Bible Study One Or Two Gospels In The New Testament?

[Terral]

Greetings:

This thread is dedicated to Debate over the differences between the ‘gospel of the kingdom’ and Paul’s ‘word of the cross’ gospel messages.

My hypothesis is that God gathered members to the kingdom ‘bride’ (John 3:29) through the first gospel described below and members to the mystery ‘body of Christ’ (Ephesians 4:12) through Paul’s Gospel #2. My conclusion is that men have been mixing the doctrinal components of these two messages together in order to create many false gospels that God sent to NOBODY.

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No one has been saved by this gospel message for almost 2000 years. Our gospel for today is #2 below:
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#1. Gospel of the Kingdom (Matthew 4:23 , 9:35, 24:14, Acts 8:12). Gospel to the Circumcised. Gal. 2:7.

1. The good news that the ‘kingdom of heaven’ is ‘at hand’ (Matthew 3:2, 4:17, 10:7). i.e., ‘preaching the kingdom.’ Acts 20:25.
2. According to Prophecy; seen by the OT Prophets. Isaiah 40:3, Malachi 3:1.
3. Repentance with the confession of sins. Mark 1:4
4. Water baptism (during confession) for the ‘forgiveness of sins.’ Mark 1:4, Acts 2:38. (John’s Baptism; Acts 19:3; name of the Father; John 1:6, 33, Matthew 28:19.)
5. Baptism in the ‘name of the Lord Jesus’ (Acts 8:16, 19:5), ‘name of the Son’ (Matthew 28:19)
6. Receive the Spirit through the baptism in the ‘name of the Holy Spirit’ (Matthew 28:19) through the laying of hands (Acts 8:17, Acts 19:6).
7. Justified by ‘works and not by faith alone.’ James 2:20-24.
8. Kingdom disciples are under Mosaic Law (Matthew 5:18, James 2:10).

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This is our “word of the cross†(1Corinthians 1:18) gospel for today, apart from borrowing any works from Gospel #1 above.
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#2. Paul’s “my gospel†(Romans 2:16, 16:25, etc.). Gospel to the Uncircumcised. Galatians 2:7.

1. The gospel of the grace of God. Acts 20:24. (Christ and Him crucified; 1Corinthians 2:2)
2. According to the revelation of the Mystery (Ephesians 6:19); NOT seen by the OT prophets. Romans 16:25.
3. Saved by God’s grace through faith APART from works. Ephesians 2:8+9.
4. Sins forgiven through the redemption IN Christ (Romans 3:24) and His shed blood (Ephesians 1:7).
5. Our ‘one baptism’ (Ephesians 4:5) is done by the ‘one Spirit’ (Ephesians 4:4) into the ‘one body’ (1Corinthians 12:13), which is into “Christ’s body.†1Corinthians 12:27.
6. We receive the Spirit when hearing (Romans 10:17) and believing (Ephesians 1:13+14) Paul’s Gospel by ‘hearing with faith.’ Galatians 3:2.
7. We are justified by faith apart from works. Romans 4:4-6.
8. We are under grace and not under law. Romans 6:14.
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Do these ‘two gospel messages’ exist in our New Testament, or is there truly only ‘one gospel?’

GL in the Debate,

In Christ Jesus,

Terral

 

[thessalonian]

If I might start with a question. What according to you is the "Gospel of God". Is it the Gospel of the Kingdom (according to you), Paul's Gospel? Or another? What is the Gospel of our Lord Jesus and the Gospel of the blessed God?

In fact, let's do it this way. Here are all the names of Gospels by your word splitting tecnique. Tell me which are the same and which are different gospels. Or are they all different?

Matt.4
[23] And he went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues and preaching the gospel of the kingdom and healing every disease and every infirmity among the people.


Matt.26
[13] Truly, I say to you, wherever this gospel is preached in the whole world, what she has done will be told in memory of her."

Mark.1
[1] The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.
[14] Now after John was arrested, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God,
[15] and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent, and believe in the gospel."

Mark.10
[29] Jesus said, "Truly, I say to you, there is no one who has left house or brothers or sisters or mother or father or children or lands, for my sake and for the gospel,

Mark.13
[10] And the gospel must first be preached to all nations.


PLEASE DO TELL WHICH OF THE GOSPELS IS THE GOSPEL TO BE PREACHED TO ALL NATIONS. THANKS.

Mark.14
[9] And truly, I say to you, wherever the gospel is preached in the [/]whole world[/b, what she has done will be told in memory of her."

Same question as above. Is this a different "the gospel" than some of the other "the gospel" s?

