S
savedbygrace57
Guest
I am familiar with it, its those Chosen in Christ before the foundation Eph 1:4, and Joint Heirs with Christ. Rom 8:17
How have you determined that this scripture is relevant to the subject matter at hand ?
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Are you taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Wearing the right shoes, and properly clothed spiritually?
Join Elected By Him for a devotional on Ephesians 6:14-15
https://christianforums.net/threads/devotional-selecting-the-proper-shoes.109094/
I am familiar with it, its those Chosen in Christ before the foundation Eph 1:4, and Joint Heirs with Christ. Rom 8:17
How have you determined that this scripture is relevant to the subject matter at hand ?
n2thelight
Member
Ephesians 1:4 "According as He hath chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love:"
What does it mean to be "chosen"?
It means that there are certain people that God chosen in the first earth age, to do a task for Him in this flesh earth age. This is not reincarnation, for it is appointed for each of us to go through this earth age, the flesh earth age, once and only once. We read; "...It is appointed unto men once to die [in the flesh], but after this the judgment." Hebrews 9:27 This appointing and choosing took place before the foundation of this earth age; the second earth age [cosmos] that we now live in.
"Without blame" refers to the fact that God intercedes in certain peoples lives. Certain people have free will, while certain others are of God's election, however, God doesn't play favorites. Christ died for the sins of all who will repent; the chosen, and the free-will. All must repent for sins they commit, and love the Lord Jesus Christ, to have the hope of His glory.
"Before the foundation of the world", [cosmos in the Greek, meaning world or earth age.] The "foundation" in the Greek text, is the verb for, "the overthrow". This refers to something that happened in that first earth age, before the overthrow of Satan and his angels that followed him. When Satan fell [war against God], one third of all angelic beings [God's children] followed Satan. Then during that war, there were some who fought against Satan, and those who did, God calls "His Chosen". They took a stand, and were overcomers in that first earth age.
Have you ever wondered why you do the things that you do, at times. It's just like you have a destiny. You have always felt their is more to life, and this world, then what you have been taught. Paul addresses this in Romans 8:27. In verse twenty six it says that there are times in your life when the Holy Spirit makes intercession for you because you don't even know what to pray for.
"And he that searcheth the heart knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God." Romans 8:27 These saints are "the set-aside ones", or "the chosen". God has a overall plan, and a purpose in that plan just for you. That purpose is to bring back His children to Him; after that overthrow, and in this earth age.
Why would God intercede in a person's life, without them even asking? When your free-will goes against God's purpose for your life, God will intercede. When Paul's "free will" was to destroy all Christians, God's will was to take this highly educated man, and use Paul as the instrument for Him. Paul used to same drive to destroy Christians, that he used later to convert people, after his conversion.
We read that the Lord said; "...For He is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and Kings, and children of Israel:" Acts 9:15
Ephesians 1:5 "Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,"
"Predestined" means "from a prior time", or "required to do a certain thing" in the Greek text. You have a choice of loving God, or loving Satan. God will not interfere with your free will choice to chose Him or Satan. However, that person that proved himself during the overthrow of Satan, were "justified", or earned the right to be called "saints", from that first earth age.
Each soul comes from God, and enters an embryo at conception. This is why Jeremiah was a chosen one. "Before I formed thee in the belly I know thee; and before thou comest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet of nations." Jeremiah 1:5
"Sanctified" thee, is to "set aside, or apart for a purpose". Sins still have to be repented, and the price to pay for them still had to be made. To the predestined, and fore chosen, God can make life so miserable to those out of His will that they will repent. God has a perfect will, and God is always fair.
"And we know that all things work together for good, to them that love God, to them who are the called according to His purpose." Romans 8:28 This verse is directed to a certain people, with a condition attached. This applies to "them who are called according to His purpose." "His purpose" is called God's plan, and God's overall plan is the offering of Salvation to all. That plan includes the teaching of God's Word; to plant seeds to convict; to live our life for Him; and to go and speak where God leads you. God will use you as it pleases Him.
"For whom He did foreknow, He also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren." Romans 8:29 God knew you, and what you were in that first earth age; and then [in that first earth age] God prearranged our destiny for this age. That destiny is to make us conform, or be like His Son, Jesus Christ. Though Jesus is the first fruits to overcome death, there are many that have that victory over death, through Christ's death and resurrection.
"Moreover whom He did predestinate, them He also called: and whom He called: He also justified: and whom He justified, them He also glorified." Romans 8:30 "Justified" means "judged" in the Greek text; God judged them there in that first earth age, and that is why God can and does intercede in the chosen's ones lives. The justified are the priests of the Zadok in the millennium age of Ezekiel 40, for the word Zadok comes from the Hebrew word meaning "the just".
