Revelation 3

[Gazelle]

:waving Hi. I'm new to the site but was wondering if I can join in on this study? I believe that all who study the Book of Revelation to John are blessed for doing so!

Since it's only 2 pages so far (chapter 3 thread) I'd like to comment from the beginning?

Sardis began in 1520 A.D., and undoubtedly extends, historically, into the Tribulation.

This period of time covers the Reformation (with its dead, lukewarm churches) and is presently part of the Laodicean period as well.

During the Reformation, entire countries became Protestant without being born again and thus this is the reason for that "deadness". Protestantism was made the state religion, and was freely embraced by millions who did not know what it meant to become new creations in Christ Jesus (see 2 Corinthians 5:17).

Thus, Sardis became the mother of dead orthodoxy. Hundreds of churches follow Sardis' lead today, I agree.

Sardis was admonished to: Be watchful or alert: knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep (Romans 13:11); Strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die: Her people were to do everything possible to salvage the little good that still remained in their bastion of dead orthodoxy; Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard: The Sardis Christians were commanded to recall the former days-the early days of their salvation when they were filled with purity and zeal; Hold fast: They were to retain the simple truth of the gospel and discard the excess baggage of ecclesiastical pomp and ceremony; and Repent: They were to change their minds. Christ's call was not for personal repentance but for the entire church, yea, the entire movement, to change. The Reformation churches needed to turn back to Christ, seeking His will and His Spirit's teachings rather than manmade ideas about theological truth.One of the areas of truth the Reformation churches failed to proclaim was the return of Christ. Therefore, the Lord said that this event would catch them unawares: Thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee. No wonder many of the present-day offspring of the Reformation have ministers who say, No one can understand the Book of Revelation. It is a deep, mysterious, symbolical, figurative book. Baloney! Preacher, layman, you are the one Christ had in mind. Awake thou that sleepest...and Christ shall [raise you from the dead] (spiritually speaking).In the midst of this deadness, Sardis had a few who could still wiggle, spiritually.

Verse 4 I think refers to those who did not soil their garments with compromise with the world. (2 Corinthians 6:17)

Verse 5 would be referring to the Bride of Christ at the marriage supper, where it is the righteousness of the saints ( Revelation 19:7,8)
Next we see the message from the Lord, but it gives us four descriptions of Him:

• He that is holy: this is Christ in Hebrews 7:26;
• He that is true: Jesus said, I am the way, the truth, and the life (John 14:6);
• He that hath the key of David: Jesus again said, I am the root and the offspring of David (chapter 22, verse 16);
• and He that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth. Christ is not only the One who opens the door, but He is the door (John 10:9).

Next:

the church of Philadelphia extends into our twentieth century and even to the point of the Rapture, the command for each of us today is that we never deny His name, for if we deny him, he also will deny us (2 Timothy 2:12). Oh, the tremendous loss some will experience at the Judgment Seat of Christ (2 Corinthians 5:10). Christ also promises these faithful brethren that the members of the synagogue of Satan (false professors of religion as described in chapter 2, verse 9) will be forced to bow and worship the Lord God Almighty, willfully or unwillfully, at a future time (chapter 3, verse 9). This could be at the Judgment Day, for Paul informed the children of God that they would share with Christ in judgment. Hear him: Do ye know that the saints will judge the world? (1 Corinthians 6:2).

Christ himself spoke of that time when He stated: As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God (Romans14:11). Finally, because of their love for Christ, the Philadelphia-era believers are promised exemption from the day of the Lord's wrath, or the Great Tribulation hour: I...will keep thee from the hour of temptation (chapter 3, verse 10). In the Greek, the word from is ek, meaning out of. God promises to keep the Philadelphia believers out of-not through (preservation), but out of (evacuation)-the Tribulation. Thus, the Church will be gone when the terrible hour of Tribulation judgment comes upon all the world to try the earth dwellers. Praise God, This world is not my home, I'm only passing through. We believers are not earth dwellers, for our citizenship is in heaven (see Philippians 3:20). In the light of the coming of Christ, an admonition is given in the next verse.

quotes from : jvim.com

 

[th1b.taylor]

Till?

Might it not be that once the Law was fulfilled thorough the passing of heaven and earth, the only things necessarily everlasting would be His words, dominion, and kingdom?

You can take that up with the master when you get home. Two weeks before I was baptized I was saved and from that moment forward I have been counciled, lead and taught by the Holy Spirit of the One Omnipotent God and that is not what He has taught me.

 

[th1b.taylor]

{20} And in the same way He took the cup after they had eaten, saying, "This cup which is poured out for you is the new covenant in My blood. Luke 22:20 (NASB)

{4} Such confidence we have through Christ toward God. {5} Not that we are adequate in ourselves to consider anything as coming from ourselves, but our adequacy is from God, {6} who also made us adequate as servants of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. 2 Corinthians 3:4-6 (NASB)

{13} When He [GOD] said, "A new covenant," He [GOD] has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to disappear. Hebrews 8:13 (NASB)

{24} and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood, which speaks better than the blood of Abel. Hebrews 12:24 (NASB)

Gee...I wonder where us cute "Satan seeds" ever got the idea that there is a "New covenant?"