Mark.16
[15] And he said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to the whole creation.

ditto.


[40] But Philip was found at Azo'tus, and passing on he preached the gospel to all the towns till he came to Caesare'a.

Which one?

Acts.14
[7] and there they preached the gospel.
[21] When they had preached the gospel to that city and had made many disciples, they returned to Lystra and to Ico'nium and to Antioch,

Which?

Acts.15
[7] And after there had been much debate, Peter rose and said to them, "Brethren, you know that in the early days God made choice among you, that by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe.

Which?

Acts.16
[10] And when he had seen the vision, immediately we sought to go on into Macedo'nia, concluding that God had called us to preach the gospel to them.

Which?

Acts.20
[24] But I do not account my life of any value nor as precious to myself, if only I may accomplish my course and the ministry which I received from the Lord Jesus, to testify to the gospel of the grace of God.

Is this the same as "my gospel"?


Rom.1
[1] Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, set apart for the ospel of God

Same as?

[3] the gospel concerning his Son who was descended from David according to the flesh

Which?

[9] For God is my witness, whom I serve with my spirit in the gospel of his Son, that without ceasing I mention you always in my prayers,
[

Rom.10
[16] But they have not all obeyed the gospel; for Isaiah says, "Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?"

For completeness I leave this in.

Rom 15
[19] by the power of signs and wonders, by the power of the Holy Spirit, so that from Jerusalem and as far round as Illyr'icum I have fully preached the gospel of Christ,

Is this a different one?



1Cor.9
[12] If others share this rightful claim upon you, do not we still more? Nevertheless, we have not made use of this right, but we endure anything rather than put an obstacle in the way of the gospel of Christ.

Which???



[
2Cor.4
[3] And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled only to those who are perishing.


Another?

[4] In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the likeness of God.

Another?

quote]from the one you accepted, you submit to it readily enough.




[7] Did I commit a sin in abasing myself so that you might be exalted, because I preached God's gospel without cost to you?

Is the Gospel of the Kingdom not God's Gospel?


Gal.2


Eph.1
[13] In him you also, who have heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and have believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,

Another?

Eph.6
[15] and having shod your feet with the equipment of the gospel of peace;

Another?


2Thes.1
[8] inflicting vengeance upon those who do not know God and upon those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus.

Another?


1Tim.1
[11] in accordance with the glorious gospel of the blessed God with which I have been entrusted.

Another?



2Cor.4

[4] In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the likeness of God.

Another?

Eph.1
[13] In him you also, who have heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and have believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,

Another?


Thanks for your time.

By the way don't mistake what I have said. I do agree there is a difference between the gospel Christ preached and the one that Paul preached. But not because they are different Gospels but because they are the same Gospel preached from a different angle. One looking forward and one looking back. The forward looking one is a subset of the other because the full Gospel had not yet been completed.

 

[Terral]

The Gospel Of The Kingdom VERSUS Our Gospel For Today

Hi Thessalonian:

Thank you very much for writing on the Gospels Debate Thread.

Thessalonian >> If I might start with a question. What according to you is the "Gospel of God".

First of all, if you are going to send a Biblical Question to this side of the discussion, then please include Scriptural references. Your questions are much easily answered when you “quote >>†from the Opening Post or any subsequent reply to give your question context. Otherwise I must give the elements of your question my own context. I will assume that your question relates to Mark 1:14-15 and the “Gospel of God†that Christ Himself preached for years prior to dying for anyone. The “Good News†of God in those verses is that the kingdom of heaven was indeed ‘at hand’ (Matthew 4:23). John the Baptist and now Christ Himself were calling Israel to become the prophesied “kingdom of priests†(Exodus 19:6), as the Lord was betrothing (Hosea 2:19-20) Israel to Himself through their obedience to the “Gospel of the Kingdom.†Matthew 9:35. Zacharias was prophesying of John the Baptist, saying,

"And you, child, will be called the prophet of the Most High; For you will go on before the Lord to prepare His ways; to give His people the knowledge of salvation by the forgiveness of their sins . . .â€Â. Luke 1:76-77.

John the Baptist began fulfilling that prophecy in Mark 1:4-5 by preaching water baptism for the forgiveness of sins:

“John the Baptist appeared in the wilderness preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins. And all the country of Judea was going out to him, and all the people of Jerusalem; and they were being baptized by him in the Jordan River, confessing their sins.†Mark 1:4-5.

