Magic/charm is science

[Classik]

Magic is science, I heard my dad say some years. This sounds funny but looks true to me.

He says demonic operation is science on its own. Maybe its science beyond your understanding.

It is a kind of science.

 

[taikina]

one definition of magic is control and manipulation of natural elements, think about that the next time you turn on the lights at your house

 

[Classik]

one definition of magic is control and manipulation of natural elements, think about that the next time you turn on the lights at your house

:toofunny
They have something in common though.

 

[Nick]

I guess there's a difference between magic and sorcery/witchcraft.

To me the latter is what we should be concerned about.

I usually think of magic as those cool magic tricks and illusions people do. They're great fun to watch. In fact, take a look at the duo Soul Mistique on Australia's Got Talent.

[video=youtube;ZZJzjzbbgE0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZJzjzbbgE0[/video]

 

[evenifigoalone]

one definition of magic is control and manipulation of natural elements, think about that the next time you turn on the lights at your house

:toofunny
"Hey, Mommy, look what I can do!" *flips light switch*
"What manner of witchery is this!?!"

 

[Seeker]

We need to differentiate between magic, miracle and illusion - illusion is what the TV magicians do. As for whether magic - and by that I mean manipulation of supernatural forces - exists, this is something about which we need to look into the scripture. Does the scripture allow for magic to be synonymous with illusion? And, finally, miracle: this is, essentially, the same as magic, but given by God to certain human beings as signs of God's support.

The narration of Moses' confrontation with the Pharaoh's sorcerers is a good example to look at, because - from the narrative present in my scripture - it seems that what the sorcerers did was mere trickery and illusion, which made it appear that their sticks were wriggling like snakes. But when Moses cast his staff, it formed a large and fast-moving snake that engulfed those of the sorcerers, who - recognising that what Moses had done was TRUE magic, i.e. a miracle, fell in humble prostration to their Lord.

 

[Chris.]

Classik, it is all perspective how you label what you see, as many things in science we consider normal were once labelled as witchcraft like alchemy for example.

If you showed someone who lived 3 hundred years ago a modern day TV remote control working, they might identify it as occult because it is using an invisible unseen force. It would be very mysterious and could be easily seen to be demonic or to function via invoking a spell.

Many years ago before science, events were described using good and bad spirits and lots of superstition.

Autopsies were also once considered evil too and had to be done in secret to avoid condemnation.

I wasn't sure where you were going with your question and how you meant magic. I put some trivia in here for you anyway since you were talking about demons. I figured you weren't talking about magicians.

 

[taikina]

what is supernatural? or paranormal? something we can't understand or something that doesn't happen everyday? i think that everything that happens in the real world is natural and normal, paranormal and supernatural are things that belong in the world of fiction. if i saw a grand miracle, like something i thought was impossible, i would label it natural. or i saw ghosts, demons or angels, i wouldn't say i saw something paranormal.

 

[Classik]

Classik, it is all perspective how you label what you see, as many things in science we consider normal were once labelled as witchcraft like alchemy for example.

If you showed someone who lived 3 hundred years ago a modern day TV remote control working, they might identify it as occult because it is using an invisible unseen force. It would be very mysterious and could be easily seen to be demonic or to function via invoking a spell.

Many years ago before science, events were described using good and bad spirits and lots of superstition.

Autopsies were also once considered evil too and had to be done in secret to avoid condemnation.

I wasn't sure where you were going with your question and how you meant magic. I put some trivia in here for you anyway since you were talking about demons. I figured you weren't talking about magicians.

Thanks.
I know some supernatural forces exist.

I read a book. I don't remember all about it anymore.

This is the summary (or let me ask you this question):


By induction, a magnet can attract an iron spoon to itself.

What do you think happens when an occultic man points at the same spoon and you notice that spoon move up and suspended in the air? What really happened? (that is if you believe there are evil powers and forces)

 

[Chris.]

Uu

Thanks.
I know some supernatural forces exist.

I read a book. I don't remember all about it anymore.

This is the summary (or let me ask you this question):


By induction, a magnet can attract an iron spoon to itself.

What do you think happens when an occultic man points at the same spoon and you notice that spoon move up and suspended in the air? What really happened? (that is if you believe there are evil powers and forces)

Here is what I think about that.
I think those abilities are just our natural human mental abilities. I think the occultist is focussing on mind energy transfer and development rather than God

Human telepathy has been documented by scientific experiment to exist. That has been known for a long time now. Is that caused by a demon in every instance? I think not.

The occultist may be mistakenly thinking demons are the sole source of his natural human abilities And making a false god of it all.

Too many cultures have documented things like you said.

There is also a very famous instance of a normal everyday Russian housewife who could move objects at will under scientificly controlled conditions. She died early because her lectronic devices mind was a freak thing that had too much energy transfer going on.

Do I think the devil was responsible for her actions or abilities? Defiantly not!

I know the apostle Peter levitated when he walked on water to go toJesus and I have no idea how that happened I would only be guessing at the mechanics of it.

Like I said in the other thread today if you showed a medieval Christian one of our modern day electronic devices like a remote control, because of lack of understanding it would be called demonic or witchcraft.

In the same way scientists are unravelling our human minds now and showing some of this stuff is just our natural abilities we all have.

 

[Classik]

Interesting reply, chris.

The book I read tells you: the spoon was lifted by an invissible supernatural being. It kind of makes sense. Once someone commands something to happen and it comes to pass... there is a supernatural being or demon (as the books claims) that performs the required action or 'whatever'

I don't dig deep into the occultic thing. It just makes sense.

Science is better (despite the similarities some books point out)

 

[Chris.]

classic books can claim what they want and its just the authors best guess.

The hard part is how do you prove that assertion that object motion is done by a supernaural being under the control of a human one.


One thing I have noticed is christians tend to be fairly gullible targets for far fetched authors claiming things unprovable like this, and some readers end up paranoid because of it.

Situation dependent though I believe Jesus miracles were supernaturally assisted.

Faith healing by holy spirit.

I wouldn't discount some african shaman activities are demonic. They are so evil.

It is all so hard to prove this stuff is supernatural origin. Its hard to prove and hard to deny too. That is why you must approach claims with an educated mind rather than just accepting peoples word for it.


1 John 4:1

Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.

Does not mean declare everything demon possessed you don't understand. It means think about it first.