Certain of God's children stood against Satan in the first earth age, and those that did stand, and did not follow Satan; God judged [justified], and He "chose" them then to be used in His eternal plan. Through God's perfect plan, God "predestined", and "ordained" each of them to His purpose to be used in this flesh age. Each of these will also be used in the Millennium age as priests, or called the "Zadok".
What does it mean to be "chosen"?
It means that there are certain people that God chosen in the first earth age, to do a task for Him in this flesh earth age. This is not reincarnation, for it is appointed for each of us to go through this earth age, the flesh earth age, once and only once. We read; "...It is appointed unto men once to die [in the flesh], but after this the judgment." Hebrews 9:27 This appointing and choosing took place before the foundation of this earth age; the second earth age [cosmos] that we now live in.
"Without blame" refers to the fact that God intercedes in certain peoples lives. Certain people have free will, while certain others are of God's election, however, God doesn't play favorites. Christ died for the sins of all who will repent; the chosen, and the free-will. All must repent for sins they commit, and love the Lord Jesus Christ, to have the hope of His glory.
"Before the foundation of the world", [cosmos in the Greek, meaning world or earth age.] The "foundation" in the Greek text, is the verb for, "the overthrow". This refers to something that happened in that first earth age, before the overthrow of Satan and his angels that followed him. When Satan fell [war against God], one third of all angelic beings [God's children] followed Satan. Then during that war, there were some who fought against Satan, and those who did, God calls "His Chosen". They took a stand, and were overcomers in that first earth age.
Have you ever wondered why you do the things that you do, at times. It's just like you have a destiny. You have always felt their is more to life, and this world, then what you have been taught. Paul addresses this in Romans 8:27. In verse twenty six it says that there are times in your life when the Holy Spirit makes intercession for you because you don't even know what to pray for.
"And he that searcheth the heart knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God." Romans 8:27 These saints are "the set-aside ones", or "the chosen". God has a overall plan, and a purpose in that plan just for you. That purpose is to bring back His children to Him; after that overthrow, and in this earth age.
Why would God intercede in a person's life, without them even asking? When your free-will goes against God's purpose for your life, God will intercede. When Paul's "free will" was to destroy all Christians, God's will was to take this highly educated man, and use Paul as the instrument for Him. Paul used to same drive to destroy Christians, that he used later to convert people, after his conversion.
We read that the Lord said; "...For He is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and Kings, and children of Israel:" Acts 9:15
Ephesians 1:5 "Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,"
"Predestined" means "from a prior time", or "required to do a certain thing" in the Greek text. You have a choice of loving God, or loving Satan. God will not interfere with your free will choice to chose Him or Satan. However, that person that proved himself during the overthrow of Satan, were "justified", or earned the right to be called "saints", from that first earth age.
Each soul comes from God, and enters an embryo at conception. This is why Jeremiah was a chosen one. "Before I formed thee in the belly I know thee; and before thou comest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet of nations." Jeremiah 1:5
"Sanctified" thee, is to "set aside, or apart for a purpose". Sins still have to be repented, and the price to pay for them still had to be made. To the predestined, and fore chosen, God can make life so miserable to those out of His will that they will repent. God has a perfect will, and God is always fair.
"And we know that all things work together for good, to them that love God, to them who are the called according to His purpose." Romans 8:28 This verse is directed to a certain people, with a condition attached. This applies to "them who are called according to His purpose." "His purpose" is called God's plan, and God's overall plan is the offering of Salvation to all. That plan includes the teaching of God's Word; to plant seeds to convict; to live our life for Him; and to go and speak where God leads you. God will use you as it pleases Him.
"For whom He did foreknow, He also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren." Romans 8:29 God knew you, and what you were in that first earth age; and then [in that first earth age] God prearranged our destiny for this age. That destiny is to make us conform, or be like His Son, Jesus Christ. Though Jesus is the first fruits to overcome death, there are many that have that victory over death, through Christ's death and resurrection.
"Moreover whom He did predestinate, them He also called: and whom He called: He also justified: and whom He justified, them He also glorified." Romans 8:30 "Justified" means "judged" in the Greek text; God judged them there in that first earth age, and that is why God can and does intercede in the chosen's ones lives. The justified are the priests of the Zadok in the millennium age of Ezekiel 40, for the word Zadok comes from the Hebrew word meaning "the just".
Certain of God's children stood against Satan in the first earth age, and those that did stand, and did not follow Satan; God judged [justified], and He "chose" them then to be used in His eternal plan. Through God's perfect plan, God "predestined", and "ordained" each of them to His purpose to be used in this flesh age. Each of these will also be used in the Millennium age as priests, or called the "Zadok".
francisdesales
Member
Perhaps you might want to cite such things that you copied and pasted here...
