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Psychedelic drugs VS. the Holy Ghost.

YosefHayim

YosefHayim

Member
Describing the essence of the Holy Trinity, the Church fathers explained that the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost were of the same "substance" which make up the Godhead, which is one God manifest as three persons.

"And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God, begotten of his Father before all worlds, God of God, Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father; by whom all things were made; who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Ghost of the Virgin Mary... And I believe in the Holy Ghost the Lord, and Giver of Life, who proceedeth from the Father [and the Son]; who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified;" - Nicene Creed​

So they three are of one spiritual substance. I don't know if my mind is just playin with words, but the Scriptures declare that the Holy Ghost teaches us all things, and brings things to remembrance. That is the Holy Ghost he which enlightens us with the truth.

So once the the spiritual substance, which is the person of the Holy Ghost, dwells within us we are enlightened with wisdom and knowledge.

Now many, who are not of God, but of the flesh, believe that psychedelic drugs are able to enlighten the users. Drugs are often refered to as a substance. Thus now a chemical substance interacts with the physical body this time, instead of a spiritual substance which renews the inner man.

Furthermore, according to John 14:26, we see the Holy Ghost doing two things.

But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach...​

He Comforts, and he Enlightens.

Psychedelics are used to simultaneously put oneself in a state of euphoria or Nirvana (comfort), and furthermore are used to obtain a sort of "spiritual enlightenment."

Many "psychonauts" will take psychedelic drugs (LSD, LSA, DMT, Marijuana, MDMA, and Psilocybin, to name a few) to put oneself in an altered state of mind in order to reach the higher self, divine self, or in otherwords the false egotistical delusion that oneself is God or a god (See Genesis 3:5 and Psalm 100:3).

Psyhedelic comes from greek words meaning "Mind/sould manifesting". Similarly the synonym "Entheogen" means "god within" or "becoming divine within".

Does this all this say conclusively that "psychedelics" are a counterfeit "substance" mimicking the Holy Ghost, offering false peace and enlightenment? Are drugs a counterfeit Holy Ghost?

In the end we can say that drugs are sorcery according to scripture. Pharmakeia, the greek for "sorceries" or "magic" is defined also as the use of drugs. A pharmakeus is a maker of magic potions.

:chin
 
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I think that it is true that drugs are the worlds way of trying to achieve, what only God can give.
Many people want to obtain wealth, or happiness, or even healing. And as anyone can see that even prescription drugs have side effects and sometimes those side effects are just as bad as the symptoms.
However if it doesn't come from God, then it is a counterfeit.
 
For those who are in and of the world, I think psychedelics offer an escape, a sense of enlightenment and peace. Back in the day, some (LSD, I think DMT, too) were used to facilitate psychotherapy. That's worldly wisdom to the max.

Christians are called to use our minds appropriately, to study God's word and listen to our brothers and sisters in Christ, all that. We don't need escape and transcendence, we need (and receive) the Holy Spirit's guidance and love.

I like your post.
 
As a former psychonaut you are so right on, entheogens were my unction and chalice, Terence McKenna and Shulgin were my prophets, and the universe was just a macrocosmic version of myself.

Great post brother. Great word. I've been praying on how I'm going to help a friend of mine understand why these things are incompatible with the faith and you've helped me a lot. Thank you for sharpening my sword!
 
Blake said:
As a former psychonaut you are so right on, entheogens were my unction and chalice, Terence McKenna and Shulgin were my prophets, and the universe was just a macrocosmic version of myself.

Great post brother. Great word. I've been praying on how I'm going to help a friend of mine understand why these things are incompatible with the faith and you've helped me a lot. Thank you for sharpening my sword!
Click to expand...

I'm not sure where he concluded this from, but this guy L.A. Marzulli talked about how drugs send the mind into the second heaven or somethin like that?

In the book of Enoch, the fallen angels taught the cutting of roots. I think in the hebrew was something like "qasaph," (maybe I butchered it), but cutting of roots was later translated as "pharmakeia". Cutting of roots would practically be like making ayahuasca tea.

