secrecy - one dangerous virus!

[Deborah13]

Kathi and Claudya You two should have a stand up comedy act.

 

[Sailingflutist-SF]

Claudya, After thinking about my earlier metaphor I realized that I stand corrected. First of all I forgot to spell check and most importantly, of the three types of love, there are only two at play in the metaphor: eros and agape. I think one can eros love alone as in infatuation or the basic, raw hormonal genre of sex as in the bar/club pick up but the HARMONIOUS, cooperative collaboration of spirit and effort which is patient and forgiving and all-giving stems from the highest form of love, agape (Christ love) at play. It is agape love which facilitates the perpetual and exclusive enjoyment of sex within a marriage, I think. Again, my two cents or euro.

 

[Classik]

Great replies tho. I totally agree with Edward's post.

I have been away for a while. Sorry.

 

[Classik]

Don't we think it was secrecy that made the serpent succeed in deceiving Eve? Adam probably didn't tell Eve where he was going. Eve probably didn't tell the husband she was expecting a visitor. Heehehehe

 

[Sailingflutist-SF]

@Caludya, I stand corrected on something I said in the earlier metaphor. I believe that there are only two types of love at play in that scenario; eros and agape. Eros being where erotic comes from and agape, the Christ-like love which loves %100 in spite of it not being deserved which is forgiving, patient, hopeful, unselfish, and all-giving. A marriage of two Christians can facilitate this kind of perpetual and exclusive innuendo.

And instead of thinking about an orchestra think about a duet such as BeBe and CeCe Winan, (

) or Larnelle and Sandi (glorious!) http://www.godtube.com/watch/?v=0FBMJCNU ((<CLICK ON THIS LINK, WORTH IT))or
on the secular side of things, Peaches and Herb (

) or Mariah Carey and Whitney Houston (

) or Simon and Garfunkel (

)

 

[Sailingflutist-SF]

Classik, The kind of love you are referring to is filao love which most people think is the "good" kind of love. For non-Christians it is the highest type of love which they can maintain through the years although at times they might display the higher, agape, there is usually a string attached to it. Filao love is the contractual or business sort of context of marriage or relationship arrangement; 50/50, you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours, tit for tat, if you want this then do this, and so on. This type of love or understanding is behind the secracy of which you refer.

What elevates love to the highest form is one having come to the end of themselves and experienced God's gracious, forgiving love ("while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.") When one is born again in such a way they become familiar with a love beyond reason which they will hopefully grow in as they age and mature in Christ. This love loves in spite of things which filao love would say, "No, you don't deserve it." It is unconditional and eternal and connected to the Grand Author of love and creation Who will enable us to exercise this love if we let Him work in us. This love trusts and has faith or puts its welfare second to the other EVEN if it is not due, as Christ was always risking His welfare for the sake of loving others.

 

[Sailingflutist-SF]

I am sorry for all of the pop up picture links I only intended there to be printed links. These pix kidda jumble things up. I am sorry. And by the way, if you have the time and desire, there is one link there which did NOT blow up into pix: the best of them all, I think for working together, the one by Larnelle Harris and Sandi Patti. You have to click on that link, as I had intended for all.

 

[Deborah13]

Great replies tho. I totally agree with Edward's post.

I have been away for a while. Sorry.

So you and your wife would never be able to take a job which required that you do not share information with anyone else. If you did and shared with your spouse you would have had to lie in order to take the job.
That means married Christians could not be in any medical field that deals with patients, research, etc.
No Christian doctors, nurses, EMTs (we have to agree to not discuss anything about the patients that we serve), etc. No medical receptionist, billing, or anyone that has any access to patient information.

 

[Edward]

Great replies tho. I totally agree with Edward's post.

I have been away for a while. Sorry.

Hey, someone agrees with me. That doesn't happen too often, lol. It's true though. Me and my wife (at first) were so connected that it was like we were almost telepathic with each other. A glance would tell what the other was thinking and we confirmed countless times. We could be talking about X then without a word both of us could begin thinking about Y in our mind, and the other knew it. We could change the subject without a word. I did have a job for awhile that had a confidentiality agreement and she would ask how went my day, so I would tell her, and also that it was a confidential thing. The thing is she did hold it confidential. We had this telepathic thing until she took her heart to the world instead of me. As far as I know, she has continued to hold the confidential things confidential. She has some honor, even now.

 

[Edward]

The sounds of silence within a marriage are a death knell. If she's still yelling at you...everything will be ok, and it can be assumed that the depth of her anger also reflects the depth of her love for you. So pay attention and do what you're supposed to do.

Anyone who can marry Carrie Fisher is ok with me! That blew my mind that Paul Simon was her husband.

 

[Sailingflutist-SF]

The sounds of silence within a marriage are a death knell. If she's still yelling at you...everything will be ok, and it can be assumed that the depth of her anger also reflects the depth of her love for you. So pay attention and do what you're supposed to do.

Anyone who can marry Carrie Fisher is ok with me! That blew my mind that Paul Simon was her husband.

Their marriage only lasted 11 months so...

 

[agua.]

So you and your wife would never be able to take a job which required that you do not share information with anyone else. If you did and shared with your spouse you would have had to lie in order to take the job.
That means married Christians could not be in any medical field that deals with patients, research, etc.
No Christian doctors, nurses, EMTs (we have to agree to not discuss anything about the patients that we serve), etc. No medical receptionist, billing, or anyone that has any access to patient information.