Regards
E
Elijah674
Guest
It is amazing that 'we' come close to agreeing on anthing. But also amazing to me is the huge DESIRE to just work & work, or post + another post (paste?) to the ones who.. as their 'stuff' claims are also then predestined because of these 'lost ones' extra belief????? They are saved and predestined so they teach, but not these others!?? Wow! And works save no one is truth, but why do they just keep on 'fervently' working then? Gen. 4:7 seems to cast a doubt on some doctrines as 'i' see it!
Some times it seems that these ones do not believe that they are in the 'predestined class' that they talk of?
And hell will be full of ones who believe in the FORCED religeon of caesar above God. As they see Rom. 13 & then 666 has it. But why use force when ALL are predestined saved or lost?
Again, whatever? --Elijah
francisdesales
Member
Elijah,
To be perfectly honest, I have a hard time understanding some of your posts. However, I think that we do agree on some issues that other Christians disagree on, such as the relationship between faith and works. It appears you accept the Biblical demands that go beyond "merely" faith "alone". Also on this subject of predestination. I think most of our disagreement largely centers on Rome and its role within the bigger picture. I would prefer to focus on our agreements, as I rarely initiate negative posts/threads, while merely responding to "set the record straight".
But also amazing to me is the huge DESIRE to just work & work, or post + another post (paste?) to the ones who.. as their 'stuff' claims are also then predestined because of these 'lost ones' extra belief????? They are saved and predestined so they teach, but not these others!?? Wow! And works save no one is truth, but why do they just keep on 'fervently' working then? Gen. 4:7 seems to cast a doubt on some doctrines as 'i' see it!
Well, perhaps it is a zeal for God, just as Saul before becoming Paul. These people, while perhaps misinformed, cannot be faulted on their zeal and perceived desire to spread what THEY THINK is God's Word or valid interpretations of It. Thus, as long as people don't get offensive or personal, I can understand their desire to post - and am not going to begin accusing them of "doing the devil's work", unless I see evidence of lack of prayer (seen more by the manner of the post, rather than the doctrinal content).
My post was innocent, I just wanted to know where they copied that post from. I highly doubt it is the work of the poster and people should give such credit when due.
Regards
n2thelight
Member
Because of certain beliefs of the site,Ive been asked not to give a link,so I really don't know when I can or can't but I should have given the author
This Bible Study is written by Roger Christopherson,
francisdesales
Member
S
savedbygrace57
Guest
Predestination is that all encompassing Purpose of God [The Godhead] in which He sovereignly decreed all things that come to pass in time, as it specifically regards the Salvation [experientially] of His Elect ! This means, all that has been, is even now, and that yet to come,was purposed by God in eternity and is brought to pass by Him providentially in time for the salvation [converting] of a great multitude whose names were written in the lambs book of life in Sovereign Election before the world began !
S
savedbygrace57
Guest
Eph 1:5 and Predestination !
5Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
Predestination, this is a Gospel Truth, there simply is no good news of salvation without incorporating this grand truth as we see Paul did here in this epistle as recapitulates His Gospel Testimony to the Ephesians. Remember he told its elders in Acts 20:27, "I shunned not to declare unto you all the counsel of God" !
Paul here declares unto what end, the God the Father in Love predestined us unto the adoption of children. In another place Paul writes Rom 8:21,23
21Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
23And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
Now we must understand that the Father adopts us and viewed us as Children in Eternal Election [To have been placed in Christ]before the world began.
For they were children before taking on flesh and blood Heb 2:13-14
The elect were Loved before the world began Jer 31:3; 1 Jn3:1;Jn 17:23-24.
Now because of this Eternal adoption by means of Election [Eph 1:4] He in time, during our lifetime sends the Spirit of Christ in our Hearts [Gal 4:5,6 New Birth] giving us to partake of the Divine Nature.[2 Pet 1:4] and God will soon have them experience the ultimate of their Eternal Adoption when we realize Rom 8:21.
And this Adoption is to Himself Eph 1:5
Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
This is the Security of the predestinated ones, For God does this for Himself, His Glory, and The elect were always His Inheritance Ps 106:5
5That I may see the good of thy chosen, that I may rejoice in the gladness of thy nation, that I may glory with thine inheritance.
Ps 4:3
3But know that the LORD hath set apart him that is godly for himself: the LORD will hear when I call unto him.
Ps 135:4
4For the LORD hath chosen Jacob unto himself, and Israel for his peculiar treasure.
Isa 43:21
21This people have I formed for myself; they shall shew forth my praise.
5Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
Predestination, this is a Gospel Truth, there simply is no good news of salvation without incorporating this grand truth as we see Paul did here in this epistle as recapitulates His Gospel Testimony to the Ephesians. Remember he told its elders in Acts 20:27, "I shunned not to declare unto you all the counsel of God" !
