Oh No

[Lewis]

N.J. legislature approves civil unions
Updated 12/14/2006 7:55 PM ET
TRENTON, N.J. (AP)  Ordered by New Jersey's highest court to offer marriage or its equivalent to gay couples, the Legislature voted Thursday to make New Jersey the third state to allow civil unions.

Democratic Gov. Jon Corzine said he would sign the measure, which would extend to same-sex couples all the rights and privileges available under state law to married people. The bill passed the Assembly 56-19 and the Senate 23-12.

"Love counts," Democratic Assemblyman Wilfredo Caraballo, a chief sponsor of the bill, said as the debate opened. "The gender of whom one loves should not matter to the state."

But Republican Assemblyman Ronald S. Dancer said: "It's my personal belief, faith and religious practice that marriage has been defined in the Bible. And this is one time that I cannot compromise my personal beliefs and faiths."

Massachusetts is the only state to allow gay marriage. Vermont and Connecticut have civil unions, and California has domestic partnerships that work similarly. Since 2004 New Jersey has had a more limited version of domestic partnerships.

Among the benefits gay couples would get under New Jersey's civil unions bill are adoption rights, hospital visitation rights and inheritance rights. Officials could begin granting civil unions 60 days after the governor signs the legislation; Corzine did not say when he would do so.

The bill was drafted in response to a New Jersey Supreme Court ruling in October that required the state to extend the rights and benefits of marriage to gay couples within 180 days. The court, in its 4-3 ruling, left it up to the Legislature to decide whether to call such unions "marriages" or something else.

READ THE RULING: N.J. Supreme Court decision

Gay rights groups have argued that not calling such unions "marriage" creates a different, and inferior, institution. But they welcomed Thursday's legislation as a step toward gaining the right to marry.

Some lawmakers also considered Thursday's action to be an interim step on the way to full marriage rights.

"This should be called what it is  marriage." said Democratic Sen. Loretta Weinberg, a sponsor of the bill. She said the title should be changed after there has been some time to study how the civil unions bill works.

Steven Goldstein, director of the gay rights advocacy organization Garden State Equality, said he expects gay couples to be able to get married in New Jersey within two years.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/200 ... ions_x.htm

 

[Lewis]

Among the benefits gay couples would get under New Jersey's civil unions bill are adoption rights, hospital visitation rights and inheritance rights. Officials could begin granting civil unions 60 days after the governor signs the legislation; Corzine did not say when he would do so.

This is not good. Talking about the adoption rights. Gay people do not need to adopt kids.

 

[jgredline]

''as in the days of Noah''

 

[Quath]

This is not good. Talking about the adoption rights. Gay people do not need to adopt kids.

Yeah, the last things kids need are loving parents that want them.

 

[Solo]

Yeah, the last things kids need are loving parents that want them.

The kids could teach the homosexuals a thing or two about God's creation of a man and a woman for the purpose of love instead of lust for the same sex. I shudder at the perversion that we the created can do to the good creation of Almighty God.

Of course, you have no idea what I am talking about. 8-)

 

[Lewis]

Yeah, the last things kids need are loving parents that want them.

That love ain't worth a dime' if it teaches them to be homosexuals. Going against how God created them. But Quath I expect such a answer from you. Because you have blind eyes toward the things of God.

 

[Quath]

That love ain't worth a dime' if it teaches them to be homosexuals. Going against how God created them. But Quath I expect such a answer from you. Because you have blind eyes toward the things of God.

Lets talk about blind eyes. Do you have any proof that kids of homosexuals learn to be gay? The studies I have seen show that kids of homosexuals are just as likely to be gay as kids of heterosexuals.

The kids could teach the homosexuals a thing or two about God's creation of a man and a woman for the purpose of love instead of lust for the same sex. I shudder at the perversion that we the created can do to the good creation of Almighty God.

You assume that gay parents have no love but lust. If that were the case, then why would they settle down to try to raise a family? If they were just about list, they should be crusing sex clubs and living up life; not taking responsibility.

Of course, you have no idea what I am talking about.

