Once saved..always saved....It's right here.

[Cygnus]

John 10:27"My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; 28and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.29"My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. NASV

If you can lose your salvation..how do you explain away the above verse?

 

[Edward]

 

[Mike S]

Hebrews 6:4-6
4For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, 5And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, 6If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

 

[gr8grace3]

John 10:27"My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; 28and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.29"My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. NASV

If you can lose your salvation..how do you explain away the above verse?

By pitting scripture against scripture. Since its been posted already........Heb 6:4-6.

Just pit a ambiguous verse, that SEEMS to teach what we want it teach ,against a clear and concise verse.

I can now say," Did God really mean NEVER perish?" John 10:28

 

[dianegcook]

John 10:27"My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; 28and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.29"My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. NASV

If you can lose your salvation..how do you explain away the above verse?

I would say, are you His sheep and do you hear His voice and do you follow Him?
A lot of different doctrines going around, but all claim, they hear His voice, some must be wrong.

 

[Malachi]

If they shall fall away

That's an "if". A hypothetical.

The question is "Will the genuine sheep fall away?" And the answer is "They cannot because they are in the Shepherd's hands" (as noted above) and the Shepherd rebukes and chastens and disciplines those who stray. "As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten".

Paul also told those Hebrew Christians that his expectation of them is that they would not be included in those who fall way. Please note (v 9): But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak.

 

[Mike S]

That's an "if". A hypothetical.

The question is "Will the genuine sheep fall away?" And the answer is "They cannot because they are in the Shepherd's hands" (as noted above) and the Shepherd rebukes and chastens and disciplines those who stray. "As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten".

That's the OSAS escape hatch. "Oh, that Christian fell away from faith and lost his salvation?" "No, That just means he wasn't genuinely saved." So,you either are saved and stay saved, or you were never really saved to begin with. No lose logic.

 

[Malachi]

So,you either are saved and stay saved, or you were never really saved to begin with. No lose logic.

And well supported by Scripture. Since no one can earn the gift of eternal life, no one can lose it either. God's gifts and callings are "without repentance" (unchangeable). Not only that but when a child is born it cannot be "unborn". The same principle applies to the New Birth.

 

[JLB]

John 10:27"My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; 28 and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand. 29 "My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. NASV

If you can lose your salvation..how do you explain away the above verse?

27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand. John 10:27-29

• Hear His voice.
• Follow Him wherever He went. [If we follow Jesus today, we would just stand behind His throne in Heaven.]

This is a direct reference to His disciples, whom He was given by His Father to disciple, then send out.

These disciples were chosen, and were personally discipled by Jesus Christ while He was in the flesh on earth.


And other sheep I have which are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock and one shepherd. John 10:16

• If Sheep were a reference to all Christians, then He would not refer to "other sheep" since "sheep" refers to all Christians.

There are times when what Jesus said, it was directed specifically to His disciples.

16 You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should remain, that whatever you ask the Father in My name He may give you... 27 And you also will bear witness, because you have been with Me from the beginning. John 15:16,27

Not every single Christian was called to be with Jesus, and be personally discipled by Him, while He was in the flesh on this earth.



JLB

 

[WIP]

Oh boy. How many of these OSAS vs nonOSAS threads are needed? You want us to stay busy I guess! This thread had best stay civil and polite or else....
We've got our hands full enough with what is already being discussed.

 

[Mike S]

Oh boy. How many of these OSAS vs nonOSAS threads are needed? You want us to stay busy I guess! This thread had best stay civil and polite or else....
We've got our hands full enough with what is already being discussed.

I felt the same way, but then I saw the thread was started by someone who just joined the forum. He hasn't been part of past discussions.

 

[Jim Parker]

John 10:27"My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; 28and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.29"My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. NASV
If you can lose your salvation..how do you explain away the above verse?

I explain it by reading the rest of the scriptures.
If you do search the scriptures, here's what you will find:

JN 15:1 "I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener. 2 He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit,


5 "I am the vine; you are the branches. If a man remains in me and I in him, he will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. 6 IF ANYONE DOES NOT REMAIN IN ME, HE IS LIKE A BRANCH THAT IS THROWN AWAY AND WITHERS; SUCH BRANCHES ARE PICKED UP, THROWN INTO THE FIRE AND BURNED.