Paul here declares unto what end, the God the Father in Love predestined us unto the adoption of children. In another place Paul writes Rom 8:21,23
21Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
23And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
Now we must understand that the Father adopts us and viewed us as Children in Eternal Election [To have been placed in Christ]before the world began.
For they were children before taking on flesh and blood Heb 2:13-14
The elect were Loved before the world began Jer 31:3; 1 Jn3:1;Jn 17:23-24.
Now because of this Eternal adoption by means of Election [Eph 1:4] He in time, during our lifetime sends the Spirit of Christ in our Hearts [Gal 4:5,6 New Birth] giving us to partake of the Divine Nature.[2 Pet 1:4] and God will soon have them experience the ultimate of their Eternal Adoption when we realize Rom 8:21.
And this Adoption is to Himself Eph 1:5
Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
This is the Security of the predestinated ones, For God does this for Himself, His Glory, and The elect were always His Inheritance Ps 106:5
5That I may see the good of thy chosen, that I may rejoice in the gladness of thy nation, that I may glory with thine inheritance.
Ps 4:3
3But know that the LORD hath set apart him that is godly for himself: the LORD will hear when I call unto him.
Ps 135:4
4For the LORD hath chosen Jacob unto himself, and Israel for his peculiar treasure.
Isa 43:21
21This people have I formed for myself; they shall shew forth my praise.
S
savedbygrace57
Guest
Foreknowledge itself is another name for Predestination.
For God to foreknow something is but to eternally,precisely, and completely arrange in advance or predestine, as covering from the beginning and all the accomplishment, including what's in between.
Look at how Peter uses the word Acts 2:23
Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
You see how determinate counsel and foreknowledge are linked together ?
1 Pet 1:2
Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
So this implies something determined by the Father about these here in 1 Pet 1:2.
The greek word is prognōsis and means:
forethought, pre-arrangement
So foreknowledge is God's predestination or prearrangement.
Its from the root word proginōskō , which means to foreknow:
see Rom 8:29
But it also means foreordained as here 1 Pet 1:
20Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
Again the Ideal of predestinate ! The WNT :
He was pre-destined indeed to this work, even before the creation of the world, but has been plainly manifested in these last days for the sake of you who, through Him,
For God to foreknow something is but to eternally,precisely, and completely arrange in advance or predestine, as covering from the beginning and all the accomplishment, including what's in between.
Look at how Peter uses the word Acts 2:23
Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
You see how determinate counsel and foreknowledge are linked together ?
1 Pet 1:2
Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
So this implies something determined by the Father about these here in 1 Pet 1:2.
The greek word is prognōsis and means:
forethought, pre-arrangement
So foreknowledge is God's predestination or prearrangement.
Its from the root word proginōskō , which means to foreknow:
see Rom 8:29
But it also means foreordained as here 1 Pet 1:
20Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
Again the Ideal of predestinate ! The WNT :
He was pre-destined indeed to this work, even before the creation of the world, but has been plainly manifested in these last days for the sake of you who, through Him,
S
savedbygrace57
Guest
For whom He did foreknow !
Rom 8:29
29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Those who are guilty of corrupting the scriptures have taken this precious word of Truth and stripped it of it's biblical meaning, so they can boast of their idol freewill. We will look at this word, it is the greek word proginōskō:
to have knowledge before hand
2) to foreknow
a) of those whom God elected to salvation
3) to predestinate
God's foreknowledge is more than God's prescience of omniscience of all things, or just knowing beforehand of what one will be or do.
The Eternal Purpose and Counsel of God is not dependent on what His creatures will or will not do [blasphemy] neither is God's Purpose and the fulfillment of it the result of God foreseeing that some would believe on Christ if given the opportunity; So in the scripture God's foreknowledge means much more than God's Knowledge before hand. If that were not so, then there would be no difference in those God foreknew and those He will say I never knew you Matt 7:23.
However in the scriptures, God's foreknowledge is not of things, but of Persons See Jer 1:5; Rom 11:2
2God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,
The bible does not speak of what He foreknew but of whom He foreknew. Rom 8:29
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
God's foreknowledge should be distinguished from His omniscience, but dishonest people will not do that. One is an attribute and the other is act of God. As we discover in the bible, there are several components that reveal unto us Biblical Foreknowledge of God !
Rom 8:29
29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Those who are guilty of corrupting the scriptures have taken this precious word of Truth and stripped it of it's biblical meaning, so they can boast of their idol freewill. We will look at this word, it is the greek word proginōskō:
to have knowledge before hand
2) to foreknow
a) of those whom God elected to salvation
3) to predestinate
God's foreknowledge is more than God's prescience of omniscience of all things, or just knowing beforehand of what one will be or do.
