The Glory as of the only begotten of the Father !

[glorydaz]

glory:

I don't think you understand that God's benevolent merciful love is unlimited

Its unlimited to His chosen people..for God declares He is sovereign and discriminate with His mercy of salvation Rom 9:

17For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

18Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

Ah, now we've moved closer to the center.
I certainly will agree that God has a special love for His children.

 

[savedbygrace57]

glory:

I don't think you understand that God's benevolent merciful love is unlimited

Its unlimited to His chosen people..for God declares He is sovereign and discriminate with His mercy of salvation Rom 9:

17For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

18Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

Ah, now we've moved closer to the center.
I certainly will agree that God has a special love for His children.

Gods Love cannot be but special, because He is special..and His Love is for His special children, and not for the children of the devil..they not special, neither is their father special to God..

 

[glorydaz]

Ah, now we've moved closer to the center.
I certainly will agree that God has a special love for His children.

Gods Love cannot be but special, because He is special..and His Love is for His special children, and not for the children of the devil..they not special, neither is their father special to God..

The children of the devil are those who listen to his voice.
Such were we all before we found the Lord.

Why do you have such hard feelings for those who haven't yet come into His saving grace?
You're supposed to love your enemies like Jesus did. I don't get where this comes from.

 

[savedbygrace57]

glory says:

The children of the devil are those who listen to his voice.

Not exclusively, for eve was a child of God, and listened to His voice..

 

[glorydaz]

glory says:

The children of the devil are those who listen to his voice.

Not exclusively, for eve was a child of God, and listened to His voice..

Eve was a child of God until she sinned and listened to satan.
Then she became his child.
I know this scripture has been given you, already, but perhaps you didn't really read it.
The unrighteous don't love God, they can't hear his words, but follow after their own lusts, and listen to satan's lies. Those are the children of the devil. Just as we were before we were saved.

Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me. Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word. Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me? He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

 

[savedbygrace57]

glory says:

Eve was a child of God until she sinned and listened to satan.
Then she became his child.

The bible does not say that, you are making that up..

After the fall, adam called eve the Mother of all living gen 3:20

And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of all living.

Thats is, all who would experience being made alive by Gods Grace..for God is the God of the living not the dead..

Matt 22:32

I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

This confirms that adam knew that God still considered them His children, even after the Fall..This too manifested adams faith..

Also, you are now teaching, that christ came from satans child..more blasphemy..

 

[glorydaz]

glory says:

Eve was a child of God until she sinned and listened to satan.
Then she became his child.

The bible does not say that, you are making that up..

After the fall, adam called eve the Mother of all living gen 3:20

And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of all living.

Thats is, all who would experience being made alive by Gods Grace..for God is the God of the living not the dead..

Matt 22:32

I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

This confirms that adam knew that God still considered them His children, even after the Fall..This too manifested adams faith..

Also, you are now teaching, that christ came from satans child..more blasphemy..

No, Adam and Eve had to get saved by grace through faith just like everyone else.
There are no exceptions to how one gets saved.
If you find some other way in the Bible, just point it out.
I'll certainly consider it.

Until we're saved, we're children of disobedience...you call them satan's seed.
I prefer to call them as the scripture does...

In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

 

[savedbygrace57]

glory says:

No, Adam and Eve had to get saved by grace through faith just like everyone else.

They were saved by grace like all of Gods elect are.The messiah was promised to come through her seed, you think one whom christ would come through was not already saved ?

In Fact, all of Gods elect are saved from their sins before they are born..

 

[glorydaz]

glory says:

No, Adam and Eve had to get saved by grace through faith just like everyone else.

They were saved by grace like all of Gods elect are.The messiah was promised to come through her seed, you think one whom christ would come through was not already saved ?

In Fact, all of Gods elect are saved from their sins before they are born..

The elect were foreknown from the foundation of the world, but their sins were not taken away until Christ died on the cross. That's why the saints of the OT looked forward to the coming Messiah.
Abraham foresaw Christ's coming and rejoiced.

Eve was the mother of the living because she was the "life giver" to human kind.
The Bible doesn't say specifically that they were saved but the covering the Lord provided from animal skins suggest that was a picture of salvation for man.

However, we can read in Gen. that Adam and Eve appeared to be justified by faith in God.

And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.

 

[savedbygrace57]

glory:

The elect were foreknown from the foundation of the world, but their sins were not taken away until Christ died on the cross

Yes the elect were foreknown from the foundation, which means foreloved, and their sins were never imputed to them, but to christ so that He may die for them..So if their sins were placed on christ, then they were saved from them, even though in time He had not yet died, but from Gods eternal perspective, He was slain from the foundation, and if so, then He was slain for their sins before the foudation..in either case, their sins were not laid to their charge ever.. 2 cor 5:

19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

How could they [the elect world] be judicially guilty for sins that were not laid to their charge ?

 

[glorydaz]

glory:

The elect were foreknown from the foundation of the world, but their sins were not taken away until Christ died on the cross

Yes the elect were foreknown from the foundation, which means foreloved, and their sins were never imputed to them, but to christ so that He may die for them..So if their sins were placed on christ, then they were saved from them, even though in time He had not yet died, but from Gods eternal perspective, He was slain from the foundation, and if so, then He was slain for their sins before the foudation..in either case, their sins were not laid to their charge ever.. 2 cor 5:

19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

How could they [the elect world] be judicially guilty for sins that were not laid to their charge ?

Gee, I guess there was no need for you to repent then, was there?