Christ came along and preached the same “Gospel of God†in the following verses of Mark 1:14-15, which is the “Gospel of the Kingdom†from Gospel #1 of the Opening Post (OP). The difference is that the baptism in the name of Jesus and the Holy Spirit (#5 +#6 of Gospel #1) become part of the “Gospel of the Kingdom†on the Day of Pentecost. Nobody could offer the Holy Spirit through the laying of hands (Acts 8:17, Acts 19:6), until after Christ ascended to send the “Helper†(John 16:7) “from the Father†(John 15:26). Therefore, the first doctrinal outline from the OP is accurate for the ‘gospel of the kingdom,’ as it was preached from the Day of Pentecost to the time this kingdom church was ‘cut off’ (Revelation 20:4) between 70 AD and 100 AD.

Thessalonian >> Is it the Gospel of the Kingdom (according to you), Paul's Gospel? Or another?

Paul’s Gospel is described by Gospel #2 in the OP above. Since you see the ‘gospel of the kingdom’ appearing in Scripture before the crucifixion (Matthew 4:23, etc.), then obviously that is not “Christ and Him Crucified†(1 Corinthians 2:2) from the Pauline Epistles. Paul’s “my gospel†(Romans 2:16, Romans 16:25) was revealed to him through a ‘revelation of Jesus Christ’ (Galatians 1:11-12) and is the ‘only Gospel’ of his thirteen letters to the Gentiles. Note carefully that Paul is submitting this ‘gospel I preach among the Gentiles’ (Galatians 2:2) to this same Peter and John (Galatians 2:9) who have been preaching the ‘gospel of the kingdom’ since the beginning. Paul calls his gospel the ‘gospel to the UNcircumcised’ (Galatians 2:7), but Christ sent the Twelve only to Jews preaching the ‘gospel of the kingdom’ here, saying,

“These twelve Jesus sent out after instructing them: "Do not go in the way of the Gentiles, and do not enter any city of the Samaritans; but rather go to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. "And as you go, preach, saying, 'The kingdom of heaven is at hand.'†Matthew 10:5-7.

We know this is the “gospel of the kingdom†(Matthew 9:35) by comparing the exact words to John’s in Matthew 3:2 and Christ’s in Matthew 4:17, which Scripture calls the “gospel of the kingdom†inMatthew 4:23. How are you going to prove that Paul’s “gospel to the UNcircumcised†is the same gospel Christ is sending to Israel only in Matthew 10:5-7? Good Luck. If everyone is preaching the same Gospel in Acts, then Paul had nothing to submit (Galatians 2:2) in the first place.

Thank you for writing and asking these very good questions,

In Christ Jesus through Paul’s Gospel,

Terral

 

[thessalonian]

First of all, if you are going to send a Biblical Question to this side of the discussion, then please include Scriptural references.

I believe I did. See above. Perhaps you got my post before I edited it. Do you think I am making them up?

 

[thessalonian]

So the "Gospel of God" is always the Gospel that Christ preached, which is different from the Gospel that Paul preached?

 

[Terral]

The Gospel Of The Kingdom VERSUS Our Gospel For Today II

Hi Thessalonian:

You added to your recent post above.

Thessalonian >> In fact, let's do it this way. Here are all the names of Gospels by your word splitting technique. Tell me which are the same and which are different gospels. Or are they all different? (snip)

How about you quote from either my hypothesis, supporting statements or conclusions from the Opening Post of ‘this’ thread and I am happy to present arguments against your opposing views. If you never quote anything from the Opening Post and offer opposing arguments, then everything there continues to stand. The “Gospel of the Kingdom†(#1 from OP) is the gospel of the Four Gospels, Acts and Hebrews – Revelation. Paul’s Gospel (#2 from OP) is the gospel of his Gentile Epistles. Paul’s gospel is called the ‘gospel of the grace of God’ in Acts 20:24, and he speaks of ‘preaching the kingdom’ (Acts 20:25), which is the ‘gospel of the kingdom,’ in describing the ‘whole purpose of God’ (Acts 20:27).

Thessalonian >> PLEASE DO TELL WHICH OF THE GOSPELS IS THE GOSPEL TO BE PREACHED TO ALL NATIONS. THANKS. (snip)

Please do not try to tell this side of the discussion how to write his posts (All CAPS = not nice). Just quote anything from the OP and present your own case using Scripture in any way you wish. My statements in the OP could not be more clear: “This thread is dedicated to Debate over the differences between the ‘gospel of the kingdom’ and Paul’s ‘word of the cross’ gospel messages.†Those things are listed for you clearly in the OP. Please start your own thread another topic if you wish.

