There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death

[researcher]

Doesn't Matthew 17 fulfill that promise?

Not really. Jesus said that it would happen after they went to the Gentiles (Mat 10:18), and after Jerusalem was destroyed (Mar 13:14) amongst other things.

They didn't go to the Gentiles until many years after Jesus died.

 

[ronniechoate34]

2Th:2:2: That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

Of course that was about 1950 years ago, lol.

They were definitely expecting him to come back in their lifetimes...

Tit 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Tit 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
Tit 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

1Ti 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which is our hope;
1Ti 1:2 Unto Timothy, my own son in the faith: Grace, mercy, and peace, from God our Father and Jesus Christ our Lord.
1Ti 6:13 I give thee charge in the sight of God, who quickeneth all things, and before Christ Jesus, who before Pontius Pilate witnessed a good confession;
1Ti 6:14 That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:

I think that they were simply passing on a message for the generations.

 

[ronniechoate34]

Doesn't Matthew 17 fulfill that promise?

Not really. Jesus said that it would happen after they went to the Gentiles (Mat 10:18), and after Jerusalem was destroyed (Mar 13:14) amongst other things.

They didn't go to the Gentiles until many years after Jesus died.

By many years you mean like 34. Because it was in 34 ad that the Christians fled and delivered the gospel to the gentiles. It was after Stephen had been stoned to death. This led to the gentiles receipt of the gospel.

 

[researcher]

2Th:2:2: That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

Of course that was about 1950 years ago, lol.

They were definitely expecting him to come back in their lifetimes...

Tit 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Tit 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
Tit 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

1Ti 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which is our hope;
1Ti 1:2 Unto Timothy, my own son in the faith: Grace, mercy, and peace, from God our Father and Jesus Christ our Lord.
1Ti 6:13 I give thee charge in the sight of God, who quickeneth all things, and before Christ Jesus, who before Pontius Pilate witnessed a good confession;
1Ti 6:14 That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:

I think that they were simply passing on a message for the generations.

It says from Paul, to Timothy. Obviously a direct admonition to from man to another. It can be used today as an example, but the letter was definitely intended for Timothy to follow.

1Ti 6:20 O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:

 

[ronniechoate34]

It says from Paul, to Timothy. Obviously a direct admonition to from man to another. It can be used today as an example, but the letter was definitely intended for Timothy to follow.

1Ti 6:20 O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:

It was probably during Timothy's lifetime that the wolves began to come in. This is instruction for all men. Not Timothy alone. The Bible was written for the generations.


2Tm:3:16: All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

 

[researcher]

It says from Paul, to Timothy. Obviously a direct admonition to from man to another. It can be used today as an example, but the letter was definitely intended for Timothy to follow.

1Ti 6:20 O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:

It was probably during Timothy's lifetime that the wolves began to come in. This is instruction for all men. Not Timothy alone. The Bible was written for the generations.


2Tm:3:16: All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

What do we get from this?
2Ti 4:13 The cloke that I left at Troas with Carpus, when thou comest, bring with thee, and the books, but especially the parchments.

What does it mean to us today?

 

[researcher]

And back to this...

For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works. Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. Mat 16:27-28

Obviously an allusion to his coming with the angels. But the disciples died.

 

[ronniechoate34]

It says from Paul, to Timothy. Obviously a direct admonition to from man to another. It can be used today as an example, but the letter was definitely intended for Timothy to follow.

1Ti 6:20 O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:

It was probably during Timothy's lifetime that the wolves began to come in. This is instruction for all men. Not Timothy alone. The Bible was written for the generations.


2Tm:3:16: All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

What do we get from this?
2Ti 4:13 The cloke that I left at Troas with Carpus, when thou comest, bring with thee, and the books, but especially the parchments.



What does it mean to us today?

To me it means that even in the face of death that we should hold to our faith and desire the Word of God. That's a message for the ages.

 

[ronniechoate34]

And back to this...

For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works. Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. Mat 16:27-28

Obviously an allusion to his coming with the angels. But the disciples died.

I think that this has been answered already.

 

[researcher]

And back to this...

For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works. Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. Mat 16:27-28

Obviously an allusion to his coming with the angels. But the disciples died.

I think that this has been answered already.

More...

Mar 12:6 Having yet therefore one son, his wellbeloved, he sent him also last unto them, saying, They will reverence my son.
Mar 12:7 But those husbandmen said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and the inheritance shall be ours.
Mar 12:8 And they took him, and killed him, and cast him out of the vineyard.
Mar 12:9 What shall therefore the lord of the vineyard do?

he will come

and destroy the husbandmen,

and will give the vineyard unto others.

Mar 12:12 And they sought to lay hold on him, but feared the people: for they knew that he had spoken the parable against them: and they left him, and went their way.

The husbandmen killed the only Son. Did the Lord of the vineyard come back and destroy the husbandman?

 

[veteran]

Our Lord's meaning is obviously connected with Pentecost and the receiving of The Holy Spirit (Acts 1-2).

These 'tills' in Matthew are related;

Matt 10:23
23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.
(KJV)

Matt 16:28
28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in His kingdom.
(KJV)

Matt 23:39
39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.
(KJV)

Matt 26:29
29 But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father's kingdom.
(KJV)


When Christ's Kingdom in the 'spiritual' came on Pentecost by The Holy Spirit, through the Church, how was that still a different manifestation than what our Lord Jesus said to those scribes and Pharisees who refused to believe in Matt.23:39? Hint, to Israel, it's about a literal kingdom with Christ Jesus here on earth, ruling over Israel literally on earth; not only being over the Church with a spiritual idea like Pentecost served while our Lord is not here in Person literally.

