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Killing Jesus

Anto9us2

Anto9us2

Member
I got it at t h e library yesterday, it is by Bill O'Reilly and Martin Dugard, both Catholics.

I read ALL OF IT LAST NIGHT.

I can't say I agree with every single conclusion, but I enjoyed it - a lot of good Roman and Jewish history in it.

Authors' say that there were TWO temple cleansing - early one at t h e beginning of JESUS' ministry in John's gospel, the 3 synoptic gospels all put it at the last week of JESUS' life

Very interesting read, I was amazed I just kept reading and reading til I was done, started about noon, read thru Monday night football game - never finished a book in one day like that!
 
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The authors definitely claim that Mary Magdalene and Mary of Bethany are not the same Mary. To me, it is possible that "woman with the alabaster jar", Mary Magdalene, and Mary of Bethany (sister of Martha and Lazarus) might all be the same person, I dunno.

But these authors, admittedly NOT Bible scholars, definitely see 2 Temple Cleansings and 2 different Mary's.

The descriptions in the book are vivid, and except for these minor points, it's very right on.
 
Matthew 21:12 And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves, 13 And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves.

John 2:12 After this he went down to Capernaum, he, and his mother, and his brethren, and his disciples: and they continued there not many days. 13 And the Jews' passover was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem, 14 And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting: 15 And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables; 16 And said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence; make not my Father's house an house of merchandise. 17 And his disciples remembered that it was written, The zeal of thine house hath eaten me up.

This was done during the Passover celebration in Jerusalem of the exodus that took place every year. The greed of the merchants would come to the Temple to sell animals for the sacrifices as they would jack up their prices for the doves and or pigeons and even the cattle and sheep as it was hard for some to travel such distances with these sacrifices for Passover feast.

The money changers would transfer Roman coins to Jewish coins in order for those Jews who traveled to pay a half a shekel as a tribute to the service of the sanctuary according to Jewish law, Exodus 30:11-16. The money exchanger's would charge a small sum for exchanging Roman coins to Jewish coins.

In the first cleansing it was the Jews that immediately confronted Jesus in the Temple, John 2:18, but in the second cleansing it was the chief priest and scribes who confronted Him.

Matthew 21:17-32 The second time the Temple was cleansed was about three years later when Jesus left Bethany where He lodged there that night and in the morning made His triumphant entry into Jerusalem during the last week of His life. This time Jesus did not make a scourge of small cords to drive them out the chief priest and scribes, but condemned them instead.

Jesus went into the Temple to teach and the chief priest and scribes confronted Jesus demanding by what authority and who gave Him that authority to speak as He did. Jesus ended up telling them that publicans and harlots will go into the kingdom of God before they ever would because they believed John the Baptist and repented, but they believed not and repented not.
 
Anto9us2 said:
The authors definitely claim that Mary Magdalene and Mary of Bethany are not the same Mary. To me, it is possible that "woman with the alabaster jar", Mary Magdalene, and Mary of Bethany (sister of Martha and Lazarus) might all be the same person, I dunno.

But these authors, admittedly NOT Bible scholars, definitely see 2 Temple Cleansings and 2 different Mary's.

The descriptions in the book are vivid, and except for these minor points, it's very right on.
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They are the same Mary as she was the sister of Martha and Lazarus as their parents were Eucharis and Cyrus. Mary Magdalene was a follower of Jesus and was a witness to His crucifixion, burial and first to witness His resurrection, Mark 16:9. She was born in Magdala hence her last name and also lived in Bethany. She was the one in whom Jesus drove seven demons out of her, Luke 8:1-3. It's believed she was a woman of wealth like that of Joanna and Suzanna as she owned her own home and also supported Jesus traveling with Him. She is also the one who purchased the Alabaster box with oil in it. In Luke 10:38-42 Martha received Jesus into her house. Mary was also the mother of John whose surname was Mark, Acts 12:12. Many say she was also a prostitute, but that is not found in scripture.
 
I see Mary the same way, and it's ok with me if there were two temple cleansing.

Where the prostitute angle came in, I don't know, I feel things should not be added that are not in th e Bible.
 
