Seventh Day Adventists.

[Slippermen]

Proper doctrine cannot be claimed by any one group as being officially theirs. A doctrine is either Christian or not. If you hold to Christian doctrine, why do you separate yourself into a sepatate denomination? What is an Adventist the other 6 days of the week? :gah

methinks its really about money and power-as religion is human and we humans have...our flaws (to say the least)

 

[Joe67]

It is God who does the dividing. He divided the light from the dark. He divided the sons of Abraham and the sons of Isaac. He will divide the sheep from the goats, the fish in the net.
He divided the river, as it left Eden, into four streams.

God divided the Seventh-day Adventists out of the congregations like he divided the northern tribes from Judah and Jerusalem. God also divided out several other congregations at the same general time period. God has a purpose in this dividing, a purpose of blessing and good.

Joe

 

[brakelite2]

Funny thing about the sabbath. People pounce on the sabbath every time the law is mentioned. "I'm not under the law, therefore I don't need to observe the sabbath." Never seem to hear people say " I'm not under the law therefore I can steal your car."
And so often further reasoning is added by many, by saying Jesus advocated working on the sabbath if it was helpful to man or beast, and therefore throwing out the baby with the bathwater by claiming that thus the whole sabbath issue is now null and void. Jesus corrected the observation of the sabbath. He didn't cancel it. The way He taught for the sabbath to be observed was the way it ought to have been done all along. And the way it ought to be done today.
It seems to me that people are searching desperately for reasons not to observe the Sabbath, and any excuse will do, jumping from one excuse to the next . Are we not all Christians here? Do we not all profess to love Jesus and have a desire to serve and obey and worship Him? Ought we not the rather be searching for reasons to obey, serve, and worship as He would have us do, rather than making excuses for doing those things the way we believe they should be done?

 

[Joe67]

Funny thing about the sabbath. People pounce on the sabbath every time the law is mentioned. "I'm not under the law, therefore I don't need to observe the sabbath." Never seem to hear people say " I'm not under the law therefore I can steal your car."

brakelite,

Sin does not have dominion over us because we are not under the law. Romans 6:14.

Through the commandment sin deceives us. Romans 7:11.

Joe

 

[Elijah674]

Hi here you'ins! I posted this up on another site to a friend, an 7th Day Sabbath keeper (not Advent though. Nor am I!) It seems to me that there are TWO things that are hated in that denomination. First is their day for worship! they come out of Jude's WINDS all over the place against this day. And in second place it seems to me that E.G.W. is hated nearly as bad or worse?? Anyhow, see if this is understandable?

Elijah here:
Your [POSTING] is starting to sound like everyone else's around here! Get some TRUTH on board & tell us where [you think] that EGW went against scripture! (drop the 2 Cor. 4:2 'personal' stuff!)

And while you are at it answer this one from Christ's Word also for us, or DO YOU DUMP HIM ALSO using your same 'same false prophet' logic? and if NOT, WHY NOT??? Christ says in Matt. 24:14 'And this Gospel of the kingdom shall go [in all the world for a wittness unto all nations] and [THEN SHALL THE END COME.]' (dated AD 33 therebouts)

Inspiration in Rom. 10:18 DOCUMENTS.. 'But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, [their sound went into ALL THE EARTH, AND THEIR WORDS UNTO THE ENDS OF THE WORLD]' (AD 60 therebouts) +

Col. 1:23 (twice documentation! see Eccl. 1:9-10 & Eccl. 3:15 + Gen. 41:32) 'If ye continue [in the faith] [grounded and settled, and be not moved away] from the hope of the Gospel, [WHICH YE HAVE HEARD, AND WHICH WAS PREACHED TO EVERY CREATURE WHICH IS UNDER HEAVEN;] (AD 64 aprox.) ..'

OK: Christ DID NOT COME, so what will you do with this seemingly conterdiction, TOSS HIS WORD OUT AS A FALSE SON OF GOD??? + Prophet as well!

OK: Don't go hide! Come on back & tell me why you dump EGW even without her posted 'pens' wording, & scripture 'posted up' reason! and then here is Christ's VERY OWN INSPIRATION 'QUOTED' which you believe.. don't believe, or whatever????

--Elijah

 

[Fembot]

I don't understand why some seem to be rebuking brakelite2 for his presentation. I thought he put it quite fairly. Seventh Day Adventist churches do not teach salvation by works just as brakelite2 said.

This is understood by most fundamentalist and evangelical churches today. At one time SDA was considered to be a cult. Most evangelicals now accept Seventh Day Adventists as evangelical.