Having done salvia, LSD, and LSA myself I believe that your mind is subject to spiritual deception. I don't think Jesus is gonna be in your trips unless he wants you off them.

We get the word pharmacy from "pharmakeia".

Revelation talks about the rise of pharmakeia in the end times.

Timothy Leary, an advocate for LSD and founder of League of Spiritual Discovery, wanted LSD legalized as a holy sacrament. He was influences by aleister Crowley. He even said himself in an interview that he was "finishing Crowley's works". Crowley changed his name to match up to 666 in gematria value, called himself the beast of rev., and crucified frogs to mock Jesus.

In the MK Ultra experiments, psyhedelics were used to experiment with mind control. It's believed the CIA gave psychedelics to the public. Constance Cumby wrote about this in "Hidden Dangers of the Rainbow" which can probably be found for free as a PDF online.

Funny how it was used for mind control and then psychotherapy. It is indeed used in therapy as Christ_empowered said.

Also, in the film TechnoCalypse, which features McKenna, we see that some believe Psyhedelics to be a tool helping people to evolve to become more advanced for the singularity and transhumanism. This is the next step of evolution, exposing itself as the lie of Genesis 3. As Richard Seed and Ray Kurzweil said, they are going to be making gods.
 
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I use to take LSD as much as I could, and I will say this, you not supposed to be able to see what you see. Looking back on it some of my trips I can still remember and the things that I saw tripping, like at a Led Zepplin concert comes to mind. But what I learned from LSD is, that there is another world.
 
Lewis said:
I use to take LSD as much as I could, and I will say this, you not supposed to be able to see what you see. Looking back on it some of my trips I can still remember and the things that I saw tripping, like at a Led Zepplin concert comes to mind. But what I learned from LSD is, that there is another world.
Click to expand...

Are you saying the things seen on psychedelics we are not meant to see?
 
I too was an acid freak, ...it's not that we weren't meant to see, but more like forbidden by Father because it will hurt us, ...drugs are a door into the supernatural dimension, it puts us into an altered state of consciousness which allows the demons to control us by suggesting things we wound never consider in our right (conscious) mind.

In the last church we taught Children's Church, there were a couple of worship leaders that hypnotized the people and when that happened there was a shift in the time-space dimension, ...just like when coming on to acid, and the congregation went wild, the children became agitated and unruly, throwing things and hitting each other.

After that when these people lead worship we went into the church and came against it in the name of Jesus, when they couldn't do their "magic" they would open their eyes and sweep the audience, invariably they locked eyes with us, ...needless to say we were not welcome there and a short while after we were put out of their reunions of Baal. 1 Cor 11:18, 19
 
YosefHayim said:
Describing the essence of the Holy Trinity, the Church fathers explained that the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost were of the same "substance" which make up the Godhead, which is one God manifest as three persons.

"And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God, begotten of his Father before all worlds, God of God, Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father; by whom all things were made; who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Ghost of the Virgin Mary... And I believe in the Holy Ghost the Lord, and Giver of Life, who proceedeth from the Father [and the Son]; who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified;" - Nicene Creed​

So they three are of one spiritual substance. I don't know if my mind is just playin with words, but the Scriptures declare that the Holy Ghost teaches us all things, and brings things to remembrance. That is the Holy Ghost he which enlightens us with the truth.

So once the the spiritual substance, which is the person of the Holy Ghost, dwells within us we are enlightened with wisdom and knowledge.

Now many, who are not of God, but of the flesh, believe that psychedelic drugs are able to enlighten the users. Drugs are often refered to as a substance. Thus now a chemical substance interacts with the physical body this time, instead of a spiritual substance which renews the inner man.

Furthermore, according to John 14:26, we see the Holy Ghost doing two things.

But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach...​

He Comforts, and he Enlightens.

