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Monergism vs. Synergism

I believe in....

  • a Synergistic Gospel.

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JM

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Monergism (monergistic regeneration) is a redemptive blessing purchased by Christ for those the Father has given Him (1 Pet 1:3, John 6:37, 39). This grace works independently of any human cooperation and conveys that power into the fallen soul whereby the person who is to be saved is effectually enabled to respond to the gospel call (Acts 2:39, 1 Cor 1:2, 9, 24, Rom 8:30 John 1:13, Acts 13:48). It is that supernatural power of God alone whereby we are granted the spiritual ability and desire to comply with the conditions of the covenant of grace; that is, to apprehend the Redeemer by a living faith, to come up to the terms of salvation, to repent of idols and to love God and the Mediator supremely. The Holy Spirit, in quickening the soul, mercifully capacitates and inclines God's elect to the spiritual exercise of faith in Jesus Christ (John 6:44, 1 John 5:1). This instantaneous and intensely personal work of God is the means by which the Spirit brings us into living union with Him.

and

...synergists believe that faith itself, a principle standing independent and autonomous of God's action of grace, is something the natural man must add or contribute toward the price of his salvation. Unregenerate man, in this scheme, is left to his freewill and natural ability to believe or reject God. Synergists teach that God's grace takes us part of the way to salvation but that the [fallen, rebellious] human will must determine the final outcome. It does this by reaching down into an autonomous principle within in its fallen unrenewed nature in order to either produce a right thought or create a right volition toward God. But, the Scriptures are clear that as long as the natural man hates God he will not come to Him. In this system, then, grace is merely an offer or a help but does not do anything to change man's heart of stone or natural hostility to God. This means that God will only look favorably upon and reward those natural men who are able to produce or contribute faith, independent of God's inward gracious call or spiritual renewal. This is a subtle, but serious, error that is plaguing the church of the 21st century. It is a misapprehension of the biblical teaching concerning the depth of our fallen nature and the radical grace needed to restore us. This leads me to believe that one of the greatest challenges facing the church today is its re-evangelization. While many evangelicals may understand the doctrine of "sola fide" (faith alone), that we must place our faith in Christ to be saved, it seems many have abandoned the biblical concept of "sola gratia" (grace alone). The Synergistic Conception of "Sola Fide" therefore must, by definition, draw on nature to cooperate with God's grace as the human fulfillment of a condition. Why do people believe this? I can only guess it is because by nature we want to maintain an island of righteousness, a last bastion of pride in thinking that he can still contribute something, be it ever so small, to our own salvation. It would involve great humility on our part to admit this. If the Church took more efforts to search the Scriptures and reform her doctrine on this point, I am convinced that a great deal of blessing would be restored and God would remove much of the current worldliness in our midst.
 
Jason -

(I know why you call yourself that now, btw. It seems like you're never coming back, and yet you do...again and again. It's SPOOOOKY).

Did you see the post by "GOD"S ARMY" about works? Interesting that you should post this at roughly the same time he did.

I don't mean to be a weenie, but I believe in BOTH M & S'ism.

HOW? Quite Simple: Coming to know God is wholly M'istic. Obvious, because HOW CAN unregenerate man respond to the ALL-GOOD almighty. Paul says clearly that there is NOTHING GOOD in his sinful nature, and clearly it would take SOMETHING GOOD to reach to God.

HOWEVER, CHRISTIAN MATURATION is a much more complicated, iterative, and, yes, SYNERGISTIC process, as expressed throughout the NT and specifically James. We now have something of God within us, and we "do the things we would not do", yet struggle to "crucify the flesh daily". Obviously, God created us - WE ARE NOT GOD, nor are we A PIECE OF GOD. There is something unique within us, that, once regenerated, is OF GOD, and continues to grow and respond to God. This process continues throughout our lifetime, and, by my reading of Revelation and the various ages and periods within it, for quite a while after.

Nevertheless, God's Sovereignty decrees that ULTIMATELY, we will mature into what He designed and created us to be. (Again, the chess example - we will ALWAYS lose to Bobby Fischer, though we have "free will" to move our pieces however we see fit. ) God designed the universe similarly to punish our behaviour when it isn't Godly, and move us relentlessly toward Christ, wherein ONLY can peace, love and joy be found, the only things we truly yearn for and seek (though many do not yet fully realize it).
 
