The Stupidity 0f Science

[th1b.taylor]

I was curious just how much the Mean Temperature the Earth has risen during the last 200 years has risen. There is no feathre to upload the graph from create the threa so I need to make the first reply to this.

 

[th1b.taylor]

My chart is much better but this one is for the last two centuries and as soon as you can stop bounching your eyballs up and doewn look at the verticle scale. the scale on my computer shows the last 136 years and the Mean Temprature has risen less than 1.5 degrees. Not Mr. Temp is Rising Gore, what was that projection, one more time?
http://www.worldclimatereport.com/wp-images/loehle_fig3.JPG

 

[Pizza]

How do you measure the mean temperature rise? I mean, maybe you can do so today, but we had not the ability to make such measurements until recently - any "record" is based on information OTHER than what we use today - direct measurements.

As James Burke once said, when describing the folly of the scientific method (and he was/is an atheist and great fan of human science):

"When you get your 'raw data', you don't really have raw data - you got what you were looking for. You designed procedures and instruments to capture the data you thought was necessary to prove or find what you were looking for..." (From "The day the universe changed")

He then went on to illustrate all the times "concensus" and "informed opinion" and "experts in their fields" were wrong. From the time of Aristotole thru the ages to when his show was produced (around 1980), he listed all the times science had to change it's mind and correct itself. There is nothing WRONG with this, it is human discovery - it's just that Burke warned of going too far when 'science' makes some announcement.

He often spoke of how political influences influence or direct science as well. Of course, none of this stopped him from predicting horrible warming that would alter life on earth by 2025.

 

[twinc]

How do you measure the mean temperature rise? I mean, maybe you can do so today, but we had not the ability to make such measurements until recently - any "record" is based on information OTHER than what we use today - direct measurements.

As James Burke once said, when describing the folly of the scientific method (and he was/is an atheist and great fan of human science):

"When you get your 'raw data', you don't really have raw data - you got what you were looking for. You designed procedures and instruments to capture the data you thought was necessary to prove or find what you were looking for..." (From "The day the universe changed")

He then went on to illustrate all the times "concensus" and "informed opinion" and "experts in their fields" were wrong. From the time of Aristotole thru the ages to when his show was produced (around 1980), he listed all the times science had to change it's mind and correct itself. There is nothing WRONG with this, it is human discovery - it's just that Burke warned of going too far when 'science' makes some announcement.

He often spoke of how political influences influence or direct science as well. Of course, none of this stopped him from predicting horrible warming that would alter life on earth by 2025.

how is it possible that we have global warming with a shrinking drifting sun in an expanding stretched out Universe - twinc

 

[GodsGrace]

My chart is much better but this one is for the last two centuries and as soon as you can stop bounching your eyballs up and doewn look at the verticle scale. the scale on my computer shows the last 136 years and the Mean Temprature has risen less than 1.5 degrees. Not Mr. Temp is Rising Gore, what was that projection, one more time?
http://www.worldclimatereport.com/wp-images/loehle_fig3.JPG

Bill, I won't be able to add much to this discussion but I do find it very interesting.
I've heard scientists say that a 2 degree rise in temperature will cause the melting of the polar ice caps and the rise of the oceans, possibly affecting towns along coasts.

I also hear that we are currently living in an ice-age.
twinc has made a very good point. The universe is expanding, the sun is gettng farther away, not closer. Plus we have this cloud cover or gas cover that does not allow the sun through. For example, auto gas emissions. I'm not very scientifically inclined, but if all the above is true, HOW could the temperature be rising?

One of the answers could be because heat cannot escape from this "dome" we've created. But then, neither would heat be coming through.

I don't trust scientists 100%. That I'm sure of. They change their mind about things all the time. Do you remember when eggs were good for us? And read meat?

My two cents...

 

[th1b.taylor]

Bill, I won't be able to add much to this discussion but I do find it very interesting.
I've heard scientists say that a 2 degree rise in temperature will cause the melting of the polar ice caps and the rise of the oceans, possibly affecting towns along coasts.

I also hear that we are currently living in an ice-age.
twinc has made a very good point. The universe is expanding, the sun is gettng farther away, not closer. Plus we have this cloud cover or gas cover that does not allow the sun through. For example, auto gas emissions. I'm not very scientifically inclined, but if all the above is true, HOW could the temperature be rising?

One of the answers could be because heat cannot escape from this "dome" we've created. But then, neither would heat be coming through.

I don't trust scientists 100%. That I'm sure of. They change their mind about things all the time. Do you remember when eggs were good for us? And read meat?

My two cents...

I remember the Fifties when the Ice Age was returning. And anyway, how did they know, in the fifties Ice Age would be madr in Hollywood, let alone Ice Age 2?

Oh, OH! It's true that squirrel is still chasing that acorn, I saw him in the yard yesterday!