Bigotry is not that hard of a concept to understand.

 

[christian_soldier]

Lets talk about blind eyes. Do you have any proof that kids of homosexuals learn to be gay? The studies I have seen show that kids of homosexuals are just as likely to be gay as kids of heterosexuals.

Oh, really? Please show me these studies. I'd be interested to know where they found a significantly large enough sample of homosexual 'parents' AND over a long term.

What to increase the number of kids beat up at school? Let homosexuals adopt.

 

[Quath]

Oh, really? Please show me these studies. I'd be interested to know where they found a significantly large enough sample of homosexual 'parents' AND over a long term.

A study looked at 300 children born to gay or lesbian parents was used in Patterson, C. J. Children of Lesbian and Gay Parents. (1992). Child Development: 1025-1039.

It is estimated that 6 to 14 million children have a gay or lesbian parent today.

What to increase the number of kids beat up at school? Let homosexuals adopt.

Beat up by people who preach hatred towards homosexuals?

 

[Steve]

That love ain't worth a dime' if it teaches them to be homosexuals. Going against how God created them. But Quath I expect such a answer from you. Because you have blind eyes toward the things of God.

'Teach' them to be homosexual? :roll:

I don't think so. It's a genetic thing.

 

[Relic]

Oh, really? Please show me these studies. I'd be interested to know where they found a significantly large enough sample of homosexual 'parents' AND over a long term.

A study looked at 300 children born to gay or lesbian parents was used in Patterson, C. J. Children of Lesbian and Gay Parents. (1992). Child Development: 1025-1039.

It is estimated that 6 to 14 million children have a gay or lesbian parent today.

Quath gets his information from pro-homosexual web sites that withhold the real truth by not publishing it!

Here is the real truth:

Homosexual Urban Legend: False: The Claim That 6-14 Million Children Are Reared In Homosexual Households

Below is an exerpt, read the whole article here:
http://traditionalvalues.org/urban/twelve.php

More Problems With Charlotte Patterson’s “Researchâ€Â

Charlotte Patterson’s research has also been called into question for a number of other reasons. Dr. Gerald Schoenewolf, a member of the National Association for Research of Therapy’s Scientific Advisory Committee, has dug into Patterson’s questionable research methods. In an article posted on the NARTH web site[/url, Dr. Schoenewolf notes:

Typically, Patterson's study of children of lesbian parents are based on interviews with the children in which they are asked questions about their social adjustment, their sexual orientation, and their mood (happiness); these interviews are also conducted with children of heterosexual parents and then compared. In other studies, projective testing is used (such as the Rorshach Inkblot Test). For example, one study involved two groups of 44 children, aged 12 to 18 (children of lesbians and children of heterosexuals). Both groups were said to have similar ethnic backgrounds, family income and parent educational level. The conclusions: no difference in perceived well-being, social adjustment, or sexual orientation (percentage of homosexuality) among these youth.

Sampling Flaws And Researcher Bias

There are several problems with this kind of research. No study of 44 children is representative of the population at large. No matter how well the sampling is done, it can't be representative. According to the National Adoption Clearing House, there are about 6 to 14 million children living with a gay or lesbian parent. How can 44 children be representative of 6 to 14 million children?

(At the time Dr. Schoenewolf wrote this article, he was unknowingly using Patterson’s bogus statistics that had been picked up and used uncritically by the National Adoption Clearing House. His article has since been amended to include new information on the 6-14 million urban legend.)

NARTH Scientific Advisory Committee member Dr. A. Dean Byrd has also pointed out serious credibility questions about Patterson’s alleged research of homosexual families and their children.