And, how was Pentecost still different than what our Lord said in Matt.26:29 to His Apostles about drinking the fruit of the vine new in His Father's kingdom? He meant drinking it literally in bodily Presence here on earth with them, a future time when His Kingdom will be literally manifested on this earth, not just spiritually manifested through His believers.

In Acts 3 after Pentecost, Peter addressed the men of Israel in the temple, preaching the coming of the kingdom, and even that The Father would send Jesus Christ Which was before preached to them. That was after Christ's Resurrection, yet they still would not believe (Acts 3:12-26). They refused even then; thus the literal physical kingdom to be established on this earth is still in abeyance. Not His Church which is spiritual, but His literal physical kingdom which all of God's prophets spoke about. And only then is when the rewards are handed out.

What we are supposed to learn from that distinction, is that this world today is not Christ's Kingdom come in full like God's Word shows, the only part established now is His spiritual kingdom, through His Church here on earth. And, it was because of Israel's rejection that prevented Christ's literal bodily coming to establish His kingdom in full, on the earth, with the restoration of all things, including Israel.
.

 

[JudaicChristian]

True death is death of the spirit in the final judgement. Your body is only the outer shell of you and who you are. Your spirit is the true you. :yes

 

[veteran]

True death is death of the spirit in the final judgement. You body is only the outer shell of you and who you are. Your spirit is the true you. :yes

Right. And that's why God's Word reveals the Heavenly coming down on earth with the New Jerusalem, the vail between this earthly dimension and the heavenly dimension being taken away (Isaiah 25; 1 Cor.15). That's what the "spiritual body", or "image of the heavenly" type resurrection body is about. It's what the idea of being caught up to be with Christ is about. Only that it's going to happen here on earth. So it's very... easy to know that still is yet to come, since we are still in bodies of corruption today.

 

[researcher]

Our Lord's meaning is obviously connected with Pentecost and the receiving of The Holy Spirit (Acts 1-2).

It's out of context and time context for it to mean that. It would have been a nonsensical statement for God to make.

For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works. Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.
Mat 16:27 & 28

The stuff below happened after the receiving of the Holy Spirit

Mat 10:17 But beware of men: for they will deliver you up to the councils, and they will scourge you in their synagogues;
Mat 10:18 And ye shall be brought before governors and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them and the Gentiles.
Mat 10:19 But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that same hour what ye shall speak.
Mat 10:20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.
Mat 10:21 And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death.
Mat 10:22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Mat 10:23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

Clearly not in time context of how Jesus said things would pan out.

 

[veteran]

Pentecost is the context of what our Lord Jesus was saying for the SPIRITUAL operation, because that was proof of the NT Church coming with Power (i.e., by The Holy Spirit). The other part is about the literal physical kingdom, which is still yet to come, and involves the restoration of Israel according to God's original promises. That's why that Matt.10 Scripture applies both to Pentecost, and to the yet fulfilled literal physical kingdom yet to come on earth.

 

[Lance]

I puzzled over that one for years. It seems to imply that since people only live 3 score and 10ish that Jesus should have returned within that time span assuming there was a toddler toddling around when Jesus said that. He didn't return. The only other possibilities I could figure is that there are people who were there all those centuries ago that are still walking and talking today. Another, Jesus did return, maybe he went fishing or something, I doubt this possibility. Last possibility, Jesus never said that and the Bible is in error. That's a big one for me to swallow since I had always been taught that the Bible is perfect but though my faith in God and his son Jesus is still strong I'm not sure about the accuracy of the Bible anymore. That said, I'm inclined to believe there are people still alive that were there when Jesus said that and they will still be alive when Jesus returns.

Its a tough one.

Whichever the answer is if we get to ask questions in heaven that will be on my list.

 

[researcher]

I was looking for some commentaries on this part of Jesus' explanations to the disciples. Reading one, I thought, "oh, that's what he was saying," lol.

Luk 17:34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left.
Luk 17:35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
Luk 17:36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
Luk 17:37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.

Jesus was saying "this person will be taken, and this person will be taken, and this person..."
And the disciples asked "Where?" As in, Where will they be taken? Lol.

I think this deserves a new topic, lol

 

[Ret]

Mat 16:24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples,
Mat 16:27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.
Mat 16:28 Verily I say unto you,
There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.

True? Not true? Happened? Didn't happen?

researcher... Said in the affirmative...There are some standing here, that will TASTE of death, after they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. I don't believe this means that no one had died a physical death, rather no one...standing at that time, or standing now....has yet tasted of death, that being the second death of Rev 20:6-14.

Spiritually speaking, our physical death is when one 'sleeps' or 'sleepeth' till either the first or the second resurrection. Those who are blessed to be in the first resurrection NEVER TASTE of DEATH, not the SECOND DEATH as per Rev 20. Only the wicked 'TASTE of DEATH' and that being after the second resurrection, after which, they see Christ coming in His kingdom!

 

[Cornelius]

Mat 16:24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples,
Mat 16:27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.
Mat 16:28 Verily I say unto you,
There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.


Mat 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
Mat 10:6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Mat 10:23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee into the next: for verily I say unto you,
Ye shall not have gone through the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.


True? Not true? Happened? Didn't happen?

Comments?

Mat 17:2 and he was transfigured before them; and his face did shine as the sun, and his garments became white as the light.

 

[XTruth]

a [some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom] Referring to disciples seeing Him transfigured, as He will be in the kingdom when it is set up at the second coming (17:1-8; 2Pet. 1:16-18).