Thessalonian >> Thanks for your time. By the way don't mistake what I have said. I do agree there is a difference between the gospel Christ preached and the one that Paul preached. But not because they are different Gospels but because they are the same Gospel preached from a different angle. One looking forward and one looking back. The forward looking one is a subset of the other because the full Gospel had not yet been completed.

Those things are easy to say, but where is your doctrinal outline teaching that ‘one gospel’ in a list of precepts like those in the OP of this thread? Please provide that at your earliest convenience and perhaps that evidence will withstand the test of Debate. Did you manage to quote one thing from my OP and disprove anything using Scripture? No. GL in the Debate,

Thank you again for writing on the Gospels Debate Thread,

In Christ Jesus,

Terral

 

[thessalonian]

This thread is dedicated to Debate over the differences between the ‘gospel of the kingdom’ and Paul’s ‘word of the cross’ gospel messages.â€Â

Seems you want to dictate terms of the thread. I believe my post was quite pertinent to the matter at hand. If you can't answer outside of your own proof text verses just admit it and I will move to another thread. Nothing says I have to quote you or refute any particular point, though I am getting to that. Y

 

[thessalonian]

Terral,

All I have asked is that you give me two colums (if you think there are only two gospels) and place the various names that include Gospel in the proper column. It's not difficult and I can't do this for you. For all I know you think there are ten gospels as someone else on the net says there are. Thanks.

 

[Terral]

The Gospel Of The Kingdom VERSUS Our Gospel For Today

Hi Thessalonian:

Thank you for writing.

Thessalonian >> So the "Gospel of God" is always the Gospel that Christ preached, which is different from the Gospel that Paul preached?

Should I stop asking for Scriptural references AND for you to PLEASE “quote me >>,†when asking questions? How difficult can it be to simply add “Mark 1:14-15" to your “Gospel of God†reference? Is that what you are asking about??? That must be your reference, because Christ is still walking around and preaching. Christ is preaching the prophetic Kingdom of the Old Testament being “AT HAND.†My descriptions of Gospel #1 of the OP cannot be written in simpler terms. I have quoted and explained Mark 1:14-15 to you already. THAT is the ‘gospel of God’ that Christ Himself is preaching to Israel ONLY. What is Christ’s testimony about the people two whom He was sent??

“But He answered and said, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel." Matthew 15:24.

Christ sent the Twelve preaching the gospel of the kingdom to ISRAEL ONLY in Matthew 10:5-7 also. Paul’s “my gospel†is called the “gospel to the UNCIRCUMCISED.†Galatians 2:7. Are the CAPS helping any? We should all be able to agree that Christ did not send these Twelve members of ISRAEL to preach the ‘gospel to the UNCIRCUMCISED’ to Israel ONLY in the Four Gospels. That is just simple common sense . . . Gospel #1 from the OP WAS seen by the OT Prophets, who saw John the Baptist (Isaiah 40:3) and the Lord (Malachi 3:1) coming to His Temple. Prophecy sees the Kingdom of Priests (Exodus 19:6) and the Bridegroom betrothing (Hosea 2:19-20) His bride (John 3:29). NONE of the prophets saw Paul, or our mystery church (Ephesians 5:32), or our gospel that is “according to the revelation of the mystery.†Romans 16:25. Otherwise Paul would have said that his gospel was according to PROPHECY.

These two gospel messages are different, because the first (gospel of the kingdom) was seen and Paul’s was not. The first includes water for forgiveness (Mark 1:4, Acts 2:38) and Paul’s has Christ’s shed blood (Ephesians 1:7). Are you going to try and prove that John the Baptist and Christ are preaching forgiveness through Christ’s shed blood in Mark 1??? Good Luck! How are you going to even begin, when the women show up at the tomb in Mark 16? What do you intend on forcing into Christ’s mouth in Mark 1? Shall He say “Crucify Me for your salvation?!†Please . . . Paul’s gospel is that Christ died for our sins and that God raised Him from the dead (1 Corinthians 15:3-4) as a PAST EVENT. Christ’s good news in Mark 1 is that the kingdom of God was then ‘at hand.’ Christ could not ask anyone to place faith in something taking place three years in the future, when these same Jews were to accept Him as the Messiah of the SAME KINGDOM. Israel had to reject Christ first for the provision of Paul’s Gospel to be made for everyone who believes. That provision of Christ’s shed blood is not even available to anyone in Mark 1, which will find your ‘one gospel’ theory laying flat on its back every time. Good luck making your case, because proving the ‘one gospel’ MYTH is very much impossible using Scripture.