So many traditions and legends a bound
One said Mary Magdalene/Bethany used to be a Priestess in a false religion

One tradition said Joseph of Arimethea and Lazarus went together to England to spread the gospel there

John Mark, they say he might be the one in a sheet that fled naked when Jesus was arrested

Of Mary, I feel she had the alabaster jar, 7 devils were cast out of her, but nothing said of prostitute or pagan priestess
 
This is why we need to stay away from traditional teachings of man as they can be deceiving. It's best that we stay with that which has already been written and taught by Christ. It's the job of the Holy Spirit to teach us either directly or by working through others. It's up to us to Spiritually discern that of what we are being taught, 1 John 4:1-6.
 
I believe each Christian has a unique perspective of the Kingdom and that these perspectives should be appreciated. That being said, each new perspective should be tested and, if found faulty, should either be discarded or taken with "a grain of salt."
 
Anto9us2 said:
The authors definitely claim that Mary Magdalene and Mary of Bethany are not the same Mary. To me, it is possible that "woman with the alabaster jar", Mary Magdalene, and Mary of Bethany (sister of Martha and Lazarus) might all be the same person, I dunno.

But these authors, admittedly NOT Bible scholars, definitely see 2 Temple Cleansings and 2 different Mary's.

The descriptions in the book are vivid, and except for these minor points, it's very right on.
Click to expand...

I don't think they are the same person.

In John 11 it says that the woman anointing Jesus head and wiping his feet with her tears was Mary of Bethany (vs 2). Also see John 12:3

This sounds like the person described by Luke at the end of chap 7 though, as he did not name her, perhaps Luke didn't know her name.

But then Luke continues at the beginning of chapter 8 to name Mary of Magdala.
So it seems to me to be two different Mary's.
 
Mary and Marie are based on Miriam - popular names for Jewish girls because of Moses' sister Miriam.

We will find out eventually.
 
Mary Magdalene (called Magdalene because she was born in Magdala, Israel) and Mary named Marie of Bethany (born at Al-Eizariya name for modern Bethany) are not the same person.

Side note: Marie and Mary are the same name. My Great Aunt's name was Marie when she lived in Romania, but when she came to America it was pronounced Mary.

According to the Genealogy of Eucharis and Cyrus who was the King of the Benjamite tribe in Magdala and a descendant from the House of David are the parents of Mary Magdalene, Mary/Marie of Bethany, Martha and Lazarus.

Mary Magdalene was born in Magdala hence the surname Magdalene, Mary/Marie of Bethany was born in Al-Eizariya later known as Bethany, Martha born in Palestine and was the mother of Mark and John who was a widow, Lazarus was born in Al-Eizariya (Bethany).

This was Mary Magdalene, daughter of Eucharis and Cyrus, a sister to Mary of Bethany, Martha and Lazarus. The other Mary is described in Mark 16:1 as Mary the mother of James and Salome and the wife of Zebedee.

Luke 8:2 And certain women, which had been healed of evil spirits and infirmities, Mary called Magdalene, out of whom went seven devils.

This is the same Mary who had the alabaster jar filled with perfume who poured the perfume over the head of Jesus and also washed and kissed the feet of Jesus, Matthew 26:6-9; Luke 7:36-50; John 12:1-3.

Mary Magdalene, Mary of Bethany, Martha and Lazarus parents were Cyrus and Eucharis from Magdala along the sea of Galilee where Cyrus was the King over the tribe of Benjamin being a royal descendant of the house of David. They had a castle there called Magdalon. A family of wealth and after Cyrus died the children inherited vast riches and possessions. Lazarus took to the military life, Martha ruled her possessions with great discretion and was a model of virtue and propriety sort of addicted to worldly cares. Probably was why she fussed so much when Jesus came to their house. Mary Magdalene involved herself with luxurious pleasures and extravagant life style she was known through all the country as "The Sinner" and very promiscuous. The seven demons which posse her that Jesus cast out of her where the seven deadly sins: gluttony, fornication, covetousness, anger, spiritual sluggishness, ego
 
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