Writing in “When Activism Masquerades as Science: Potential Consequences of Recent APA Resolutions,†Dr. Byrd notes that an American Psychological Association committee used Patterson’s research to promote homosexual marriage, but a Florida court found serious flaws in her materials. He writes:

Of particular concern was the Committee's reliance on the research of Charlotte Patterson whose studies were questioned and subsequently excluded from a Florida Court. The Court concluded:

“Dr. Patterson's impartiality also came into question when prior to trial, she refused to turn over to her own attorneys copies of documentation utilized by her in studies. This court ordered her to do so (both sides having stipulated to the Order), yet she unilaterally refused despite the continued efforts on the part of her attorneys to have her do so. Both sides stipulated that Dr. Patterson's conduct was a clear violation of this Court's order. Her attorneys requested that sanctions be limited to the exclusion of her personal studies at trial and this Court agreed to do so.

“Dr. Patterson testified as to her own lesbian status and the Respondent maintained that her research was possibly tainted by her alleged use of friends as subjects for her research. This potential was given more credence than it should have been by virtue of her unwillingness to provide the Respondent as well as the Petitioner, with the documents ordered to be produced" (1997, JUNE AMER, Petitioner v Floyd P. Johnson, p. 11).

Charlotte Patterson’s “research†is simply pro-homosexual propaganda disguised as science. Her research methods are shoddy and unreliable, yet her work is repeatedly reprinted by the American Psychological Association, homosexual activist organizations, and in friend of the court briefs that are used to justify homosexual marriage and homosexual adoption of children.

For reliable analyses of Patterson’s questionable research and other homosexual activists who are attempting to use “studies†to promote the homosexual agenda, and for information on the significant differences between children in homosexual versus heterosexual homes, download and distribute the following documents:

When Activism Masquerades as Science: Potential Consequences of Recent APA Resolutions
[url]http://www.narth.com/docs/masquerades.html

When Propaganda Is Disguised As Research: The Case of Charlotte J. Patterson
http://www.narth.com/docs/patterson.html

Review Of Research On Homosexual Parenting, Adoption, And Foster Parenting
http://www.narth.com/docs/rekers.html

Gender Complementarity and Child-rearing: Where Tradition and Science Agree
http://www.narth.com/docs/gendercomplementarity.html

"Destructive Trends in Mental Health: The Well-Intentioned Path to Harm"
http://www.narth.com/docs/destructive.html

No Basis: What the Studies Don’t Tell Us About Same-Sex Parenting
http://www.marriagewatch.org/publications/nobasis.pdf

Dr. Jeffrey Satinover Testifies Before Massachusetts Senate Committee Studying Gay Marriage
http://www.narth.com/docs/senatecommittee.html

b]Dual-Gender Parenting: Optimal Child Rearing[/b]http://www.narth.com/docs/optimal.html

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Psalm 33:4
For the word of the LORD is right; and all his works are done in truth.

Psalm 28:5
Because they regard not the works of the LORD, nor the operation of his hands, he shall destroy them, and not build them up.

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"As long as I have breath and as long as there are people who care about children, I don't believe this issue will ever die down. With 1.8 million children missing, it's damn time somebody did something about it besides me." ~John Walsh~

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NAMBLA must be stopped!
GLSEN must be stopped!

 

[Solo]

Relic,
You didn't actually think that Quath's argument was based on legitimate facts did you?! What would make him change horses in midstream; especially when the stream is ankle deep? :D

 

[Quath]

Quath gets his information from pro-homosexual web sites that withhold the real truth by not publishing it!

AdoptionServices.org is not a pro-homosexual website. It is a pro-adoption one.

Homosexual Urban Legend: False: The Claim That 6-14 Million Children Are Reared In Homosexual Households

I took a look at some of this and you bare basically throwing anti-homosexual bias because you claim there is pro-homosexual bias in the study I cite. If you are so worried about bias, you should worry about it from your end as well.

The complaints I see from these articles are not very concrete. They talk about suspicious numbers and about some low count surveys. However, without knowing the models used and how each study was used to come to a conclusion, this refutal is meaningless.

What I see is worse is that studies that anti-homosexuals try to discredit assume that the opposite must be true. For example, "Lewis W" says that homosexuals teach their children to be gay. Where is the proof of this? None is given, it is just assumed.

We should learn from history. When we wanted to justify slavery, we did so by making up answers. We said the blacks were too dumb to compete with whites and therefore it was humane to keep them like pets.

