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Did John write his own Gospel? I believe he did, and if so it is very reasonable to find that his brother James wrote the Gospel of Mark. Could Nicodemus write? Certainly because he was a religious leader. Could Peter write? The evidence seems to indicate he could not because he used the scribe Silas who, incidentally Paul also co-authored letters with. Silas was with Peter and Paul and was a scribe! What do you know about Matthew, Mark, and Luke? Hardly anything except what some people told us later, many years after they were dead.
Sorry, I had to edit that last post. Too much caffeine and only a little sleep last night.
 
They didn’t claim qualifications. They just recorded what they knew. They didn’t know they were writing the Bible. Others read it found it inspired. Why do you, who supposedly heard from the Holy Spirit, doubt these works? That’s the question. If you were filled with faith from the H Spirit, why is doubting the Word of God a fruit?

When you pray, do you seek answers? Why is it so confusing to you that God might be answering my prayers and giving me guidance. I don’t say this in arrogance. In fact I am exceedingly humbled by the interaction of the Holy Spirit in my life. Especially when I consider the answers I’m receiving and assembling for prophecy. Why is God using me to deliver the messages I am? Maybe because I promised to follow God wherever he leads and in response I keep getting led. When the next message is published called “Unraveling Daniel,” it will be shown how the author fraud becomes a very important fulfilled piece of prophecy.

I fully believe in scripture as the word of God, but tradition is not scripture. That is apparently where we differ. I don’t put faith in those who came after the apostles in a large part because John in 1 John 2:18-19 told me not to. We can agree to differ.
 
We are going on a six week road trip therefore I will try to keep communicating but it will be intermittent and slow. Thanks for all the feedback!!! BTW, four years ago if I read my posting I’d have the same concerns that many of you do. Just like anyone who writes about scripture, my words MUST also be put to the test just as scripture demands. I hope you find that I do not add any words to scripture - I only present the written Word then provide my thoughts that I claim to be inspired by the Holy Spirit. My words are inspired but they are not the word of God - they are mine. I DO NOT claim to speak for God like some in the church do who create additional scripture. It doesn’t matter to me what theologians or anyone else claim because I only consider evidence, and scripture is the only evidence that I have found and put my trust in.
 
Ok. Well that would be another discussion in and of itself.

But let me ask, why do you think the Lord would allow the church throughout the last 2 millennium to believe the Gospels were written by those who didn't actually write them? And if it were true, why would it be spiritually significant? Again, I have my own view, but I'm searching for what you think is the spiritual import in needing to know this information, assuming it is true.
I had to address this point because it is very important. The Lord decreed certain time events that we know and believe. For example, the seventy sevens of Daniel turns out to be a thorough and complete description of Jesus‘ seven year mission to start the church. Together with Revelation, prophecy provides the EXACT year of Jesus birth, the circumstances and days of Jesus seven year mission, that includes the start of the church. This data summary and analysis will hopefully come out within a month in “Unravelling Daniel” and I’m wrapping up “Decoding Revelation“ now. My point of this is, like the coming of Jesus, in prophecy, God decreed certain events to happen in the church over time. The gospel authors misnaming is a major part of that decree and a portion of the proof that most prophecy has already been fulfilled.
 
When you pray, do you seek answers?
When I pray, I’m not looking for answers to questions. When I have questions, I ask and get answers.
Why is it so confusing to you that God might be answering my prayers and giving me guidance.
It’s not at all confusing to
me. His ways are crystal clear to
me.
I don’t say this in arrogance.
Oh yes you did.
In fact I am exceedingly humbled by the interaction of the Holy Spirit in my life.
If you were humble, you wouldn’t brag that you are here to help us out of the mire. In fact, you wouldn’t mention God is personally teaching you.
Especially when I consider the answers I’m receiving and assembling for prophecy.
Tell us what answers you’ve received and we can do the biblical injunction and judge your “revelation.”
Why is God using me to deliver the messages I am?
We haven’t established He is doing so yet. That’s just your claim. So far looks dubious. Servants of the One True God don’t talk so much about their marvelous selves and how special they are.
Maybe because I promised to follow God wherever he leads and in response I keep getting led.
Give examples please.
When the next message is published called “Unraveling Daniel,” it will be shown how the author fraud becomes a very important fulfilled piece of prophecy.
Ah, discrediting the Word of God…..doesn’t sound promising.
I fully believe in scripture as the word of God, but tradition is not scripture.
The Gospels ARE scripture.
That is apparently where we differ. I don’t put faith in those who came after the apostles in a large part because John in 1 John 2:18-19 told me not to. We can agree to differ.
We don’t differ there and I never said I think as you are guessing I do.