RO 11:17 If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root, 18 do not boast over those branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you. 19 You will say then, "Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in." 20 Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but be afraid. 21 For IF GOD DID NOT SPARE THE NATURAL BRANCHES, HE WILL NOT SPARE YOU EITHER.


22 CONSIDER THEREFORE THE KINDNESS AND STERNNESS OF GOD: STERNNESS TO THOSE WHO FELL, BUT KINDNESS TO YOU, PROVIDED THAT YOU CONTINUE IN HIS KINDNESS. OTHERWISE, YOU ALSO WILL BE CUT OFF.


1CO 9:27 No, I beat my body and make it my slave so that after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified for the prize.

1CO 10:12 So, if you think you are standing firm, becareful that you don't fall!


COL 1:21 Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your evil behavior. 22 But now HE HAS RECONCILED YOU BY CHRIST'S PHYSICAL BODY THROUGH DEATH TO PRESENT YOU HOLY IN HIS SIGHT, WITHOUT BLEMISH AND FREE FROM ACCUSATION-- 23 IFYOU CONTINUE IN YOUR FAITH, established and firm, not moved from the hope held out in the gospel.


HEB 3:12 See to it, brothers, that none of you has a sinful, unbelieving heart that turns away from the living God. 13 But encourage one another daily, as long as it is called Today, so that none of you may be hardened by sin's deceitfulness. 14 WE HAVE COME TO SHARE IN CHRIST IFWE HOLD FIRMLY TILL THE END THE CONFIDENCE WE HAD AT FIRST.


HEB 6:4 It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, 6 IFTHEY FALL AWAY, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.


PHP 3:7 But whatever was to my profit I now consider loss for the sake of Christ. 8 What is more, I consider everything a loss compared to the surpassing greatness of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them rubbish, that I may gain Christ 9 and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ--the righteousness that comes from God and is by faith. 10 I want to know Christ and the power of his resurrection and the fellowship of sharing in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, 11 and so, somehow, to attain to the resurrection from the dead.



12 Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already been made perfect, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. 13 Brothers, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, 14 I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.


2PE 1:5 For this very reason, make every effort to add to your faith goodness; and to goodness, knowledge; 6 and to knowledge, self-control; and to self-control, perseverance; and to perseverance, godliness; 7 and to godliness, brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness, love. 8 For if you possess these qualities in increasing measure, they will keep you from being ineffective and unproductive in your knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 But if anyone does not have them, he is nearsighted and blind, and has forgotten that he has been cleansed from his past sins.


10 Therefore, my brothers, be all the more eager to make your calling and election sure. For IFYOU DO THESE THINGS, YOU WILL NEVER FALL,


2PE 2: 20 IF THEY HAVE ESCAPED THE CORRUPTION OF THE WORLD BY KNOWING OUR LORD AND SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST AND ARE AGAIN ENTANGLED IN IT AND OVERCOME, THEY ARE WORSE OFF AT THE END THAN THEY WERE AT THE BEGINNING. 21 It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them.


EZE 18:24 "But if a righteous man turns from his righteousness and commits sin and does the same detestable things the wicked man does, will he live? None of the righteous things he has done will be remembered. Because of the unfaithfulness he is guilty of and because of the sins he has committed, he will die.”

 

[dianegcook]

I explain it by reading the rest of the scriptures.
If you do search the scriptures, here's what you will find:

JN 15:1 "I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener. 2 He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit,


5 "I am the vine; you are the branches. If a man remains in me and I in him, he will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. 6 IF ANYONE DOES NOT REMAIN IN ME, HE IS LIKE A BRANCH THAT IS THROWN AWAY AND WITHERS; SUCH BRANCHES ARE PICKED UP, THROWN INTO THE FIRE AND BURNED.


RO 11:17 If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root, 18 do not boast over those branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you. 19 You will say then, "Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in." 20 Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but be afraid. 21 For IF GOD DID NOT SPARE THE NATURAL BRANCHES, HE WILL NOT SPARE YOU EITHER.


22 CONSIDER THEREFORE THE KINDNESS AND STERNNESS OF GOD: STERNNESS TO THOSE WHO FELL, BUT KINDNESS TO YOU, PROVIDED THAT YOU CONTINUE IN HIS KINDNESS. OTHERWISE, YOU ALSO WILL BE CUT OFF.


