Sunday 'Church' tradition vs. small groups

[Adullam]

We don't know what size the churches were. If they were small, it could very well have been due to persecution. There is no biblical mandate that a church must be of a given size.

You say you want unity, yet having many more smaller churches would further fracture the Christian community. And, again, it would allow for significantly more heresy and false teachings. You have something against large churches but fail to see the potential disaster of doing away with "large" churches and having only "small" churches. You entire position is based on conjecture and generalizing.

To see the truth you will have to turn your argument inside-out. The bible gives us the example of how to meet. If ALL are to participate in a meeting then that would limit the number of people to a number who can ALL interact with each other.

The early church was united with a common leadership. The meetings were limited in size to what could fit into a private home. But the saints would circulate from house to house on a daily basis.

The sunday service thing comes from a corrupted form of Roman practice centuries later.
Most people just follow the present conditioning and have not looked into what is really written in the bible.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

You have something against large churches but fail to see the potential disaster of doing away with "large" churches and having only "small" churches.

What I'm actually against is the tradition of the Sunday morning service itself, not just the size of the meeting. But it's true that large congregations seem to go part and parcel with the reigning Sunday tradition so that one generally means the other.

 

[Adullam]

Christianity today is presenting a completely different message to what was first preached by the apostles. It has been subverted through the traditions of men. It is having the exact opposite effect in the world that is should have. It has become the ministry of men towards God rather than the ministry of God towards men.

 

[Adullam]

Now that Christianity has been reduced to a religion, we see that compared with other religions Christianity could learn more about unity from all the others. This is how far Christianity has fallen.

Christianity has lost all credibility and is the laughing stock of the world. What other religion can boast of thousands of denominations? Jesus is whoever you want Him to be. Such is the cost of leaving behind the words of Jesus and the Spirit that unites true believers into a supernatural unity of commitment and love.

The evidence we are presenting to the world is that Christianity is just a man-made, man-centered religion that serves us with good feelings that we have an eternal insurance against calamity.

We love the disunity (in the name of our freedom) and the option to pick whatever truths we wish....while ignoring other truths in this consumer based religious system that has more in common with Costco than the upper room. We love the convenience of the Mc Church corporation. Super size me!

 

[Tina]

Now that Christianity has been reduced to a religion, we see that compared with other religions Christianity could learn more about unity from all the others.

Is being united in a false religion that leads followers straight to hell better than being disunited in the one true religion on some non-salvific matters that isn't going to cost anyone's salvation ?

Christianity has lost all credibility and is the laughing stock of the world.

If Christianity has lost all credibility, then why do you still call yourself a "Christian" ?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Is being united in a false religion that leads followers straight to hell better than being disunited in the one true religion on some non-salvific matters that isn't going to cost anyone's salvation ?

The disunity among believers in the church has made her weak and ineffective and robs her of influence in the world. To me, that is the important point about this. Even a false religion is powerful and effective when it is united in it's cause.

 

[ChristianNationalist]

I see where you're coming from, but most churches have a bible study available; usually after the service. That may be the small intimate group you're looking for.

 

[Adullam]

I see where you're coming from, but most churches have a bible study available; usually after the service. That may be the small intimate group you're looking for.

or...many Christians after their meeting around the Lord go to a restaurant...this might just be the larger meeting you are looking for! ;)
All are welcome!

 

[Adullam]

Is being united in a false religion that leads followers straight to hell better than being disunited in the one true religion on some non-salvific matters that isn't going to cost anyone's salvation ?


Salt that has lost it's saltiness is thrown on the dungheap. It staggers the mind to think that every person who thinks they're saved...actually is!

Your premise makes no sense at all. How can dis-unity bring about any salvation. A divided house cannot stand.





If Christianity has lost all credibility, then why do you still call yourself a "Christian" ?

I'm not the one bringing the division.....do you see that? I still identify with Christianity even in it;s disfunctionality. I am my brothers keeper, no matter how delusional they are.

 

[ChristianNationalist]

or...many Christians after their meeting around the Lord go to a restaurant...this might just be the larger meeting you are looking for! ;)
All are welcome!

lol, that works too. Whatever floats your boat.

 

[elijah23]

I want to get connected with a small group of believers. You know, a cell group or life group that some churches have outside of their main meetings.

Should a small group be church for a person?

Should a small group replace the tradition of Sunday morning church? Can it?

I think you would be happier if you also belonged to a full-fledged church.

 

[Nick]

The disunity among believers in the church has made her weak and ineffective and robs her of influence in the world.

Speak for yourself, America.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

I think you would be happier if you also belonged to a full-fledged church.

Even if I was in a small group that fulfilled everything God seeks to fulfill in a meeting of the saints?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Speak for yourself, America.

How many denominations do you have down under? And what are the points of doctrine that divide them?

 

[Nick]

How many denominations do you have down under? And what are the points of doctrine that divide them?

Many denominations. Probably not as many as in America. But not the point.

Christianity is thriving in places such as Africa. While churches in America and the UK and other parts of the Western world compromise on the Gospel, many African Christians stand firm on their faith and uncompromising on issues such as homosexuality.

 

[tim-from-pa]

I want to get connected with a small group of believers. You know, a cell group or life group that some churches have outside of their main meetings.

Should a small group be church for a person?

Should a small group replace the tradition of Sunday morning church? Can it?

