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People cant go into churches...

M

mattcandyc

Member
People in Scotland where I stay can't go into churches.
A group of Scottish church leaders has launched a claim for judicial review over the Scottish Minsters’ unprecedented decision to close churches and criminalise public worship during the current lockdown.
Restrictions set forth by First Minister Nicola Sturgeon on Jan. 8 made it a criminal offense in the highest level for churches to meet in-person, even to perform a baptism.

Church officials notified the Scottish Ministers on Jan. 15, pleading for them to re-open churches. They explained that closing churches violates the European Convention of Human Rights law and the Scottish Constitution.

Additionally, the emotional and spiritual needs within the congregation and community cannot be addressed if these restrictions remain in effect.

The church leaders pointed out in their claim they clearly understand the significance of COVID-19 and the difficult decisions the Scottish Government has had to make in an effort to protect communities.

But the church officials say they believe the Scottish Ministers’ have “failed to appreciate that the closure of places of worship is a disproportionate step and one which has serious implications for freedom of religion.”

The Scottish Ministers’ replied by denying the claim and asserted that the state can “regulate the secular activities of Churches…for the purposes of protecting public health” and that churches must “comply with secular law” and remain closed.

According to Christian Legal Centre, Scotland hasn’t attempted to close churches since the 17th century during the persecution of the Presbyterian church.

Now church officials are asking for houses of worship in Scotland to remain open so people can attend services and events without fear of prosecution.

In the claim, the church leaders “hold that public corporate worship, involving the physical gathering together of Christians…are fundamental and indispensable aspects of their religion,” and that “in the absence of the gathered people of God, there is effectively no church.”
Scottish Ministers’ say they are making decisions based on “science” to warrant several lockdown measures, including church closures
 
mattcandyc said:
People in Scotland where I stay can't go into churches.
A group of Scottish church leaders has launched a claim for judicial review over the Scottish Minsters’ unprecedented decision to close churches and criminalise public worship during the current lockdown.
Restrictions set forth by First Minister Nicola Sturgeon on Jan. 8 made it a criminal offense in the highest level for churches to meet in-person, even to perform a baptism.

Church officials notified the Scottish Ministers on Jan. 15, pleading for them to re-open churches. They explained that closing churches violates the European Convention of Human Rights law and the Scottish Constitution.

Additionally, the emotional and spiritual needs within the congregation and community cannot be addressed if these restrictions remain in effect.

The church leaders pointed out in their claim they clearly understand the significance of COVID-19 and the difficult decisions the Scottish Government has had to make in an effort to protect communities.

But the church officials say they believe the Scottish Ministers’ have “failed to appreciate that the closure of places of worship is a disproportionate step and one which has serious implications for freedom of religion.”

The Scottish Ministers’ replied by denying the claim and asserted that the state can “regulate the secular activities of Churches…for the purposes of protecting public health” and that churches must “comply with secular law” and remain closed.

According to Christian Legal Centre, Scotland hasn’t attempted to close churches since the 17th century during the persecution of the Presbyterian church.

Now church officials are asking for houses of worship in Scotland to remain open so people can attend services and events without fear of prosecution.

In the claim, the church leaders “hold that public corporate worship, involving the physical gathering together of Christians…are fundamental and indispensable aspects of their religion,” and that “in the absence of the gathered people of God, there is effectively no church.”
Scottish Ministers’ say they are making decisions based on “science” to warrant several lockdown measures, including church closures
Click to expand...

This is sad.


It seems that those in power, though not all, are elevating the fear of a virus over faith in God.



JLB
 
Christians can still pray, and read the Bible. I have mentioned to people generally they can pray, and this website promotes it

Home

www.trypraying.co.uk www.trypraying.co.uk
 
Like above, at least individual believers can still pray and worship God spiritually. Its the one thing the world cannot take from anyone.
 
Last edited:
mattcandyc said:
People in Scotland where I stay can't go into churches.
A group of Scottish church leaders has launched a claim for judicial review over the Scottish Minsters’ unprecedented decision to close churches and criminalise public worship during the current lockdown.
Restrictions set forth by First Minister Nicola Sturgeon on Jan. 8 made it a criminal offense in the highest level for churches to meet in-person, even to perform a baptism.