The Eternal Purpose and Counsel of God is not dependent on what His creatures will or will not do [blasphemy] neither is God's Purpose and the fulfillment of it the result of God foreseeing that some would believe on Christ if given the opportunity; So in the scripture God's foreknowledge means much more than God's Knowledge before hand. If that were not so, then there would be no difference in those God foreknew and those He will say I never knew you Matt 7:23.
However in the scriptures, God's foreknowledge is not of things, but of Persons See Jer 1:5; Rom 11:2
2God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,
The bible does not speak of what He foreknew but of whom He foreknew. Rom 8:29
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
God's foreknowledge should be distinguished from His omniscience, but dishonest people will not do that. One is an attribute and the other is act of God. As we discover in the bible, there are several components that reveal unto us Biblical Foreknowledge of God !
S
savedbygrace57
Guest
More on whom He foreknew !
God's foreknowledge should be distinguished from His omniscience, but dishonest people will not do that. One is an attribute and the other is act of God. As we discover in the bible, there are several components that reveal unto us Biblical Foreknowledge of God !
Lets begin by pointing that scripture shows us that God's foreknowledge is also Fore ordination. Now Peter in His 1 Epistle states that believers are God's Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father 1 Pet 1:2
2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
Now those who willfully wrest the scriptures will point to this verse as well as Rom 8:29, and state that they mean God foresaw who would choose Him or believe on Christ by their freewill. This however is a lie and Blasphemy, for this makes God's Purpose of Election [ Rom 9:11] dependent upon the will of the creature, but scripture is its best interpreter, and the very sane greek word for foreknow in Rom 8:29 and Foreknowledge in 1 Pet 1:2, Peter uses again in 1 Pet 1:20, its the word foreordain 1 Pet 1:20
20Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
So the word foreknowledge includes both determination and Sovereign Control. Now in Acts 2:23, Peter in principle is saying the same thing about the death of Christ Acts 2:23
23Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
Jesus was slain or crucified by the determinate counsel and Foreknowledge of God, it could read " being delivered by the determinate counsel and fore ordination of God ! God's foreknowledge is a determining factor. See Acts 4:28
28For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done.
Thats again foreknowledge !
God's foreknowledge should be distinguished from His omniscience, but dishonest people will not do that. One is an attribute and the other is act of God. As we discover in the bible, there are several components that reveal unto us Biblical Foreknowledge of God !
Lets begin by pointing that scripture shows us that God's foreknowledge is also Fore ordination. Now Peter in His 1 Epistle states that believers are God's Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father 1 Pet 1:2
2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
Now those who willfully wrest the scriptures will point to this verse as well as Rom 8:29, and state that they mean God foresaw who would choose Him or believe on Christ by their freewill. This however is a lie and Blasphemy, for this makes God's Purpose of Election [ Rom 9:11] dependent upon the will of the creature, but scripture is its best interpreter, and the very sane greek word for foreknow in Rom 8:29 and Foreknowledge in 1 Pet 1:2, Peter uses again in 1 Pet 1:20, its the word foreordain 1 Pet 1:20
20Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
So the word foreknowledge includes both determination and Sovereign Control. Now in Acts 2:23, Peter in principle is saying the same thing about the death of Christ Acts 2:23
23Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
Jesus was slain or crucified by the determinate counsel and Foreknowledge of God, it could read " being delivered by the determinate counsel and fore ordination of God ! God's foreknowledge is a determining factor. See Acts 4:28
28For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done.
Thats again foreknowledge !
S
savedbygrace57
Guest
More on God's Foreknwledge of His Elect !
1 Pet 1:2
2Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
God's Foreknowledge of His Elect is His Eternal Love of the Them in Christ Jesus. Now God's Love for any can only be as He views them in Union with Christ Jesus, for its described as The Love of God in Christ Jesus Rom 8:39
39Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in[in the sphere of] Christ Jesus our Lord.
Those God foreknew, His People as per Rom 11:2
2God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,
Those He loved with an Everlasting Love Jer 31:3, choosing them in the Son of His Love , who was foreknown [1 Pet 1:20 ] whom He Loved before the foundation of the world Jn 17:24
24Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
And so, since they were by Him, chosen in Christ before the foundation of the world Eph 1:4
4According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
They also were Loved in the same manner and date, before the foundation of the world Jn 17:23
23I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
That small greek word as is an adverb kathōs and means:
according as
a) just as, even as
b) in proportion as, in the degree that
2) since, seeing that, agreeably to the fact that
3) when, after that
So the foreknown were Loved in Christ even as Christ was Loved or in that same degree as He was, before the foundation of the world. That means prior to the foundation of the world !
1 Pet 1:2
2Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
God's Foreknowledge of His Elect is His Eternal Love of the Them in Christ Jesus. Now God's Love for any can only be as He views them in Union with Christ Jesus, for its described as The Love of God in Christ Jesus Rom 8:39
39Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in[in the sphere of] Christ Jesus our Lord.