I agree. Well said. :yes

 

[Fembot]

Answering grade 2 questions with grade one answers doesn't make the grade. Torah has evolved by the word coming to us in living form. What about the teachings of Christ? Can we not progress?

Did Jesus come to abolish the law? Did Christ die on the cross so we could eat "pulled-pork" BBQ sammy's and get brain worms in the process?

[youtube:awo89j9k]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJCh7bR1Nf0[/youtube:awo89j9k]

If you think for a second Christ came to free you from following His good advice you have missed the reason why He came.

That was a great video. Thanks so much for posting...

 

[RND]

That was a great video. Thanks so much for posting...

You're welcome.

 

[RND]

Sin does not have dominion over us because we are not under the law. Romans 6:14.

Not until the law is broken is one "under the law."

Through the commandment sin deceives us. Romans 7:11.

Exactly.

 

[wavy]

Not until the law is broken is one "under the law."

Curious...Ga iv.4.


Finis,
Eric

 

[RND]

Not until the law is broken is one "under the law."

Curious...Ga iv.4.


Finis,
Eric

"...the fullness of time had come" - Regards the prophecy of Daniel 9.

"God sent forth his Son born of woman" - as prophesied in Isaiah 7:14

"under the law" - Under the requirements/customs/tradition of the Mosaic law. See the cross references for the verse you provided - "at the end of eight days, when he was circumcised", "when the time came for their purification according to the Law of Moses, they brought him up to Jerusalem", "the parents brought in the child Jesus, to do for him according to the custom of the Law..."

 

[wavy]

"...the fullness of time had come" - Regards the prophecy of Daniel 9.

Not really.

"God sent forth his Son born of woman" - as prophesied in Isaiah 7:14

Not really.

"under the law" - Under the requirements/customs/tradition of the Mosaic law. See the cross references for the verse you provided - "at the end of eight days, when he was circumcised", "when the time came for their purification according to the Law of Moses, they brought him up to Jerusalem", "the parents brought in the child Jesus, to do for him according to the custom of the Law..."

Here's where we get to the point. You just said 'Not until the law is broken is one "under the law"'.

Since this passage says Jesus is 'under the law', that either means he broke it or your interpretation of 'under the law' is wrong. Take your pick.


Finis,
Eric

 

[RND]

Not really.

How so?

Not really.

How so?

Here's where we get to the point. You just said 'Not until the law is broken is one "under the law"'.

Well, are you going to ask "which" law or make an assumption I was referring to the Mosaic?

Since this passage says Jesus is 'under the law', that either means he broke it or your interpretation of 'under the law' is wrong. Take your pick.

I think you have already displayed that you don't know the distinction of the various law classifications in the Bible and have a greater misunderstanding of what "law" Jesus is accused of breaking.

You know, if you stopped acting like you knew it all you might have some room to learn something. Take your own siggy to heart.

See Deuteronomy 23:25 for a better understanding as to what Jesus and His disciples did.

 

[wavy]

Well, are you going to ask "which" law or make an assumption I was referring to the Mosaic?

So...which one is it?

I think you have already displayed that you don't know the distinction of the various law classifications in the Bible and have a greater misunderstanding of what "law" Jesus is accused of breaking.

When did I ever say anything about Jesus being accused of breaking any specific law?

Try to pay attention.

You said: 'Not until the law is broken is one "under the law."'

Ga iv.4 says Jesus was under the law. The logical consequence of this is that Jesus either broke the law, or you're wrong.

You imply that you weren't referring to the Mosaic law...so which 'law' were you referring to?

See Deuteronomy 23:25 for a better understanding as to what Jesus and His disciples did.

This doesn't have anything to do with the present discussion I initiated with you. Again, try to pay attention...


Finis,
Eric

 

[RND]

So...which one is it?

It's the ten commandments. No one is "under the law" until they break the law. One can't be accused of murder until they hate their brother without cause.

When did I ever say anything about Jesus being accused of breaking any specific law?

Right here: "Since this passage says Jesus is 'under the law', that either means he broke it..."

Try to pay attention.

You said: 'Not until the law is broken is one "under the law."'

Ga iv.4 says Jesus was under the law. The logical consequence of this is that Jesus either broke the law, or you're wrong.

You imply that you weren't referring to the Mosaic law...so which 'law' were you referring to?

The Ten Commandments.

[quote:ibhfpmb5]See Deuteronomy 23:25 for a better understanding as to what Jesus and His disciples did.