Church officials notified the Scottish Ministers on Jan. 15, pleading for them to re-open churches. They explained that closing churches violates the European Convention of Human Rights law and the Scottish Constitution.

Additionally, the emotional and spiritual needs within the congregation and community cannot be addressed if these restrictions remain in effect.

The church leaders pointed out in their claim they clearly understand the significance of COVID-19 and the difficult decisions the Scottish Government has had to make in an effort to protect communities.

But the church officials say they believe the Scottish Ministers’ have “failed to appreciate that the closure of places of worship is a disproportionate step and one which has serious implications for freedom of religion.”

The Scottish Ministers’ replied by denying the claim and asserted that the state can “regulate the secular activities of Churches…for the purposes of protecting public health” and that churches must “comply with secular law” and remain closed.

According to Christian Legal Centre, Scotland hasn’t attempted to close churches since the 17th century during the persecution of the Presbyterian church.

Now church officials are asking for houses of worship in Scotland to remain open so people can attend services and events without fear of prosecution.

In the claim, the church leaders “hold that public corporate worship, involving the physical gathering together of Christians…are fundamental and indispensable aspects of their religion,” and that “in the absence of the gathered people of God, there is effectively no church.”
Scottish Ministers’ say they are making decisions based on “science” to warrant several lockdown measures, including church closures
Click to expand...
Baptism is an integral part of Christian faith and living and also a commandment from Jesus.

While it is true that we are to be subject to governing authorities as explained in Romans 13:1-7 (NKJV) ....

Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God. Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will bring judgment on themselves. For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil. Do you want to be unafraid of the authority? Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same. For he is God’s minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God’s minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil. Therefore you must be subject, not only because of wrath but also for conscience’ sake. For because of this you also pay taxes, for they are God’s ministers attending continually to this very thing. Render therefore to all their due: taxes to whom taxes are due, customs to whom customs, fear to whom fear, honor to whom honor.

it is also true that when man's law collides with God's law, God's law trumps man's law as explained by Peter in Acts 5:26-29 (NKJV) ...

Then the captain went with the officers and brought them (apostles accused of spreading the gospel) without violence, for they feared the people, lest they should be stoned. And when they had brought them, they set them before the council. And the high priest asked them, saying, “Did we not strictly command you not to teach in this name? And look, you have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this Man’s blood on us!” But Peter and the other apostles answered and said: “We ought to obey God rather than men.

I think Jesus tells us to keep things in proper perspective and priority in Luke 20:20-25 (NKJV)...

So they watched Him, and sent spies who pretended to be righteous, that they might seize on His words, in order to deliver Him to the power and the authority of the governor. Then they asked Him, saying, “Teacher, we know that You say and teach rightly, and You do not show personal favoritism, but teach the way of God in truth: Is it lawful for us to pay taxes to Caesar or not?” But He perceived their craftiness, and said to them, “Why do you test Me? Show Me a denarius. Whose image and inscription does it have?” They answered and said, “Caesar’s.” And He said to them, “Render therefore to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s.
 
Mat 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

They might want to close the actual church building, but nothing will prevent us from gathering together even if its on a Christian forum like this one.
 
The organiser of a car park church worship in Bulwell has vowed to fight a £10,000 fine issued by police for running the event.
Pastor Chez Dyer, 47, organised theChurch on the Streets event at the Top House pub car park, attended by more than 30 people on Saturday, February 20.
These are events Pastor Chez has been running "since August", and consists of worshippers attending a car park for a church service in their vehicles before being fed outdoors.
The services also help to feed the homeless and have a food stall in attendance "for between 15 and 20 people" each week.
However, the Bulwell event was shut down by officers from Nottinghamshire Police, who said they have been advising the organisers for "the past few weeks" that the events "are not allowed".
This came despite Pastor Chez and other people in attendance at the event citing what they described as "unclear" Government guidelines, claiming it was a legal place of worship.
They also claim that, under guidelines for feeding the homeless during the pandemic, there was no breach of lockdown rules.
Police were called the event on Saturday after receiving reports from the public, before ordering guests to get into their cars and issuing Pastor Chez with a summons to pay the £10,000 fine.
Speaking to Nottinghamshire Live, she vowed to fight the fine and raised concerns about the impact it could have on her work.
"It's disappointing receiving the fine but I will be contesting it and going the whole way with it," she said.
 