Those God foreknew, His People as per Rom 11:2
2God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,
Those He loved with an Everlasting Love Jer 31:3, choosing them in the Son of His Love , who was foreknown [1 Pet 1:20 ] whom He Loved before the foundation of the world Jn 17:24
24Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
And so, since they were by Him, chosen in Christ before the foundation of the world Eph 1:4
4According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
They also were Loved in the same manner and date, before the foundation of the world Jn 17:23
23I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
That small greek word as is an adverb kathōs and means:
according as
a) just as, even as
b) in proportion as, in the degree that
2) since, seeing that, agreeably to the fact that
3) when, after that
So the foreknown were Loved in Christ even as Christ was Loved or in that same degree as He was, before the foundation of the world. That means prior to the foundation of the world !
S
savedbygrace57
Guest
God Knew His Elect from Everlasting as He knew no others, that principle is seen here Amos 3:2
You only have I known of all the families of the earth: therefore I will punish you for all your iniquities.
Deut 7:6-7
6For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.
7The LORD did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye were the fewest of all people:
God knew His Special People in Christ, and so had a special delight and affection for them from everlasting. As Adam knew his wife Eve, intimately, and She was given to him from God, and no doubt he had a special exclusive Love for her.
These are those whom Jesus Christ shall never say : Matt 7:23
23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Again, Jesus is not speaking of His omniscience of these evil doers, but of His Love and Special Affection as a Husband to a Wife Eph 5:25
25Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;
You only have I known of all the families of the earth: therefore I will punish you for all your iniquities.
Deut 7:6-7
6For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.
7The LORD did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye were the fewest of all people:
God knew His Special People in Christ, and so had a special delight and affection for them from everlasting. As Adam knew his wife Eve, intimately, and She was given to him from God, and no doubt he had a special exclusive Love for her.
These are those whom Jesus Christ shall never say : Matt 7:23
23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Again, Jesus is not speaking of His omniscience of these evil doers, but of His Love and Special Affection as a Husband to a Wife Eph 5:25
25Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;
S
savedbygrace57
Guest
God's foreknowledge is God's approval Ps 1:6
6For the LORD knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish.
The Lord owns and approves of the way of the Righteous [ Righteous by Christ obedience Rom 5:19]. When Jesus says " I know my Sheep" He distinguishes them from the ones He shall yet say to " I never knew you"
For they were never given to Him by the Father as Per Jn 6:39
39And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. and
Jn 10:29
29My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
Jn 17:2
2As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
They were never accepted in the Beloved, Favored in Him Eph 1:6
6To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
6For the LORD knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish.
The Lord owns and approves of the way of the Righteous [ Righteous by Christ obedience Rom 5:19]. When Jesus says " I know my Sheep" He distinguishes them from the ones He shall yet say to " I never knew you"
For they were never given to Him by the Father as Per Jn 6:39
39And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. and
Jn 10:29
29My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
Jn 17:2
2As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
They were never accepted in the Beloved, Favored in Him Eph 1:6
6To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
S
savedbygrace57
Guest
God's foreknowledge is their security !
Those that God foreknew, that is their security. Those He foreknew and Loved in Christ. 2 Tim 2:19
19Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
See the difference in these and those who will hear these words Matt 7:23
23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
You see that ? Those God knows will be effectually redeemed from all iniquity as per design of Christ giving Himself for them Titus 2:14
14Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
But those that Jesus will say to them " I never knew you" He calls them "ye that work iniquity" See the difference ? Those He knew were redeemed from all iniquity, those He did not know were workers of iniquity ! His redeeming death made the difference. His Foreknowledge made a difference ! All those foreknown of God are His People Rom 11:2a
2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew.
Thats their security, God foreknowing them ! This means, if we are true believers, we were foreknown of God from all eternity, Loved, Chosen and Accepted and secured in Christ and God's Purpose of Grace, which was given us in Christ before the began. 2 Tim 1:9. If we believe the Truth as it is in Christ Jesus, it is because we were foreknown and Chosen in Him from the beginning, and thus we shall be made to depart from iniquity, which is False Antichrist Teachings and made to cleave to the Truth !
Those that God foreknew, that is their security. Those He foreknew and Loved in Christ. 2 Tim 2:19
19Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
See the difference in these and those who will hear these words Matt 7:23
23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
You see that ? Those God knows will be effectually redeemed from all iniquity as per design of Christ giving Himself for them Titus 2:14
14Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
But those that Jesus will say to them " I never knew you" He calls them "ye that work iniquity" See the difference ? Those He knew were redeemed from all iniquity, those He did not know were workers of iniquity ! His redeeming death made the difference. His Foreknowledge made a difference ! All those foreknown of God are His People Rom 11:2a
2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew.