So far not convincing. Too full of you and your special revelation which so far discredits the Gospels.
 
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I asked for input at theologyonline about why God would wait for so many years to have the Gospels written. God is in charge and decreed the time of Jesus, so what possible reason was there for God waiting to have his word written?

Why should God have done things as you think they ought to have been done?

Jesus (God) handpicked twelve disciples, commissioned them to start the church, then people named Matthew, Mark, and Luke and one of the disciples waited years to write them? This was the source of my doubts I had to address. The story of a Jesus is great but the story of the authors lacks credibility when considering God is in charge.

I'm not clear on why the writers of the Gospels being who they are, and the timing of their writing of the Gospels, gave you doubts...

Jesus handpicked his eyewitnesses, so shouldn’t we expect that Jesus had his eyewitnesses write his story at the start of His church? With God nothing is impossible? With God his eyewitnesses writing his story is not only probable it is likely. That seems reasonable to me.

What do you mean "Jesus handpicked his eyewitnesses"?

Why should we expect that Jesus would have his eyewitnesses write his story at the "start of the Church" and not at some other time?

Why should what seems reasonable to you be what seems reasonable to anyone else?
 
We are going on a six week road trip therefore I will try to keep communicating but it will be intermittent and slow. Thanks for all the feedback!!! BTW, four years ago if I read my posting I’d have the same concerns that many of you do. Just like anyone who writes about scripture, my words MUST also be put to the test just as scripture demands. I hope you find that I do not add any words to scripture - I only present the written Word then provide my thoughts that I claim to be inspired by the Holy Spirit. My words are inspired but they are not the word of God - they are mine. I DO NOT claim to speak for God like some in the church do who create additional scripture. It doesn’t matter to me what theologians or anyone else claim because I only consider evidence, and scripture is the only evidence that I have found and put my trust in.
You doubt the veracity of the Gospels so your claim that you only present the written word falls flat. You claim Barnabas wrote a Gospel. That is definitely adding to the Word. Your words don’t appear inspired to me. They cause the reader to doubt the Word of God, something the Holy Spirit doesn’t do. Try something besides the Gospels aren’t what we all believe for a change.
 
When I pray, I’m not looking for answers to questions. When I have questions, I ask and get answers.

It’s not at all confusing to
me. His ways are crystal clear to
me.

Oh yes you did.

If you were humble, you wouldn’t brag that you are here to help us out of the mire. In fact, you wouldn’t mention God is personally teaching you.

Tell us what answers you’ve received and we can do the biblical injunction and judge your “revelation.”

We haven’t established He is doing so yet. That’s just your claim. So far looks dubious. Servants of the One True God don’t talk so much about their marvelous selves and how special they are.

Give examples please.

Ah, discrediting the Word of God…..doesn’t sound promising.

The Gospels ARE scripture.

We don’t differ there and I never said I think as you are guessing I do.

So far not convincing. Too full of you and your special revelation which so far discredits the Gospels.
 
When I pray, I’m not looking for answers to questions. When I have questions, I ask and get answers.

It’s not at all confusing to
me. His ways are crystal clear to
me.

Oh yes you did.
So someone like me who follows the Lord and researches what I’m asked to research, and writes what I’m asked to write is considered arrogant be you? What part is arrogant?
If you were humble, you wouldn’t brag that you are here to help us out of the mire. In fact, you wouldn’t mention God is personally teaching you.
My results have helped bring people to faith. If wanting to help people to find Jesus is bragging, than I am guilty.

Tell us what answers you’ve received and we can do the biblical injunction and judge your “revelation.”