This doesn't have anything to do with the present discussion I initiated with you. Again, try to pay attention...[/quote:ibhfpmb5] It has a lot to do with understanding what Jesus and His disciples were doing and what "law" they were accused of breaking by the Pharisees. Instead of your attempt belittle me with your "pay attention" quips you might want to actually read what is being written.

The verse you quoted, Galatians 4:4, is clearly referring to the requirements of the Mosaic law that Joseph and Mary were to perform as part of Jesus being born a Jew. This verse doesn't refer to Jesus breaking the ten commandments by virtue of His birth to a woman.

 

[wavy]

You're not following along very well, but I'll give it one last try...

It's the ten commandments. No one is "under the law" until they break the law. One can't be accused of murder until they hate their brother without cause.

So Jesus broke the ten commandments? And since when were the ten commandments not included in the law of Moses?

Right here: "Since this passage says Jesus is 'under the law', that either means he broke it..."

You're not grasping the conceptual relations here...

You quoted me correctly, but where do you see me saying anything about some one accusing Jesus of breaking a specific law? Got that? Specific.

It has a lot to do with understanding what Jesus and His disciples were doing and what "law" they were accused of breaking by the Pharisees. Instead of your attempt belittle me with your "pay attention" quips you might want to actually read what is being written.

Since when was I part of a discussion about the Pharisees accusing Jesus of breaking anything? You're lost...I think you might have me confused with someone else. So I'll be expecting an apology.

The verse you quoted, Galatians 4:4, is clearly referring to the requirements of the Mosaic law that Joseph and Mary were to perform as part of Jesus being born a Jew. This verse doesn't refer to Jesus breaking the ten commandments by virtue of His birth to a woman.

Ah, so you're just plain inconsistent? 'Under the law' doesn't mean what you said it means here? Why not? Because it disproves your dictum earlier that only when one breaks the law are they under the law?


Finis,
Eric

 

[RND]

You're not following along very well, but I'll give it one last try...

I think you're being obtuse.

So Jesus broke the ten commandments? And since when were the ten commandments not included in the law of Moses?

I never suggested Jesus broke any law. Let's follow how this conversation started shall we? You quoted me, used Galatians 4:4 and said curious. I'm just simply reminding you what "under the law" in Galatians 4:4 means. Again:

"under the law" - Under the requirements/customs/tradition of the Mosaic law. See the cross references for the verse you provided - "at the end of eight days, when he was circumcised", "when the time came for their purification according to the Law of Moses, they brought him up to Jerusalem", "the parents brought in the child Jesus, to do for him according to the custom of the Law..."

You're not grasping the conceptual relations here...

You quoted me correctly, but where do you see me saying anything about some one accusing Jesus of breaking a specific law? Got that? Specific.

I deduce this from your inaccurate use of Galatians 4:4.

Since when was I part of a discussion about the Pharisees accusing Jesus of breaking anything? You're lost...I think you might have me confused with someone else. So I'll be expecting an apology.

No apology necessary. You obviously misunderstand the term "under the law" in Galatians 4:4.

Ah, so you're just plain inconsistent?

Not at all. I just read differently than you with apparently greater understanding of what is being said.

'Under the law' doesn't mean what you said it means here? Why not?

I already explained that to you. Shall I try again?

"under the law" - Under the requirements/customs/tradition of the Mosaic law. See the cross references for the verse you provided - "at the end of eight days, when he was circumcised", "when the time came for their purification according to the Law of Moses, they brought him up to Jerusalem", "the parents brought in the child Jesus, to do for him according to the custom of the Law..."

Because it disproves your dictum earlier that only when one breaks the law are they under the law?

Not at all. It simply proves you don't have a good grasp on the law, either the Moral or the Mosaic. When I said one is not "under the law" until it's broken I clearly was referring to the ten commandments and I explained that. You were the one that used Galatians 4:4 with little understanding of what "law" Paul was talking about here. :crazy

Try to keep this in mind: Jesus never broke the ten commandments not the Mosaic law. Had He broken the law, either one, in either thought, word, or deed He would have been guilty of being a law breaker, and thus a sinner, and wholly unqualified to be our Savior.

 

[wavy]

Okay, whatever. I'm not playing games with you anymore. You're right because you say so, and I just lack understanding...nevermind that you're arguing with some other imaginary figure who said something about the Pharisees accusing Jesus of breaking the Sabbath...

I think the reader can decide for themselves.


Finis,
Eric

 

[RND]

I think the reader can decide for themselves.

I think you're finally right about something.