Thats their security, God foreknowing them ! This means, if we are true believers, we were foreknown of God from all eternity, Loved, Chosen and Accepted and secured in Christ and God's Purpose of Grace, which was given us in Christ before the began. 2 Tim 1:9. If we believe the Truth as it is in Christ Jesus, it is because we were foreknown and Chosen in Him from the beginning, and thus we shall be made to depart from iniquity, which is False Antichrist Teachings and made to cleave to the Truth !
S
savedbygrace57
Guest
Predestination !
Lets look a little at Predestination as we have Foreknowledge !
Our Dictionary defines the word as thus:
pre·des·ti·na·tion /prɪˌdɛstəˈneɪʃən, ˌpridɛs-/ Show Spelled[pri-des-tuh-ney-shuhn, pree-des-] Show IPA
noun
1. an act of predestinating or predestining.
2. the state of being predestinated or predestined.
3. fate; destiny.
4. Theology .
a. the action of God in foreordaining from eternity whatever comes to pass.
b. the decree of God by which certain souls are foreordained to salvation. Compare election ( def. 4 ) , double predestination.
Biblically:
Its the greek word proorizō
to predetermine, decide beforehand
2) in the NT of God decreeing from eternity
3) to foreordain, appoint beforehand
This word is properly used only with reference to God's plan or purpose of salvation. The Greek word rendered "predestinate" is found only in these six passages, Acts 4:28; Rom. 8:29, 30; 1 Cor. 2:7; Eph. 1:5, 11;
Now, its God's most certain and immutable Purpose of Grace regarding His Elect, those He foreknew. This Eternal immutable Purpose was to conform His Chosen Perfectly to the image of the Glorified Christ Jn 17:5. This was destined, determined before God made the world Rom 8:29-30
29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Eph 1:3-6,11
3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
4According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
6To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
11In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
Lets look a little at Predestination as we have Foreknowledge !
Our Dictionary defines the word as thus:
pre·des·ti·na·tion /prɪˌdɛstəˈneɪʃən, ˌpridɛs-/ Show Spelled[pri-des-tuh-ney-shuhn, pree-des-] Show IPA
noun
1. an act of predestinating or predestining.
2. the state of being predestinated or predestined.
3. fate; destiny.
4. Theology .
a. the action of God in foreordaining from eternity whatever comes to pass.
b. the decree of God by which certain souls are foreordained to salvation. Compare election ( def. 4 ) , double predestination.
Biblically:
Its the greek word proorizō
to predetermine, decide beforehand
2) in the NT of God decreeing from eternity
3) to foreordain, appoint beforehand
This word is properly used only with reference to God's plan or purpose of salvation. The Greek word rendered "predestinate" is found only in these six passages, Acts 4:28; Rom. 8:29, 30; 1 Cor. 2:7; Eph. 1:5, 11;
Now, its God's most certain and immutable Purpose of Grace regarding His Elect, those He foreknew. This Eternal immutable Purpose was to conform His Chosen Perfectly to the image of the Glorified Christ Jn 17:5. This was destined, determined before God made the world Rom 8:29-30
29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Eph 1:3-6,11
3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
4According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
6To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
11In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
S
savedbygrace57
Guest
In Predestination God, Before the World began made a Eternal Choice of all He would save, how and when and where He would save them, every detail. God had purposed the very day, hour and occasion when He would convert Saul of Tarsus. And so it is with each vessel of mercy. Paul's conversion into a believer serves as an Pattern as to how God saves and makes into believers , not so much an exact duplication of Paul's conversion experience as an individual, but it illustrates the same effectual power of Sovereign Grace reigning unto Life through Jesus Christ Rom 5:21 to accomplish the Divine Purpose. As with Zacchaeus [ See Lk 19], Predestination has to do with God prearranging all the necessary circumstances to perform bringing the Elect to Glory and being perfectly conformed to the Image of Christ. This Truth of predestination is a repudiation of mans freewill gospel !
S
savedbygrace57
Guest
Predestination God's Purpose !
The True God of scripture is a God of Purpose, everything in time revolves around Purpose Ecc 3:1
1To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven:
The word season is the hebrew word zĕman and means:
a set time, appointed time, time
In everything the Triune God has an Immutable Purpose as stated in Isa 46:9-11
9Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me,
10Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:
11Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass; I have purposed it, I will also do it.