I gave you overall results and pointed you to the data for your review. Please tell me what “we” don’t agree with.

We haven’t established He is doing so yet. That’s just your claim. So far looks dubious. Servants of the One True God don’t talk so much about their marvelous selves and how special they are.
Give examples please.

Ah, discrediting the Word of God…..doesn’t sound promising.
How did I discredit the word of God? Please be specific.
lease provide
The Gospels ARE scripture.
We don’t differ there and I never said I think as you are guessing I do.

So far not convincing. Too full of you and your special revelation which so far discredits the Gospels.
Please explain how I have discredited the Gospel by concluding through almost 2 years of full time work that the authors of the Gospels were not who they have been claimed to be, but are men who were eyewitnesses who walked and talked with Jesus?
 
Why should God have done things as you think they ought to have been done?



I'm not clear on why the writers of the Gospels being who they are, and the timing of their writing of the Gospels, gave you doubts...
A story is only as good as the source. The story of Jesus is phenomenal, but not knowing who wrote it, made it just another unproven story. The Holy Spirit let me know it was time to resolve my issues. Yes Dorothy Mae, the Holy Spirit let me know, and I am very blessed that he did.
What do you mean "Jesus handpicked his eyewitnesses"?
Jesus asked people to follow him, then he went on the mountain and selected his twelve.
Why should we expect that Jesus would have his eyewitnesses write his story at the "start of the Church" and not at some other time?
What would be a possible reason for waiting? The disciples were told to start the church and they started preaching right away.

Why should what seems reasonable to you be what seems reasonable to anyone else?
This is an open discussion and I’ve presented some results and data. Why is it so reasonable to you that Matthew, Mark, and Luke wrote the Gospels. Have you ever researched and looked at the data to support this belief of yours. I find it interesting that many stand firm in their belief of what people who came after the disciples said, but they don’t address 1 John 2:18-19 and other warnings about false teachers to come. Read chapters two and three of Revelation. Jesus has told John and the church that the synagogue of Satan is in the church. What happened to that evil entity in the church? Did it leave the church or grow like John said in his letter?
 
A story is only as good as the source.

I don't know what this means because it could mean several different things. A fictional story isn't judged as "good" on the same basis as the biographical story of someone's life is, or on the same basis as the story of an actual event in history will be. What, then, do you mean by "a good story"? According to what standard?

The story of Jesus is phenomenal, but not knowing who wrote it, made it just another unproven story.

We know who many of the authors of the Bible were. The Gospels, in particular, have well-settled authorship. What, though, is crucial to me as a Christian is not the authorship of the Gospels but whether or not Christ truly rose from the dead. On this subject, I think the available evidence makes it far more reasonable to think he did than that he didn't.

The Holy Spirit let me know it was time to resolve my issues.

Uh, yeah... How did he do this, exactly?

Jesus asked people to follow him, then he went on the mountain and selected his twelve.

He asked men to follow him? Then he went up a mountain and selected the Twelve? Scripture, please.

What would be a possible reason for waiting? The disciples were told to start the church and they started preaching right away.

This is evasive. I haven't made any opposing claim; I've only asked you to explain your own claim. You said that it would have been better for the members of the Twelve to have written the Gospel accounts immediately upon their happening, so justify why this is so. I don't see that there is any good grounds for such a claim, but maybe you'll surprise me. Your evasion here, though, doesn't bode well...

Why is it so reasonable to you that Matthew, Mark, and Luke wrote the Gospels. Have you ever researched and looked at the data to support this belief of yours.

Yes, I've looked at, and argued for, the well-established authorship of the Gospels over the course of many years. But establishing beyond a shadow of doubt who wrote what is ultimately just a distraction from other, more vital matters. And so, rather than go into long explanations that I expect you'll simply dismiss out-of-hand, here are some links you can peruse at your leisure:




I find it interesting that many stand firm in their belief of what people who came after the disciples said, but they don’t address 1 John 2:18-19 and other warnings about false teachers to come.

Uh huh.

Read chapters two and three of Revelation. Jesus has told John and the church that the synagogue of Satan is in the church. What happened to that evil entity in the church? Did it leave the church or grow like John said in his letter?