1CO 9:27 No, I beat my body and make it my slave so that after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified for the prize.

1CO 10:12 So, if you think you are standing firm, becareful that you don't fall!


COL 1:21 Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your evil behavior. 22 But now HE HAS RECONCILED YOU BY CHRIST'S PHYSICAL BODY THROUGH DEATH TO PRESENT YOU HOLY IN HIS SIGHT, WITHOUT BLEMISH AND FREE FROM ACCUSATION-- 23 IFYOU CONTINUE IN YOUR FAITH, established and firm, not moved from the hope held out in the gospel.


HEB 3:12 See to it, brothers, that none of you has a sinful, unbelieving heart that turns away from the living God. 13 But encourage one another daily, as long as it is called Today, so that none of you may be hardened by sin's deceitfulness. 14 WE HAVE COME TO SHARE IN CHRIST IFWE HOLD FIRMLY TILL THE END THE CONFIDENCE WE HAD AT FIRST.


HEB 6:4 It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, 6 IFTHEY FALL AWAY, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.


PHP 3:7 But whatever was to my profit I now consider loss for the sake of Christ. 8 What is more, I consider everything a loss compared to the surpassing greatness of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them rubbish, that I may gain Christ 9 and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ--the righteousness that comes from God and is by faith. 10 I want to know Christ and the power of his resurrection and the fellowship of sharing in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, 11 and so, somehow, to attain to the resurrection from the dead.



12 Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already been made perfect, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. 13 Brothers, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, 14 I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.


2PE 1:5 For this very reason, make every effort to add to your faith goodness; and to goodness, knowledge; 6 and to knowledge, self-control; and to self-control, perseverance; and to perseverance, godliness; 7 and to godliness, brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness, love. 8 For if you possess these qualities in increasing measure, they will keep you from being ineffective and unproductive in your knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 But if anyone does not have them, he is nearsighted and blind, and has forgotten that he has been cleansed from his past sins.


10 Therefore, my brothers, be all the more eager to make your calling and election sure. For IFYOU DO THESE THINGS, YOU WILL NEVER FALL,


2PE 2: 20 IF THEY HAVE ESCAPED THE CORRUPTION OF THE WORLD BY KNOWING OUR LORD AND SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST AND ARE AGAIN ENTANGLED IN IT AND OVERCOME, THEY ARE WORSE OFF AT THE END THAN THEY WERE AT THE BEGINNING. 21 It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them.


EZE 18:24 "But if a righteous man turns from his righteousness and commits sin and does the same detestable things the wicked man does, will he live? None of the righteous things he has done will be remembered. Because of the unfaithfulness he is guilty of and because of the sins he has committed, he will die.”

 

[By Grace]

Oh boy. How many of these OSAS vs nonOSAS threads are needed? You want us to stay busy I guess! This thread had best stay civil and polite or else....
We've got our hands full enough with what is already being discussed.

I am solidly entrenched on one side of the OSAS debate, but the details of which side are irrelevant. From what WIP posted, there are two things that are apparent on this site, and I might add on other sites which permit the debate of the issue of OSAS:

1) It is a very divisive issue
2) It is an issue for which each side claims Scripture, (to differing degrees)
3) There are posters who will not change their position, who are as entrenched as I am on my side​

Therefore, I ask if it is an exercise in futility, and perhaps a bit delusional to believe that you who do not have the skills or scholarship of the original proponents of the different sides, (NONE of us do) can change the mind of someone on who has dug in his/her heels on their particular side of the fence as you have on your side?

So when the discussion becomes uncivil or impolite, as WIP noted it has done so in the past, who "wins"? Who gets built up if their deeply cherished beliefs are thrashed by another?

Do we dare to think or say that the other person on the different side of the OSAS discussion is a heretic, or not going to heaven? Do we dare say that the blood of Jesus is insufficient for their sins to be atoned for since they are on the different side of the fence?

When we can all admit that for now, "we see through a glass darkly, " but will see clearly when face-to-face with Jesus why should the fact that the verses supporting our side of the fence and the verses that support the person on the other side of the fence come from the same Bible, and that those verses were inspired by the same Holy Spirit to write a perfect representation of what God the Father wanted to be written, then we will cease making enemies of our brother or sister.