Psychedelics are used to simultaneously put oneself in a state of euphoria or Nirvana (comfort), and furthermore are used to obtain a sort of "spiritual enlightenment."

Many "psychonauts" will take psychedelic drugs (LSD, LSA, DMT, Marijuana, MDMA, and Psilocybin, to name a few) to put oneself in an altered state of mind in order to reach the higher self, divine self, or in otherwords the false egotistical delusion that oneself is God or a god (See Genesis 3:5 and Psalm 100:3).

Psyhedelic comes from greek words meaning "Mind/sould manifesting". Similarly the synonym "Entheogen" means "god within" or "becoming divine within".

Does this all this say conclusively that "psychedelics" are a counterfeit "substance" mimicking the Holy Ghost, offering false peace and enlightenment? Are drugs a counterfeit Holy Ghost?

In the end we can say that drugs are sorcery according to scripture. Pharmakeia, the greek for "sorceries" or "magic" is defined also as the use of drugs. A pharmakeus is a maker of magic potions.

:chin
Click to expand...

NO, the Original Trinity Doctrine the Cathloic Church (Not the Church Fathers) were defending the deity of Jesus in 325ad from a man named Arius.

Constatine and other said Jesus is God of God, the same Essence as the Father (Substance) They never mentioned the Holy Spirit and they were not defending some doctrine of Monotheism.

Hundreds of years later................................ the idea of Godhead and the 3 came into being and they are one God.

God manifesting himself as 3 persons is not trinity at all as you stated.

That is Apostolic Oneness invented in 1914.

Getting the historic facts strraight and now trying to figure out how the Holy Spirit V.S drugs......
 
i am not a former acid head ..i liked smoking weed .. but to the post But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach...the comforter is as one sent to walk along beside us. leads guides directs our every step . walk in the spirit led of the spirit keeps us from the lust of the flesh if we want
 
Brother Mike said:
NO, the Original Trinity Doctrine the Cathloic Church (Not the Church Fathers) were defending the deity of Jesus in 325ad from a man named Arius.

Constatine and other said Jesus is God of God, the same Essence as the Father (Substance) They never mentioned the Holy Spirit and they were not defending some doctrine of Monotheism.

Hundreds of years later................................ the idea of Godhead and the 3 came into being and they are one God.

God manifesting himself as 3 persons is not trinity at all as you stated.

That is Apostolic Oneness invented in 1914.

Getting the historic facts strraight and now trying to figure out how the Holy Spirit V.S drugs......
Click to expand...

Oneness teaching says that Jesus is the only person in the godhead. That's not what I posted.
 
Karl said:
I too was an acid freak, ...it's not that we weren't meant to see, but more like forbidden by Father because it will hurt us, ...drugs are a door into the supernatural dimension, it puts us into an altered state of consciousness which allows the demons to control us by suggesting things we wound never consider in our right (conscious) mind.

In the last church we taught Children's Church, there were a couple of worship leaders that hypnotized the people and when that happened there was a shift in the time-space dimension, ...just like when coming on to acid, and the congregation went wild, the children became agitated and unruly, throwing things and hitting each other.

After that when these people lead worship we went into the church and came against it in the name of Jesus, when they couldn't do their "magic" they would open their eyes and sweep the audience, invariably they locked eyes with us, ...needless to say we were not welcome there and a short while after we were put out of their reunions of Baal. 1 Cor 11:18, 19
Click to expand...

How did they hipnotize everyone?
 
YosefHayim said:
Oneness teaching says that Jesus is the only person in the godhead. That's not what I posted.
Click to expand...

I would go recheck that. I went to an apostolic church for a long time.

1 that become 3 is Oneness as you posted.
3 that are 1 is modern trinity.

Oneness states there is One God who manfest in 3 equal parts or what part is needed.

Trinity never stated there is One God. Modern corrupted versions that came hundreds of years later did that.

Don't take my word for these things, go google it and study it out.