Revelation 2:8-9
8 “And to the angel of the church in Smyrna write: ‘The words of the first and the last, who died and came to life.
9 “‘I know your tribulation and your poverty (but you are rich) and the slander of those who say that they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan.

Revelation 3:7-9
7 "And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write: He who is holy, who is true, who has the key of David, who opens and no one will shut, and who shuts and no one opens, says this:
8 'I know your deeds. Behold, I have put before you an open door which no one can shut, because you have a little power, and have kept My word, and have not denied My name.
9 'Behold, I will cause those of the synagogue of Satan, who say that they are Jews and are not, but lie—I will make them come and bow down at your feet, and make them know that I have loved you.


Where do these passages indicate that the "synagogue of Satan" was in the Church? I don't see that stated anywhere in the above...
 
I don't know what this means because it could mean several different things. A fictional story isn't judged as "good" on the same basis as the biographical story of someone's life is, or on the same basis as the story of an actual event in history will be. What, then, do you mean by "a good story"? According to what standard?
a nonbeliever searching for answers reading the story of Jesus with unknown authors says, “Yah right, you expect me to believe this?”
We know who many of the authors of the Bible were. The Gospels, in particular, have well-settled authorship. What, though, is crucial to me as a Christian is not the authorship of the Gospels but whether or not Christ truly rose from the dead. On this subject, I think the available evidence makes it far more reasonable to think he did than that he didn't.
If the story of Jesus cannot be validated through known authors, then the story of his coming v
back from the dead is just a story.
Uh, yeah... How did he do this, exactly?



He asked men to follow him? Then he went up a mountain and selected the Twelve? Scripture, please.



This is evasive. I haven't made any opposing claim; I've only asked you to explain your own claim. You said that it would have been better for the members of the Twelve to have written the Gospel accounts immediately upon their happening, so justify why this is so. I don't see that there is any good grounds for such a claim, but maybe you'll surprise me. Your evasion here, though, doesn't bode well...
I’ve lpresented the results of my investigation and pointed people to the data. It’s a theory I believe is much more credible than the one that is accepted theology. I’m not at all being evasive. Prove the existing theological stew as valid and correct or prove my conclusions wrong from the data. I look forward to it!
Yes, I've looked at, and argued for, the well-established authorship of the Gospels over the course of many years. But establishing beyond a shadow of doubt who wrote what is ultimately just a distraction from other, more vital matters. And so, rather than go into long explanations that I expect you'll simply dismiss out-of-hand, here are some links you can peruse at your leisure:
I commend you for your interest in researching the origins of the Gospel authors so maybe you can provide some proof why you believe the existing story? It’s only a distraction if my data is proven wrong.





Uh huh.



Revelation 2:8-9
8 “And to the angel of the church in Smyrna write: ‘The words of the first and the last, who died and came to life.
9 “‘I know your tribulation and your poverty (but you are rich) and the slander of those who say that they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan.

Revelation 3:7-9
7 "And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write: He who is holy, who is true, who has the key of David, who opens and no one will shut, and who shuts and no one opens, says this:
8 'I know your deeds. Behold, I have put before you an open door which no one can shut, because you have a little power, and have kept My word, and have not denied My name.
9 'Behold, I will cause those of the synagogue of Satan, who say that they are Jews and are not, but lie—I will make them come and bow down at your feet, and make them know that I have loved you.


Where do these passages indicate that the "synagogue of Satan" was in the Church? I don't see that stated anywhere in the above...
Doesn't chapter one put it all into scope - a performance appraisal of the beginning church? It seems like the performance of the church is a bit off and needing attention. Gee, why did John receive this vision when he is an old man in prison? More theological stew without proof? That’s a teaser in case you haven’t picked up on that.
revelation
 
So someone like me who follows the Lord and researches what I’m asked to research, and writes what I’m asked to write is considered arrogant be you? What part is arrogant?
Well, humility as to your own greatness is not your strong suit. I’m not convinced it is the Holy Spirit directing you. Not a single author of the Bible, clearly inspired, boasted of their own personal greatness as you do.