Look at real data and don't let the hate guide you.

 

[Solo]

I took a look at some of this and you bare basically throwing anti-homosexual bias because you claim there is pro-homosexual bias in the study I cite. If you are so worried about bias, you should worry about it from your end as well.

The complaints I see from these articles are not very concrete. They talk about suspicious numbers and about some low count surveys. However, without knowing the models used and how each study was used to come to a conclusion, this refutal is meaningless.

What I see is worse is that studies that anti-homosexuals try to discredit assume that the opposite must be true. For example, "Lewis W" says that homosexuals teach their children to be gay. Where is the proof of this? None is given, it is just assumed.

We should learn from history. When we wanted to justify slavery, we did so by making up answers. We said the blacks were too dumb to compete with whites and therefore it was humane to keep them like pets.

Look at real data and don't let the hate guide you.

You may have said that the blacks were too dumb to compete with whites and therefore it was humane to keep them like pets, but I know of noone on this forum, at my church, at my workplace, in my community that feels like you do. In fact, blacks have been free to compete with whites for many, many years now.

Also, believers hate sin just as God the Father does because it destroys individuals for all eternity. God and believers love people much more than those who reject the truth of God's word.

You will discover this once you pass from this physical existance basket in which you place all of your eggs.

 

[Relic]

What to increase the number of kids beat up at school? Let homosexuals adopt.

Beat up by people who preach hatred towards homosexuals?

:o
And you think people who claim to be homosexuals don't lash out and beat up people who disagree with their life choices to have sexual relations and sodomize each other? :o

Fact is, Quath, there have been plenty reports of homosexuals who have, for no good reason, acted out in violence against those who are anti-gay who have good reason to be anti-gay. They care about the spread of sin and what it does to a society who blatantly ignores and commits to transgression against the truth of God's absolute laws.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Psalm 33:4
For the word of the LORD is right; and all his works are done in truth.

Psalm 28:5
Because they regard not the works of the LORD, nor the operation of his hands, he shall destroy them, and not build them up.

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And those who don't believe in God and the unchanging, absolute truths of His word, are not exempt from this truth. No one is exempt from the absolute laws of God. Adam and Eve proved that way back when! And the bible is full of plenty enough history that shows even the 613 laws Moses wrote are not going to save anyone from sin but that even though harsh laws are set in place.... not one can live up to them... And so..... we have Christ Jesus who is the ONLY way to overcome the sins of this world.
But anti-Christ types don't believe, so they will perish in their sins instead of finding salvation from them. What a shame. Pray for redemption from sin through the salvation of the Holy Spirit of Christ Jesus.

GayPride is what stands in the way of them coming out of their sin. Pride, instead of learning the value of shame for what it is, they insist there is no shame in their sin, but only pride. Well, they will see sooner or later the results of that perversion they try to put on the truth of God's Holy Word.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Psalm 33:4
For the word of the LORD is right; and all his works are done in truth.

Psalm 28:5
Because they regard not the works of the LORD, nor the operation of his hands, he shall destroy them, and not build them up.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Homosexuals think they are exempt from God's truth. and they live by the lies of false research done only to promote the furtherance of this perverted lifestyle. Sad, so sad that " false pride" and deception is the lord they choose to live by. They walk blinded by their own sense of false pride, what they call gay pride.

.

 

[Relic]

Quath gets his information from pro-homosexual web sites that withhold the real truth by not publishing it!

AdoptionServices.org is not a pro-homosexual website. It is a pro-adoption one.

Oh contraire Quath!
Adoption services.org, in the end of all their matters, is bound to what politics dictate to them, not to the truth of what God reveals that homosexuality really is...sin, a perversion of His Truth, a perversion which leads to nothing but destruction in so many areas of ones life and the life of others involved.

Adoption services is a secular based interest and they must comply with the laws of the state and Federal laws. And we all know that the laws of each state are different. Adoption services adhere to only partial standards of truth. The truth is Quath, they are not the TOTALLY in compliance to what is really the whole truth and nothing but the whole truth. They practice mainly by what the secular government dictates and don't need to go by what truth any research reveals as long as the 'government' has not yet made it a law to do so.