The pandemic has highlighted Christian’s “irreconcilable conflict” between obeying the state and God, a QC has said as she argued that Nicola Sturgeon acted outwith her constitutional powers byclosing churches.

Lord Braid heard yesterday that this tension had caused 27 church ministers to instruct Advocate Janys Scott, QC to raise a judicial review at the Court of Session in Edinburgh.
The ministers believe that the Scottish government’s decision to close churches earlier this year was unlawful and breached their right to religious freedom under human rights legislation.
They also believe that the Scottish government has breached the obligations placed on it by the British constitution.
The ministers are seeking an order declaring the decision to be unlawful
 
WIP said:
Baptism is an integral part of Christian faith and living and also a commandment from Jesus.

While it is true that we are to be subject to governing authorities as explained in Romans 13:1-7 (NKJV) ....

Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God. Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will bring judgment on themselves. For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil. Do you want to be unafraid of the authority? Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same. For he is God’s minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God’s minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil. Therefore you must be subject, not only because of wrath but also for conscience’ sake. For because of this you also pay taxes, for they are God’s ministers attending continually to this very thing. Render therefore to all their due: taxes to whom taxes are due, customs to whom customs, fear to whom fear, honor to whom honor.

it is also true that when man's law collides with God's law, God's law trumps man's law as explained by Peter in Acts 5:26-29 (NKJV) ...

Then the captain went with the officers and brought them (apostles accused of spreading the gospel) without violence, for they feared the people, lest they should be stoned. And when they had brought them, they set them before the council. And the high priest asked them, saying, “Did we not strictly command you not to teach in this name? And look, you have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this Man’s blood on us!” But Peter and the other apostles answered and said: “We ought to obey God rather than men.

I think Jesus tells us to keep things in proper perspective and priority in Luke 20:20-25 (NKJV)...

So they watched Him, and sent spies who pretended to be righteous, that they might seize on His words, in order to deliver Him to the power and the authority of the governor. Then they asked Him, saying, “Teacher, we know that You say and teach rightly, and You do not show personal favoritism, but teach the way of God in truth: Is it lawful for us to pay taxes to Caesar or not?” But He perceived their craftiness, and said to them, “Why do you test Me? Show Me a denarius. Whose image and inscription does it have?” They answered and said, “Caesar’s.” And He said to them, “Render therefore to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s.
Click to expand...
This is a hard teaching.
God gives us direct authority and delegated authority.
I think when each person decides on their own whose authority to obey, it causes a mass of confusion in the church.
God gave us delegated authority for a reason.
If we don't obey it, how does God bring his church together as one?

If we only had direct authority, then everyone would have to hear and receive the same in order to be as one.
God does not do that.
God has delegated authority for a reason.
In Jewish law, if a woman made a vow to God, she would still need her husband's approval.
If she didn't get it, she could not fulfill the vow.
And God would deal with the husband.
God always maintains the authority he has delegated.

As in the case with Peter, someone in authority needs to make a decision on what to do.
He then becomes responsible for his actions.
If we follow him, then we are either drawn closer to God or not.

That leaves us today.
Individual people and individual churches making decisions is not in the order of authority to God.
We need to be careful what decisions we make.
 
Rollo Tamasi said:
This is a hard teaching.
God gives us direct authority and delegated authority.
I think when each person decides on their own whose authority to obey, it causes a mass of confusion in the church.
God gave us delegated authority for a reason.
If we don't obey it, how does God bring his church together as one?

If we only had direct authority, then everyone would have to hear and receive the same in order to be as one.
God does not do that.
God has delegated authority for a reason.
In Jewish law, if a woman made a vow to God, she would still need her husband's approval.
If she didn't get it, she could not fulfill the vow.
And God would deal with the husband.
God always maintains the authority he has delegated.