GL in the Debate and thank you again for writing on the Gospels Debate Thread,

In Christ Jesus,

Terral

 

[thessalonian]

Should I stop asking for Scriptural references

Christ is preaching the prophetic Kingdom of the Old Testament being “AT HAND.â€Â

:

:-D

 

[thessalonian]

Terral,

Are "God's Gospel" and "the Gospel of God" the same or different Gospels? I quoted them above. You can figure it out I suspect.

 

[thessalonian]

Are there two different Gospels of God?

Mark.1
[14] Now after John was arrested, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God,

Rom.1
[1] Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, set apart for the gospel of God

1Thes.2
[2] but though we had already suffered and been shamefully treated at Philip'pi, as you know, we had courage in our God to declare to you the gospel of God in the face of great opposition.

1Pet.4
[17] For the time has come for judgment to begin with the household of God; and if it begins with us, what will be the end of those who do not obey the gospel of God?

 

[Terral]

The Gospel Of The Kingdom VERSUS Our Gospel For Today

Hi Thessalonian:

Thank you for writing.

Thessalonian >> Seems you want to dictate terms of the thread.

My hypothesis, supporting statements and conclusions appear in the Opening Post of this thread and can be challenged by any registered member of this fine Board. All you have to do to participate is “quote me >>†and show any errors using Scripture. I am here to defend the positions presented in the OP of this thread, apart from going where others might like to carry the topic. Your off topic comments that address nothing in my Opening Post add nothing to this discussion.

Thessalonian >> I believe my post was quite pertinent to the matter at hand.

Congratulations. All of that nonsense remains standing in your post above for everyone to see. What have you quoted and proven errant from the OP? Nothing. Have you presented a ‘one gospel’ doctrinal outline to counter mine from the OP? No. The two gospel outlines in the OP contain directly opposing doctrinal components, which speak to the fact that those messages are indeed different. Those are the ‘pertinent’ matters at hand on this thread.

Thessalonian >> If you can't answer outside of your own proof text verses just admit it and I will move to another thread.

You will not find hijacking any of my threads very easy. Those underhanded tactics might work elsewhere, but your ‘one gospel’ argument will either withstand the test of Debate on this thread or it will not; if you ever get around to making a case. This side will not be holding his breath. If you have no case to present, the I will thank you for posting your chat someplace else.

Thessalonian >> Nothing says I have to quote you or refute any particular point, though I am getting to that.

We agree. The only reason to quote me and try to attack the ‘two gospel’ hypothesis of my OP is if you feel capable in doing so. If your ‘one gospel’ interpretation is indeed correct (not), then your task of dismantling my errant statements in the OP should be very easy indeed. However, all of this strutting around and posturing is just more evidence that you have no “one gospel†case to present at all.

Thessalonian >> All I have asked is that you give me two colums (if you think there are only two gospels) and place the various names that include Gospel in the proper column.

I keep asking you to “quote me >>†from whatever you find errant about the two gospel outlines of the OP to then give us your thoughtful reply. All of your opposing points to my hypothesis are being addressed and all of my positions are holding firm. Are the readers any more informed about your ‘one gospel’ theory? No. I cannot even quote one thing you have written on that topic. Ask 1000 questions if you like and anything you say that challenges my hypothesis in the OP will most certainly be answered.

Thessalonian >> It's not difficult and I can't do this for you. For all I know you think there are ten gospels as someone else on the net says there are. Thanks.

No sir. Only two gospels are given in the OP of this thread. You are not here to debate the topic at all, but to try and muddy the water with everything else. Your own premise appears to be that only one gospel exists in the NT. Great! Where is your post describing that gospel message? How are sins forgiven? How do believers receive the Holy Spirit? How are they justified? Was your gospel seen by the Prophets or what that a mystery revealed later? Are your believers under the Law or not? All of those things and more are answered concerning ‘both’ gospel messages of the NT in the OP of this thread for the prophetic kingdom bride (Gospel #1) and the mystery grace body (Gospel #2). Do you see ten doctrinal outlines in the OP? No. Let’s get real then . . .

Thessalonian >> Are there two different Gospels of God?

Yes. They are described in the OP of this thread.

GL in the Debate and thank you again for writing,

In Christ,

Terral

 

[thessalonian]

I quote scripture, ask questions, and you cry foul. I won't play your silly game. The Gospel of the Kingdom is called that because it was the predessor to Christ establishing the kingdom.

Col.1
[13] He has delivered us from the dominion of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son,

It was no longer called that afterward because the kingdom had been established. It is not a different gospel but the same one looking forward.


