that my message is "hate speech" i will take what ever penalty the state enforces upon me even if that become the death penalty. If the homosexual justification movement thinks that establishing their views as laws of the state will silence people who believe God they are deluding themselves. Irrespective of the laws of state Christian will stand up for the teachings of God.

So what that Society puts approval stamps on it?

Jews don't eat pork, but pork is legal to eat. Pork is approved in socieity. Jews are not protesting to make pork meat illegal.

I don't mind if Jews stand on the street corner and declare pork to be unclean. I don't mind if they buy air time on TV networks and have promotional adds stating as such.

Remember your talking with me now. I have already stated that i do not care what the state decides on the laws it establishes. I do not talk for those who are seeking to pressurise the enactment of laws or the rescinding of laws.

Are Christians so easily influenced by socieity? So in order to keep this sin away from Christians, we must ban it in socieity? Are Christians really that weak? Can't we be more like the Jews with pork? Have a firm establishment of this is what we believe and keep it.

We Christians are a out going Faith. That means sharing our message is part of our faith. We are called upon to give a message that reveals sin and reveals the One who is offering atonement for that sin and eternal life. Now if we are faced with a society that is going down the path of redefining sins as not being sins, we are dealing with a society that is out to undermine one of the steps we believe is important in others coming to accept the atonement of the Messiah Jesus. People must believe they have a problem before they will embrace the solution. What the homosexual justification movement is doing is seeking to remove from the minds of people the reality of the sin of homosexuality. Therefore seeking to remove homosexuals from the atonement of the Messiah Jesus.

I don't make these statements as a way of defending/protecting Christians. Christians believe God so they do not need protecting. I state these things because i want to see non-Christians convicted of their sins and saved through the Atonement of the Messiah Jesus.

Everyone knows Jews don't eat pork. Didn't need a law to make everyone aware this is what Jews beleive.

Well we know that some who claim to be Christian and some Organizations that claim to be Christians are part of the homosexual justification movement. So things are not so clear to the wider community, That's another resion Christians must speak out on this issue.

Are you saying when society says it's ok means Christians says it's ok?

Some do. Some stand with Scriptures, some twist scripture or deny scripture to fit in with the state.

So Christians rely on law status to tell the population what we beleive in? Why can't we just tell the population ourselves?

We do.

Since all sin are bad ...and they are all equal... then the sin of homosexuals equals sin of lying. Have you ever lied?

Yes i have lied. But thankfully i acknowledge that lying is sin and i trust in the salvation of the Messiah Jesus. But a homosexual convinced by the homosexual justification movement that his homosexual lifestyle is good will never acknowledge it as sin and will never have the salvation of the Messiah Jesus.

if yes, doesn't that make you same as homosexuals in the eyes of God?

Then how can one homosexual say to another "you're sinning!"

Of course a homosexual can say to me when i have lied "you are sinning". And i would acknowledge my lie as such.

The "gay community" already thinks their lifestyle is good. Christians have always said homosexuality is bad. A change in law would change this?

No. i know there are homosexuals who are not at peace with their lifestyle. I know there are homosexuals who realise there is something wrong. There are however some who are on the borderline, who are uncertain, or not yet firmly decided on the matter. If is for them that we give the message, not to condemn but to Save them. We do not reveal sin to condemn. We reveal sin to reveal to the sinner their problem and we reveal to them the solution thought Jesus.

I haven't met any gay person who thought their lifestyle is a sin and seeks forgiveness. Don't think a change of law would change that thinking.

I have talked to homosexuals and others who have come to the realisation that what they have done is sin. To those who are set in their conviction that they are not sinners nothing i can say will change them. But i know some are open to conviction.

Doesn't the bible says do not judge one another? I think the point of what Jesus's message is love, not condem. In other words, focus on your own sins, quit picking on others. ...because you are just like them!

You see it as picking on them. I see it as totally different. I see it as giving warning and showing them to way to safety. What you see as Judging i see as Warning. I do not throw people in prison for sins; i do not condemn people to eternity apart from God. What i do is give warning. And yes i am a sinner just like them and i have gone through a process of being convicted of my sin, not a pleasant experience but a necessary one. And i am thankful i was taken through that process because i am saved now through the Atonement of the Messiah Jesus.

When one realize one's just as bad as a murder, one stop condeming the murder's sin.

One then does not start preaching that Murder is good. And that is what the homosexual justification movement is doing in regard to the homosexual lifestyle.

Jesus said just by having hate in your heart, you have committed murder. Jesus said just by lusting, you have committed adultery. We are just like the homosexuals. How can we turn to them and say "you're bad" when we are just as bad?

Because they are Bad... Just because i am Bad does not make their badness Good.

This is why we are saved by grace. Grace is only given to the undeserved.

Yeah but grace must be Accepted... And a person who has been convinced they are not in sin will not accept grace they have been lead to believe they do not need.

If you deserve it, it's no longer grace. Our sins are forgiven, so how can we turn around and critisize other's sins?

We reveal sin to move sinners to come to seek grace. We do not say "Ohhh what you are engaged in is ok. Don't listen to them hate monger Christians".

Like Jesus said about the one who owes money and had his debt forgiven. But later turns around and make someone who owes him money pay.

You have got things totally wrong. So wrong. I am glad to be forgiven my debt and want to see homosexuals forgiven their debt. But if they do not recognise they are in debt they will never seek to have it forgiven.

My point is, a Christian's main focus on eliminating sin should be on their own sin and no one else's.

Well i am a Christian. And it is not my main focus to eliminate sin. I am a sinner and will be until the day i die. So attempting to become sinless to me is a act of foolish vanity, it will never happen. But resisting sin and believing sin is sin are good things.

In this case, quit picking on the gays and let them be. We can only try to convince them our believes, forcing them is not the way. It's not what Jesus would want us to do.

Where am i forcing gays? I am forcing no one. I give a message for others to consider. That’s not forcing anything.

Like the saying "you have to quit smoking first before you fight 2nd hand smoke"

I know a smokers who understand that their smoking is bad for them and bad for their children. You don't have to give up smoking to know it is bad.



[FONT=&quot]
All Praise The Ancient Of Days[/FONT]

 

[reba]

Well said Adstar

 

[Mike]

I've moved this thread from Q&A to A&T. The Q&A Forum is intended so that non-Christians can ask questions of Christians, and Christians can respond. (Read the forum description) With all of the non-Christians having responded, it isn't following this format.

Now, there will be no moderating of posts.