.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Psalm 33:4
For the word of the LORD is right; and all his works are done in truth.

Psalm 28:5
Because they regard not the works of the LORD, nor the operation of his hands, he shall destroy them, and not build them up.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"As long as I have breath and as long as there are people who care about children, I don't believe this issue will ever die down. With 1.8 million children missing, it's damn time somebody did something about it besides me." ~John Walsh~
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

NAMBLA must be stopped!
GLSEN must be stopped!

 

[Quath]

And you think people who claim to be homosexuals don't lash out and beat up people who disagree with their life choices to have sexual relations and sodomize each other? :o

Fact is, Quath, there have been plenty reports of homosexuals who have, for no good reason, acted out in violence against those who are anti-gay who have good reason to be anti-gay. They care about the spread of sin and what it does to a society who blatantly ignores and commits to transgression against the truth of God's absolute laws.

During America's segregated and racist past, some blacks beat up whites. However, for the most part, it was the blacks that were ill treated. This appears to be the same for homosexuals.

And those who don't believe in God and the unchanging, absolute truths of His word, are not exempt from this truth. No one is exempt from the absolute laws of God.

Christians only pay lip service to this idea. They talk about how great God is and how perfect his commandments are, but they ignore most of them because they are too barbaric.

The Bible said the OT laws were perfect and eternal. Do you doubt the Bible? Do you doubt Jesus when he said the Old Laws would not change until heaven and Earth pass? Do you obey the Old Laws? If not, you are just paying lip service as well.

GayPride is what stands in the way of them coming out of their sin. Pride, instead of learning the value of shame for what it is, they insist there is no shame in their sin, but only pride. Well, they will see sooner or later the results of that perversion they try to put on the truth of God's Holy Word.

I see it more as lack of shame, than pride. It is equivalent to living in a world where you are told that you have to be homosexual, even though you have heterosexual lusts. You could hide your feelings and try to fit in, but you are not happy. You could try to marry the opposite gender, but society would shame you and try to punish you.

Do onto others...

Adoption services is a secular based interest and they must comply with the laws of the state and Federal laws.

Yeah, secular, not just blindly accepting the teachings of a religion. They have to actually look to reality to determine their messages, not just accept a priest's word on the issue.

 

[Lewis]

I have a friend that was gay' and now he is married, to a woman. And I have another male friend that did the same thing. And I have heard one of them say that it was wrong to be gay' when he was active in that life style. But at that time he could not help himself. I have some cousins where 2 brothers are gay and one sister out of 5 brothers and sisters. And one of their mothers brothers is also gay' and he left his wife because of it. And the oldest ones father was different from the rest of them, And his first cousin Howard Rollins the now dead movie star' was also gay. This mess hurt my family to death. I have aften thought that the brothers and sisters' got it from each other. Oh and one of the brothers Glen' died of AIDS.

 

[peace4all]

I am sorry you have had such negative problems associated with your relatives. Some people get the short end of the stick it seems. My uncle and his husband (in canada) seem to be very terrefic together, and they both help raise my uncles daughter (and her mom back here does too). he pays almost double the child support, and is always visiting, and she really enjoys seeing him.(she actually looses weight while in canada, because her dad doesn't let her eat mcdonalds every other day)

My experience so far has been good. It is a shame that all can't share good experiences like that.

 

[Quath]

My wife's best friend, Chris, is gay. He and his partner come over for the holidays. Our kids love "Uncle Chris" and always want to see him. He is very happy with his lifestyle.

You can't help who you are attracted to. I find it kind of sad that people feel that some people should not be with those they desire and should instead deal with a relationship with someone they are not attracted to.

I have talked to homosexuals that tied to be straight. If ted Haggard could have accepted his gayness, maybe he could have met a nice man and raised a good family. Now, he has hurt many people with his attempts to hide who he really is. If people didn't pressure himto be straight, maybe his life could have turned out happier.