Jason -

(I know why you call yourself that now, btw. It seems like you're never coming back, and yet you do...again and again. It's SPOOOOKY).
LOL...I believe he calls himself Jason..... because it's his real name. 8-)
 
I'm aware, Vic. But he has claimed on many other strings that this is "his last post", only to reappear. But I give him much credit, the guy has studied those who have come before, unlike far too many of my fellow Protestants, who believe that God's Revelative Purpose skipped from Moses to Isaiah to the Apostles to Them.

I crack up at most Protestant broadsiding of the RC church, just because they believe that the "REAL" church just REAPPEARED in 1540, after a millenia-plus of non-existence.

News flash for those of you unfamiliar with GUTTENBERG. Prior to the printing press, one could credibly argue that the Protestant movement was IMPOSSIBLE. So next time you see an 11th century cathedral with stained glass windows of the Saints and too many statuary, when you 'tsk-tsk-tsk' about idolatry, remember that when the doggone thing was built, 97% of the laity was ILLITERATE. It was picture-books, folks. Did Christians depend too much on the clergy? I don't know, if you couldn't add or subtract, how much would you depend on your accountant to do your taxes?

Now, how SLOWLY the RC Church responded to the education of its members is a criticism worth considering, but given Protestantism's willingness to spin off 6 denominations a week and 3 on Sundays, I'll forgive Rome a little conservatism. As the saying goes, you need a plan, so you know what you're varying from.

That St. James gal on your sig is 'smokin'!, btw. With a kind of chaste, holy beauty, of course...
 
I agree with Jason. There is absolutely nothing we can do to become saved. Majority of the churches has turn the truth into a lie, it's really sad. For instance, the sinner's prayer, or asking Jesus to come into our hearts. We can't dictate God to do what we want, God is not our servant. Also God has a timeline when he will change one of his chosen vessels to become spiritually alive, it's not always when someone hears the gospel for the very first time of their lives, it could be 5,10, 20 years or even an hour before death that God can quicken that indiviual. Just like the thief on the cross, God quicken his heart before he died and John the Baptist was quicken in his mother womb at 6mons, well why couldn't God waited until John come out of his mother womb to do this, God knows the perfect timing to save a person. It has to be between conception and the last breath on earth or before Christ return as the rewarder/Judge.
 
"Behold I stand at the door and knock. If any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him and sup with him"

I think, James, that even Monergists would say that it is THEORETICAL AND THEOLOGICAL, that even MONERGISM FEELS like SYNERGISM.

It's not: "Behold, I stand at the door and knock. Just so folks know not to stand too close - - I'm about to kick it down." Jesus as "Popeye Doyle".

I think God does, in actuality, "kick down" our doors. But He is patient and kind, knowing how to touch us and change us in ways that do this effectively through our opening to Him.
 
Dean said:
Jason -

(I know why you call yourself that now, btw. It seems like you're never coming back, and yet you do...again and again. It's SPOOOOKY).

I didn't mean I wasn't coming back to the forum, just that one thread....but yes, did come back to it...once or twice.

B0000C6EBX.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg


Why, do we have a problem!


kidding.jpg
 
People who believe in synergism believe that man is much more powerful than God! That of course is breaking the first 2 commandments. They believe that the Holy Spirit does NOTHING in empowering men to believe. This is of course is a trick of satan to hieghten the power of the human being over God. They have no clue that it is GOD who is changing our hearts, not we ourselves. If we could do that, then we wouldn't even NEED God. We could do it all ourselves! Sorry, but faith CANNOT come from a sinful mind. That is an oxymoron.
 
Dean said:
"Behold I stand at the door and knock. If any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him and sup with him"

I think, James, that even Monergists would say that it is THEORETICAL AND THEOLOGICAL, that even MONERGISM FEELS like SYNERGISM.

It's not: "Behold, I stand at the door and knock. Just so folks know not to stand too close - - I'm about to kick it down." Jesus as "Popeye Doyle".