The word purposed here means: to be predetermined, be pre-ordained
God's Eternal Purpose of Predestination is the Redemption of His Elect, the Chosen Royal Seed in Christ, which includes the predetermination of all things Eph 1:11
11In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
All things that occur in this life to each of us was purposed by God in Eternity, Just like the Death of Christ and the events and people who participated were all according to God's Eternal Predestination Acts 2:23;4:27-28. It was predestined of God who would betray Christ being judas, who would be Governor Pilate, and who would be High priest Caiaphas, all these things must come to pass; and in all these things, was God's Eternal Purpose of Being Glorified by His Son, the Lord Jesus Christ in the Salvation of His People. In Election God chose a People for Himself to be saved, and in Predestination He ordained all things that come to pass to ensure their Eternal Redemption !
The True God of scripture is a God of Purpose, everything in time revolves around Purpose Ecc 3:1
1To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven:
The word season is the hebrew word zĕman and means:
a set time, appointed time, time
In everything the Triune God has an Immutable Purpose as stated in Isa 46:9-11
9Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me,
10Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:
11Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass; I have purposed it, I will also do it.
The word purposed here means: to be predetermined, be pre-ordained
God's Eternal Purpose of Predestination is the Redemption of His Elect, the Chosen Royal Seed in Christ, which includes the predetermination of all things Eph 1:11
11In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
All things that occur in this life to each of us was purposed by God in Eternity, Just like the Death of Christ and the events and people who participated were all according to God's Eternal Predestination Acts 2:23;4:27-28. It was predestined of God who would betray Christ being judas, who would be Governor Pilate, and who would be High priest Caiaphas, all these things must come to pass; and in all these things, was God's Eternal Purpose of Being Glorified by His Son, the Lord Jesus Christ in the Salvation of His People. In Election God chose a People for Himself to be saved, and in Predestination He ordained all things that come to pass to ensure their Eternal Redemption !
S
savedbygrace57
Guest
Those whom He foreknew !
Rom 11:2
2God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,
This same word foreknew Peter uses here 1 Pet 1:20
20Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
So, Rom 11:2 could read
2God hath not cast away his people which he foreordained. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying, Or
1 Pet 1:20 could read
20Who verily was foreknew before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
His People He foreordained, foreordained to what ? Well the same word is used here Rom 8:29
29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
They were foreordained or predestinated to be conformed to the image of His Son !
The Foreknown of God, are all who God foreknew in Christ and who had a Representative being in Him from Eternity, having been chosen in Him Eph 1:4, No they did not have an actual Being, but a Representative Being in their Surety, who did have an actual Being. We know they had this denotative being in Christ Jesus their Head and Mediator, simply because the scripture teaches that they had grace given them IN Him before the world began.
2 Tim 1:9
9Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
Christ Jesus was the Mediator before the world began 1 Tim 2:5
5For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
The word Mediator is the greek word mesitēs and means:
one who intervenes between two, either in order to make or restore peace and friendship, or form a compact, or for ratifying a covenant
2) a medium of communication, arbitrator
As Mediator therefore He was confirmed as the Surety of the Everlasting Covenant Heb 7:22; Heb 13:20 for All those Chosen in Him before the foundation.
These are the Ones God foreknew Rom 11:2;8:29; 1 Pet 1:20, they were foreknew in the Foreknew or foreordained one that they were predestinated to be conformed into His Image !
All whom God did not choose in Christ before the world began are the ones Jesus will say to them Matt 7:23
23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
They were never of the foreknown Rom 11:2
2God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,
Rom 11:2
2God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,
This same word foreknew Peter uses here 1 Pet 1:20
20Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
So, Rom 11:2 could read
2God hath not cast away his people which he foreordained. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying, Or
1 Pet 1:20 could read
20Who verily was foreknew before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
His People He foreordained, foreordained to what ? Well the same word is used here Rom 8:29
29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
They were foreordained or predestinated to be conformed to the image of His Son !
The Foreknown of God, are all who God foreknew in Christ and who had a Representative being in Him from Eternity, having been chosen in Him Eph 1:4, No they did not have an actual Being, but a Representative Being in their Surety, who did have an actual Being. We know they had this denotative being in Christ Jesus their Head and Mediator, simply because the scripture teaches that they had grace given them IN Him before the world began.
2 Tim 1:9
9Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
Christ Jesus was the Mediator before the world began 1 Tim 2:5
5For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
The word Mediator is the greek word mesitēs and means:
one who intervenes between two, either in order to make or restore peace and friendship, or form a compact, or for ratifying a covenant
2) a medium of communication, arbitrator
As Mediator therefore He was confirmed as the Surety of the Everlasting Covenant Heb 7:22; Heb 13:20 for All those Chosen in Him before the foundation.
These are the Ones God foreknew Rom 11:2;8:29; 1 Pet 1:20, they were foreknew in the Foreknew or foreordained one that they were predestinated to be conformed into His Image !
All whom God did not choose in Christ before the world began are the ones Jesus will say to them Matt 7:23
23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
They were never of the foreknown Rom 11:2
2God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,