And so far, all you’ve written is how you doubt the veracity of the Gospels. Hummmm not a good start.
My results have helped bring people to faith. If wanting to help people to find Jesus is bragging, than I am guilty.
That is highly doubtful. You preach that three of the Gospels are not reliable. That’s teaching the opposite of faith. If you’d really researched matters, you’d know it wasn’t important to those people WHO did a piece. Moses is credited with writing the first 5 books of Moses, but he certainly didn’t write about his own burial. Doesn’t mean we therefore doubt the veracity of those works. This is what real research brings.
I gave you overall results and pointed you to the data for your review. Please tell me what “we” don’t agree with.
What data for my review? You cast doubt in the Gospels. We disagree sharply there.
How did I discredit the word of God? Please be specific.
Your insistence that the Gospels aren’t telling the truth. They were written by other men.
Please explain how I have discredited the Gospel by concluding through almost 2 years of full time work that the authors of the Gospels were not who they have been claimed to be, but are men who were eyewitnesses who walked and talked with Jesus?
What a waste of two full years!!! If you’d devoted your energy to DOING what Jesus taught in those Gospels, you’d have something worthwhile to tell. I’m very sure that your teaching raises doubts, not faith in the minds of those who embraced it. How less likely they would be to trust those Gospels!
 
a nonbeliever searching for answers reading the story of Jesus with unknown authors says, “Yah right, you expect me to believe this?”

If the story of Jesus cannot be validated through known authors, then the story of his coming v
back from the dead is just a story.

I’ve lpresented the results of my investigation and pointed people to the data. It’s a theory I believe is much more credible than the one that is accepted theology. I’m not at all being evasive. Prove the existing theological stew as valid and correct or prove my conclusions wrong from the data. I look forward to it!

I commend you for your interest in researching the origins of the Gospel authors so maybe you can provide some proof why you believe the existing story? It’s only a distraction if my data is proven wrong.

Doesn't chapter one put it all into scope - a performance appraisal of the beginning church? It seems like the performance of the church is a bit off and needing attention. Gee, why did John receive this vision when he is an old man in prison? More theological stew without proof? That’s a teaser in case you haven’t picked up on that.
a nonbeliever searching for answers reading the story of Jesus with unknown authors says, “Yah right, you expect me to believe this?”

If the story of Jesus cannot be validated through known authors, then the story of his coming v
back from the dead is just a story.

I’ve lpresented the results of my investigation and pointed people to the data. It’s a theory I believe is much more credible than the one that is accepted theology. I’m not at all being evasive. Prove the existing theological stew as valid and correct or prove my conclusions wrong from the data. I look forward to it!

I commend you for your interest in researching the origins of the Gospel authors so maybe you can provide some proof why you believe the existing story? It’s only a distraction if my data is proven wrong.

Doesn't chapter one put it all into scope - a performance appraisal of the beginning church? It seems like the performance of the church is a bit off and needing attention. Gee, why did John receive this vision when he is an old man in prison? More theological stew without proof? That’s a teaser in case you haven’t picked up on that.
I opened one of the links you attached and it claimed, “Most scholars believe,” so I quit reading because the thoughts of scholars are not evidence and I figured that the article would provide more information that was opinion based rather than factual. Could I be wrong and missed something? By all means, but I’ve been down this road many hours and found no evidence to support Matthew, Mark, and Luke. Hence my challenge! I’ve put my cards on the table and I’m waiting to see yours.
 
a nonbeliever searching for answers reading the story of Jesus with unknown authors says, “Yah right, you expect me to believe this?”
For millennia men and women have done just that. But you raise doubt they didn’t have.
If the story of Jesus cannot be validated through known authors, then the story of his coming v
back from the dead is just a story.
Again, you preach doubt, not faith.
I’ve lpresented the results of my investigation and pointed people to the data. It’s a theory I believe is much more credible than the one that is accepted theology. I’m not at all being evasive. Prove the existing theological stew as valid and correct or prove my conclusions wrong from the data. I look forward to it!
That would a great waste of time.
I commend you for your interest in researching the origins of the Gospel authors so maybe you can provide some proof why you believe the existing story?
Because of their transforming power. If one DOES the teaching of Christ, one comes to know the truth and the truth sets one free.
It’s only a distraction if my data is proven wrong.
It’s a distraction at best.
Doesn't chapter one put it all into scope - a performance appraisal of the beginning church? It seems like the performance of the church is a bit off and needing attention. Gee, why did John receive this vision when he is an old man in prison? More theological stew without proof? That’s a teaser in case you haven’t picked up on that.
Casting more doubt on the Bible….
 
