Some problems with todays " gospel"

[GodspromisesRyes]

The thing is when the REAL gospel and the REAL Jesus is preached their preaching is confirmed by signs and wonder and miracles.- NOT the showy gold dust, fillings, jewels falling from the sky kind but the kind that SHOWS that it is the kingdom of God that has come unto people through the word preached.

When we are born again and have recieved the Holy Spirit- the kingdom of God is IN US. When we go about living like Christ and speaking from the Holy Ghost rivers of living sweet water to others we by that word bring the kingdom of God unto them! When they hear and believe they will have a manifestation of the kingdom of God in their lives or in themsleves because they are by faith receving the kingdom of God with power.This isnt about just wanting miracles or wanting to see things, it is about the power of God in the true word of God to transform people from mere men to sons of God. To make them by the SPirit new creations that walk by faith and are transformed into the image of CHrist not to just stay the same ole sinner that attends a building.

Recently i was testifying to another christian about the work and power of God that was happenign to save a certian person and it appeared like all i said just past right around them and like they couldnt hear it believe it or receive it at all with any understanding for some reason and i was seeing unbelievers hear it and recieve it as truth more willingly.that is just very sad to me. How much of the christians we see commonly are BELIEVERS? or how many have received the Holy Ghost? How many more have said one prayer and just try in their own flesh to " live a good life".

I think that the doctrines and traditions of men have so overtaken what is commonly preached that the overall condition of the church is very much like the religion of the jews in jesus day

 

[Cornelius]

I 100% agree with you.

I left the formal church when I realized this , which you have posted ! I asked the pastor where his sign was. "Sign?" he asked."Yes, your sign outside your building that promises people deliverance from bondage and sickness.You should have a sign saying: "Come in here to be free from sin and the curse forever." He just looked at me. They had lots of gold dust in that building. It even covered the hands of the people. The pastor phoned me and told me to come and look. But nobody became free of anything ! No real healing, no deliverance.

Once outside I could breathe and then I found that outside the camp, many believers where walking in the simple truth of the gospel . They were believing the promises, they understood what Jesus meant when He said : "It is finished" They were in the rest (sabbath) of God according to Hebrews. They were experiencing the power of God in the daily lives. God was providing for them, healing them, setting them free from bondage and sin. They were not in the spotlight , not on TV, not taking any money. Just disciples. Simple ordinary people who loves the Word of God and honor it above all else. When God said something in the Word they all would agree with no "yes but....." added ever.

They are in UNITY. There God commands a blessing.

 

[ronniechoate34]

Are you saying that the voice of God is tiny and that we don't know Him or hear His Word in our lives? Also I know a little something about white noise. Not because of the movie of the same name but because of a few of my own personal experiences. Why did you mention it as a cover for the truth?

No, I am not saying that the "voice of God is tiny and that we cannot know Him"... I am saying we need to slow down, empty ourselves of other worries and anxieties and allow ourselves to just LISTEN! Then, we discern if this is the Lord's voice, not our own. Every thought that comes into our head is not God's voice!

White noise is my term for the thoughts about cutting the grass or getting dinner done that pop into my head while trying to pray. This is no cover for the truth, so stop accusing me of things WITHOUT fully understanding what I am talking about (which you have admitted). That is not how Christians address each other - shoot and ask questions later...

Regards

Okay if that's not what you are saying then fine. But it came across to me in that way so I asked about it. I didn't mean to ruffle your feathers.


I don't agree with the idea of letting go of our worries and anxieties and just "listening" as a way to discern the spirits. First of all what are you listening for? What is it that you expect to hear that you were not able to grasp in the Word of God? I have prayed for understanding many times and it always comes back to the scriptures. Always my questions have been answered by more scripture. Personally I doubt if you'll be the only one to hear it when God speaks to this generation.


I don't believe that I admitted to not understanding what you are talking about. I am not aware when or where that took place in this thread. I don't believe I have posted here in this thread but one other time.


I see. I understand why you said white noise.

 

[francisdesales]

Okay if that's not what you are saying then fine. But it came across to me in that way so I asked about it. I didn't mean to ruffle your feathers....

Perhaps you can ask without accusing me of hiding the "truth"??? You begin with "I don't know what you are saying. Fine. Then, you close with "you are covering the truth..."