I think God does, in actuality, "kick down" our doors. But He is patient and kind, knowing how to touch us and change us in ways that do this effectively through our opening to Him.

A most appropriate quote from scripture, Dean!

And by the tally, I see few Calvinists here, expecially the hyper-Calvininsts who would have God ram salvation down our throats, our free will of choice not to play in the issue at all.

God bless,

PAX


Bill+†+


Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone
those sent to you, how many times I yearned to gather your
children together, as a hen gathers her young under her wings,
but
YOU WERE UNWILLING!
Matt 23:37
 
Jason said:
Bill, good to see ya still postin'. :biggrin

Got kicked-out of CARM so I am looking into old familiar forums... :biggrin

Anyway, I have at least five forums I ususally circulate through, just reduced to about four! :-D :sad :o

God bless,

PAX

Bill+†+



Pillar and Foundation of Truth, the Church. (1 Tim 3:15)
 
Bill, welcome back...again. You will never be kicked out of here, no matter what you say about Jason! jk, I love you both.

William Putnam said:
A most appropriate quote from scripture, Dean!

And by the tally, I see few Calvinists here, expecially the hyper-Calvininsts who would have God ram salvation down our throats, our free will of choice not to play in the issue at all...
No offense to either party, but I think that statement was ironic Bill, considering Dean is a UR. I'm sure you didn't know that, so no harm done.
 
Did CARM get annoyed that you actually presented robust Scriptural defenses for the RCC? That's no fun, it undermines the myth that all Catholics have the spiritual awareness of a cow ambling through an abatoir.

Wouldn't want anyone to interfere with the Grand Old Sport of Catholic bashing!

Gosh, wonder what they'd do to a Reconciliationist like me? A nice burning over a bit of green wood jumps to mind.
 
Vic said:
Bill, welcome back...again. You will never be kicked out of here, no matter what you say about Jason! jk, I love you both.

Me? Say someething about (gasp!) Jason?

Neva hoppon coppon! :-D

William Putnam said:
A most appropriate quote from scripture, Dean!

And by the tally, I see few Calvinists here, expecially the hyper-Calvininsts who would have God ram salvation down our throats, our free will of choice not to play in the issue at all...
No offense to either party, but I think that statement was ironic Bill, considering Dean is a UR. I'm sure you didn't know that, so no harm done.

Let's see, "United Republican"? :bday:

Look, many non-Catholics say things that may be the truth, even while I may disagree with much of what they may believe.

Why, even you, Vic, every now and then, says something truthful...!

Heehee! :angel:

God bless,

PAX

Bill+†+


I believe in God,
the Father Almighty,
Creator of heaven and earth;
and in Jesus Christ, His only Son,
Our Lord;
who was conceived by the holy Spirit,
born of the Virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, died,
and was buried.

He descended into hell;
the third day He arose again from the dead;
He ascended into heaven,
sitteth at the right hand of God,
the Father almighty;
from thence He shall come to judge
the living and the dead.

I believe in the holy Spirit,
the Holy Catholic Church,
the communion of saints,
the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body,
and life everlasting.

Amen.


- The Apostles Creed -
 
Dean said:
Did CARM get annoyed that you actually presented robust Scriptural defenses for the RCC? That's no fun, it undermines the myth that all Catholics have the spiritual awareness of a cow ambling through an abatoir.

Actually, I kinda perpetuated it on purpose, my getting sick and tired if the obvious anti-Catholicism and bigotry emanating from the very head of the moderators in the Catholic forum there!

As for "scriptural defenses," that is (or was) my main thrust there, also quoting from the early church fathers to show how "Catholic" they were from the earliest of times, never once spouting some of the quaint "new doctrines" that come from the Fundamentalists that was never there before the so called "Protestant Reformation."

Wouldn't want anyone to interfere with the Grand Old Sport of Catholic bashing!

Gosh, wonder what they'd do to a Reconciliationist like me? A nice burning over a bit of green wood jumps to mind.

Give it a try. Sign up, go to the Catholic forum and introduce yourself!