For millennia men and women have done just that. But you raise doubt they didn’t have.

Again, you preach doubt, not faith.
Are we reading the same thread? I believe 100% in the saving grace of the sacrifice of Jesus! How many times do I have to repeat this? Claiming the gospels are the truth but the authors are not who they are claimed is in no way preaching doubt! I‘ve challenged you to present evidence proving me wrong.









That would a great waste of time.

Because of their transforming power. If one DOES the teaching of Christ, one comes to know the truth and the truth sets one free.

It’s a distraction at best.

Casting more doubt on the Bible….
How can a claim that Nicodemus, James, Silas recording the words of Peter, and John wrote eyewitness accounts of their time with Jesus, be preaching doubts? These men are MORE proof of the Gospels being true than Matthew, Mark, and Luke. Your statement makes no sense.

For millennia men and women have done just that. But you raise doubt they didn’t have.

Again, you preach doubt, not faith.

That would a great waste of time.

Because of their transforming power. If one DOES the teaching of Christ, one comes to know the truth and the truth sets one free.

It’s a distraction at best.

Casting more doubt on the Bible….
 
Are we reading the same thread? I believe 100% in the saving grace of the sacrifice of Jesus!
How do you know about the saving grace of Jesus? From the Gospels that you doubt are true. You’ve cut off the branch you sit upon.
How many times do I have to repeat this? Claiming the gospels are the truth but the authors are not who they are claimed is in no way preaching doubt!
It certainly is. Just ask any atheist. Your position is the Gospels lie about the author and that is very important. So why believe them?
I‘ve challenged you to present evidence proving me wrong.
You have chosen to believe 3 of the Gospels lie. There’s not going to be any evidence to convince you since you have “special revelation” no one else has. Anyone claiming the Holy Spirit showed them the Gospel claim what is not true and is quite proud of that revelation has a sturdy wall about them. No other thought can penetrate.
How can a claim that Nicodemus, James, Silas recording the words of Peter, and John wrote eyewitness accounts of their time with Jesus, be preaching doubts?
Because that is NOT what the books say of themselves. “The Gospel according to Matthew” is not according to Matthew for you….hence a lie by any definition.
These men are MORE proof of the Gospels being true than Matthew, Mark, and Luke. Your statement makes no sense.
How? The very title is a lie. Your position makes no sense at all.

you say:
No Gospel but John was written by the recorded author.
Names found elsewhere in Acts did the writing but lied about the authorship.
It’s therefore more reliable having lied about it in the first words????
 
I opened one of the links you attached and it claimed, “Most scholars believe,” so I quit reading because the thoughts of scholars are not evidence and I figured that the article would provide more information that was opinion based rather than factual. Could I be wrong and missed something? By all means, but I’ve been down this road many hours and found no evidence to support Matthew, Mark, and Luke. Hence my challenge! I’ve put my cards on the table and I’m waiting to see yours.
The problem with the above repulsion to scholars, is this is evidence that you aren’t one. You disdain the research of scholars. It isn’t a lack of education on information, it’s a lack of education on how to think. You place emphasis on “special revelation” which no educated person needs do.
 
Jesus (God) handpicked twelve disciples, commissioned them to start the church, then people named Matthew, Mark, and Luke and one of the disciples waited years to write them? This was the source of my doubts I had to address. The story of a Jesus is great but the story of the authors lacks credibility when considering God is in charge.
This was your first step into doubt and darkness. You believed the story of Jesus based on the writings of the Gospel but doubted the veracity of the authors. Embracing this inconsistency led to further doubt.
 
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