The people that made the doctrine have stated that Trinity is not found in scriptures.
The folks that made the doctrine stated that (Cathloic encyclopedia 1912)

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oneness_Pentecostalism

This doctrine states that there is one God, a singular divine Spirit, who manifests himself in many ways, including as Father, Son, and Holy Ghost (a.k.a. Holy Spirit). This stands in sharp contrast to the doctrine of three distinct and eternal "persons" posited by Trinitarian theology.

You said:
YosefHayim said:
which is one God manifest as three persons.
Click to expand...

Now I have told you twice to help you. Have ears to hear and recieve the help.

Modern Trinity is there are 3 that are 1. Some modern purist say there are 3 that are of the same "NATURE" Essence, substance.

1 that become 3 is Oneness. Like you stated.

If your Oneness then that is fine, just don't call it trinity. YOU mentioned "Holy Trinity" Though.

You might be a modelist mixing both doctrines as modalist do. That is fine also.

recieve the help though when given.
 
YosefHayim said:
How did they hipnotize everyone?
Click to expand...

Remember the old movies with the swaying watch, today they use melodic words, for example they repeat Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, over and over, people that search for experiences are prime subjects for hypnotism, it's the power of suggestion at work.
 
Brother Mike said:
I would go recheck that. I went to an apostolic church for a long time.

1 that become 3 is Oneness as you posted.
3 that are 1 is modern trinity.

Oneness states there is One God who manfest in 3 equal parts or what part is needed.

Trinity never stated there is One God. Modern corrupted versions that came hundreds of years later did that.

Don't take my word for these things, go google it and study it out.

The people that made the doctrine have stated that Trinity is not found in scriptures.
The folks that made the doctrine stated that (Cathloic encyclopedia 1912)

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oneness_Pentecostalism

This doctrine states that there is one God, a singular divine Spirit, who manifests himself in many ways, including as Father, Son, and Holy Ghost (a.k.a. Holy Spirit). This stands in sharp contrast to the doctrine of three distinct and eternal "persons" posited by Trinitarian theology.

You said:


Now I have told you twice to help you. Have ears to hear and recieve the help.

Modern Trinity is there are 3 that are 1. Some modern purist say there are 3 that are of the same "NATURE" Essence, substance.

1 that become 3 is Oneness. Like you stated.

If your Oneness then that is fine, just don't call it trinity. YOU mentioned "Holy Trinity" Though.

You might be a modelist mixing both doctrines as modalist do. That is fine also.

recieve the help though when given.
Click to expand...

How is 3 persons as 1 God different than 1 God as 3 persons? Is God one God or 3 gods?

The scriptures say there is one God, and the three which are one are God.

Did 3 come first or did 1 come first?

And from 3 creeds on this site, they all say the 3 are of the same substance.
http://www.crcna.org/welcome/beliefs/creeds/nicene-creed
 
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Karl said:
Remember the old movies with the swaying watch, today they use melodic words, for example they repeat Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, over and over, people that search for experiences are prime subjects for hypnotism, it's the power of suggestion at work.
Click to expand...

How do you recognize it? Is there anything you would recommend? I go to a nondenom church, and sometimes I wonder if they are using certain tactics.
 
YosefHayim said:
How do you recognize it? Is there anything you would recommend? I go to a nondenom church, and sometimes I wonder if they are using certain tactics.
Click to expand...

Brother, all I can tell you is know the Word, anything that is unscriptural is questionable Isa 8:20, ...lots of emphasis on the Holy Spirit, manifestations of the flesh, practices that Jesus didn't do, that are not found in the book of Acts and are not taught or explained in the Epistles, ...which is how we determine Church doctrine.

The witness of the Holy Spirit inside of us, ...if you are wondering then that is the Holy Spirit not giving His approval, the Holy Spirit teaches us about Jesus, ...did Jesus do it during His ministry, did the Church practice it in the book of Acts, is further instruction, teaching given in the Epistles, ...when the Holy Spirit is present and active there is complete peace. Jn 14:16, 17, 26, 15:26
 
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