The Firmament Above The Earth Is Solid?

[Razeontherock]

I have no agenda. Just trying to understand it. So went to the concordance (blb) and it was surprising to me that it said it is solid.

That's what we're supposed to do, right? Go back into the original language of the text to gain insight. And, yes, I agree, let's stick to the text of the scriptures.

So where is it saying that the waters above are clouds?
And why wouldn't it be solid as stated in the text?

Concordances (especially Strong's, which is primitive in terms of scholarship) lexicons and other study aids are helpful, but only bring us so far. It is no substitute for speaking the language. To see what I mean, just read the Amplified version. It spells out all the meanings of the words, only eliminating those that are grammatically impossible.

The resultant understanding is that we can't latch onto one possible meaning out of many, in this case "solid," and tell ourselves "that's the one!" There is no reason to think that one is what was intended, to the exclusion of all others. Hebrew just doesn't work that way. There is especially no reason to think that what was intended was a literal, one English word meaning; ancient Hebrew was figurative and symbolic.

There is every reason to take the intent of the text as pointing to God's supremacy, filling us with wonder, and encouraging us to learn. And learn we have! Ancient peoples did, too; but God didn't use Scripture to spell out scientific details for us. What kind of a parent spells out all the answers for their child? He gave us a brain, and encourages us to use it. Passages like this are part of that process. Most pioneers of science specifically credited God for their inspiration, while the discoveries were gained through experimentation and hard work.

I can envision God as puzzled that we haven't figured out gravity and how to manipulate it yet, sad that we still struggle with energy, and horrified at our misuse of atomic energy when we have so many ways of using it safely.

 

[Razeontherock]

And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven. Genesis 1:20 KJV

Birds were flying in the open firmament of heaven.

Man was made from dirt. These were made from water, and flew. Water is lighter than dirt.

Is this telling us any scientific principle? I'm not claiming it does, but it does give us a separation of types of creation that is usually overlooked.

Do hollow bones of birds float?

 

[Michael74]

Out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to Adam to see what he would call them. And whatever Adam called each living creature, that was its name. Genesis 2:19 NKJV

 

[Edward]

And thank God it is not salvific, just like "Nephilim", "rapture", and other controversial mysteries.

I'll take Michael's cue above:
Gen. 1:20: "And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven."

So according to your theory, the birds fly in a solid.
TD

That's a pretty good scripture there, Brother, lol. Lots of scriptures since this morning I see. That's pretty plain too.

Well I asked for it, didn't I? Lol. OTOH, in scripture, Jesus walked though walls. So He could have made the birds able to fly through a solid. He's God, is anything too hard for Him? :wink

 

[Edward]

Hebrews see things vastly different than gentiles, and keep in mind we were grafted in.
One major difference in our thinking which is reflected in our language is this. Hebrews think in terms of function and verb. We think in terms of nouns.

Keeping this in mind, they are not going to look at the idea of solid which is used to describe a verb the way we might because we use adjectives to describe nouns, not verbs.. Let me give you an example that was taught to me years ago.

We look and we see a solid door. Solid describes the door. They see a swinger, because its function is to swing open or closed. Where we focus on the noun, they focus on the verb. So where do the adjectives come in, after all, it is a solid door that swings. Or in their mind, a solid swinger.

Jews seek signs and gentiles seek knowledge. It's amazing how we can look at the same thing yet understand it in vastly different ways.

Take a look at this commentary and tell me what you see in terms of "solid" for the verses you've quoted. If not anything else, you should see a completely different discussion going on.

https://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/8165#showrashi=true

So they screwed us. We don't even know how to think right. Well, at least me lol.

Is the door solid? Is it more solid, or more empty space? Since things are made up of atoms, they are actually more empty space than solid. Think of an atom. A nucleus with electrons spinning around it. but if it were scaled up, , the distances involved between the electrons and nucleus make it such that it is actually more empty space than solid. More of an illusion than real.

Lol. You explained that very well Brother. See though? The more I learn, the less I know I know.

 

[Edward]

Man was made from dirt. These were made from water, and flew. Water is lighter than dirt.

Is this telling us any scientific principle? I'm not claiming it does, but it does give us a separation of types of creation that is usually overlooked.

Do hollow bones of birds float?

Man was not made from dirt. Dust Brother. There's difference. Especially back then. Nevertheless...what is dirt made from?

da da da....and let the dry ground appear. Only water upon the earth before then. and then, what's water made of?
I'm pretty sure that it's light.

 

[Edward]

Take a look at this commentary and tell me what you see in terms of "solid" for the verses you've quoted. If not anything else, you should see a completely different discussion going on.

https://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/8165#showrashi=true

Gimme a few on this, Brother. I'm fixin some eats and tryin to unwind and various things all at once, but I'll get to it tonight. I want to actually read it when I can give it some proper attention, lol. Ok?

 

[Edward]

Out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to Adam to see what he would call them. And whatever Adam called each living creature, that was its name. Genesis 2:19 NKJV

Good catch Brother!

 

[Razeontherock]

Man was not made from dirt. Dust Brother. There's difference. Especially back then. Nevertheless...what is dirt made from?

da da da....and let the dry ground appear. Only water upon the earth before then. and then, what's water made of?
I'm pretty sure that it's light.

So what's the difference between dust and dirt, in this usage? And why is it any difference "back then" than it is now?

 

[stovebolts]

da da da....and let the dry ground appear. Only water upon the earth before then. and then, what's water made of?
I'm pretty sure that it's light.

Yes, everything created was from, through and by the light.
Notice: in the beginning darkness was not created, it was simply the absence of light.
But now that the light has come, how is darkness created? By removing the light of course.

 

[chessman]

So what's the difference between dust and dirt,

I don’t know. But you can’t spell dust without us.

 

[stovebolts]

I don’t know. But you can’t spell dust without us.

Ha, I love this!

 

[jasonc]

Yes, everything created was from, through and by the light.
Notice: in the beginning darkness was not created, it was simply the absence of light.
But now that the light has come, how is darkness created? By removing the light of course.

Act of God but not the means of how He did it.we will not know this side if heaven.

 

[Edward]

So what's the difference between dust and dirt, in this usage? And why is it any difference "back then" than it is now?

The difference is, dirt is dirt and dirty, and the dust was more along the lines of...like, construction dust...clean.

Back then the world was clean, fresh, and brand new. Man has trashed the world, and it's upper layer is cruddy now as compared to when it was new.

I heard one pastor on YouTube say God revealed to him that man was created from gold dust from the Pison river actually...
I have no clue if it's true or not...but could be I guess.

 

[Edward]

Yes, everything created was from, through and by the light.
Notice: in the beginning darkness was not created, it was simply the absence of light.
But now that the light has come, how is darkness created? By removing the light of course.

Exactly!

What is faster than light?




Darkness when light comes! Lol