I don't believe that I admitted to not understanding what you are talking about. I am not aware when or where that took place in this thread. I don't believe I have posted here in this thread but one other time.

How about I refresh your memory on the only other post you made here, since you have decided not to review your only post made here...

Ronnie's post in red.

This is off topic but when I hear things like this it makes me think. It makes me think "Wait a minute. What is this person trying to say here?" So I am gonna' ask because I can.

Here is where you ask me about what I am talking about because you don't understand my point...

Why did you mention it as a cover for the truth?

Here's where you accuse me of covering the truth, quite quickly after you express you don't understand what I am talking about. Don't even bother waiting to hear me explain myself, cause ya got it figured out already...

Hence, my "shoot first and ask questions later..."

I don't agree with the idea of letting go of our worries and anxieties and just "listening" as a way to discern the spirits. First of all what are you listening for? What is it that you expect to hear that you were not able to grasp in the Word of God?

Discernment means figuring out WHO is talking, whether you are God, through what you interpret or hear.

I have prayed for understanding many times and it always comes back to the scriptures. Always my questions have been answered by more scripture.

that's wonderful. but God speaks through other means than the Scriptures.

Personally I doubt if you'll be the only one to hear it when God speaks to this generation.

Personally, I have no idea where that came from, ronnie. More of that "shoot first, ask questions later" mentality? I never said or even implied that I am the only one who would hear God speaking in this generation...

 

[Dude named Louis]

Hebrews 10:24-25 (New International Version)

24And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds. 25Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

_____

You know it's a little ironic to me how some of you folks who think you have the REAL gospel and are so quick to condemn the church (universal) or specific churches. Is it your belief that what you have found has eluded people for a couple of thousand years? If it has not, if it is so clear in scripture what you speak of, has no one taught it? Shouldn't like-minded people throughout the centuries have come together by now and begun assembling and preaching what you say is the truth?

If that is not the case then are you starting to do it now? If so, don't you think it will be only a matter of time before someone else comes along, looks at your "church", your "body" and say, "wow, those poor suckers are missing the point."

I don't hear much love coming from your gospel. I hear divisiveness.

 

[DarcyLu]

i have reservations about churches, but this weekend i went to a church who once a year pray over couples who can not have children, i guess this has been so successful there have been articles in the local papers and this church is located in a very large city. people from all over the US come to this church each year to be prayed over. they allowed the couples who had been prayed for in 2009 speak of their journey - holding their new babies. There were at least 20-25 babies that had been prayed for and it was so wonderful, amazing and a powerful message to get to SEE these tiny little miracles!! i am not saying that these couples could not form their own prayer team and am sure they have, but these couples get to have 1,000's of people praying for them all at once! to me this is a perfect example of His Body at work. BTW, this church does preach, "by His stripes ye are healed".

My point is, after this weekend, i do know there are churches who are "doing things right" and the Spirit is working through their prayers. it was healing for me to see this because i can be judgemental toward churches today - it's freeing and although i still believe there are many churches going in the wrong direction, obviously there are many more where God is using His Body in a great way! Praise Him for not leaving His Church and for building up His Body in a grand way!

 

[tim-from-pa]

This is my observation about the church. There are those on this board, including myself, that are considered cults or have beliefs like cults, but there is something to say about them. At least they are well versed in Scripture with the same zeal that the original church had--- they have to be to defend their position. Yet, the mainline church will do all in it's power to condemn such people to hell if they don't change (and become like them I suppose) to a forever and ever burning fire, Amen and Amen! Yet, you have your average run-of-the-mill Christian who doesn't search, who doesn't study the bible, who believes everything feed to them, and oh yes, they accepted Jesus and all that pizazz and since they don't rock the boat, they are "OK" although most likely abysmally ignorant of scripture. I find the whole futile exercise is in some sort of conformity rather than searching the scriptures. If one believes, or claims to believe the scriptures after searching them, even if they are wrong, I believe God puts immeasurably more credit in them than a conformist who "accepted Christ" and blows the dust off their bible, or worse, just reads selective passages they were taught to "strengthen their walk". And by conformist, I don't only mean lukewarm Christians. There are some rollers flying higher than a kite every Sunday morning who really believe they believe all the bible, but in fact, much is the traditions of men.