By the way you pit James against Paul but forget about this passage among others.

Romans 2
[4] Or do you presume upon the riches of his kindness and forbearance and patience? Do you not know that God's kindness is meant to lead you to repentance?
[5] But by your hard and impenitent heart you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of wrath when God's righteous judgment will be revealed.
[6] For he will render to every man according to his works:
[7] to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life;
[8] but for those who are factious and do not obey the truth, but obey wickedness, there will be wrath and fury.

God of course will give grace to the one in his grace to do this good but I certainly wouldn't go before the pearly gates without them. James and Paul agree. They are preaching the SAME gospel. And it is the same in Matt 25, the sheep and the goats. I am quite sure you can look that up yourself. It's likely in your bible.

You think you can come on this board and bully me in to debating the way you think I should. By the way I don't see any scripture in your last post. Now this is my last post in this thread. I don't waste my time with boorish controlling dictators.

Blessings

 

[Terral]

The Gospel Of The Kingdom VERSUS Our Gospel For Today

Hi Thessalonian:

Thank you for writing on the Gospels Debate Thread.

Thessalonian >> I quote scripture, ask questions, and you cry foul. I won't play your silly game.

Thank is completely up to you. I am sorry your attempts to hijack this thread did not pay dividends this time around. Everything you have said against my two gospels hypothesis has been addressed to my satisfaction.

Thessalonian >> The Gospel of the Kingdom is called that because it was the predessor to Christ establishing the kingdom. (snip Colossians 1, Romans 2).

Scripture describes the “gospel of the kingdom†perfectly in the Four Gospels, as I have given the doctrinal components in Gospel #1 of the OP. Perhaps you are currently unaware that any gospel message is taught in precepts for that particular “doctrine of salvation.†Kingdom doctrine for the ‘bride’ (John 3:29) contains directly opposing doctrinal elements from Grace doctrine for the mystery ‘body of Christ’ (Ephesians 4:12). We will explore those differences in a “Churches Debate Thread,†when this thread has run its course. Paul gave grace doctrine to the Colossians and Romans some three decades AFTER Christ is preaching the ‘gospel of God’ in Mark 1:14-15. You are mixing elements related to ‘the mystery’ of Paul’s letters with elements of “prophecy†from the Four Gospels apart from understanding either in a clear light.

Thessalonian >> God of course will give grace to the one in his grace to do this good but I certainly wouldn't go before the pearly gates without them. James and Paul agree. They are preaching the SAME gospel. And it is the same in Matt 25, the sheep and the goats. I am quite sure you can look that up yourself. It's likely in your bible.

Heh . . . do you think? However, your pearly gates have nothing at all to do with anything presented in the OP of this thread describing the two gospels of the New Testament. What have you quoted and proven errant using Scripture? Nothing.

Thessalonian >> You think you can come on this board and bully me in to debating the way you think I should.

No sir. Please write as many of these off topic posts on anything you like. I was trying to help you stay on track of the hypothesis of this thread by asking you to quote me >> and show any errors using Scripture. However, please do not be offended if do not allow you to carry the topic off to SomeWhereElseVille. The Opening Post is not too long and my hypothesis is stated clear as day. You have an opposing view and I would love to see your ‘one gospel’ theory pasted to this thread, so that perhaps we have something to Debate.

If you do find anything out of place or errant about my Opening Post presentation OR you have your own ‘one gospel’ outline to post on this thread, then please be my guest and let’s have fun with it. You do see that Christ preached the ‘gospel of God’ straight out of the box in Mark 1:14-15, because that is in your Bible also. If Christ preached Himself Crucified saying that all believers would gain eternal life and participate in His death, burial and resurrection (Paul’s Gospel), then Satan would have laughed in His face and never crucified Him (1 Corinthians 2:6-8).

Can you understand that very simple concept that God had to keep these things of Paul’s gospel “Hidden In God†(Ephesians 3:9)?? That is the only place that Satan could not look for himself as the “god of this world†(2 Corinthians 4:3-4). Christ preached the ‘gospel of the kingdom,†so Satan crucified the King of that kingdom and the rest is history. God raised Paul up AFTER THE FACT and gave him Gospel #2 from my OP (Galatians 1:11-12). You appear unimpressed by the fact that Paul had to go and submit this “gospel I preach among the Gentiles†(Galatians 2:2) to the same Peter and John (Galatians 2:9) that you say is preaching his gospel. Haaaa! Did Peter preach forgiveness in Christ’s shed blood after Calvary in Acts 2? No! He is still preaching REPENTANCE and BAPTISM (Acts 2:38) like John the Baptist in Mark 1:4. Why? Paul would not tell him about Paul’s gospel until Acts 15 (Galatians 2). You are mixing the doctrinal components of BOTH gospel messages together and the ‘works’ of the first with the second . . . .

