Reprobation

[savedbygrace57]

Born to be destroyed 2


2 Pet 2:12

12 But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;

The word made is the greek word gennaō and means:


of men who fathered children

a) to be born

b) to be begotten

Now this is spoken of men and false teachers in particular as we see in vs 1 2 Pet 1:1

But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

Now, how some understand false teachers to be saved or once saved beats me, since Peter makes it clear they were false, not backslidden brethren but false teachers who no doubt made a profession of Faith. But false teachers are the same as false brethren that Paul mentions 2 Cor 11:26

In journeyings often, in perils of waters, in perils of robbers, in perils by mine own countrymen, in perils by the heathen, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren;

Gal 2:3-4

3 But neither Titus, who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised:

4 And that because of false brethren unawares brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage:

Back to the text subject, that God ordained these false teachers lives, yes from the womb to partake of this condemnation and destruction or perdition Jude 1:4

4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

They were ordained of old to this fate; and so it is, that God before the world began, whereas at the same time He ordained the Eternal Salvation of the Elect, these were ordained to perdition, and disobedience, yes a disobedience appointed to occur in time 1 Pet 2:8

8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.

To some it is plainly pointed this 1 Thess 5:9

9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

This plainly indicates that some men are ordained to wrath, to perdition and destruction and condemnation !

While others, God's Chosen have been appointed to obtain Salvation through Jesus Christ their Saviour and Lord 2 Tim 2:10

10 Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.

Now in these things God is described as a potter making souls, either vessels of electing mercy and honor ,or vessels of wrath unto destruction and eternal ruin Rom 9:22 !

 

[savedbygrace57]

Even the wicked for the day of evil !

We refuse to agree with the false premise that God Loves all men without exception or that Christ died in order to save the same, scripture is plain that God made the Wicked, the vessels of wrath for the Day of Evil Prov 16:4

4 The Lord hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil.

From day one of his natural existence, he is being kept for the evil day ! Job 21:30

That the wicked is reserved to the day of destruction? they shall be brought forth or led forth to the day of wrath.

Also these same were hated by God before they were born Rom 9:11-13

11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth )

12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

Before of old God ordained them to condemnation Jude 1:4

4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

There whole life given to them of God is only to fit them as they fit themselves for destruction Rom 9:22

22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: See Job 21:30 !

These were made or born to be taken and destroyed 2 Pet 2:12

12 But these, as natural brute beasts, made or born to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;

They are by the Divine Purpose those appointed to wrath 1 Thess 5:9

9 For God hath not appointed[or predestinated us] us to wrath[as others], but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, For reprobation is God's Eternal Purpose of rejection as His Eternal Purpose of Election to Salvation !

 

[savedbygrace57]

The world Christ did not Pray for is doomed !

Did you know that there is a world that Christ did not and does not pray for or intercedes for ? Jn 17:9

9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.

This world that Jesus does not pray for, is the world that He did not died for, like the world of the ungodly here 2 Pet 2:5

And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;

This world will be condemned in the Day of Judgment 1 Cor 11:32

32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

That is the world Christ did not die for, the world of the reprobates !

 

[BornAgain]

reba



The Elect of God !

Since we are discussing this topic the thread What is Unconditional Election, I would like to know who the elect of God are.

 

[savedbygrace57]

Since we are discussing this topic the thread What is Unconditional Election, I would like to know who the elect of God are.

They are the Elect of God, you will find out in the day of Judgment ! You will also find out who was not God's Elect and who were reprobates !

 

[savedbygrace57]

That Christ did not come to save all people without exception, but in fact, He came also for the purpose that many should fall, the opposite of of His Purpose that many should rise, this purpose is even seen within the nation of Israel Lk 2:34

34 And Simeon blessed them, and said unto Mary his mother, Behold, this child is set [appointed or destined] for the fall and rising again of many in Israel; and for a sign which shall be spoken against;

The word again is not in the original ! So it could read, He is set or appointed or destined for the fall and rising up of many in Israel, speaking of National Israel here. Now Peter seems to confirm this understanding here 1 Pet 2:8

7 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,

8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.

This appointed disobedience is what Lk 2:34 calls He was set for their fall !

This is also indicated in Jesus words here Jn 9:39

39 And Jesus said, For judgment [ to fulfill the purpose and decree of God] I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.

Now what can be more plainer than this, that Christ's appointed coming into the World was not for the Spiritual Interest of all mankind without exception, but in fact, to further many on to eternal damnation and perdition Matt 23:32-33

32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.

33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

That is the Judgment or appointment of God Jn 9:39

39 And Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.

The Judgment was set !

 

[BornAgain]

Well, I did as I said and read your thread on reprobation and see that I am in the majority and disagree with your views on the topic.

I stand firm in the belief that:

Reprobation, in Christian theology is a corollary to the Calvinistic doctrine of unconditional election which derives that some of mankind (the elect) are predestined by God for salvation. Therefore, the remainder are left bound to their fallen nature and certain damnation. This same state of unbelief is also known as reprobation. In Calvinist terminology, the non-elect are often referred to as the reprobate. Similarly, when a sinner is so hardened as to feel no remorse or misgiving of conscience, it is considered as a sign of reprobation.

I pray that anybody reading this thread regarding reprobation will not be mislead into thinking that they are predestined to hell or damned before they were born.