 

[DarcyLu]

This is my observation about the church. There are those on this board, including myself, that are considered cults or have beliefs like cults, but there is something to say about them. At least they are well versed in Scripture with the same zeal that the original church had--- they have to be to defend their position. Yet, the mainline church will do all in it's power to condemn such people to hell if they don't change (and become like them I suppose) to a forever and ever burning fire, Amen and Amen! Yet, you have your average run-of-the-mill Christian who doesn't search, who doesn't study the bible, who believes everything feed to them, and oh yes, they accepted Jesus and all that pizazz and since they don't rock the boat, they are "OK" although most likely abysmally ignorant of scripture. I find the whole futile exercise is in some sort of conformity rather than searching the scriptures. If one believes, or claims to believe the scriptures after searching them, even if they are wrong, I believe God puts immeasurably more credit in them than a conformist who "accepted Christ" and blows the dust off their bible, or worse, just reads selective passages they were taught to "strengthen their walk". And by conformist, I don't only mean lukewarm Christians. There are some rollers flying higher than a kite every Sunday morning who really believe they believe all the bible, but in fact, much is the traditions of men.

hi tim, i agree with alot of what you said, there are many people who call themselves Christians, but do not study the Word, they believe what they are told and do not check the information they are receiving. we are responsible for our own salvation and imo, it is one of THE most important thing someone can do for themselves - obviously. yet, it seems there are some who generalize all Christians, even if they do or do not attend church. just as you feel "judged on this forum" by saying people believe you belong to a cult, it is the same the other way, just because a person does attend church does not mean they are one of those who do not really know the scripture. perhaps they can not find another place to fellowship with others that have exaclty the same beliefs and you can find othes in a church. another point i would like to make, it seems there is an "us" vs "them" mentality and if we are true seekers of His truth and have not yet come to the entire truth yet, should we see them as "one of those" or part of the Body of Christ who should be supported, prayed for and loved just as anyone else should be. i am changing my tune a little bit from past posts, but God has shown me how judgmental i have been and how i was beginning to be an "us" vs "them" type and i have had to since repent of this sin.
just my
God bless -

 

[ronniechoate34]

Hebrews 10:24-25 (New International Version)

24And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds. 25Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

_____

You know it's a little ironic to me how some of you folks who think you have the REAL gospel and are so quick to condemn the church (universal) or specific churches. Is it your belief that what you have found has eluded people for a couple of thousand years? If it has not, if it is so clear in scripture what you speak of, has no one taught it? Shouldn't like-minded people throughout the centuries have come together by now and begun assembling and preaching what you say is the truth?

If that is not the case then are you starting to do it now? If so, don't you think it will be only a matter of time before someone else comes along, looks at your "church", your "body" and say, "wow, those poor suckers are missing the point."

I don't hear much love coming from your gospel. I hear divisiveness.

Who are you addressing here?

 

[Dude named Louis]

...just as you feel "judged on this forum" by saying people believe you belong to a cult, it is the same the other way, just because a person does attend church does not mean they are one of those who do not really know the scripture. perhaps they can not find another place to fellowship with others that have exaclty the same beliefs and you can find othes in a church. another point i would like to make, it seems there is an "us" vs "them" mentality and if we are true seekers of His truth and have not yet come to the entire truth yet, should we see them as "one of those" or part of the Body of Christ who should be supported, prayed for and loved just as anyone else should be. i am changing my tune a little bit from past posts, but God has shown me how judgmental i have been and how i was beginning to be an "us" vs "them" type and i have had to since repent of this sin.
just my
God bless -

Said with love and humility. The body of Christ is alive and well both inside and outside of church walls.

 

[Dude named Louis]

Hebrews 10:24-25 (New International Version)

24And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds. 25Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

_____

You know it's a little ironic to me how some of you folks who think you have the REAL gospel and are so quick to condemn the church (universal) or specific churches. Is it your belief that what you have found has eluded people for a couple of thousand years? If it has not, if it is so clear in scripture what you speak of, has no one taught it? Shouldn't like-minded people throughout the centuries have come together by now and begun assembling and preaching what you say is the truth?

If that is not the case then are you starting to do it now? If so, don't you think it will be only a matter of time before someone else comes along, looks at your "church", your "body" and say, "wow, those poor suckers are missing the point."

I don't hear much love coming from your gospel. I hear divisiveness.

Who are you addressing here?

I thought it was clear.

 

[ronniechoate34]

Okay if that's not what you are saying then fine. But it came across to me in that way so I asked about it. I didn't mean to ruffle your feathers....