Thessalonian >. By the way I don't see any scripture in your last post. Now this is my last post in this thread. I don't waste my time with boorish controlling dictators.

Heh . . . Okay partner. If you will look at everything I quoted from you up there, we see no Scripture in your chat room reply. My case is presented in the OP and you are trying to either support or refute my hypothesis. If you have no case, then my job is already done. Please stop by and present your ‘one gospel’ doctrinal outline if you ever develop one and we will see if that can withstand the test of debte like the two presented above. I will “quote you†and show any errors using Scripture apart from dragging you all over asking a 1000 questions.

Thank you again for writing on the Gospels Debate Thread,

In Christ Jesus through obedience to Paul’s Gospel apart from works,

Terral

 

[thessalonian]

If I might start with a question. What according to you is the "Gospel of God". Is it the Gospel of the Kingdom (according to you), Paul's Gospel? Or another? What is the Gospel of our Lord Jesus and the Gospel of the blessed God?

In fact, let's do it this way. Here are all the names of Gospels by your word splitting tecnique. Tell me which are the same and which are different gospels. Or are they all different?

Matt.4
[23] And he went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues and preaching the gospel of the kingdom and healing every disease and every infirmity among the people.


Matt.26
[13] Truly, I say to you, wherever this gospel is preached in the whole world, what she has done will be told in memory of her."

Mark.1
[1] The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.
[14] Now after John was arrested, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God,
[15] and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent, and believe in the gospel."

Mark.10
[29] Jesus said, "Truly, I say to you, there is no one who has left house or brothers or sisters or mother or father or children or lands, for my sake and for the gospel,

Mark.13
[10] And the gospel must first be preached to all nations.


PLEASE DO TELL WHICH OF THE GOSPELS IS THE GOSPEL TO BE PREACHED TO ALL NATIONS. THANKS.

Mark.14
[9] And truly, I say to you, wherever the gospel is preached in the [/]whole world[/b, what she has done will be told in memory of her."

Same question as above. Is this a different "the gospel" than some of the other "the gospel" s?

Mark.16
[15] And he said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to the whole creation.

ditto.


[40] But Philip was found at Azo'tus, and passing on he preached the gospel to all the towns till he came to Caesare'a.

Which one?

Acts.14
[7] and there they preached the gospel.
[21] When they had preached the gospel to that city and had made many disciples, they returned to Lystra and to Ico'nium and to Antioch,

Which?

Acts.15
[7] And after there had been much debate, Peter rose and said to them, "Brethren, you know that in the early days God made choice among you, that by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe.

Which?

Acts.16
[10] And when he had seen the vision, immediately we sought to go on into Macedo'nia, concluding that God had called us to preach the gospel to them.

Which?

Acts.20
[24] But I do not account my life of any value nor as precious to myself, if only I may accomplish my course and the ministry which I received from the Lord Jesus, to testify to the gospel of the grace of God.

Is this the same as "my gospel"?


Rom.1
[1] Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, set apart for the ospel of God

Same as?

[3] the gospel concerning his Son who was descended from David according to the flesh

Which?

[9] For God is my witness, whom I serve with my spirit in the gospel of his Son, that without ceasing I mention you always in my prayers,
[

Rom.10
[16] But they have not all obeyed the gospel; for Isaiah says, "Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?"

For completeness I leave this in.

Rom 15
[19] by the power of signs and wonders, by the power of the Holy Spirit, so that from Jerusalem and as far round as Illyr'icum I have fully preached the gospel of Christ,

Is this a different one?



1Cor.9
[12] If others share this rightful claim upon you, do not we still more? Nevertheless, we have not made use of this right, but we endure anything rather than put an obstacle in the way of the gospel of Christ.

Which???



[
2Cor.4
[3] And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled only to those who are perishing.


Another?

[4] In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the likeness of God.

Another?

quote]from the one you accepted, you submit to it readily enough.




[7] Did I commit a sin in abasing myself so that you might be exalted, because I preached God's gospel without cost to you?

Is the Gospel of the Kingdom not God's Gospel?


Gal.2


Eph.1
[13] In him you also, who have heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and have believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,

Another?

Eph.6
[15] and having shod your feet with the equipment of the gospel of peace;

Another?


2Thes.1
[8] inflicting vengeance upon those who do not know God and upon those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus.