THAT is the reason why I see the discussion of such things as OSAS unprofitable, and bordering on creating unnecessary schisms which divide the body of Christ.

If you believe I am in error on that, tell me why, but do not expect me to tell you on which of the side of the fence I stand.

 

[GodsGrace]

John 10:27"My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; 28and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.29"My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. NASV

If you can lose your salvation..how do you explain away the above verse?

It's interesting how one can interpret scripture based on preconceptions one has, or how one comes to believe certain concepts - even concepts that are not perfectly clear.

For instance, I heard recently of a Priest who is teaching annihalism. Interesting in and of itself. So if I read your scripture with this in mind, I could come up with: Jesus gives eternal life to those who believe in Him and they will never be annihalated.

But since Jesus Himself speaks of condemnation and the broad way that leads to destruction. Mathew 7:13, I'll have to explain it like this:
My sheep hear my voice and I know them, and they follow me:
Let him who has ears, hear. Mathew 11:15 Not all will hear. There are different flocks of sheep. Sheep will be familiar with the voice of their shepherd. We will know our shepherd's voice. He'll be calling us and telling us what to do to stay close to Him. Hearing Him and following Him will make us His sheep.

I know them:
From the beginning of time God foreknew who would choose Him. Romans 8:29 God not only foreknew, but he also predestined those who would choose Him to be conformed to the image of His Son. The predestination is in the conforming of the reborn to the image of the son - God is not choosing who will be saved. He only knew in advance who would be. We can also say that Jesus knows who is following Him and who is not.

And they follow me:
Interesting word "follow". First of all, why do sheep follow the shephard? Because they get lost on their own. They might wander off into danger. Wolves, clifts, dogs. Instead the shepherd leads them to green pastures (no, really) where they could feed on sweet grass and flowers. They could rest knowing that they are well taken care of. Unfortunately, they don't appreciate this unless they DO wander off into danger.

And I give eternal life to them:
Jesus is the resurrection and the life. He will give to us, through His energy, the power of resurrection after death, to our glorified body (at the end times) and life eternal. John 11:25 and John 6:51

And they will never perish:
When we become a child of God and are trusting in Him for our salvation, we can be sure that He will be forever present in the person of the Holy Spirit to keep us safe in His hands and that He will never change His mind in regard to our salvation. Of course, we could change OUR mind. If WE decide to leave God and abandon His way and refuse to follow Him and do not listen to His voice and refuse to hear it, how will He save us from those dangers where lost sheep tread? HE will never leave us, but we CAN leave Him. We are not forced or coerced into serving God, and will not be forced to continue in that service. If we were, we would not have free will.
2 Peter 2:20-22

And no one will snatch them out of my hand... My Father is greater than all...
No one, or no force, can snatch us out of God's hand unless it is our will. Satan can try many ways to snatch us out of God's hand, but it's up to our will to remain safe with the Holy Spirit. Christ went to the cross so that we may be safe in God's hands - we just need to trust in Jesus' redeeming sacrifice. God is stronger than any force trying to snatch us away. 1 John 4:4

I believe salvation can be lost, although it seems unlikely to me once we have experimented the love of Jesus.
John 6:68

And this is how I would explain your verse, John 10:27.

Wondering

 

[GodsGrace]

I am solidly entrenched on one side of the OSAS debate, but the details of which side are irrelevant. From what WIP posted, there are two things that are apparent on this site, and I might add on other sites which permit the debate of the issue of OSAS:

1) It is a very divisive issue
2) It is an issue for which each side claims Scripture, (to differing degrees)
3) There are posters who will not change their position, who are as entrenched as I am on my side​

Therefore, I ask if it is an exercise in futility, and perhaps a bit delusional to believe that you who do not have the skills or scholarship of the original proponents of the different sides, (NONE of us do) can change the mind of someone on who has dug in his/her heels on their particular side of the fence as you have on your side?

So when the discussion becomes uncivil or impolite, as WIP noted it has done so in the past, who "wins"? Who gets built up if their deeply cherished beliefs are thrashed by another?

Do we dare to think or say that the other person on the different side of the OSAS discussion is a heretic, or not going to heaven? Do we dare say that the blood of Jesus is insufficient for their sins to be atoned for since they are on the different side of the fence?