 

[BornAgain]

It is nothing personal...really. I see you are very passionate with what you believe to be the truth but I see it another way. This is my opinion this time, but I really do have a hard time thinking that God predestined anybody before they were born to hell. It just does not make sense to me because God loves us so much and is long suffering and wants ALL of us that are sinners to repent so we can be with Him in heaven.

Peace to you and I think it is appropriate to say I will agree to disagree....

 

[savedbygrace57]

ba

Well, I did as I said and read your thread on reprobation and see that I am
in the majority and disagree with your views on the topic.

You reject Truth, and I have nothing else for you, see ya at the Judgment !

I pray that anybody reading this thread regarding reprobation will not be
mislead into thinking that they are predestined to hell or damned before they
were born.

Its very possible since multitudes were, God only ordained that few find life Matt 7:14

Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Even though a number no man can number have been Chosen by God, in comparison to how many He reprobated and made vessels of wrath, its few !

 

[savedbygrace57]

The Reprobate are these !

The Reprobate are all those of the none elect, whom God did not choose in Christ before the foundation and accepted then in Him for the praise of the Glory of His Grace Eph 1:4-6. All such are dogs and swine. Jesus says of them here Matt 7:6

Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

Peter writes this 2 Pet 2:22

22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

We are fools to believe that such people belong to these that Paul writes this of Eph 5:25-26

25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

Back to the dogs, John writes Rev 22:15

14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.


These dogs are excluded from the heavenly Kingdom, that which was prepared for God's Sheep and Elect Matt 25:34

34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

God says through Paul about dogs Phil 3:2

2 Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision.

This beware comes from Jesus Himself Matt 7:15

15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.


Those called brute beast, made only to be as beasts and taken to be destroyed 2 Pet 2:12

12 But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;

That word made is the greek word gennaō and means:


of men who fathered children

a) to be born

b) to be begotten

So God is telling us that these men and women were born into this world to be taken and destroyed, BTW they are the same ones that this is written of 2 Pet 2:22

22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.


None of these ever had a chance for Salvation, not ever, their whole purpose for living was to be vessels of wrath being fitted for destruction Rom 9:22

22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

 

[BornAgain]

The Reprobate are these !

The Reprobate are all those of the none elect, whom God did not choose in Christ before the foundation and accepted then in Him for the praise of the Glory of His Grace Eph 1:4-6. All such are dogs and swine. Jesus says of them here Matt 7:6

Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

Peter writes this 2 Pet 2:22

22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

We are fools to believe that such people belong to these that Paul writes this of Eph 5:25-26

25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

Back to the dogs, John writes Rev 22:15

14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.


These dogs are excluded from the heavenly Kingdom, that which was prepared for God's Sheep and Elect Matt 25:34

34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

God says through Paul about dogs Phil 3:2

2 Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision.

This beware comes from Jesus Himself Matt 7:15

15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.


Those called brute beast, made only to be as beasts and taken to be destroyed 2 Pet 2:12

12 But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;

That word made is the greek word gennaō and means:


of men who fathered children

a) to be born

b) to be begotten

So God is telling us that these men and women were born into this world to be taken and destroyed, BTW they are the same ones that this is written of 2 Pet 2:22

22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.


None of these ever had a chance for Salvation, not ever, their whole purpose for living was to be vessels of wrath being fitted for destruction Rom 9:22

22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and :4-6.to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

I have been studying a lot on this today and have a few questions.

To address Eph 1:4-6 so I understand:

According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Eph 1:4 (KJV)

From this do we learn that certain persons were chosen in Christ before the foundation of the world? Was this choosing conditional or unconditional?

that we should be holy and without blemish before him in love:— It is said of that class that they were the elect "according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, in sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience." (1 Pet. 1:1, 2.)

One who does not first show his election by obeying God may be sure that he will never be elected to anything beyond obedience. So is obedience the prerequisite to all other and higher election? I couldn't find anything about how God discourages a man from seeking to make his calling and election sure, nor to give him assurance of salvation, save to obedience to the will of God.

5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, Eph 1:5 (KJV)

There is no doubt but there is a certain foreordination taught in the Bible. In the passage before us it is clearly taught, as well as in some others. Jesus said: "And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and they shall become one flock, one shepherd." (John 10:16.)

In this he recognizes that he had a flock that were not then following him as the Shepherd. At Corinth the Lord said unto Paul: "Be not afraid, but speak and hold not thy peace: for I am with thee, and no man shall set on thee to harm thee: for I have much people in this city." (Acts 18:9, 10.) They had not yet believed, but God calls them his people. Does this mean of both passages is that there were a number of persons of that frame of mind and disposition of heart that when they heard the gospel they would believe and obey it?

through Jesus Christ unto himself— God's foreordination of men to the standing as sons is to bring them to himself, into perfect fellowship with himself as the true end and object of their being.

according to the good pleasure of his will,—God foreordained the provisions of salvation, the characters that should be saved, and the conditions and tests by which they would be saved. He left every man free to choose or reject the terms and provisions of salvation and in so doing to refuse to form the character God has foreordained to be his children and so predestined to everlasting life.

6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. Eph 1:6 (KJV)

which he freely bestowed on us in the Beloved:-In or by grace we are accepted in Christ, the beloved of God. Does this all teaches that all those in Christ are blessed?