I don't think we're talking about breaking professional confidences Deborah. The secrecy in question is in things that could harm the relationship and professional oaths don't really fit this do you think ? We're obligated to keep a confidence when necessary.

Pro 11:13 A talebearer revealeth secrets: but he that is of a faithful spirit concealeth the matter.

 

[Deborah13]

I don't think we're talking about breaking professional confidences Deborah. The secrecy in question is in things that could harm the relationship and professional oaths don't really fit this do you think ? We're obligated to keep a confidence when necessary.

Pro 11:13 A talebearer revealeth secrets: but he that is of a faithful spirit concealeth the matter.

Hi agua, I agree we are obligated to keep a confidence even from our spouse. Some do not agree.
I was responding first to post #3 and #4, and then Classik was agreeing with post #4 from what I could see, thus my response to him.
It was definitely about sharing professional confidences and personal things told to someone in confidence.
Some people here think that you should tell your spouse everything if they want to know. Even if it has nothing to do with your marriage or them in anyway.
The only way I would think it was OK for me to break a confidence is if someone's life were/was in immediate danger.

That Proverb is a good one to remember.

Claudya should that be were or was in that last sentence? It stinks when a German person has better grammar than I do!

 

[Edward]

Deborah13, I'm listening to you all and think you have a good point, perhaps even exactly correct. I'm pondering this and will continue to do so. I'm not anally sticking to my view on this. I am able to learn also. One certainly would not have to lie to the spouse about a confidential work matter, it could be explained as such, and probably irrelevant to the marriage. My main point that I do stick to is absolute trust and honor within the marriage. There is no need to lie. Not even a little white lie (whatever that is, lol). I can see the honor in remaining confidential to the employer. Perhaps even more than an effort to be open with ones spouse. This point you make is valid and has been on my mind since it was first brought up.

:yes

 

[Edward]

Their marriage only lasted 11 months so...

Really. I didn't know that. Still though...

 

[Deborah13]

Deborah13, I'm listening to you all and think you have a good point, perhaps even exactly correct. I'm pondering this and will continue to do so. I'm not anally sticking to my view on this. I am able to learn also. One certainly would not have to lie to the spouse about a confidential work matter, it could be explained as such, and probably irrelevant to the marriage. My main point that I do stick to is absolute trust and honor within the marriage. There is no need to lie. Not even a little white lie (whatever that is, lol). I can see the honor in remaining confidential to the employer. Perhaps even more than an effort to be open with ones spouse. This point you make is valid and has been on my mind since it was first brought up.

:yes

Not everyone is cut out to live the same life styles. Because I can live happily not knowing everyone who my husband is communicating with, etc. Doesn't mean someone else can.
I completely agree with you about lying. Never, ever, lie to anyone especially not to your spouse.
No one will trust a liar.

 

[Edward]

Yeah, lol. My son is frustrated that I do not trust him and asks why. It's because of all the lies he has told me and the things he has stolen from me. It took me awhile to get where I'm at with him. It will take awhile to get back. This wasn't a single mistake he made, but a pattern of behavior over the course of a year. Now he doesn't understand why a single comment of ok, I will make effort and stop lying to you so now you can trust me again, doesn't give me trust in him immediately like he thinks it should.

Trust is earned over a period of time. It can be lost instantly with most people, but this is my son, so it took a pattern of behavior and many repeat offenses to make it clear that he didn't just make a mistake. He did it, so now he has to live with it, and work to get it back if he wants to.

 

[Classik]

So you and your wife would never be able to take a job which required that you do not share information with anyone else. If you did and shared with your spouse you would have had to lie in order to take the job.
That means married Christians could not be in any medical field that deals with patients, research, etc.
No Christian doctors, nurses, EMTs (we have to agree to not discuss anything about the patients that we serve), etc. No medical receptionist, billing, or anyone that has any access to patient information.

Maybe you need to read his post again.

 

[Sailingflutist-SF]

Really. I didn't know that. Still though...

Edward, believe me, 11 mos doesn't mean that he knew who or what he married at all. They were still newly weds still discovering each other. There is SO much that people destructively hide from the other before marriage and into marriage which should have NEVER been hid; even more so in Hollywood where this woman was VERY deeply entrenched.

Of paramount importance besides whether they are a believer in and follower of Christ, I believe, is any emotional baggage which has NOT been completely dealt with as I guarantee that it WILL eventually rear its ugly head and will hurt/interfere with/destroy the relationship. The prospective spouse should be made aware of any emotional baggage including and esp where they were an innocent victim. If they are TRULY in love it won't hurt the relationship but rather strengthen it.

INTIMACY in a relationship hinges upon honest, open sharing. If I discover that I can't trust my spouse (he or she has lied to/deceived me) intimacy is destroyed as INTIMACY by its very nature makes one vulnerable. And we all are interested in our self-preservation. Forgiveness and recovery are possible but it takes time and will and the Lord's help.

 

[Sparkey]

Privacy is normal and needed. It's a matter of respect.

Secrets are deliberately hidden out of fear of being seen for what you are. There are some secrets (like when one conceals a matter that belongs to another so as to spare them shame) that are based on respect also.