When we can all admit that for now, "we see through a glass darkly, " but will see clearly when face-to-face with Jesus why should the fact that the verses supporting our side of the fence and the verses that support the person on the other side of the fence come from the same Bible, and that those verses were inspired by the same Holy Spirit to write a perfect representation of what God the Father wanted to be written, then we will cease making enemies of our brother or sister.

THAT is the reason why I see the discussion of such things as OSAS unprofitable, and bordering on creating unnecessary schisms which divide the body of Christ.

If you believe I am in error on that, tell me why, but do not expect me to tell you on which of the side of the fence I stand.

I agree with you By Grace
OTOH, it helps yourself also to discuss what you believe. Someone might say something that sparks a thought.
I haven't been here that long so this is new to me - that might have something to do with my thoughts too.

I don't think discussing anything about God is futile. I might have a different opinion a year from now!

Wondering

 

[Cygnus]

Hebrews 6:4-6
4For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, 5And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, 6If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

That's a wonderful verse.....but I can present 4 interpretations for that verse.
Considering to claim this verse suggest you can loose your salvation....which is in strong contradiction to getting snatched out of Jesus' hand, I would have to think your interpretation is incorrect.

Is the author of Hebrews talking about a christian that has committed apostasy or a person who is a member of a church with a false proclamation of faith? The wheat and the tares? Those false proclaimers can be partakers of the list in Heb 6:4-6....

But is about christians? Could it be imposible to renew them to repentance? This opens the question....what is repentance? There are two types of repentance. One type of repentance is a repentance of ...contrition,... the repentance of Godliness, a broken and contrite heart, the fruit of a person in the Holy Spirit or the repentance of ...attrition....repentance motivated by the fear of punishment.

Another possibility is also from the time of Hebrews. When people of the church were being killed for the name of Christ. Some of those christions were given up by people from within the church and removed....is it possible it would be impossible for them to be restored to the church fellowship?

Another candidate was those that returned to the Jewish ways...embracing the Judaizers ways.

Or, Hebrews speaking in terms of "IF" you could repudiate Christ...you would be lost with no chance of repentance.

So, Mike S, you posted the verse as if it spoke for itself...how do we know your interpretation is correct considering it contradicts not being snatched from Jesus' hand?

 

[Cygnus]

By pitting scripture against scripture. Since its been posted already........Heb 6:4-6.

Just pit a ambiguous verse, that SEEMS to teach what we want it teach ,against a clear and concise verse.

I can now say," Did God really mean NEVER perish?" John 10:28

To you I say, read my post above to Mike S. It also answers your claim it is a "clear and concise verse".

 

[Cygnus]

Oh boy. How many of these OSAS vs nonOSAS threads are needed? You want us to stay busy I guess! This thread had best stay civil and polite or else....
We've got our hands full enough with what is already being discussed.

That may be true....your tired of this topic....but I have not seen an answer to being able to be snatched from Jesus' hand.
So far all I have seen is verses posted in contradiction to being snatched from Jesus' hand.

That's why I asked....what does being snatched from Jesus' hand mean? I wifh someone would address the opening post.

 

[smaller]

That's the OSAS escape hatch. "Oh, that Christian fell away from faith and lost his salvation?" "No, That just means he wasn't genuinely saved." So,you either are saved and stay saved, or you were never really saved to begin with. No lose logic.

No, it's not. The writer of Hebrews deployed an ALLEGORY in that stretch. So it must be understood ALLEGORICALLY. I'll highlight the allegorical terms here first:

Heb. 6:
7 For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:
8 But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

All we have to do to sort through this is to insert Paul's depiction of himself into the above equation to see MORE clearly into this obvious ALLEGORY:

2 Corinthians 12:7
And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

Yes, these THORNS can GROW in the flesh, choke out the ground, and THEIR END is in fact to be BURNED in the infamous LoF.

And we are well warned that this can and does happen. It by no means would have meant that Paul could have ever been lost. He may however have been taken out of the game, in his ground, his body, while still on earth from the work of the Gospel, had he not attended to the matters. He points to the same things again in 2 Tim. 2:20-21, for believers. And also in many other scriptures. That's why Paul is a hard dude to understand. He was a MASTER of ALLEGORY. (See his finest piece on allegory in Gal. 4). It's identical to Hebrews, if we "get" Paul's drift.