Another?


1Tim.1
[11] in accordance with the glorious gospel of the blessed God with which I have been entrusted.

Another?



2Cor.4

[4] In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the likeness of God.

Another?

Eph.1
[13] In him you also, who have heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and have believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,

Another?


Thanks for your time.

By the way don't mistake what I have said. I do agree there is a difference between the gospel Christ preached and the one that Paul preached. But not because they are different Gospels but because they are the same Gospel preached from a different angle. One looking forward and one looking back. The forward looking one is a subset of the other because the full Gospel had not yet been completed.

" If you will look at everything I quoted from you up there, we see no Scripture in your chat room reply."


:-?

Oh that's right, bearing false witness is the Old Testament. It's not a part of Paul's Gospel.

 

[thessalonian]

Can you understand that very simple concept that God had to keep these things of Paul’s gospel “Hidden In God†(Ephesians 3:9)?? That is the only place that Satan could not look for himself as the “god of this world†(2 Corinthians 4:3-4). Christ preached the ‘gospel of the kingdom,†so Satan crucified the King of that kingdom and the rest is history. God raised Paul up AFTER THE FACT and gave him Gospel #2 from my OP (Galatians 1:11-12).

So the gospel that Christ preached was not really to be preached to the whole world even though he said it was to be?

Matt.26
[13] Truly, I say to you, wherever this gospel is preached in the whole world, what she has done will be told in memory of her."


Mark.13
[10] And the gospel must first be preached to all nations.

Please answer a question directly for a change instead of crying about how I have not addressed your topic or have not quoted scripture (even though I did).

 

[Terral]

Terral Is Here To Write On "The Topic" Of This Thr

Hi Thessalonian:

Thessalonian >> " If you will look at everything I quoted from you up there, we see no Scripture in your chat room reply."

Did anything you quoted from Scripture apply to one thing presented in the Opening Post of this thread? No. Did you quote ‘one word’ from the Opening Post before rambling on about something else? No. In fact, have you offered us one line of your own “one gospel†doctrinal outline? No. If you cannot quote me >> and find errors in my ‘two gospel’ hypothesis AND cannot draft your own ‘one gospel’ doctrinal outline, then we have nothing to Debate. My case is presented in the Opening Post and nothing you have said addresses ‘the topic’ of this thread. I am happy to quote you and show the errors in your “one gospel†interpretation, if you ever get around to posting one. This one liner post from you is the perfect example of "chat." Please post that elsewhere. TY in advance.

Thank you again for writing on the Gospels Debate Thread,

In Christ,

Terral

 

[thessalonian]

Re: Terral Is Here To Write On "The Topic" Of This

Hi Thessalonian:

Thessalonian >> " If you will look at everything I quoted from you up there, we see no Scripture in your chat room reply."

Did anything you quoted from Scripture apply to one thing presented in the Opening Post of this thread? No. Did you quote ‘one word’ from the Opening Post before rambling on about something else? No. In fact, have you offered us one line of your own “one gospel†doctrinal outline? No. If you cannot quote me >> and find errors in my ‘two gospel’ hypothesis AND cannot draft your own ‘one gospel’ doctrinal outline, then we have nothing to Debate. My case is presented in the Opening Post and nothing you have said addresses ‘the topic’ of this thread. I am happy to quote you and show the errors in your “one gospel†interpretation, if you ever get around to posting one. This one liner post from you is the perfect example of "chat." Please post that elsewhere. TY in advance.

Thank you again for writing on the Gospels Debate Thread,

In Christ,

Terral

Mr Terral,

Of course you do not admit to lying about whether I included scripture in my first post or not. My first post was to clarify my understanding of your position. I quoted various passages that use the word "gospel" in them. Most certainly you will agree that these all give us insight in to what the gospel is. Therefore I wanted to know how you associated them all. You cry foul with another chat room post. Such things are invalid you say in your thread. I do think asking you questions is quite in line with proper debate. Apparently you don't like to answer them however as all you have done is stammer around about how we have not quoted you or refuted you. I will get around to my understanding of the ONE gospel when you answer some of my questions. Until then you are just wasting my time.

 

[thessalonian]

Terral:" If you will look at everything I quoted from you up there, we see no Scripture in your chat room reply."

Thessalonian >> " If you will look at everything I quoted from you up there, we see no Scripture in your chat room reply."


Terral:Did anything you quoted from Scripture apply to one thing presented in the Opening Post of this thread?

Which is it Terral? First you say I quoted no scripture then you backtrack. Is bearing false witness okay today?