Sins of the flesh

[francisdesales]

But I know for a fact that water baptism is not necessary for salvation, as my Dad is a living testimony.

Water baptism is "ordinarily" necessary, but not absolutely. God's Spirit blows where He wills. Thus, the earliest Church recognized that unbaptized martyrs were baptized in "blood". The Church also recognizes a "baptism by desire" for those who could not possibly have access to the knowledge of water baptism as taught by the Church - say, Aztecs in 1200 AD. IF they knew about it, they would have been baptized. Naturally, only God knows "IF they would have"!

So technically, Josh, you should add "water baptism is not absolutely necessary for salvation".

Oh, and congrats on your Dad. You must have been proud to see his conversion. I imagine it was very powerful for you.

Regards

 

[Arj]

Ok,what happens iff i knowingly sin against god and he takes away his Holy Spirit.I repent and try to follow again in the ways of the lord,but he wont give his spirit back to me.What do i do.

 

[Catholic Crusader]

Ok,what happens iff i knowingly sin against god and he takes away his Holy Spirit.I repent and try to follow again in the ways of the lord,but he wont give his spirit back to me.What do i do.

Well, as Christians, we know that won't happen. If you truly repent (and we can debate what that means) God will always forgive. God is a loving God.

Luke 15:10
"In the same way, I tell you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents."

 

[Arj]

I feel im naturally too evil to repent properly,as ive tried so much and his spirit hasnt returned to me.Im at a loss as to what to do now.

 

[biblecatholic]

I feel im naturally too evil to repent properly,as ive tried so much and his spirit hasnt returned to me.Im at a loss as to what to do now.

When the devil puts that thought in your mind rebuke that thought. No one is too evil to repent. .... even if you can't repent "properly" tell the Lord - help, or do it for me "I don't know how to do this properly but I want to do it from the heart" It does help to confess to another person-like in James 5.... SOmetimes we don't "feel" the Holy SPirit but that doesn't mean He's gone. Sometimes we have hidden pride which can effect this, thinking that our sin is to big and that God has "written you off" but his is trusting in our sin more than in the Mercy of God. God's name is Mercy. He's the perfect Father with His arms wide open waiting for the a restored relationship


Blessings

 

[Arj]

I suppose its really about having faith.

 

[Catholic Crusader]

I feel im naturally too evil to repent properly,as ive tried so much and his spirit hasnt returned to me.Im at a loss as to what to do now.

Don't say that. No man is too evil to seek Gods forgiveness. But is does take effort on your part. You must honestly try to turn away frfom whatever bad things you do. But if your repentence is sincere, just remember that "with God all things are possible".

Think of it like weightlifting, and being a saint is like being built like young Arnold Schwarzenegger. You can't get there in one day, but you CAN get there. But even if you don't, you can still go to heaven if you try your best.

You will always sin. I do. I go to confession every week. Even the Pope goes to confession every week!!! He's a sinner too. Do not despair though - trust in God, "casting all your cares on Him, because He cares for you." (1 Peter 5:7)

 

[francisdesales]

I feel im naturally too evil to repent properly,as ive tried so much and his spirit hasnt returned to me.Im at a loss as to what to do now.

Arj,

The mere fact that you feel this way is an indication that God is working within you. Those who do not possess the Spirit do not repent, nor do they regret displeasing God. Having feelings of remorse, even if you say they are imperfect, is an indication that the Spirit is indeed moving within you.

Remember, God's Spirit is NOT about emotional feelings, but about faith working in love... When we love, we have proof of His presence within us. Don't rely on "feelings".

Regards

 

[Rick W]

Remember, God's Spirit is NOT about emotional feelings, but about faith working in love... When we love, we have proof of His presence within us. Don't rely on "feelings".

Regards

:smt023 :smt023 :smt023

 

[cyberjosh]

But I know for a fact that water baptism is not necessary for salvation, as my Dad is a living testimony.

Water baptism is "ordinarily" necessary, but not absolutely. God's Spirit blows where He wills. Thus, the earliest Church recognized that unbaptized martyrs were baptized in "blood". The Church also recognizes a "baptism by desire" for those who could not possibly have access to the knowledge of water baptism as taught by the Church - say, Aztecs in 1200 AD. IF they knew about it, they would have been baptized. Naturally, only God knows "IF they would have"!

So technically, Josh, you should add "water baptism is not absolutely necessary for salvation".

Oh, and congrats on your Dad. You must have been proud to see his conversion. I imagine it was very powerful for you.

Regards

You are right Joe, and I do believe that water baptism has its rightful place. I do not believe Jesus said to no effect to go into the world and preach the Gospel and to baptize those who repented. And I believe strongly now that water baptism has a strong symbolical quality of cleansing (as also seen in the OT) and also picturing death and ressurection, while at the same time providing the necessary confessional and demonstrative medium for declaring Christ as Lord publically before men - thus it is a powerful and wonderful thing indeed! I just didn't want anyone to get legalistic with it, which I see you clearly do not.

As for my Dad's conversion, yes I am indeed proud of Him, but I did not actually see his confession personally (though I have heard his tesimony), as it happened when I was very little or perhaps before I was born. But I have felt the power and fruit thereof ever since I was a small child and my Dad invested in me such a passion for God and the Bible since I was little, he would lay down with me each night and read the Bible to me and have me memorize Bible verses, which I really got into (I remember) because of some neat picture verses we had found through a Christian homeschooling foundation. But as I grew my relationship with my Dad has grown, and he has ever been an example to me in the image of Christ and we have prayed countless times over deep and even intimate things and I have a very great respect for my Dad, and I give all the glory to God, for man alone cannot demonstrate fruits of righteousness, love, and compassion - for such virtues only come by the Spirit of Christ and his powerful work in us. And I must say that I am indeed lucky, for my Dad makes it a joy and even an honor to obey the commandment to obey and honor your parents.

God Bless,

~Josh

 

[Catholic Crusader]

...I believe strongly now that water baptism has a strong symbolical quality of cleansing...

Most Christians believe it is more than symbolic: Most Christians believe Water Baptism is a channel of grace, and that it actually effects what it symbolizes.

Sorry, I know this is not a baptism thread, but I had to make that point.

 

[francisdesales]

As for my Dad's conversion, yes I am indeed proud of Him, but I did not actually see his confession personally (though I have heard his tesimony), as it happened when I was very little or perhaps before I was born. But I have felt the power and fruit thereof ever since I was a small child and my Dad invested in me such a passion for God and the Bible since I was little, he would lay down with me each night and read the Bible to me and have me memorize Bible verses, which I really got into (I remember) because of some neat picture verses we had found through a Christian homeschooling foundation. But as I grew my relationship with my Dad has grown, and he has ever been an example to me in the image of Christ and we have prayed countless times over deep and even intimate things and I have a very great respect for my Dad, and I give all the glory to God, for man alone cannot demonstrate fruits of righteousness, love, and compassion - for such virtues only come by the Spirit of Christ and his powerful work in us. And I must say that I am indeed lucky, for my Dad makes it a joy and even an honor to obey the commandment to obey and honor your parents.

Indeed, then you are truly blessed to have such a father on earth through whom God has worked. Many of us don't have that true earthly father figure in our thoughts that leads us to better picture our heavenly Father...

Brother in Christ