 

[GodsGrace]

I remember the Fifties when the Ice Age was returning. And anyway, how did they know, in the fifties Ice Age would be madr in Hollywood, let alone Ice Age 2?

Oh, OH! It's true that squirrel is still chasing that acorn, I saw him in the yard yesterday!

I think we're up to Ice Age 4 or 5!!
And that's about all I know about the ice age.
Except that it must have been very cold. And no central heat.
So I'm glad I wasn't around ---

 

[th1b.taylor]

I think we're up to Ice Age 4 or 5!!
And that's about all I know about the ice age.
Except that it must have been very cold. And no central heat.
So I'm glad I wasn't around ---

Me 2!

 

[Pizza]

The "coming ice age" thing was a kneejerk reaction to observed cooling from just after the "dust bowl days" to the 70's.

As my sister pointed out, the dust bowl days were unusually warm, so a cooling after them should have seemed reasonable - part of some cycle - but the kneejerk reactoin was to ASSUME that the spiral down was both caused by us AND unstoppable unless we took drastic measures.

So you see, the thinking today is just the same as back then, we car causing warming (now referred to as 'change' since there is so little evidence for warming) and that we must panic and over react.

THIS is why my father never believed any 'panic talk' or "crisis warning" as he'd lived 80 years and said that "they are constantly telling us of the next disaster, disaster that never comes, but turns into some other crisis". The quick move from "Cooling" to "warming" to "change" makes dad's remarks very clear, as well as his thinking. There is no crisis, there never was. There IS change, and there ARE cycles - and always have been.

 

[th1b.taylor]

The "coming ice age" thing was a kneejerk reaction to observed cooling from just after the "dust bowl days" to the 70's.

As my sister pointed out, the dust bowl days were unusually warm, so a cooling after them should have seemed reasonable - part of some cycle - but the kneejerk reactoin was to ASSUME that the spiral down was both caused by us AND unstoppable unless we took drastic measures.

So you see, the thinking today is just the same as back then, we car causing warming (now referred to as 'change' since there is so little evidence for warming) and that we must panic and over react.

THIS is why my father never believed any 'panic talk' or "crisis warning" as he'd lived 80 years and said that "they are constantly telling us of the next disaster, disaster that never comes, but turns into some other crisis". The quick move from "Cooling" to "warming" to "change" makes dad's remarks very clear, as well as his thinking. There is no crisis, there never was. There IS change, and there ARE cycles - and always have been.

I've only made 72 at this time but he, your dad, was certainly right!

 

[jasonc]

The earth is moving away most likely but this barely noticeable If that is the case.the moon is moving away from the earth.it's not much each year.it can't be as all life woukd cease

 

[th1b.taylor]

The earth is moving away most likely but this barely noticeable If that is the case.the moon is moving away from the earth.it's not much each year.it can't be as all life woukd cease

I will agree to the truth of this statement with one caveat, this what trash science proposes to be true because it is, at this time, to accurately measure with, known, acuracy ad anyone can postulate anything. What is a sure truth is that the earth is exactly where God wants it to be.

 

[twinc]

The earth is moving away most likely but this barely noticeable If that is the case.the moon is moving away from the earth.it's not much each year.it can't be as all life woukd cease

we are not talking each year we are talking centuries according to old age scientists billions of years - twinc

 

[jasonc]

I will agree to the truth of this statement with one caveat, this what trash science proposes to be true because it is, at this time, to accurately measure with, known, acuracy ad anyone can postulate anything. What is a sure truth is that the earth is exactly where God wants it to be.

Ok,we can measure this.we shoot lasers at objects to determine speed and distance.the amount per is in the mm.let's say for arugementertainment it's 1mm per year.in 1000 years that's only a meter.

3ft won't be affecting much in the tides.the earth isn't constant on its axial tilt and its not noticed by the naked eye.



Its is larger. I wouldnt call the same means I measured and guides arty false science. What ever happens it's in God's control but I'm posting only what moves.we orbit the sun as it moves. We are moving away from the sun.

 

[th1b.taylor]

Ok,we can measure this.we shoot lasers at objects to determine speed and distance.the amount per is in the mm.let's say for arugementertainment it's 1mm per year.in 1000 years that's only a meter.

3ft won't be affecting much in the tides.the earth isn't constant on its axial tilt and its not noticed by the naked eye.



Its is larger. I wouldnt call the same means I measured and guides arty false science. What ever happens it's in God's control but I'm posting only what moves.we orbit the sun as it moves. We are moving away from the sun.

[It is still trash science until and if if can be confirmed for as long they claim it as fact because it is all based on theoretical assumptions from previous (by much shorter) comparisons where they have tested on known factors. There exists nothing in that long a range and lasers are brand new and it is impossible to verify results over a decade or two and that is trash science. Empirical science requires absolute proof and until that proof is provided, it is an unproven theory, not even worthy of a capital letter.