As in the case with Peter, someone in authority needs to make a decision on what to do.
He then becomes responsible for his actions.
If we follow him, then we are either drawn closer to God or not.

That leaves us today.
Individual people and individual churches making decisions is not in the order of authority to God.
We need to be careful what decisions we make.
Click to expand...
I think they are wrong in closing the churches. If they keep to the hygiene and social distance it should be allowed. At the same time I also believe we should obey the government as long as it is not against God. I have never read in scripture that we hhave to go to church. In the dark ages, when Catholics and Protestants were killing each other, people were hiding in their chimneys in the UK It is not so long ago when the IRA were bombing Engkand in a religious war. I was only a few metres away from where the last bomb went off in Mancchester. In Itreland it was so bad that police were escorting children to school. None of this stopped people worshipping God. Tribulation brings you a stronger faith. That is what matters, and we have to make sure we are ready for the times o come.
The apostles his after Jesus died "for fear of the Jews."
We have to be ready.
Lockdown is a great time to read and study. To be so close to our Saviour.
Ee have so much mire at the moment than in times past. We can fellowship on our phones and on the internet, and by post.
We must keep our spirits up. We have ea h other, and we have God
 
Tessa said:
I think they are wrong in closing the churches. If they keep to the hygiene and social distance it should be allowed. At the same time I also believe we should obey the government as long as it is not against God. I have never read in scripture that we hhave to go to church. In the dark ages, when Catholics and Protestants were killing each other, people were hiding in their chimneys in the UK It is not so long ago when the IRA were bombing Engkand in a religious war. I was only a few metres away from where the last bomb went off in Mancchester. In Itreland it was so bad that police were escorting children to school. None of this stopped people worshipping God. Tribulation brings you a stronger faith. That is what matters, and we have to make sure we are ready for the times o come.
The apostles his after Jesus died "for fear of the Jews."
We have to be ready.
Lockdown is a great time to read and study. To be so close to our Saviour.
Ee have so much mire at the moment than in times past. We can fellowship on our phones and on the internet, and by post.
We must keep our spirits up. We have ea h other, and we have God
Click to expand...
Awesome post!
 
JLB said:
Whose science?
Click to expand...
I don't think the O.P. has ever answered this.
In Italy they use the same term.

IOW....they could listen to science, or the science, which just means doctors and the WHO and all those higher ups that give their opinion as to what to do in this pandemic and what measures to use.

Then the alternate would be government officials that either want, or do not want, to close everything down and may have their own ideas as to how respond to this virus.
 
wondering said:
I don't think the O.P. has ever answered this.
In Italy they use the same term.

IOW....they could listen to science, or the science, which just means doctors and the WHO and all those higher ups that give their opinion as to what to do in this pandemic and what measures to use.

Then the alternate would be government officials that either want, or do not want, to close everything down and may have their own ideas as to how respond to this virus.
Click to expand...
Do what we do in Florida

1616017269244.png
 
Rollo Tamasi said:
This is a hard teaching.
God gives us direct authority and delegated authority.
I think when each person decides on their own whose authority to obey, it causes a mass of confusion in the church.
God gave us delegated authority for a reason.
If we don't obey it, how does God bring his church together as one?

If we only had direct authority, then everyone would have to hear and receive the same in order to be as one.
God does not do that.
God has delegated authority for a reason.
In Jewish law, if a woman made a vow to God, she would still need her husband's approval.
If she didn't get it, she could not fulfill the vow.
And God would deal with the husband.
God always maintains the authority he has delegated.

As in the case with Peter, someone in authority needs to make a decision on what to do.
He then becomes responsible for his actions.
If we follow him, then we are either drawn closer to God or not.

That leaves us today.
Individual people and individual churches making decisions is not in the order of authority to God.
We need to be careful what decisions we make.
Click to expand...
Do you mean that direct authority is from God.....what HE commands -
and delegated authority would be, say, the government?
 
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