My advice is to "lurk" for a while, get a feel of how things go, and note how quickly the forum moves. It probably gets more "hits" then any Christian forum in the internet! Oh, and read the rules! Calling the head moderator an "anti-Catholic" and a "bigot" will get her attention big time! :roll:

God bless,

PAX

Bill+†+


My soul proclaims the greatness of the Lord; my spirit rejoices in God my savior.
For he has looked upon his handmaid's lowliness; behold, from now on will all ages
call me blessed.
(Luke 1:46-48)
 
Where is Christ in all of this??? I am not a catholic, or a LUTHERan, or CALVINist,, I am a CHRISTian because I follow Christ. The problem with all these doctrines is that THEY are followed instead of Christ alone! Jesus says we have ONE teacher. I believe him! Paul tells us in 1 Co. 1:11-13, "My brothers, some from Chloe's household have informed me that there are quarrels among you. What i mean is this: 'I follow Paul'; another, 'I follow Apollos'; another, 'I follow Cephas' still another, 'I follow Christ.' Is Christ divided? Was paul crucified for you? Were you baptized into the name of Paul?" Unfortuantely these donctrines KEEP us from the unity of Christ! How i wish that the churches would focus on Christ instead of Mary, Luther, Calvin, etc. The church has done nothing except to create division. If we all focus on Christ, then the truth will be made known to us.
 
Heidi said:
Where is Christ in all of this??? I am not a catholic, or a LUTHERan, or CALVINist,, I am a CHRISTian because I follow Christ. The problem with all these doctrines is that THEY are followed instead of Christ alone! Jesus says we have ONE teacher. I believe him! Paul tells us in 1 Co. 1:11-13, "My brothers, some from Chloe's household have informed me that there are quarrels among you. What i mean is this: 'I follow Paul'; another, 'I follow Apollos'; another, 'I follow Cephas' still another, 'I follow Christ.' Is Christ divided? Was paul crucified for you? Were you baptized into the name of Paul?" Unfortuantely these donctrines KEEP us from the unity of Christ! How i wish that the churches would focus on Christ instead of Mary, Luther, Calvin, etc. The church has done nothing except to create division. If we all focus on Christ, then the truth will be made known to us.

Heidi, first of all, who are you talking to?

Secondly, I am certainly glad you follow "Christ alone." I would not have it other way!

Now, it would be interesting to find out from you exactly what you mean to "follow Christ alone." Would that include following exactly what Christ taught..and...and...commanded? Would that possibly include following and being a member, in obedience to Him, The Christ, His Church?

Go to my web site and see my quest in finding that church...

Now, I know you have problems with "doctrinal issues." I would suggest you do some research and find out what the early Christians believed in from the earliest of times. I am referring to the writings of the early church fathers.

"Is Christ divided," you ask.

Who "divided" Him, may I ask?

As a Fundamentalist, I wondered why myself, and after much consideration and study, I saw the logic in seeking the only church who could trace her history back Christ Himself (and is thus the oldest Church.) And before the so called "Protestant Reformation," there was only one Christian Church in existence (neglecting for the moment, the Orthodox schism in the 10th century) for the first 1500 years of her existence!

Seek out this church, Heidi, and with an unbiased heart and mind, seek out the depth of her holiness, even while grave sins have been committed by some of her sons and daughters, and find the truth! :)

God bless,

PAX

Bill+†+



Et ego dico tibi quia tu es Petrus et super hanc petram
aedificabo ecclesiam meam et portae inferi non praevalebunt
adversum eam et tibi dabo claves regni caelorum et quodcumque
ligaveris super terram erit ligatum in caelis et quodcumque
solveris super terram erit solutum in caelis.

(Matt 16:18-19 From the Latin Vulgate)
 
Following Christ alone means following Christ ALONE. Jesus said we have only ONE teacher. Jesus is the ONLY mediator between men and God. For me to have a PERSON interpret Christ's words FOR me is putting my faith in that person, is it not? If a friend comes to you and tells you that John Doe exists, but you haven't met john Doe, then you have to take your firend's word that he exists, do you not? But when you meet John Doe, you can listen to John Doe yourself rather than go through your friend to do it. Since I have only ONE teacher, and that is the Holy Spirit in me, only then can I discern true teachings from false ones. But without the Holy spirit, then it is just a guess. When you meet Christ for yourself, you will then know who to follow.
 
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