Perhaps you can ask without accusing me of hiding the "truth"??? You begin with "I don't know what you are saying. Fine. Then, you close with "you are covering the truth..."

I don't believe that I admitted to not understanding what you are talking about. I am not aware when or where that took place in this thread. I don't believe I have posted here in this thread but one other time.

How about I refresh your memory on the only other post you made here, since you have decided not to review your only post made here...

Ronnie's post in red.

This is off topic but when I hear things like this it makes me think. It makes me think "Wait a minute. What is this person trying to say here?" So I am gonna' ask because I can.

Here is where you ask me about what I am talking about because you don't understand my point...

Why did you mention it as a cover for the truth?

Here's where you accuse me of covering the truth, quite quickly after you express you don't understand what I am talking about. Don't even bother waiting to hear me explain myself, cause ya got it figured out already...

Hence, my "shoot first and ask questions later..."

I don't agree with the idea of letting go of our worries and anxieties and just "listening" as a way to discern the spirits. First of all what are you listening for? What is it that you expect to hear that you were not able to grasp in the Word of God?

Discernment means figuring out WHO is talking, whether you are God, through what you interpret or hear.

I have prayed for understanding many times and it always comes back to the scriptures. Always my questions have been answered by more scripture.

that's wonderful. but God speaks through other means than the Scriptures.

Personally I doubt if you'll be the only one to hear it when God speaks to this generation.

Personally, I have no idea where that came from, ronnie. More of that "shoot first, ask questions later" mentality? I never said or even implied that I am the only one who would hear God speaking in this generation...

I think you are putting words in my posts that aren't there. I never said that "YOU are covering the truth"


Actually you are the one that said that God's voice isn't getting through because of the white noise. So naturally I assumed you meant that the white noise in our lives covers the voice of truth. That's is to say the voice of God that directs us in what the truth is.


I had no idea which way you would go with your answer. But yes you are right. I was confused about the exact meaning of your words.

Here's where you accuse me of covering the truth, quite quickly after you express you don't understand what I am talking about. Don't even bother waiting to hear me explain myself, cause ya got it figured out already...

Actually it's a question. A question is not an accusation. A question is simply my asking for information. When did questioning become accusatory? I know that policemen ask questions but there isn't any reason to be defensive unless you feel like you've done something wrong. Is there?


For some reason I thought that you meant you listen for the voice of God. But you mean that you are listening for men's voices. I discern the spirits by applying the Bible to whatever I am hearing. That way I'll know if I am talking to the right Spirit or not.

that's wonderful. but God speaks through other means than the Scriptures.

He does? I wasn't aware nor do I believe that God is making any new revelations to anyone. If God speaks to someone and it's contrary to the scriptures then it isn't the voice of God at all. That's how we discern the spirits. Remember?

Personally I doubt if you'll be the only one to hear it when God speaks to this generation.

Personally, I have no idea where that came from, ronnie. More of that "shoot first, ask questions later" mentality? I never said or even implied that I am the only one who would hear God speaking in this generation...

So then tell me. What does God sound like? Does He sound like a man preaching the Word of God and calling people to repent? Tell me, what new revelation have you received?

 

[ronniechoate34]

[quote="Dude named Louis":2if80vta]Hebrews 10:24-25 (New International Version)

24And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds. 25Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

_____

You know it's a little ironic to me how some of you folks who think you have the REAL gospel and are so quick to condemn the church (universal) or specific churches. Is it your belief that what you have found has eluded people for a couple of thousand years? If it has not, if it is so clear in scripture what you speak of, has no one taught it? Shouldn't like-minded people throughout the centuries have come together by now and begun assembling and preaching what you say is the truth?

If that is not the case then are you starting to do it now? If so, don't you think it will be only a matter of time before someone else comes along, looks at your "church", your "body" and say, "wow, those poor suckers are missing the point."

I don't hear much love coming from your gospel. I hear divisiveness.

Who are you addressing here?

I thought it was clear.[/quote:2if80vta]


Nope. How could it be? Everyone is divided. Actually all of this division. It's only started fairly recently. Most of it has just sprang up in just the last hundred years or so.

 

[jasoncran]

enough, thread is done, i know francisdales long enought to say where this will go, and it aint looking good. I will let rick and the others decide what to do with this one.