 

[savedbygrace57]

glory:

The elect were foreknown from the foundation of the world, but their sins were not taken away until Christ died on the cross

Yes the elect were foreknown from the foundation, which means foreloved, and their sins were never imputed to them, but to christ so that He may die for them..So if their sins were placed on christ, then they were saved from them, even though in time He had not yet died, but from Gods eternal perspective, He was slain from the foundation, and if so, then He was slain for their sins before the foudation..in either case, their sins were not laid to their charge ever.. 2 cor 5:

19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

How could they [the elect world] be judicially guilty for sins that were not laid to their charge ?

Gee, I guess there was no need for you to repent then, was there?

Sure, the elect repent, not to get saved, but to manifest that they have been turned to God away from the folly of their own understanding of how one is Justified..

repentance is evidence of Justification, not the cause of it..

 

[savedbygrace57]

The very creation of Adam and the OT sacrifices as types and shadows give us to understand the pre existence to the God Man Mediator who would come and give His life as a offering for the chosen seed..

Adam was a figure of him that was to come rom 5:

14Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
The word figure is the greek word:


typos which means:

the mark of a stroke or blow, print
2) a figure formed by a blow or impression
a) of a figure or image
b) of the image of the gods
3) form
a) the teaching which embodies the sum and substance of religion and represents it to the mind, manner of writing, the contents and form of a letter
4) an example
a) in the technical sense, the pattern in conformity to which a thing must be made
b) in an ethical sense, a dissuasive example, a pattern of warning
1) of ruinous events which serve as admonitions or warnings to others
c) an example to be imitated
1) of men worthy of imitation
d) in a doctrinal sense
1) of a type i.e. a person or thing prefiguring a future (Messianic) person or thing
The scripture speaks of the offerings being shadows of good things to come per heb 8:

5Who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount.

heb 10:1

For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

A shadow or figure or type gives a representation of a body or substance, hence, the body or substance had to exist in order for the shadow to be cast before it..The shadow of a thing is manifested before the actual body or substance itself..

The shadows and types of Christ and figure were first seen, before His exact person, Image came into manifestation..

Its noteworthy that the word manifestation is used to describe the appearing of Christ on the earthly scene..i.e 1 jn 3:8

He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

He existed before being manifested note John says " The Son of God was manifested"

Again 1 jn 3:5

And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.

1 jn 1:2

For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us

You see, the Life was with the Father, and then via the virgin birth, it was manifested..

1 pet 1:20
Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

When Paul wrote that Adam was a figure of Him to come, that means Christ the second Adam existed [ substantively] but was not yet made manifest, for if the last Adam had not already preexisted, the first Adam could not have been a figure of him or a shadow of him..

 

[glorydaz]

Sure, the elect repent, not to get saved, but to manifest that they have been turned to God away from the folly of their own understanding of how one is Justified..

repentance is evidence of Justification, not the cause of it..

Repentance is, indeed, necessary for salvation. One doesn't believe without turning his eyes upon Jesus.

Repentance is turning from our old sinful ways and looking upon Jesus.
The perfect picture is given in the scripture. It's all wrapped up in faith and belief. There is no believing without turning...thus repentance is a necessary part of being justified by faith.

And the LORD said unto Moses, Make thee a fiery serpent, and set it upon a pole: and it shall come to pass, that every one that is bitten, when he looketh upon it, shall live. And Moses made a serpent of brass, and put it upon a pole, and it came to pass, that if a serpent had bitten any man, when he beheld the serpent of brass, he lived.

And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:

Here's the turn or burn verse...

I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

One is justified by faith...and must turn (repent) to our Lord Jesus Christ...thus the command for "all men every where to repent."

And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

 

[savedbygrace57]

glory:

Repentance is, indeed, necessary for salvation

Only to manifest salvation and manifest that it indeed has been given to one by their Saviour..

acts 5:

31Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

The Saviour of His People gives repentance when Saving them..

 

[glorydaz]

glory:

Repentance is, indeed, necessary for salvation

Only to manifest salvation and manifest that it indeed has been given to one by their Saviour..

acts 5:

31Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

The Saviour of His People gives repentance when Saving them..

It's important not to put the cart before the horse.

Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, saith the Lord GOD. Repent, and turn yourselves from all your transgressions; so iniquity shall not be your ruin.

A person isn't saved until they repent and believe.

And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

Repentance then forgiveness...

And if he trespass against thee seven times in a day, and seven times in a day turn again to thee, saying, I repent; thou shalt forgive him.

Repent and be converted that sins may be blotted out.

Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.

When we turn to Him, He turns to us. Repentance is necessary for salvation.

Therefore say thou unto them, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Turn ye unto me, saith the LORD of hosts, and I will turn unto you, saith the LORD of hosts.

The gospel is to be preached..."to open their eyes, and to TURN THEM" from darkness...that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among the sanctified. Repentance is necessary for salvation.

Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee, To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

 

[savedbygrace57]

glory:

A person isn't saved until they repent and believe.

Not True, a person is saved before God from the foundation, repentance and believing makes that manifest, The death of christ saves a person, and He was slain from the foundation..

 

[glorydaz]

glory:

A person isn't saved until they repent and believe.

Not True, a person is saved before God from the foundation, repentance and believing makes that manifest, The death of christ saves a person, and He was slain from the foundation..

You're putting God in a time zone. The OT saints had to wait until Christ went to the cross. Had he been actually slain from the beginning they would have had no need to wait. God foreknows who will be saved, but that does not affect the day of their actual salvation. You can't put your human understanding on God or eternity...thus, we are not saved until the actual day we are born again.

Now once has He appeared as the sacrifice....

For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself. And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

The kingdom was prepared from the foundation....the blood of all the prophets was shed from the foundation. First you need to understand what "from the foundation" is actually saying. It isn't what you think.

Matthew 25:34
Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
Luke 11:50
That the blood of all the prophets, which was shed from the foundation of the world, may be required of this generation;

 

[savedbygrace57]

glory:

You're putting God in a time zone

No I am not, God is eternal..