Paul has a word for people still stuck in the Law:

{23} But before faith came, we were kept in custody under the law, being shut up to the faith which was later to be revealed. {24} Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith. {25} But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor. {26} For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. {27} For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. Galatians 3:23-27 (NASB)

You can keep the Law if you'd like, but don't presume to preach it as gospel. It is not.

Peace. Out.

I did not make up lies to tell about you but you did about me, I hope God will forgive you your sin against me and against Him.

 

[Stormcrow]

I did not make up lies to tell about you but you did about me, I hope God will forgive you your sin against me and against Him.

The cute part is the fact that the Bible is split in two by so many today and they have the New Testament (They like the term, New Covenant) superseding the Bible Jesus and His Disciples taught from. They do this in spite of Jesus´ own proclamation that not one speck of the Law and the prophets would pass away.

In your original post, cited just above, you clearly disparage those who believe - as the Bible clearly teaches - the existence (and superiority) of the new covenant, then definitively declare that Jesus taught the Law would not pass away. When shown your clear and obvious error on both counts (not just by me) you retreated into the kind of childish nonsense of which you accuse others.

You presume to teach others but teach falsehoods. Would the Holy Spirit do that, or is that the work of the kind of proud, arrogant man you accuse others to be?

Go ahead. Continue to ignore my questions, but I'm reasonably sure others can see that you're not helping your own case.

 

[Stormcrow]

If you spent half as much time encouraging, and building people up in the words of Christ as you do slandering and finding faults in peoples posts, you'd draw more people to Christ, but unfortunately, you seem blinded by your constant need to be right and self-proclaimed wisdom.

First of all, I certainly do not have to justify myself to you. If you don't like what I write, please avail yourself of the ignore feature this board offers. The fact that you insist on making this about me instead of discussing the merits of what I write suggests to me that you are both ill-equipped to discuss said merits or even follow the TOS of this board!

And yes, I certainly can address your question regarding Matthew 5-8, but as I am typing his from my Android and not a real keyboard, and since such a discussion requires more material than I can offer from a mere cell phone, you're still going to have to wait (if you actually even cared about such a discussion in the first place given your obvious disdain for my writing.)

Where we go from here depends largely on how you respond further.

 

[jasoncran]

we arent saved by the law, the law is and was the means to convict men of their sins and didnt and doesnt make one righteous. no man could and can keep it.

the lord came to die on the cross so that men could be saved. we are saved by grace not of the law per the torah

that doesnt mean we sin and can sin all day long and ignore the commandments. it means that when we see where fail we must repent.

that said keep it clean, or this will be locked.

 

[Stormcrow]

that doesnt mean we sin and can sin all day long and ignore the commandments. it means that when we see where fail we must repent.

I don't think I or anyone else ever suggested we can continue to sin. However, as Paul points out in Galatians, the Law was a tutor until faith came, and when faith came, we no longer needed the tutor. Why is that? Because the work of sanctification and conviction now happens via the Holy Spirit in each and every believer.

Therefore the Law and all it entails passed when heaven and earth passed, and the kingdom of God was fully ushered in. That all happened with the events of 70 AD.

 

[jasoncran]

I don't think I or anyone else ever suggested we can continue to sin. However, as Paul points out in Galatians, the Law was a tutor until faith came, and when faith came, we no longer needed the tutor. Why is that? Because the work of sanctification and conviction now happens via the Holy Spirit in each and every believer.

Therefore the Law and all it entails passed when heaven and earth passed, and the kingdom of God was fully ushered in. That all happened with the events of 70 AD.

quick question, would and could a jew be saved via the torah in those days tween the cross and the events of ad 70?

and yet ignore the teachings of christ?

 

[th1b.taylor]

No, that would make Jesus a liar and that will not happen.

 

[Stormcrow]

quick question, would and could a jew be saved via the torah in those days tween the cross and the events of ad 70?

and yet ignore the teachings of christ?

Christ taught from the Torah and told the disciples that not one letter or smallest stroke of the Law would pass UNTIL heaven and earth passed. Further, His first advent was al about offering salvation to the Jew first, as He was born under the Law.

I've explained what that means (the passing of heaven and earth) in other posts, but as I am only using a cell phone to type this (posting links is downright impossible), I'll have to write more when I get back to my computer.

 

[Lloyd]

First of all, I certainly do not have to justify myself to you. If you don't like what I write, please avail yourself of the ignore feature this board offers. The fact that you insist on making this about me instead of discussing the merits of what I write suggests to me that you are both ill-equipped to discuss said merits or even follow the TOS of this board!

And yes, I certainly can address your question regarding Matthew 5-8, but as I am typing his from my Android and not a real keyboard, and since such a discussion requires more material than I can offer from a mere cell phone, you're still going to have to wait (if you actually even cared about such a discussion in the first place given your obvious disdain for my writing.)

Where we go from here depends largely on how you respond further.

I asked you a simple question, which you still haven't answered. Please spare me the 'where we go from here depends on how you respond' - once again another humble filled post, as it's a priviledge to speak with someone as mighty as you. Your arrogance is astounding.

The reason I pulled you up was I've read your posts for months and all you do is slam people and keep pushing your theories on people as if you are 100% correct. Now, from just a simple question of mine, you're skirting around an answer but if I posted a quote from Revelation, I'm sure you would jump all over it.