Yes, it can, Jethro. That's how the early church was, and also the persecuted church then and now. Also, sometimes you need a small group to avoid false doctrine to teach and edify.

Actually, that's what I do now, as I haven't been to a church service in over a year now. Ironically, the smaller group of people who really want to learn are right there in church, so instead of having home groups, I still go to church, but just classes and bible studies and avoid the liturgies.

I jokingly refer to our church as church #1 and church #2 (i.e two churches in one). Church #1 are the members who attend services only and then stuff their faces during class time in the social hall with sugary treats. Church #2 are people like me who sneak in the back (apocryphal) door :toofunny and go to the classroom (or the Tuesday night bible studies) with like-minded people. If I should happen to venture into the social hall, a person from church #1 may very well ask me, "Where have you been? I have not seen you for ages!" That's because they are from church #1 and aren't studying the Word as I am doing.

And that's how I like to keep it---- church #1 people hardly know I exist. You may find church #2 people right there in your own church, and can allot time right there to study with them without the need to hold it in someone's home. The only time you ever have to hold it in someone's home is if you have a church#1 pastor that may give you flack over holding bible studies in church. In that case, take the starving church#2 people to your home and study there the true Word. I'm fortunate enough to have a pastor who joins us so I don't have to do that. But I understand he has to do the liturgy to keep church #1 people happy. I would not want to be in his shoes, however.

 

[Free]

To see the truth you will have to turn your argument inside-out. The bible gives us the example of how to meet. If ALL are to participate in a meeting then that would limit the number of people to a number who can ALL interact with each other.

The early church was united with a common leadership. The meetings were limited in size to what could fit into a private home. But the saints would circulate from house to house on a daily basis.

But if you look closely, you will see that there was already disunity, which Paul speaks about. And that was in his time. And while the Bible records how the early church met, it is descriptive and is in no way whatsoever prescriptive.

And looking at how the Church is now, there is no way that, for all intents and purposes, a near infinite increase in the number of groups meeting would result in increased unity. The disunity would increase proportionally to the number of groups. If the church is so lacking in unity now, further fracturing it will exacerbate the problem.

This is a significant problem in the argument for small groups only. And, as I have mentioned a couple of times now, the likelihood of error and heresy being taught would likely increase proportionally as well.

These two significant problems alone should give one a tremendous amount of caution in arguing for small groups only.

Now that Christianity has been reduced to a religion, we see that compared with other religions Christianity could learn more about unity from all the others. This is how far Christianity has fallen.

Christianity always has and always will be a religion.

Christianity has lost all credibility and is the laughing stock of the world. What other religion can boast of thousands of denominations? Jesus is whoever you want Him to be.

And with many more small groups, we would have that many more denominations and Jesuses (pl?).

We love the disunity (in the name of our freedom) and the option to pick whatever truths we wish....while ignoring other truths in this consumer based religious system that has more in common with Costco than the upper room. We love the convenience of the Mc Church corporation. Super size me!

And the way to deal with this is by increasing the number of groups and decentralizing authority? In stead of having a Mc Church every few blocks, you would have many types of churches on every block. Talk of picking and choosing.

The disunity among believers in the church has made her weak and ineffective and robs her of influence in the world. To me, that is the important point about this.

And yet small groups in favour of larger Sunday service would significantly increase disunity.

 

[elijah23]

Even if I was in a small group that fulfilled everything God seeks to fulfill in a meeting of the saints?

A person can get lonely. The fellowship and support of a church goes a long ways towards solving that problem. I think the Lord planned it that way.

 

[Tina]

Many denominations. Probably not as many as in America. But not the point.

Christianity is thriving in places such as Africa. While churches in America and the UK and other parts of the Western world compromise on the Gospel, many African Christians stand firm on their faith and uncompromising on issues such as homosexuality.

Well said, Nick !

Christianity is thriving not only in regions like Africa but also Asia. That is not to say denominations don't exist here - of course they do.... but not at the expense of dividing the church and compromising scriptures.


There is too much judgementalism and broad generalization going on in this thread.

I can almost sense bitterness among some "Christians" against what they perceive as "churches" and denominations.

Disunity and disagreements are global epidemic that does not only exist in Christianity but also in other religions like Islam from which terrorism cults stem.

Sure, other religions like Buddhism and Hinduism appear most united, but so what? Unity is useless without salvation.

Terrorism or no terrorism, unity or disunity, big church or small church .... no religion guarantees salvation except Christianity, and that's the fact.

The disunity among believers in the church has made her weak and ineffective and robs her of influence in the world. To me, that is the important point about this. Even a false religion is powerful and effective when it is united in it's cause.

That the church robbing the world of influence by becoming weak and ineffective in certain parts of the world like the US and UK cannot solely be blamed on denominations and disintegration but on human weaknesses in failing to understand scriptures.

The Catholic Church boasts of being a most united church and the one true church but look at the kind of extra-biblical and anti-biblical doctrines it has spun, leading the entire flock of 1 billion astray. Has "unity" in the church helped at all ?

How about small churches? Can unity always be guranteed in a small church and even with unity, how can it guarantee right interpretation of scriptures?

 

[jasoncran]

@ free. here in florida and two the south of me there is a poor black hood. a street that is the highest in crime., deaths and drugs. on this same road theres at least ten churches all within walking distance. imagine if these united and prayed and lived for the lord.

i bet that community would be different today.